Lawsuit over Stairway to Heaven

[IpMan]

2 minutes ago, gibsonfan159 said:

Then you have Sam Smith being sued by Tom Petty for a progression that is much, much less distinctive than Stairway vs Taurus. So one has to wonder if it's just money that does the talking.

Like a famous man once said, "the answer is always no if you never ask."

[timothy5151]

 

It seems Malofiy is stumbling right out the gate. He says at 1:18 that they aren't claiming copyright on sound composition but is appealing because he feels there was an injustice when the jury from the previous trial were not allowed to hear the sound composition. Huh?

The female judge seems to call him out on his BS at 2:00 and by 4:33 the middle judge seems to become annoyed with him and shakes his head and by 5:06 has a look on his face like WTF are we doing here before he goes back at Malofiy.  By 11:20 the case is falling apart and by 13:27 Malofiy can't even come up with Court examples or even give a convincing argument as to why Taurus' copyright should be outside the scope of sheet music, which would give him grounds for appeal due to infringement. He does not seem prepared at all. Very unprofessional. The excerpt below says it all.

 

Malofiy: "... I think there's many case we cited, I can't, at this moment, go back and tell you weather or not they were Section 9 or not."

Female Judge: "Well isn't that critical?"

Malofiy: "In every case that we have shown and in every case before this court, even in the 6th circuit, in other courts.... have never held, in Supreme Court, have never held that the deposit copy in any way defines the scope of the copyright protection"

Female Judge: "I didn't see any case where the copyright was secured by the deposit that the court held that. Can you cite me a case?"

Maloify: "I'll double check on that your Honor and supplement if I may"

 

Edited March 13, 2018 by timothy5151
Additional content and spelling

[TheMadIrishman]

From a musical standpoint, Taurus is nothing like Stairway to Heaven. The reason why the Spirit estate lost was because they tried to sue Zeppelin for the entire song even though they meant the intro. Another reason why they lost so hard was because they were basically sueing them over an A minor chord. If you read the sheet music, Stairway is completely opposite to Taurus- one is an A minor ascending chord while the other is an descending chord. However if you listen to them, thay sound simular because of this one chord progression. If you skip to 3:40 in this video, it really explains the riff 

  

 

[reids]

On 3/13/2018 at 2:54 AM, timothy5151 said:

 

It seems Malofiy is stumbling right out the gate. He says at 1:18 that they aren't claiming copyright on sound composition but is appealing because he feels there was an injustice when the jury from the previous trial were not allowed to hear the sound composition. Huh?

The female judge seems to call him out on his BS at 2:00 and by 4:33 the middle judge seems to become annoyed with him and shakes his head and by 5:06 has a look on his face like WTF are we doing here before he goes back at Malofiy.  By 11:20 the case is falling apart and by 13:27 Malofiy can't even come up with Court examples or even give a convincing argument as to why Taurus' copyright should be outside the scope of sheet music, which would give him grounds for appeal due to infringement. He does not seem prepared at all. Very unprofessional. The excerpt below says it all.

 

Malofiy: "... I think there's many case we cited, I can't, at this moment, go back and tell you weather or not they were Section 9 or not."

Female Judge: "Well isn't that critical?"

Malofiy: "In every case that we have shown and in every case before this court, even in the 6th circuit, in other courts.... have never held, in Supreme Court, have never held that the deposit copy in any way defines the scope of the copyright protection"

Female Judge: "I didn't see any case where the copyright was secured by the deposit that the court held that. Can you cite me a case?"

Maloify: "I'll double check on that your Honor and supplement if I may"

 

Hopefully, the judges will throw it out of court and Led Zeppelin can finally move on with “Stairway To Heaven”. They should actually sue the person(s) who brought up this silly case for damages and their legal fees/ wasting their time. 

R😎

[Tea41]

Translation of what Maloify is saying in laymen terms: "Can we please have just .000001% of anything having to do with the incomparable masterpiece Stairway to Heaven, even though it sounds nothing like the hoky, cringeworthy elevator music called Taurus?  I swear you'll never hear from us again"...

[hummingbird69]

32 minutes ago, Tea41 said:

Translation of what Maloify is saying in laymen terms: "Can we please have just .000001% of anything having to do with the incomparable masterpiece Stairway to Heaven, even though it sounds nothing like the hoky, cringeworthy elevator music called Taurus?  I swear you'll never hear from us again"...

+1

[zeplz71]

wtf, looks like an appeal was granted and it's heading back to court:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-09-28/led-zeppelin-to-face-retrial-over-stairway-theft-claims

[Stryder1978]

....LMAO...the Ninth Circuit, the court that has been overturned by the Supreme Court more than any other court in the history of the US!!!

[JTM]

On ‎3‎/‎14‎/‎2018 at 11:13 PM, Tea41 said:

Translation of what Maloify is saying in laymen terms: "Can we please have just .000001% of anything having to do with the incomparable masterpiece Stairway to Heaven, even though it sounds nothing like the hoky, cringeworthy elevator music called Taurus?  I swear you'll never hear from us again"...

Of course  STH  lends it's intro from Taurus (I've thought so for about forty years, right from the first time I heard it). Though it's not the same it's similar, so many people are blinded by Lovezeppelinitis they refuse to see any similarity. I'm not in favour of the remaining members of "Spirit" having a winning day in court though because they also borrowed the  "chordal sequence" too.

[NYR]

Are you kidding me??  It's a chord progression that's probably been played by different artists hundreds of times over for their own material.  No way in hell should the estate get anything. 

[JTM]

14 minutes ago, NYR said:

Are you kidding me??  It's a chord progression that's probably been played by different artists hundreds of times over for their own material.  No way in hell should the estate get anything. 

