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dpat

TSRTS soundtrack original Celebration Day version

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dpat   

Back in the day, this was the original (1976) version of the "Celebration Day" song that appeared on The Song Remains The Same soundtrack, the difference from current version happens around 2:25, a version I find more appealing -- but was probably scrapped due to video restrictions.

 

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joeboy   

The original was far superior.  I feel Jimmy should have stuck with his original gut feeling about the song and not turned it over to someone else to decide.  

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Xolo1974   
7 hours ago, dpat said:

Back in the day, this was the original (1976) version of the "Celebration Day" song that appeared on The Song Remains The Same soundtrack, the difference from current version happens around 2:25, a version I find more appealing -- but was probably scrapped due to video restrictions.

 

That's fuck all compared to how they butchered No Quarter. Shocking!

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porgie66   
1 hour ago, tmtomh said:

Yes, the final guitar solo in the original is epic.

Agreed, one of the baddest versions ever. 

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jsj   

the new version of TSRTS is Page's absolute nadir in my opinion. changing the solo on celebration day to an inferior one, an incomplete black dog, the complete f*ck up of the no quarter solo, the horrendous clanking edit in dazed and confused, and isn't there a dodgy splice in whole lotta love as well. just f*cking awful

on the plus side of course we got the missing songs which was fantastic, but in many ways instead of improving upon the original release they made it more disappointing. I cannot think of any other album by a major band with such amateur editing

what Page was thinking is beyond me and why didn't someone say "er. jimmy, have you cleaned your ears recently, some of the edits sound horrendous mate"

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porgie66   
13 minutes ago, jsj said:

the new version of TSRTS is Page's absolute nadir in my opinion. changing the solo on celebration day to an inferior one, an incomplete black dog, the complete f*ck up of the no quarter solo, the horrendous clanking edit in dazed and confused, and isn't there a dodgy splice in whole lotta love as well. just f*cking awful

on the plus side of course we got the missing songs which was fantastic, but in many ways instead of improving upon the original release they made it more disappointing. I cannot think of any other album by a major band with such amateur editing

what Page was thinking is beyond me and why didn't someone say "er. jimmy, have you cleaned your ears recently, some of the edits sound horrendous mate"

I agree with you , but apparently the original soundtrack couldn't be altered due to copyright issues so it had to be as it is in the film. Not sure what that means specifically, I'm sure there are people here who can edify us. 

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Strider   

Can't believe I have to explain this again at this late date, as it should be common knowledge by now after the endless discussions that have been had on the subject of TSRTS Massacre.

1. Film rights vs. Music rights. This whole debacle could have been avoided by Jimmy Page if, instead of saying he was remastering/restoring "The Song Remains the Same" movie, he announced he was putting together a 1973 Madison Square Garden compilation release. Because when you are talking about a film, the director of the film has rights that are rigorously guarded by the DGA and AMPAS...not one frame of film can be changed without the director's approval.

Guess what? By the time Jimmy Page decided to do something about TSRTS, the director Joe Massot had died. That's when Jimmy should have aborted and changed his focus to putting out an audio-only release of the 1973 MSG shows.

2. By sticking to the film, Jimmy could remaster the sound all he wanted, but he could not add or subtract any footage. All the original edits (the short Black Dog, the sloppy Dazed transition, the missing No Quarter segue, the butchered Whole Lotta Love) had to, pardon the pun, remain the same. Any new songs could not be inserted into the movie at the proper point in the setlist, but added on as bonus footage on a separate disc. Celebration Day, The Ocean, etc. were tacked onto the DVD releases, but any theatrical showings of TSRTS would still be missing the extra songs.

3. While the film could not be touched, that didn't mean the soundtrack album had to remain the same. It is here where Jimmy's thinking is puzzling. Was he just being lazy in having the new remastered TSRTS album mirror the film exactly, bad edits and all, even though the original soundtrack didn't mirror the film in 1976? Were other people involved in the decision process...corporate bean counters? Kevin Shirley? There simply exists no rationale, other than laziness, for what they did to the new TSRTS soundtrack.

