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Companion discs are rubbish


Flares

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Even if we're Zeppelin nuts, enough to bring us here to discuss Zeppelin on the regular, of course we disagree on many things, because we're all pretty dead set on what we like and don't like. Think you both make decent points though.

One thing that sums up how I feel about the companion discs and the material chosen for them... something that sums up how I feel about them all in one sentence... What was wrong with including Danmarks Radio "Babe I'm Gonna Leave You"??? I can't think of anything more worthwhile for a Zeppelin 1 companion disc. And if a live version exists in soundboard form that hasn't circulated in complete form, it could be even better. That just sums up how I feel about the whole project. Missed some great stuff, included some subpar stuff that even us diehards don't care for.

Jimmy saying "didn't have much for Zeppelin 1 companion disc" is complete BS. BBC stuff would have been fine. Communication Breakdown from 4/1/71 is another I think easily would have done better.

Edited by Dirty Work
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On 6/16/2017 at 2:48 AM, Boleskinner said:

I've put forward my logical argument, if you want to resort to personal insult, because you don't have a counter argument, then that's up to you.

But I'm not resorting to mud slinging.

We'll need to agree to disagree. 

 

I agree we need to agree to disagree. As for an argument, I've made my argument, in detail, with a list of tracks and five different reasons why I think they are worthwhile. I agree with you 100% that you don't have to agree with my reasons - but to say I don't have reasons at all, is just silly. Conversely, your argument seems devoid of specifics, and your main "reasoning" consists of zingers ("we got a happy meal instead of a mother lode") and vague generalities that have no bearing on the actual argument: "music is judged with emotion and gut feeling" - well of course it is. We just feel differently about the tracks.

Edited by tmtomh
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8 hours ago, tmtomh said:

I agree we need to agree to disagree. As for an argument, I've made my argument, in detail, with a list of tracks and five different reasons why I think they are worthwhile. I agree with you 100% that you don't have to agree with my reasons - but to say I don't have reasons at all, is just silly. Conversely, your argument seems devoid of specifics, and your main "reasoning" consists of zingers ("we got a happy meal instead of a mother lode") and vague generalities that have no bearing on the actual argument: "music is judged with emotion and gut feeling" - well of course it is. We just feel differently about the tracks.

Can't let it go, can you.

Have to reply with another insult.

I put forward my reasons: specifically that you thought scraping a 50 per cent return on companion tracks was acceptable and I thought, along with many other fans, that it wasn't and the release was a major disappointment.

To rationalise your argument you had to go to the lengths of creating a convoluted key system with ratings.

When it comes to the point when your creating keys and tables and graphs to judge music, then you've lost the argument already.

As I said, "music is judged with emotion and gut feeling" not pie charts and protractors.

What's next a gantt chart to justify Page's musical inactivity.

Edited by Boleskinner
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It seems we're clearly talking past each other and appear to feel the other is not hearing what we're saying. Wouldn't be the first - or 1000th - time that has happened on an internet forum. Perhaps we can at least agree on that.

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3 hours ago, tmtomh said:

It seems we're clearly talking past each other and appear to feel the other is not hearing what we're saying. Wouldn't be the first - or 1000th - time that has happened on an internet forum. Perhaps we can at least agree on that.

Agreed. Let's move on.

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • 2 weeks later...

Luxury! Beatles fans have two unreleased tracks - Not Guilty and What's The New Mary Jane. Both are crap. There is nothing else - Leave My Kitten Alone and Lend Me Your Comb are on the BBC discs. I was quite surprised at the quality of the extras disc in the Sgt Pepper re-release but the songs are pretty much just works in progress or different mixes. The Zeppelin extras discs had enough material that had not evolved into released versions, some quite significantly different. Personally I wish that Jimmy had included bootlegged material as with remastering, I believe that the average fan would have been delighted and the committed fans like us would also have been delighted.  

Sadly, I don't hold out hope for an Earls Court release as it would take Jimmy at least 20 years to to cut and paste between all five nights, including a few seconds here, a few seconds there, until he was satisfied.  Still, what we have is not too bad quality so I'd be ok with that if we never see an official release.

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3 hours ago, Jukkin said:

Luxury! Beatles fans have two unreleased tracks - Not Guilty and What's The New Mary Jane. Both are crap. There is nothing else - Leave My Kitten Alone and Lend Me Your Comb are on the BBC discs. I was quite surprised at the quality of the extras disc in the Sgt Pepper re-release but the songs are pretty much just works in progress or different mixes. The Zeppelin extras discs had enough material that had not evolved into released versions, some quite significantly different. Personally I wish that Jimmy had included bootlegged material as with remastering, I believe that the average fan would have been delighted and the committed fans like us would also have been delighted.  

