Jump to content
Slate Blackcurrant Watermelon Strawberry Orange Banana Apple Emerald Chocolate Marble
Slate Blackcurrant Watermelon Strawberry Orange Banana Apple Emerald Chocolate Marble
Hotplant

Random Thoughts v.3

Recommended Posts

42 minutes ago, apantherfrommd said:

 

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/202/204/786.jpg 

I'm not certain. From the link, it looks like people in trouble. I think it's when people go sour because they can't accept things.

You brought up something about London's murder rate being higher than New York City's. To what do you believe this is attributed?

786.jpg

 

That is funny. I thought it was going to be someting about clinging to God and guns or something like that.

 

About London murder rate, i was talking to a lady from England and she said it is all immigrants causing the problems in London and not English people. She said the mayor of London is the problem because he is soft on criminal aliens.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, redrum said:

I don't even know. :blink:

image.thumb.png.a1286a6973cfad1cfe950c7d5691f7c0.png

MIND....CANNOT.....UNSEE :run:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

so I guess Russia chickened out

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, kipper said:

so I guess Russia chickened out

Maybe, or the whole thing was just a setup.... a show if you will. Again we simply hit some silly airbase which is likely operational again as I type this.

That being said, one of the things I did agree with Trump on was staying out of Syria. It sucks what Asad is doing but we cannot get involved in every single shitstorm around the world. Or, if we do we should have the full backing and support of the UN to do it which would include first and foremost, cutting off Syria completely from the rest of the world. Screw military intervention, you want to stop these assholes, seize all their assets and isolate the country, nothing in or out until they decide to play nice. You think Russia or anyone else could do a Berlin 1948 style airlift for a whole country for months? Um, no.

Of course that would never happen because it would work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, IpMan said:

Maybe, or the whole thing was just a setup.... a show if you will. Again we simply hit some silly airbase which is likely operational again as I type this.

That being said, one of the things I did agree with Trump on was staying out of Syria. It sucks what Asad is doing but we cannot get involved in every single shitstorm around the world. Or, if we do we should have the full backing and support of the UN to do it which would include first and foremost, cutting off Syria completely from the rest of the world. Screw military intervention, you want to stop these assholes, seize all their assets and isolate the country, nothing in or out until they decide to play nice. You think Russia or anyone else could do a Berlin 1948 style airlift for a whole country for months? Um, no.

Of course that would never happen because it would work.

Happy Saturday, IpMan! One possibility could be a coordinated political theater so to speak. The US did telegraph they were about to leave Syria. Purposely. Ask why do you telegraph your move and to whom? Also why would Syria (with ISIS 99% defeated launch a chem attack on normal families ensuring its own defeat from the jaws of victory) :) Does that make any sense?

- 1st target = SSRC facility in greater #Damascus, used for R&D & testing of chemical & biological warfare agents.

- 2nd target = CW storage facility, west of #Homs, used for Sarin.

- 3rd target = CW equipment storage & command post west of #Homs.

"None of our aircraft or missiles in this operation were successfully engaged," and that the operation took out the heart of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad’s chemical weapons program and set back the program by years.

While Syria tried to pre-empt the press conference by publicly claiming that Syrian air defenses shot down 71 of 103 missiles, McKenzie said: "No Syrian weapon had any effect on anything we did," and that the U.S. "successfully hit every target."

“Good souls will not be humiliated,” Syrian President Bashar Assad tweeted, while hundreds of Syrians gathered in Damascus, the capital, where they flashed victory signs and waved flags in scenes of defiance after the one-hour barrage launched Friday evening (early Saturday in Syria).

Good. Then both sides are happy. It's a Win-Win! No Animals were harmed in the making of this film.

Edited by apantherfrommd
grammar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bees have a stinger for self-protection. Yet in using it they die.

Nuclear weapons are mankind's stinger.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, apantherfrommd said:

Happy Saturday, IpMan! One possibility could be a coordinated political theater so to speak. The US did telegraph they were about to leave Syria. Purposely. Ask why do you telegraph your move and to whom? Also why would Syria (with ISIS 99% defeated launch a chem attack on normal families ensuring its own defeat from the jaws of victory) :) Does that make any sense?

- 1st target = SSRC facility in greater #Damascus, used for R&D & testing of chemical & biological warfare agents.

- 2nd target = CW storage facility, west of #Homs, used for Sarin.

- 3rd target = CW equipment storage & command post west of #Homs.

"None of our aircraft or missiles in this operation were successfully engaged," and that the operation took out the heart of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad’s chemical weapons program and set back the program by years.

