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LOCKERBIE. Terrorist is to be released.


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Hey Big Dan,

Nice chatting with you!

My sources show that over 73% of the entire island of Ireland, including Northern Ireland, is Catholic.

Ireland's largest religious group is Christianity, of which the largest denomination is the Catholic Church (over 73% for the entire island, and about 86.8%[111] for the Republic), and most of the rest of the population adhere to one of the various Protestant denominations. The largest is the Anglican Church of Ireland. The Irish Muslim community is growing, mostly through increased immigration (see Islam in Ireland). The island also has a small Jewish community (see History of the Jews in Ireland). Over 4% of the Republic's population describe themselves as of no religion. From Wiki.

Also, the native Irish people were Celts and Druids, pagans (as well as the native people of England). Christiaity came to Ireland with St. Patirck in 432, and in isolated enclaves or monostaries widely scattered in remote regions of the island.

The Norman invaders to Ireland in 1169 were of course Catholic, as was England at that time. Ireland did not come under Protestant rule until William of Orange (William and Mary) in 1690 (Ireland lost at the Battle of the Boynne). Of course you know that England did not become Protestant until around 1534 under Henry VIII. And indeed there was no Protestant branch of Christianity until Martin Luther in 1517. So the native Irish were pagans, then became Catholic, and the English overlords who took over the government and churches of Ireland in the late 1600's oppressed the Irish people and their Catholic religion, stealing their lands and their churches, instituting their Protestant faith.

And yes, the British, French, Dutch, and Spanish explorers/settlers of the Americas did steal the land from the native Americans (Indians, if you choose to use this term, meaning indiginous peoples). In the 1700's, the colonists of the US choose to have home rule in America, not rule by England, so they rebelled and fought for their freedom from England. Same thing, the Irish, fighting for home rule, not England rule. So both, in essence, are/were freedom fighters.

And using your definition of "terrorist", then the American Revolutionaries were indeed terrorists, too. An example: The Boston Tea Party. This would have been classified as terrorism in their day.

And I will admit to being ignorant in using the terms "English" and "British" interchangeably. As I learned on my recent trip, and as you pointed out, 1066 was the end of true "English" rule with the Battle of Hastings and Norman conquer of England by William the Conquerer, Duke of Normandy. But the English people prior to this date were an amalagum of Roman, Celtic, Gaelic, Anglo, Saxon and other ancestry. So what makes one truely English? Same with Americans. We are a mixture of dozens of heritages, and likewise, so were the native indeginous Indian people. They were a mixture of many tribes, and probably some came from Asia and Europe over the Straits of Alaska (Bering Strait )on a supposed land bridge between Alaska and Russia.

Hi Doc, nice to chat to you also.

Glag you took my post as it was meant to be, informative, so many on here take offence, which is not my style.

I, like many other people in the British Isles, (England, Ireland, Scotland, Wales) have come to realise that there is far too much hatred between us to have a United Country, so it would be better to go our own ways, while i have nothing personal against any individual (well there are a few i suppose) i just cant stand all the Moaning that you get from all but the English, with the exception of the English wanting Everyone to just "Go Home" and see if living back in your own Country is Better than living amongst your worst Enemy, The English.

No when do you think that the Native People of Americia will get to Rule there own Country? and i mean all of it, from the Artic Circle to Mexico and from East to West Coast, the Answer is of course "Never".

Now when the Red Indians start to Murder your Soldiers, Kill your Civilians, Indiscrimatly Bome your Cities, then and only then tell me that the IRA-UDA are Freedom Fighters., I have lived through the IRAs Bombing of London, been close to a few of their Bombs, its not funny, and its not a Fight For Freedom either, its Terrorism.

If the Red Indians did that to you, whay would your responce be? "Anniliate them" which is exactly what you did, and what we didnt do, so the Irish should thank God that the Anglo-Norman-British didnt behave in such a barbarious way as the Americans did in the 1800s shouldnt they?

And i just dont believe i could call the Revolutionaries People of your country in the 1700s Terrorists, because they were not, they were Freedom Fighters, and they won, if they had lost they would have been called "Traitors" and "Hung" i suppose.

But to say that the Irish Terrorists are the same as your Revolutionaries is totally wrong, they are more like the Red Indian and you are like the Anglo-Norman-British, Oppressive, Land Hungry, Money Grabbing, whatevers, and me? i''m just a Poor Englishman waiting for "My" Revolution.

See you next week, i'm off to the Country for the Weekend.

Kind Regards, Danny

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The debate about freedom fighters /terrorists is mute. No matter what anyones opinion is, blowing up a passanger plane is an act of mass murder. As a Scot, I'm feeling embarassed today

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Hi Mangani,

I stand corrected Sir, still no better than what we did with the Irish Terrorists though. But take heart in this little snippet i found.

" The US is Scotland's largest source of inward investment, with more than 500 American-owned businesses employing 90,000 people."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/telegraph-view/6062949/Lockerbie-bomber-an-ill-conceived-gesture.html

So the American Government can hit back at Scotland where it really hurts, in their pockets, close all business with Scotland at 5pm this Friday and see the Scotch cry in to their Sporrans. And teach them and the world that to put Money (from oil investment with Libya) before Justice will cost you dearly, but the thats what the world does already isnt it?

Regards, Danny

On the other hand BigDan a SCOTSMAN of the Black Watch fired the longest recorded shot in Afghanistan when he took out a Taliban leader at 1,500 metres.

This was only a week or so ago.

http://www.scottishsundayexpress.co.uk/posts/view/119427/Scots-sniper-kills-Taliban-leader-with-longest-shot

So yeah the Scottish law system didn't act appropriately with this Lybian terrorist but other Scotsmen (and other British) are giving their lives and fighting and dying side by side with the U.S.A. This sems to be almost ignored.