Sadly, I don't hold out hope for an Earls Court release as it would take Jimmy at least 20 years to to cut and paste between all five nights, including a few seconds here, a few seconds there, until he was satisfied.  Still, what we have is not too bad quality so I'd be ok with that if we never see an official release.

You're crazy, Not Guilty is great, better than some of Georges stuff that made it onto the White Album, imo.

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1 hour ago, Sathington Willoughby said:

You're crazy, Not Guilty is great, better than some of Georges stuff that made it onto the White Album, imo.

Yes. Certified and on day release only. So what's your excuse?

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  • 2 months later...

I think the Coda Companion discs are great. BIOH, Levee, Wanton, Sugar Mama, St.Tristian are all gems to listen to IMHO. Wish they could have got the FM broadcast version of Wanton pn there and cleaned it up too. Same with Fire.

So it's not perfect but i'd say it's a welcome pleasure.

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I'm not as disapointed in the material as I am the way it was released. That alternate SIBLY turned me on to the song after being bored by it for so long. One thing is certain with Zep and their marketing; Greed and product control to the max. Why not release all the companion songs on a double/triple disc set with new artwork? Forcing people to buy/rebuy all the albums was just begging for them to be pirated. At least a compilation album with new original artwork would've given collectors a good reason to buy it. It's no different than putting Hey Hey What Can I Do on a single instead of the album, just to force the sell of the single. In the digital age, this just isn't smart marketing.

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  • 3 months later...

..its all comes down to this.. there is no lack of unreleased material, there is more than likely tons of shit locked down in Pages "vaults"..  basically what he does, and always has done..and more than likely will continue to do..is simply release as little as possible..just enough so as to continue to sell cds, dvds, vinyl and box sets (ect). He is not going to throw all of his proverbial "cards" on the table thus leaving nothing more to sell. There will be " New Led Zeppelin material" coming out well past the point of Page being around, along with everyone on this forum now. Its all about $$ and getting the absolute most out of what he has.. and that means throwing out very small bits and pieces over a very long time along with using any excuse in the meantime to be able to do it this way (no more unheard tracks, lost tapes, no multi-tracks, bad quality, blah blah blah)   Its all bullshit.

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On 2/11/2018 at 1:34 AM, SamoKodela said:

I think the companion discs bring all sorts of details, listen carefully!

i agree with you on that.

Not to mention, the Zep III and Coda companion discs by themselves offer a wealth of amazing material: Totally different take of SIBLY; That's the Way at the original speed/pitch with dulcimer; Jennings Farm Blues; Key to the Highway/Trouble in Mind; St. Tristan's Sword; blistering alt. take of Bring It On Home; the two 1972 Bombay tracks; great alt. version of In the Light; alt. take of The Wanton Song; radically different early version of Levee; Sugar Mama; and a great alt. version of Bonzo's Montreux that is superior to the original/official version.

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Yeah, I listened carefully and heard slightly more hi-hat in rock 'n' roll.

I also heard the ring of the cash register as Page dished up a truly mediocre set of "alternate" mixes that are almost identical or missing vocals.

All the decent stuff could have fitted on a double CD.

A large percentage of it was fluff.

Studio Magik in the best possible quality was what fans wanted.

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10 hours ago, Boleskinner said:

Yeah, I listened carefully and heard slightly more hi-hat in rock 'n' roll.

I also heard the ring of the cash register as Page dished up a truly mediocre set of "alternate" mixes that are almost identical or missing vocals.

All the decent stuff could have fitted on a double CD.

A large percentage of it was fluff.

Studio Magik in the best possible quality was what fans wanted.

What about the tracks I specified in the comment right above yours? Those are not alt mixes or backing tracks.

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8 hours ago, tmtomh said:

What about the tracks I specified in the comment right above yours? Those are not alt mixes or backing tracks.

Mate, as I said, in my post "All the decent stuff could have fitted on a double CD."

As I recall, we've already had a lengthy ding-dong over the remasters, so I guess we'll need to agree to disagree.

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16 hours ago, Boleskinner said:

Mate, as I said, in my post "All the decent stuff could have fitted on a double CD."

As I recall, we've already had a lengthy ding-dong over the remasters, so I guess we'll need to agree to disagree.

"Lengthy ding-dong over the remasters" - I like that! :thumbsup:

We will indeed have to agree to disagree - and tolerate each other's ongoing posts about it in this thread.

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The stellar remastering work was the reason to buy the sets. The companion music was just gravy--and some of it was the best gravy I've ever heard.

We could have had a hell of a lot more if Page hadn't been concerned with only giving us mixes from the period itself.

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