While Syria tried to pre-empt the press conference by publicly claiming that Syrian air defenses shot down 71 of 103 missiles, McKenzie said: "No Syrian weapon had any effect on anything we did," and that the U.S. "successfully hit every target."

“Good souls will not be humiliated,” Syrian President Bashar Assad tweeted, while hundreds of Syrians gathered in Damascus, the capital, where they flashed victory signs and waved flags in scenes of defiance after the one-hour barrage launched Friday evening (early Saturday in Syria).

Good. Then both sides are happy. It's a Win-Win! No Animals were harmed in the making of this film.

One of the weapon platforms used was the incredible British Panavia Tornado attack aircraft. Even though it has been in service since 1983, it is still considered the worlds best, most capable high-speed, low altitude attack aircraft. It still holds the world speed record for low altitude at mach 1.7 at 200 ft above deck. That is goddamned amazing right there.

When it comes to high-speed, low altitude ground attack, it is the Panavia Tornado...except no substitute. These babies make an F-15 E Strike Eagle look tame in comparison.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, IpMan said:

 It sucks what Asad is doing but we cannot get involved in every single shitstorm around the world. Or, if we do we should have the full backing and support of the UN to do it which would include first and foremost, cutting off Syria completely from the rest of the world. Screw military intervention, you want to stop these assholes, seize all their assets and isolate the country, nothing in or out until they decide to play nice.

so then why did we get involved in Europe in world war 2? It didn't involve us.

Isnt Syria helped by Iran? Didnt Obama give iran billions of dollars that was seized and then didnt Iran use some of that to help fight for Syria?  At least that is what all the newspapers have said.

No Americans, English or French military were killed and also no Russians. I dont know a lot about war but that sounds like a good mission to me.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Strider said:

Bees have a stinger for self-protection. Yet in using it they die.

Nuclear weapons are mankind's stinger.

when the bomb was dropped on Japan didnt that end the war and Japan gave up? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, apantherfrommd said:

Good. Then both sides are happy. It's a Win-Win! No Animals were harmed in the making of this film.

My sentiments exactly. Message sent, message delivered.

Now the US and its allies should stay out of the Syrian Civil War, aside from deporting all the young, able-bodied Syrians in America and Europe who should be there in Syria fighting their own goddamn war for a change.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, kipper said:

when the bomb was dropped on Japan didnt that end the war and Japan gave up? 

It took two actually, but one could argue the US, indeed mankind, lost a good deal of its humanity by doing so. Mind you, I believe the bombings were necessary to end a war the Japanese started and would have continued to fight.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, kipper said:

when the bomb was dropped on Japan didnt that end the war and Japan gave up? 

I'm not talking about back then. I'm talking about now.

When the U.S. dropped "Fat Man" and "Little Boy" on Japan, we were the only ones with a nuclear bomb and since it had never been used on an actual living city, no one really knew what the full extent of the horror and destruction such a weapon would unleash on living things.

When we found out, our reaction was one of revulsion and a sudden realization that a nuclear war would lead inevitably to our destruction. It is also why the people who sold our nuclear secrets to the Soviet Union deserved to die.

More crucially, those bombs used on Hiroshima and Nagasaki were puny in comparison to the power wielded by today's nuclear weapons. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, IpMan said:

Maybe, or the whole thing was just a setup.... a show if you will. Again we simply hit some silly airbase which is likely operational again as I type this.

That being said, one of the things I did agree with Trump on was staying out of Syria. It sucks what Asad is doing but we cannot get involved in every single shitstorm around the world. Or, if we do we should have the full backing and support of the UN to do it which would include first and foremost, cutting off Syria completely from the rest of the world. Screw military intervention, you want to stop these assholes, seize all their assets and isolate the country, nothing in or out until they decide to play nice. You think Russia or anyone else could do a Berlin 1948 style airlift for a whole country for months? Um, no.

Of course that would never happen because it would work.

One day I do believe when there are enough really good leaders in power (kinda like the opposite of modern times) there will be a commitment to a baseline of acceptable behavior from Governments. Nothing overstepping any sovereign marks, just really, really basic stuff.

Countries who fall short will not be welcomed into the international community. No trade, no travel, no nothing. If you cannot meet the most BASIC of human decency/standards/norms, fuck you.

It should be like that now.

8 hours ago, IpMan said:

One of the weapon platforms used was the incredible British Panavia Tornado attack aircraft. Even though it has been in service since 1983, it is still considered the worlds best, most capable high-speed, low altitude attack aircraft. It still holds the world speed record for low altitude at mach 1.7 at 200 ft above deck. That is goddamned amazing right there.

