Your thoughts on autonomous vehicles?

[kipper]

22 minutes ago, Walter said:

@IpMan No problem guys/gals. Muscle car envy knows no gender boundaries. 😉

I love driving every time I get behind the wheel.

everybody knows Detroit hasn't made muscle cars since the mid 1970s.

here is what your car looks like from my bus window cowboy.  And probably by anyone driving a real muscle car too

 

 

 

[SteveAJones]

24 minutes ago, kipper said:

everybody knows Detroit hasn't made muscle cars since the mid 1970s.

here is what your car looks like from my bus window cowboy.  And probably by anyone driving a real muscle car too

 

 

 

POST OF THE YEAR

[kipper]

2 hours ago, IpMan said:

Have to admit, that was pretty funny

 

hehe! 

sometimes I cant help my self.  I'm not embarrassed to ride the bus anyway. I could buy a car, I just don't need one. You learn a lot about people riding the bus too. Not just the people on the bus, many who you make friends with. Its also a good opportunity to help other people. Everyday I carry a extra lunch in a bag to work and everyday I find somebody who I know needs it.  Im happy on my bus.

I just had to laugh at that car photo. So funny what people brag about sometimes.

[kipper]

3 minutes ago, SteveAJones said:

POST OF THE YEAR

thanks Steve,  

that made my day

Kip

[SteveAJones]

2 hours ago, IpMan said:

It's real simple Steve, I have no right to complain or critique Japanese life or government as I do not live there, nor doe Japanese life affect my life. You claim about the interstate highway system makes no sense in light of my comment regarding large scale metropolis having the proper infrastructure and public transportation. That is an apples to avocados comparison if I ever saw one and your comment is dead wrong. If the inner city mass transit systems  were unpopular, why did GM/Ford/ Chrysler invest millions to get rid of them? According to you they would have died a slow death on their own so why the need to destroy it?

I have never met a person who lives in or near a large city who would rather drive a car vs. take public transit if available. Further, the wino train as you call it is popular enough with the punters that they are standing room only...unless NY & Chicago, Portland, Seattle, San Francisco, Boston have millions of homeless winos no one is aware of.

IpMan, I'm suggesting it's illogical to draw comparisons between the US, which is metaphorically speaking an apple, to Japan, or Scandanavia, or Australia, or any other "orange" on the planet. You do this all the time, whether it's mass transit, health care, guns, etc.

As a by the way, the federal interstate highway system was conceived to replace railways as the principle means through which to transport goods, thereby promoting inter-state commerce. The nation's railroad owners were robber barons who otherwise held a vise grip on commerce. Of course the auto makers saw an opportunity to expand their market and took it, but again, it isn't as if rail was the future, then or now. They accelerated the destruction because that's a business principle called market dominance.      

NY, Chicago, Portland, Seattle, San Francisco, Boston have plenty of winos and street vagrants, many of whom turn train rides into spontaneous performance art. Most of the poor bastards riding those rails do it because they have to. Next time, just go Greyhound, and leave the jiving to us.

 

[IpMan]

1 hour ago, SteveAJones said:

IpMan, I'm suggesting it's illogical to draw comparisons between the US, which is metaphorically speaking an apple, to Japan, or Scandanavia, or Australia, or any other "orange" on the planet. You do this all the time, whether it's mass transit, health care, guns, etc.

As a by the way, the federal interstate highway system was conceived to replace railways as the principle means through which to transport goods, thereby promoting inter-state commerce. The nation's railroad owners were robber barons who otherwise held a vise grip on commerce. Of course the auto makers saw an opportunity to expand their market and took it, but again, it isn't as if rail was the future, then or now. They accelerated the destruction because that's a business principle called market dominance.      

NY, Chicago, Portland, Seattle, San Francisco, Boston have plenty of winos and street vagrants, many of whom turn train rides into spontaneous performance art. Most of the poor bastards riding those rails do it because they have to. Next time, just go Greyhound, and leave the jiving to us.

 

Actually, the highway system was never intended to replace or even supersede rail insofar as the transportation of goods was concerned and was not until the late 90's that freight shipped via truck became greater than freight shipped via rail. Eisenhower & the Clay Committee never brought up rail in insofar as a replacement of such. Though I agree, the railroad tycoons were indeed Robber-Barrons and general scum.

https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/infrastructure/originalintent.cfm

Regarding your apples to oranges...do you then consider every other country on the planet an orange and the United States as the only apple? That would be some hardcore American exceptionalism indeed and if such is the case, why do you not live in America?

[redrum]

9 hours ago, Strider said:

You'll never catch me in one of these contraptions...no way I would trust them.

When you put the key in a Russian voice comes on and says: 'Trust Me!'

