Slate Chocolate Marble
Slate Chocolate Marble

Led Zeppelin Official Forum

Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to contribute to this site by submitting your own content or replying to existing content. You'll be able to customize your profile, while also communicating with other members via your own private inbox, plus much more! This message will be removed once you have signed in.

tmtomh

Members
  • Content count

    426
  • Joined

  • Last visited

About tmtomh

  • Rank
    Zep Head

Profile Information

  • Gender
    Male

Recent Profile Visitors

955 profile views
  1. It seems we're clearly talking past each other and appear to feel the other is not hearing what we're saying. Wouldn't be the first - or 1000th - time that has happened on an internet forum. Perhaps we can at least agree on that.
  2. I agree we need to agree to disagree. As for an argument, I've made my argument, in detail, with a list of tracks and five different reasons why I think they are worthwhile. I agree with you 100% that you don't have to agree with my reasons - but to say I don't have reasons at all, is just silly. Conversely, your argument seems devoid of specifics, and your main "reasoning" consists of zingers ("we got a happy meal instead of a mother lode") and vague generalities that have no bearing on the actual argument: "music is judged with emotion and gut feeling" - well of course it is. We just feel differently about the tracks.
  3. Man, that's a tough one! I think folks here have really nailed the top choices. If I had to choose, I'd guess I'd go with Seattle 6-19-72 because it's such a long, interesting, and fantastic show, and the existing source is just awful-sounding. Osaka and Offenburg would be right behind it on my list though. The only show I can think to add into the mix that hasn't been mentioned yet is the 9-19-1970 evening show at Madison Square Garden. Fantastic, and while the AUD source is decent, it would be astounding to hear this show in better quality.
  4. Again, you are arguing against a straw man. There's no graphs or pie charts here - and you know it. A 50% return is not "a crap return in any walk of life." If you think my argument is contrived, then provide some evidence for that claim. Mindless arrogance won't win you any arguments. Also, it helps if you display at least a minimum of accountability for what you say. So at least acknowledge that you're not the OP of this thread.
  5. Unless you have two accounts here or the admins deleted the original first post in this thread, you're not the OP; Flares has the first post here. Your Titanic and happy meal jokes don't make any sense in this context. Your "tamborine slightly louder in the mix" comment is silly, and doesn't acknowledge that right at the outset of my comment I agreed that many of the tracks are indeed of little value. And so your claim, via the WIC analogy, that I actually know the companion material is lame but am trying to rationalize that it's better, is both inaccurate and condescending. I get that it's easier to argue against the view you would prefer others have, than to argue against what they actually write. You are welcome to your opinion, but you are not welcome to mine.
  6. Good point about IS and GP - agree, especially about GP.
  7. I disagree. Yes, the casual fan is not going to be interested in many of the companion tracks. And I agree some tracks are fairly pointless, providing very minor variations (e.g. Rock and Roll, Kashmir). And I agree that the companion-disc versions of Fool in the Rain, All My Love, and I'm Gonna Crawl on ITTOD sound terrible and it's an embarrassment that Page included them. But having revisited all 67 of the companion tracks (excluding the live Paris show companion to Zep I), my argument is that about half of them - just over 30 - are very worthwhile. I'm sympathetic to the argument that they could have released the best companion tracks on a single 3-CD set - and if they had, I am confident many naysayers would've changed their tune. But even so, these tracks are available inexpensively on CD - when they came out the Deluxe CDs could be had for as little as $1 or $2 more than the album-only CDs. Not to mention the companion tracks always have been available a la carte for $1.29 or so from the online music download sites. So I don't think how they organized them or priced them is a problem. At any rate, here are the tracks I think are valuable, and here's a key to my reasons for each one. Would be very interested