When it comes to high-speed, low altitude ground attack, it is the Panavia Tornado...except no substitute. These babies make an F-15 E Strike Eagle look tame in comparison.

 

I kinda liked the F1-11's myself until they retired them some years ago now. I was lucky enough to have a project out at the Airforce base here, one of the older mechanics told us some incredible stories about the aircraft.

Edited by rm2551

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, IpMan said:

It sucks what Asad is doing

An interesting way to describe chemical warfare against civilians, many of whom were children.

16 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

It took two actually, but one could argue the US, indeed mankind, lost a good deal of its humanity by doing so. Mind you, I believe the bombings were necessary to end a war the Japanese started and would have continued to fight.

With regards to the US losing its humanity, by which I don't know if you mean Truman or every American (it was done after obtaining UK consent too)...I think it could also be argued that it was more humane than the alternative of a full invasion of Japan. It was estimated that the casualties for the Allied forces would have run up into the millions. That does not take into account the complete devastation that would have been laid down upon the Japanese and their home country. Truman did what he was sworn in to do, and maybe nowadays we can talk about his humanity/lack thereof, but over a million Americans did not die because of his decision. That was his incentive.

From Truman's Diary:

That day, Truman noted in his diary that:

This weapon is to be used against Japan between now and August 10th. I have told the Sec. of War, Mr. Stimson, to use it so that military objectives and soldiers and sailors are the target and not women and children. Even if the Japs are savages, ruthless, merciless and fanatic, we as the leader of the world for the common welfare cannot drop that terrible bomb on the old capital [Kyoto] or the new [Tokyo]. He and I are in accord. The target will be a purely military one.

Hiroshima had a large military base. Of course, many civilians were killed, and that is a tragedy, but not one that would have been avoided if there was a full scale invasion.

8 hours ago, rm2551 said:

One day I do believe when there are enough really good leaders in power (kinda like the opposite of modern times) there will be a commitment to a baseline of acceptable behavior from Governments. Nothing overstepping any sovereign marks, just really, really basic stuff.

I feel like this is partly being attempted with the UN today. There is such a lack of accord worldwide about what "basic" and "decent" even means.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, kipper said:

so then why did we get involved in Europe in world war 2? It didn't involve us.

Isnt Syria helped by Iran? Didnt Obama give iran billions of dollars that was seized and then didnt Iran use some of that to help fight for Syria?  At least that is what all the newspapers have said.

No Americans, English or French military were killed and also no Russians. I dont know a lot about war but that sounds like a good mission to me.

 

Kip, I am beginning to believe you are being intentionally dense as a form of either parody or trolling as no one can be so ignorant. The war in Europe threatened the whole world, Syria only threatens Syria.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, paplbojo said:

An interesting way to describe chemical warfare against civilians, many of whom were children.

 

You understand my meaning so please don't play the outraged observer, it is beneath you. Further, you cannot condemn one (Syria) for it's actions yet have no problem with dropping nukes on a civilian population AFTER the government surrendered. We got nothing for dropping the bombs as the conditions for surrender remained the same after the bombs were dropped as they were before.

If you believe the US should be the worlds police force,  join the military and walk the walk.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, IpMan said:

Kip, I am beginning to believe you are being intentionally dense as a form of either parody or trolling as no one can be so ignorant.

Bingo. Pick up your prize at the window.

Edited by Strider
For clarification.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, IpMan said:

You understand my meaning so please don't play the outraged observer, it is beneath you. Further, you cannot condemn one (Syria) for it's actions yet have no problem with dropping nukes on a civilian population AFTER the government surrendered. We got nothing for dropping the bombs as the conditions for surrender remained the same after the bombs were dropped as they were before.

If you believe the US should be the worlds police force,  join the military and walk the walk.

There is a school of thought that says the Japanese would have surrendered before November, before the full scale invasion would have started. That is theory, and while entirely possible, unknowable. A quick search led me to several websites that all concluded: They approached the Soviet Union to begin figuring the most favorable way to surrender, but publicly they restated intentions to fight until the end, rejecting calls for surrender. So they had most certainly not surrendered. Learn your history!

I wonder, IpMan, has America ever done anything right? Ever?

Also, I absolutely would have a problem if the USA dropped nukes on Japan after Japan surrendered, wtf kind of assumption is that to make? If Truman were told that the Japanese just surrendered, and he said, ah fuck it let's do it anyways, I would find that, obviously, abhorrent. Based (among other things) on the above quote from his diary, I cannot fathom that would ever be the case. 