 

[gibsonfan159]

8 hours ago, Walter said:

When you’ve got this 6-speed, manual shift, 426 horsepower convertible beast...who’d want to be driven by some bullshit computer? Life needs to be lived...

Just get the fuck out of the speed lane! 😡

Out of the 426 HP, how much have you used? Lol.

I can't talk though, I recently upped my engine size so I can zoom past the four-cylinders on steep inclines. It's nice to have some extra kick when you need it.

[redrum]

3 hours ago, kipper said:

everybody knows Detroit hasn't made muscle cars since the mid 1970s.

here is what your car looks like from my bus window cowboy.  And probably by anyone driving a real muscle car too

 

 

 

Didn't Anthony Weiner buy that off Craigslist?

[SteveAJones]

3 hours ago, IpMan said:

Regarding your apples to oranges...do you then consider every other country on the planet an orange and the United States as the only apple? That would be some hardcore American exceptionalism indeed and if such is the case, why do you not live in America?

Yes, in most but not all respects the US is the only apple. The principles that the country was founded upon and propelled the nation to greatness are now devoid from about 50% of the population. I could see the direction the country was headed 30+ years ago and decided I preferred to live my life as an expatriate. 

What many Americans will see at the train station this morning:

What I will see at the train station:

 

[paplbojo]

16 hours ago, IpMan said:

You know Steve I simply stated my opinion, no need to be insulting. You have your opinion, I have mine. I guess mass transit is another one of those luxuries other nations use successfully which somehow cannot work here even though it did until the 1950's when a corporate conspiracy (verified) destroyed them all except for a handful in places like NY & Chicago.

Do you know more about what this was? I'm curious. 

 

I don't think we can point to something 60 years ago as the reason public transit sucks today. If you are referring to the GM trolly conspiracy in the 40s I also don't think that has any real bearing on anything. I think the reason public transit in cities sucks is twofold:

1) it's naturally a very, very challenging proposition, to provide efficiency in so highly dense areas. Most of the European cities with good transit were bombed in WW2 and got to build anew afterwards, American infrastructure is generally much older. 

2) Government sucks at everything. The city governments and state governments responsible spend so much money time and resources on a billion and a half other things nowadays, that things that they really ought to exist for, like public transit, get thrown to the wayside. And since it is such a complex issue, being thrown to the wayside is a surefire way to ensure no progress will be made. 

[paplbojo]

33 minutes ago, SteveAJones said:

The principles that the country was founded upon and propelled the nation to greatness are now devoid from about 50% of the population.

It's a real heartbreaker, this is. Sad and true. 

[gibsonfan159]

2 hours ago, paplbojo said:

It's a real heartbreaker, this is. Sad and true. 

It doesn't help that every attempt by the educated, progressive people in the U.S. gets shot down by people wanting to make America segregated...I mean great again. "Science is bad, mmmkay!"

Sorry, off topic.

[Stryder1978]

48 minutes ago, gibsonfan159 said:

It doesn't help that every attempt by the educated, indocrinated, hate-filled progressive people in the U.S. gets shot down by people wanting to make America segregated...I mean great again. "Science is bad, mmmkay!"

Sorry, off topic.

There, fixed it for ya!

[Charles J. White]

21 hours ago, gibsonfan159 said:

Do you think they'll ever be fully implemented in society or just on a small scale? Is it something you'd be glad about or would you be against any changes for driving? 

I think the whole liability issue will prevent them from being fully implemented. You're not going to be able to sleep or read a book while the car drives you like a lot of people think. You'll still need to be prepared to take over manually in case something goes wrong.  That's gonna create a giant gray area for whose ultimately responsible for the vehicle. The driver or computer?

It's been said before but this is the REAL deal - the world is going to have MASSIVE anger and resentment and government won't know how to deal with it because of these reasons:

(1) Millions of Taxi Drivers will find themselves out of work

(2) This is from Canada just recently - a lot of people are going to be impacted: https://globalnews.ca/news/4000125/suncor-union-outcry-automation-oilsands-jobs/

(3) Millions of tractor trailer drivers will find themselves out of work

(4) 100,000 pizza delivery drivers in 1 company were just told indirectly they won't be needed: http://fortune.com/2017/09/18/pizza-delivery-self-driving-cars/

This is not 50 years away, it's not 25 years away, it's here NOW - and that means in 10 years it WILL be mainstream because insurance companies want fewer accidents and read ledgers only they don't deal in emotion and bean counters for companies will see how to reduce staff and improve profit margins - The great battle between contributors and users will be a guaranteed annual income because society won't allow hundreds of millions of people to suddenly become unemployed because that will lead to chaos and governments will want to keep order 

 

[Stryder1978]

...excellent point Charles, I was selfishly just thinking about my lack of trust in having a computer control my 75 mph vehicle!