I never listen to it. When I want to hear 1973 MSG, I put on my original TSRTS album or one of the MSG bootlegs. I can excuse Jimmy's editing of RAH '70 and the BBC sessions and HTWWW.

The butchering of the remastered TSRTS was inexcusable and a failure to fans and the Led Zeppelin legacy.

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Mook   
14 minutes ago, Strider said:

Can't believe I have to explain this again at this late date, as it should be common knowledge by now after the endless discussions that have been had on the subject of TSRTS Massacre.

1. Film rights vs. Music rights. This whole debacle could have been avoided by Jimmy Page if, instead of saying he was remastering/restoring "The Song Remains the Same" movie, he announced he was putting together a 1973 Madison Square Garden compilation release. Because when you are talking about a film, the director of the film has rights that are rigorously guarded by the DGA and AMPAS...not one frame of film can be changed without the director's approval.

Guess what? By the time Jimmy Page decided to do something about TSRTS, the director Joe Massot had died. That's when Jimmy should have aborted and changed his focus to putting out an audio-only release of the 1973 MSG shows.

2. By sticking to the film, Jimmy could remaster the sound all he wanted, but he could not add or subtract any footage. All the original edits (the short Black Dog, the sloppy Dazed transition, the missing No Quarter segue, the butchered Whole Lotta Love) had to, pardon the pun, remain the same. Any new songs could not be inserted into the movie at the proper point in the setlist, but added on as bonus footage on a separate disc. Celebration Day, The Ocean, etc. were tacked onto the DVD releases, but any theatrical showings of TSRTS would still be missing the extra songs.

3. While the film could not be touched, that didn't mean the soundtrack album had to remain the same. It is here where Jimmy's thinking is puzzling. Was he just being lazy in having the new remastered TSRTS album mirror the film exactly, bad edits and all, even though the original soundtrack didn't mirror the film in 1976? Were other people involved in the decision process...corporate bean counters? Kevin Shirley? There simply exists no rationale, other than laziness, for what they did to the new TSRTS soundtrack.

I never listen to it. When I want to hear 1973 MSG, I put on my original TSRTS album or one of the MSG bootlegs. I can excuse Jimmy's editing of RAH '70 and the BBC sessions and HTWWW.

The butchering of the remastered TSRTS was inexcusable and a failure to fans and the Led Zeppelin legacy.

The sound on it is great in my opinion though.

I don't listen to many bootlegs either & I have to say I really enjoy it as I don't really know what's been cut out.

Having said that, I'm never entirely sure why he feels the need to chop & change so much, they were such a great live band.

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Strider   
2 minutes ago, Mook said:

The sound on it is great in my opinion though.

I don't listen to many bootlegs either & I have to say I really enjoy it as I don't really know what's been cut out.

Having said that, I'm never entirely sure why he feels the need to chop & change so much, they were such a great live band.

Do you have the original 1976 TSRTS album? Either on vinyl or the first cd release? A simple A>B comparison will show you what you are missing.

Yes, the sound is improved...but not enough to compensate for the gouged bits.

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porgie66   
10 minutes ago, Strider said:

Do you have the original 1976 TSRTS album? Either on vinyl or the first cd release? A simple A>B comparison will show you what you are missing.

Yes, the sound is improved...but not enough to compensate for the gouged bits.

I prefer the original LP mastering to the remaster but I can understand why people like the amplified, high eq sound of the remaster. The best way to listen to the whole show IMO is the Heywood remaster. It uses the best versions of Celebration Day and No Q, no missing beat in SIBLY and adds missing sections to Dazed and Whole Lotta Love. It was really confounding that Jimmy didn't remaster the album soundtrack or simply give us a complete concert from the multi tracks. 