I don't know who's post you are quoting but you obviously have not read this thread properly, nobody has said "Spirit" should get anything.

[NYR]

Sorry about that you are correct.  I misread the humorous post before mine claiming that they should get something.  Kinda new here will be more careful next time.  :-)

[cosmic_juice]

34 minutes ago, NYR said:

Sorry about that you are correct.  I misread the humorous post before mine claiming that they should get something.  Kinda new here will be more careful next time.  🙂

Welcome to the Forum!!! 

[mysticman560]

I doubt anyone on a Led Zeppelin forum is likely to be objective about the lawsuit. Judging from the posts here, there's really no point in discussing the lawsuit against the band, because it seems that Zeppelin can do no wrong.

Edited September 28, 2018 by mysticman560

[SymphonyX]

Regardless of the outcome, I won't think of Zeppelin any differently.

This could drag on for years and even go up to higher courts.  Aside from the current circus going on with the Supreme Court, according to history we used to have more Supreme Court Judges.  There is a very good chance we will see a boosted number of expanded Judges brought in. 

[morningson]

America loves a lawsuit. And then another. And another. 

One question though: Stairway was released in 1971. Why did it take them the best part of 40 years to bring it to court? And I'm not being facetious, I'd genuinely like to know.

[mrmike9]

If you can read legalese here is the court's ruling from earlier today. http://cdn.ca9.uscourts.gov/datastore/opinions/2018/09/28/16-56057.pdf

[gibsonfan159]

4 hours ago, mysticman560 said:

I doubt anyone on a Led Zeppelin forum is likely to be objective about the lawsuit. 

Guess again! Although I personally believe Page borrowed it from Spirit, I don't think there's any legal grounds for a lawsuit because he plays it differently.

[Tea41]

7 hours ago, JTM said:

Of course  STH  lends it's intro from Taurus (I've thought so for about forty years, right from the first time I heard it). Though it's not the same it's similar, so many people are blinded by Lovezeppelinitis they refuse to see any similarity. I'm not in favour of the remaining members of "Spirit" having a winning day in court though because they also borrowed the  "chordal sequence" too.

The 2 are not even close, unless you need a hearing aid.  Real musicians like Rik Emmett explain why in this video, he plays both and explains how they are not even remotely similar. But you know more than Rik Emmett, right? Go to 2:38, and also 5:30 and learn something..

 

Edited September 29, 2018 by Tea41

[gibsonfan159]

Can we talk about how ridiculous the Whole Lotta Love lawsuit was? I mean, those words existed way before. People borrow lyrics all the time. Should've been thrown out.

[sixpense]

Would anyone expect anything less from the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals? They have a history of ridiculous decisions. (And at least one Judge has "issues" that forced him to retire early)

No, nothing to do with Kavanaugh!  

[hummingbird69]

Great Vid.  Rick Emmitt is awesome!! Love his work with Triumph. I'm glad he made it so clear that anyone can see and hear the difference.

[apantherfrommd]

This WILL sound stupid, but it is coming from me (The Ultimate Man).

But why can't music just be free? If someone wants to use notes here and there, let them?

Either that or I have another idea - Let's sue everyone who uses any note!

Because other bands have used them, and other bands have heard those notes before, and have probably been influenced to compose music because of those notes.

When you really think about it, how many different drum beats are there that can claim plagiarism? Why doesn't Ringo sue Led Zeppelin for his Sgt. Pepper's Reprise vs. When the Levee Breaks kind of sounds like a slower version?  Halfway Joking, Sam The Man. But these lawsuits are BS.

Led Zeppelin took notes on a scale, and did something amazing and better with them than anyone else had at the time. (period)

If someone else comes along and does a Led Zeppelin song better than Led Zeppelin, I would hope they would give the devil their due, but if not, I would hope music could just be free to enjoy someday. Bragging rights only.

4 minutes ago, sixpense said:

Would anyone expect anything less from the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals? They have a history of ridiculous decisions. (And at least one Judge has "issues" that forced him to retire early)

No, nothing to do with Kavanaugh!  

[Strider]

16 hours ago, zeplz71 said:

wtf, looks like an appeal was granted and it's heading back to court:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-09-28/led-zeppelin-to-face-retrial-over-stairway-theft-claims

Such a bogus decision...and just in time to cast a pall over the 50th anniversary.  Most media outlets will take the lazy angle that Led Zeppelin stole all of their songs, reinforced by all the bullshit on the internet by people with an axe to grind.

Now everyone has to be dragged back to court and time and money wasted. The first jury was able to render the correct verdict. Given the decline in intelligence and musical intelligence in particular in the jury pool, the odds of getting a good jury two times in a row are slim.

The fact that Led Zeppelin's music has to be judged by a bunch of peons is about as ridiculous as the Senate sitting in judgement over Kavanaugh's sex life. We all know Senate and House Pages are some of the most sexually harrassed people on the planet.

12 hours ago, mysticman560 said:

I doubt anyone on a Led Zeppelin forum is likely to be objective about the lawsuit. Judging from the posts here, there's really no point in discussing the lawsuit against the band, because it seems that Zeppelin can do no wrong.

You sound like someone with an axe to grind. So let us hear it...what is your take on the subject?

[The Rover]

12 hours ago, SymphonyX said:

Regardless of the outcome, I won't think of Zeppelin any differently.

This could drag on for years and even go up to higher courts.  Aside from the current circus going on with the Supreme Court, according to history we used to have more Supreme Court Judges.  There is a very good chance we will see a boosted number of expanded Judges brought in. 

The outcome will change absolutely nothing about my love for LZ and their music. All musicians (red, black, yellow, white) steal. None are without that crime. So in the big scheme of things, I don't give a fuck.