And, I do not believe the USA should be the world's police force. I have been staunchly against us being the world's police force for a long time now. You continue to make wrong assumptions about me. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Strider said:

Bingo. Pick up your prize at the window.

I wonder, Strider, do you think that the USA should involve itself in any humanitarian crises around the world? I ask honestly, and of course there is not really a right or wrong answer. As I noted just above I do not think we should be the world's police. That said, I have changed over time to be more willing to step in, when there is both a humanitarian crisis and it would be of some benefit for the USA to intervene. Never putting our soldiers in harms way, but perhaps airstrikes as was the case in Syria. Few and far between, but if, with relatively little risk, we can help to put an end to a government attacking its citizens via chemical warfare for instance, I feel like it is worth considering. Of course there are crises like this happening all over the world all the time.

In this case, it is not really a case of Syria only threatens Syria, as Syria is really a proxy for Russia and Iran. Israel and Saudi Arabia seem more than willing to take lead.

I think the first step to ending our reign as world police would be to fully pull out of the UN. We started down that path by recently pulling $300mm from them. Gotta love it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

It took two actually, but one could argue the US, indeed mankind, lost a good deal of its humanity by doing so. Mind you, I believe the bombings were necessary to end a war the Japanese started and would have continued to fight.

thats what I thought. It basically saved lives on both sides and now Japan is one of the best  nations in the world.  It kind of reminds me of when the police are forced to shoot somebody who is killing people. Doesnt mean the cops want to do it, but sometimes there isnt another option.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Strider said:

I'm not talking about back then. I'm talking about now.

When the U.S. dropped "Fat Man" and "Little Boy" on Japan, we were the only ones with a nuclear bomb and since it had never been used on an actual living city, no one really knew what the full extent of the horror and destruction such a weapon would unleash on living things.

When we found out, our reaction was one of revulsion and a sudden realization that a nuclear war would lead inevitably to our destruction. It is also why the people who sold our nuclear secrets to the Soviet Union deserved to die.

More crucially, those bombs used on Hiroshima and Nagasaki were puny in comparison to the power wielded by today's nuclear weapons. 

I think we had a good idea what it would do. And as Steve Jones already said even he thinks it had to happen.

nuclear bombs are like guns  Strider. You need to stop worrying about the good countries that have them they arent the problem. If the good countries get rid of them then there will be destruction because evil nations are the ones making the problems.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, IpMan said:

Kip, I am beginning to believe you are being intentionally dense as a form of either parody or trolling as no one can be so ignorant. The war in Europe threatened the whole world, Syria only threatens Syria.

doesnt syria threaten Isreal too?  If Iran is backing Syria then that has to be true.

And correct me if I am wrong but in WW2 Germany wasnt threatening the USA. Were we supposed to be the world police then too?

I think you are just changing your arguement always to fit each situation. At least in WW2 we didnt know the Germans were killing innocent people with gas. Now if we know Syria is then shouldt we help those people?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, paplbojo said:

With regards to the US losing its humanity, by which I don't know if you mean Truman or every American (it was done after obtaining UK consent too)...I think it could also be argued that it was more humane than the alternative of a full invasion of Japan. It was estimated that the casualties for the Allied forces would have run up into the millions. That does not take into account the complete devastation that would have been laid down upon the Japanese and their home country. Truman did what he was sworn in to do, and maybe nowadays we can talk about his humanity/lack thereof, but over a million Americans did not die because of his decision. That was his incentive.

From Truman's Diary:

That day, Truman noted in his diary that:

This weapon is to be used against Japan between now and August 10th. I have told the Sec. of War, Mr. Stimson, to use it so that military objectives and soldiers and sailors are the target and not women and children. Even if the Japs are savages, ruthless, merciless and fanatic, we as the leader of the world for the common welfare cannot drop that terrible bomb on the old capital [Kyoto] or the new [Tokyo]. He and I are in accord. The target will be a purely military one.

Hiroshima had a large military base. Of course, many civilians were killed, and that is a tragedy, but not one that would have been avoided if there was a full scale invasion.

I feel like this is partly being attempted with the UN today. There is such a lack of accord worldwide about what "basic" and "decent" even means.

It was a loss of humanity for mankind. It could be argued that it was more humane than a full scale invasion, but it was a loss of humanity nonetheless. Truman is in deep denial to characterize Hiroshima as a military target. I've been to Hiroshima. I've toured the museum and the park. Truman never did, and diary entries aside, in his private statements he did later regret the civilian deaths. Three years later he made the statement, "...This isn't a military weapon. It is used to wipe out women and children and unarmed people..."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...