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Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the story was that Jimmy just turned the thing over to Kevin Shirley, and he was the one who FUBARed it.

Its nice to have the songs not originally on the soundtrack, but the project was botched horribly in several places and that's all there is to it imo.  Agree with Porgie, the best attempt to date at getting it right is the Heywood edition.

Shirley hasn't worked on another Zep project since.  Coincidence?

 

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Mook   
5 hours ago, Strider said:

Do you have the original 1976 TSRTS album? Either on vinyl or the first cd release? A simple A>B comparison will show you what you are missing.

Yes, the sound is improved...but not enough to compensate for the gouged bits.

Yeah, I have the original CD, to be honest I hadn't listened to it for a few years before the remastered one came out and not since. I do remember a difference in No Quarter (probably because it's my favourite song on the LP).

Edited by Mook

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Xolo1974   
5 hours ago, Strider said:

Do you have the original 1976 TSRTS album? Either on vinyl or the first cd release? A simple A>B comparison will show you what you are missing.

Yes, the sound is improved...but not enough to compensate for the gouged bits.

Striders right Mook. After having the original vinyl I couldn't fuckin believe the change when I heard the re-release. Now, my go to version is the Heywood version. It has the best of everything - the extra songs, the original edits, the plantations, "thankyou" at the end and just an all round better mix to boot 

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Strider   
7 hours ago, FL6 said:

Are you guys talking about the difference between the album and film?

We are talking about the difference between the original 1976 album versus the remastered supposed upgraded expanded edition Jimmy did in 2005 or 2007 or whenever it was.

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jsj   
On ‎21‎/‎07‎/‎2017 at 5:10 PM, White Phone said:

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the story was that Jimmy just turned the thing over to Kevin Shirley, and he was the one who FUBARed it.

Its nice to have the songs not originally on the soundtrack, but the project was botched horribly in several places and that's all there is to it imo.  Agree with Porgie, the best attempt to date at getting it right is the Heywood edition.

Shirley hasn't worked on another Zep project since.  Coincidence?

 

even if it were Shirley behind the shonky edits, Page would/should have had to agree to the final version.

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jsj   
On ‎21‎/‎07‎/‎2017 at 10:19 PM, Mook said:

Yeah, I have the original CD, to be honest I hadn't listened to it for a few years before the remastered one came out and not since. I do remember a difference in No Quarter (probably because it's my favourite song on the LP).

just play the different versions of no quarter and notice the difference in the guitar solos. on the remaster there's a sizeable chunk of the guitar intro hacked out.

 

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jsj   
On ‎21‎/‎07‎/‎2017 at 4:31 PM, Mook said:

I don't listen to many bootlegs either & I have to say I really enjoy it as I don't really know what's been cut out.

 

I don't think you need to be aware of what was edited out just that the edits are so clumsily done as to be unnoticeable. I genuinely thought maybe my CD was faulty when I first heard the remastered D&C

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rm2551   

I have the Video In for a Quick Garden, the "Fan Edition", and audio only Heywood version and The Garden Tapes. (plus the official release, and other boots of particular nights)

Unfortunately I wore out my original CD so don't have that now. I believe the Heywood offers the best of the unofficial listens from comments around these pages. I'll have to give that one a run.

I was stunned the start of the solo in NQ was shortened when it was re-released. It was a crime to cut that part out as it really is magic. Leaving RP's voice unaltered was a big improvement, but why the hell take out that beautiful piece in the middle?????

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The Missing part of The Rain Song was fixed for the remaster.

 

Personally i prefer the remastered version cause the mix is so much better.

The left channel panning of the snare drum on the original soundtrack just dosent do it for me.

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joeboy   

The Rain Song remaster doesn't quite cut it for me.  The audience shouts and cheers are missing. The organ and guitar mix is not as good as the original.  Delayed cheering at the end is fake.  Clean and clear sound is not a soundtrack.

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