[Charles J. White]

3 minutes ago, Stryder1978 said:

...excellent point Charles, I was selfishly just thinking about my lack of trust in having a computer control my 75 mph vehicle!

Here is an interesting discussion from Canada on the subject matter that talks about how many millions of people are about to lose their job - it starts around 31 min and 5 seconds - I know that in Canada for example when Uber first arrived Taxi drivers shut down airports because they didn't like competition from other humans - imagine what would happen when tens of millions of tractor trailer drivers, taxi drivers, bus drivers go into work at some point are told "We don't need you" and it's not because of human competition but because of self driving vehicles - PANIC and ANGER sets in

https://toddveinotteshow.podbean.com/e/the-todd-veinotte-show-episode-191-1504739903/

[SteveAJones]

21 minutes ago, Charles J. White said:

It's been said before but this is the REAL deal - the world is going to have MASSIVE anger and resentment and government won't know how to deal with it because of these reasons:

(1) Millions of Taxi Drivers will find themselves out of work

(2) This is from Canada just recently - a lot of people are going to be impacted: https://globalnews.ca/news/4000125/suncor-union-outcry-automation-oilsands-jobs/

(3) Millions of tractor trailer drivers will find themselves out of work

This is not 50 years away, it's not 25 years away, it's here NOW - and that means in 10 years it WILL be mainstream because insurance companies want fewer accidents and read ledgers only they don't deal in emotion and bean counters for companies will see how to reduce staff and improve profit margins - The great battle between contributors and users will be a guaranteed annual income because society won't allow hundreds of millions of people to suddenly become unemployed because that will lead to chaos and governments will want to keep order. 

The negative impact as stated is so exaggerated. For example, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics there are only about 178,000 people employed as taxi drivers or chauffeurs in the US. I also know for a fact there's actually a chronic shortage of commercial truck drivers, leading to cargo saturation at the ports. Hey, people use to make buggy whips and top hats. Time marches on.    

[JTM]

34 minutes ago, Charles J. White said:

It's been said before but this is the REAL deal - the world is going to have MASSIVE anger and resentment and government won't know how to deal with it because of these reasons:

(1) Millions of Taxi Drivers will find themselves out of work

 

 

 

[Charles J. White]

 3.5 million professional truck drivers in the United States, according to estimates by the American Trucking Association. And according to the government their 300,000 taxi drivers so that is about 4 million just there. Another 1.4 Million of Delivery Truck Drivers and Driver/Sales Workers. So that gets the number of to 5.4 miilion, another 700,000 bus drivers -around 6 million, another 86,000 who drive boats for a living, another 700,000 operate tractors . Gets you into the millions maybe 7 million just in the States alone. I'm sure there is many others - government is not really good at tracking people but we get the point. My guess is that you could double that number for Europe. Most likely another 7 million people in South Korea, Japan, Taiwan, Singapore, and China. Big changes coming, really big changes

[Bong-Man]

If it keeps me mobile and independent as I get older, I'm all for it.

[SteveAJones]

6 minutes ago, Charles J. White said:

 3.5 million professional truck drivers in the United States, according to estimates by the American Trucking Association. And according to the government their 300,000 taxi drivers so that is about 4 million just there. Another 1.4 Million of Delivery Truck Drivers and Driver/Sales Workers. So that gets the number of to 5.4 miilion, another 700,000 bus drivers -around 6 million, another 86,000 who drive boats for a living, another 700,000 operate tractors . Gets you into the millions maybe 7 million just in the States alone. I'm sure there is many others - government is not really good at tracking people but we get the point. My guess is that you could double that number for Europe. Most likely another 7 million people in South Korea, Japan, Taiwan, Singapore, and China. Big changes coming, really big changes

I agree change is coming, but I also recognize the way the world works. For one thing, the start up costs for a fleet of self-driving trucks is astronomical. For another, most of the commercial truckers are union members, which means they yield considerable influence on politicians. You can bet lobbyists will protect their interests through stringent state and federal regulation of self-driving vehicles.  

[Stryder1978]

43 minutes ago, JTM said:

 

LMAO....classic!

[gibsonfan159]

2 hours ago, Stryder1978 said:

There, fixed it for ya!

I'll have to let you have the last word on that because we know the thread will get locked lol.

[gibsonfan159]

1 hour ago, Charles J. White said:

 

This is not 50 years away, it's not 25 years away, it's here NOW - and that means in 10 years it WILL be mainstream 

 

It's ...really not. Everything is still in early testing phases and there are still major problems that aren't close to being worked out. Everything is speculation as of now. You know, jet packs were supposed to be flying us around by 1980.