in others' perspectives. Key to Reasons for Inclusion on the List: Previously unreleased (either totally unreleased, or never officially released) Significantly or totally different version, take, or mix Better sound than prior masterings Instrumental version that's interesting and/or benefits from removal of vocal Similar to album version but with better or interestingly different sonics or mix Zep II Ramble On (rough mix with cold ending) (2) (totally different feel from the album version) La La (1) Zep III Since I've Been Loving You (first take) (2) (totally different take) Bathroom Sound (4) That's the Way (rough mix with dulcimer) (2) (totally different version, and at original speed/pitch Jennings Farm Blues (1) Key to the Highway/Trouble in Mind (1) Zep IV The Battle of Evermore (4) Stairway to Heaven (5) Going to California (4) Houses of the Holy The Song Remains the Same (instrumental with guitar overdubs) (2, 4) (this has been a grail for many hardcore fans for years, and great to have without the sped-up helium vocals) The Rain Song (rough mix) (5, and also necessary to pair with TSRTS) Over the Hills and Far Away (4) No Quarter (4) (great to have without the slowed-down quaalude vocals) Physical Graffiti Brandy and Coke (Trampled Under Foot) (2 or 5) Sick Again (early version) (2) (a revelation) Houses of the Holy (rough mix) (5) Presence 10 Ribs & all/Carrot Pod Pod (Pod) (1) (Could include the alt. vocal version of Royal Orleans too, but it's horrid so I didn't ) In Through the Out Door In the Evening (rough mix) (2) The Epic (Carouselambra) (5) Coda If It Keeps on Raining (When the Levee Breaks) (2) Bonzo's Montreux (mix in progress) (2, 5) (better than the album version) Baby Come on Home (3) Sugar Mama (1) (different mix and better sound than the bootleg version too) Hey, Hey, What Can I Do (3) Four Hands (Four Sticks) (Bombay) (1) (grail for many hardcore fans) Friends (Bombay) (1) (grail for many hardcore fans) St. Tristan's Sword (1) (epic grail) Desire (The Wanton Song) (2) Bring It On Home (rough mix) (2) (totally different than album versions; a revelation) Walter's Walk (instrumental) (4) (great to have without the 1982 vocals) Everybody Makes It Through (In the Light) (2)
  8. Oh, sorry, I misunderstood.
  9. Not sure, but Zep always had a sense of humor. After all, their band name means failure. So I'd guess they named their label Swan Song for a similar tongue-in-cheek reason. (The winged-man logo comes from a German artist's drawing, but it also looks quite a lot like Icarus in his final moments of flight before his wings melted - another fatalistic/ironic failure image...) As for the song/musical suite itself, perhaps Page thought there was an elegiac or funereal quality to it.
  10. Yes - but based on how good the 9-28-71 soundboard snippet sounds, it would seem that a regular/true soundboard source for 9-29 would sound a good deal better than the botched multitrack/stage-mic recording of 9-29 that currently circulates.
  11. I'm not going to defend the 2007 version - but one thing to keep in mind is that some of the crappy edits on the 2007 version were because they did a single mix, edit, and mastering for the CD and DVD re-releases, and so all the tracks that appear in the movie had to be edited to fit the existing video footage - apparently Page doesn't have the rights that would allow him to recut/change the video in any way. That said, I agree with others - it was f***ing stupid not to make the audio version its own thing and keep the musical integrity of the original 9 tracks.
  12. D'oh! That was a typo on my part when I wrote 9-29-71 - I meant -928. At any rate, I share your hope about 9-28 (and 9-29!).
  13. Also Montreux 3-7-1970, NYC 09-19-1970 (evening show), Fillmore West 4-27-69 (also 4-26, but 4-27 has much better sound) - and the upcoming Seattle 3-21-1975 soundboard release is going to be epic.
  14. I wouldn't get your hopes up, although I hope I'm wrong in my pessimism. If I had to guess, I would guess it will be an "upgraded" version of the video soundtrack source, whose sonic benefits over the existing best versions are modest at best. As I say, I hope I am wrong. Also, I'd much prefer to see the 9-29-71 soundboard released - great performance, plus holy sh** the one-song teaser we got last year is one of the best-sounding Zep soundboards from the entire '69-'71 period. But it would be weird to have that promotional photo, with that particular date, if it weren't a 40th anniversary release of Seattle '77.