Some of the comments on other forums have been shocking. It's as if the Scottish (and other British) help on the war on terror doesn't mean a thing. Sometimes I wonder why we are there.

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Back to the topic at hand.

I just saw news footage on CNN of the Lybian people celebrating the return of their hero, the terrorist.

And the news commentator quotes Obama as saying of the release: "It was a mistake".

The Scottish government has been contemplating the release for over a week now. It's been all over the news in Scotland. It's a little too late now for Obama to be speaking up. Is that all he has to say?

What would you like Obama and/or the US government to do? It WAS a mistake. Obama did not lie when he said that. However, Scotland is not in our jurisdiction, we have no authority to usurp THEIR authority, we can't make them overturn the decision and bring the guy back. The Scottish government made a decision the US has been on record saying they do not agree with. That's the most we can do. Unless you want us to pretend Scotland is Iraq and invade or something. Because short of sending troops into Edinburgh, we can't do jack squat.

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Because short of sending troops into Edinburgh, we can't do jack squat.

True. What's he gonna do? Threaten Scotland or Britain? Where will that get him? He NEEDS the U.K on his side in the 'war on terror'.

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True. What's he gonna do? Threaten Scotland or Britain? Where will that get him? He NEEDS the U.K on his side in the 'war on terror'.

It's a little too late to do anything NOW, after the fact.

He had plenty of opportunity PRIOR to the release, while the Scots were contemplating the release for over a week, to make his opinion known, exert political pressure on the Scots to keep the terrorist in jail. The Scots did debate the release for over a week before they decided to release him. Since the Scots are indeed our allies, all he had to do was politely ask or suggest that they deny his freedom on the basis that it would be an insult to those who were innocently killed, those of all countries. But he has such a weak and inconsequential international political pressence, maybe they wouldn't listen to him? This incident just re-enforces the perception of him as being anti-American. He stood by and didn't stand up for the best interests of the Americans who were murdered and their families. It's almost blasphemy, in my opinion. He continues to be un-American.

I guess he was too busy making sure that the "Cash for Clunkers" fiasco continues and that his failing health care reform agenda makes him look good to his liberal cronies.

And the media is again suppressing the story, but Americans are outraged by this release and the president's inaction. You just aren't hearing about it from the mainstream media. Obama's approval rating continues to plummet.

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Holy shit, that's more talking points than I thought could be crammed into one post. THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES HAS NO CONTROL OVER THE GOVERNMENT OF SCOTLAND. He could stamp his feet, yell and scream and throw things until the cows came home, at the end of the day the decision rested with the government of Scotland and the government of Scotland alone. Maybe you're one of those people who think the President of the United States should be able to make some pronouncement from the White House and everyone merely runs at his bidding when he snaps his fingers. It doesn't work that way. There was absolutely NOTHING the United States could have done to prevent this from happening, short of some kind of armed insurrection. Hey, maybe that's what you were looking for.

To call the President of the United States un-American because he doesn't have the thought-making processes of the last guy is absolutely asinine. You wouldn't know what an un-American was if it slapped you in your Rush O'Hannity listener face.

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Sometimes justice delayed is not always justice denied. The victims of Lockerbie got an instant death.

Prostate cancer. What a lingering painful death.

Your `nads fall off and rot in hell. Not much use in the afterlife with the 72 virgins.

At least the guards in kilts don`t have to clean up the puke, piss and shit.

Let his loving family do it I say.

Maybe even Qaddafi Duck can pull a little bed pan duty for his "innocent" martyr.

qaddafi-crop.jpg

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Sometimes justice delayed is not always justice denied. The victims of Lockerbie got an instant death.

Prostate cancer. What a lingering painful death.

Your `nads fall off and rot in hell. Not much use in the afterlife with the 72 virgins.

At least the guards in kilts don`t have to clean up the puke, piss and shit.

Let his loving family do it I say.

Maybe even Qaddafi Duck can pull a little bed pan duty for his "innocent" martyr.

Well that school of thought is also a reasonable one. Can't argue with it. I've heard other folks say it's better that the tax payer in Britain doesn't have to pay for caring for this bloke while he's dying painfully.

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The debate about freedom fighters /terrorists is mute. No matter what anyones opinion is, blowing up a passanger plane is an act of mass murder. As a Scot, I'm feeling embarassed today

"Iran Air Flight 655, also known as IR655, was a civilian airliner shot down by the United States Navy on Sunday 3 July 1988, over the Strait of Hormuz."

An Act of Terrorism? or a Fcuking Awfull Mistake? Depends which side your on, doesnt it?

Hi Ally,

I forgot you were Scotch, and one of me bestest mates on here, i feel like i let you down having a go at the Scotch, please feel free to bring up "Banockburn" or any other Anglo-Norman Defeat mate.

http://www.rampantsc...res/battles.htm

Ally no need to feel "embarassed" by the Fools that make up All Governments, and the People on here who think or believe that this was done as an "Act of Compassion" are even bigger Fools, IMHO.

He was released to help OIL the Machinery that is being put in to place so that the Big Oil Companies can get there dirty hands on the Libyan Oil Reserves.

"British energy giants Royal Dutch Shell, BG and BP signed preliminarydeals with the Libyan government to help develop the national oil andgas sector. BP announced a $900 million deal with Tripoli in 2007,while Shell moved on a similar deal in 2004 when the U.N. SecurityCouncil lifted weapons-related sanctions.

Britain expects to increase its energy imports to 80 percent by 2015 asNorth Sea reserves become depleted. Libya, for its part, needs foreigninvestments to ramp up production, down from 3.3 million barrels perday in 1970 to a current rate of just 1.8 million.

Libya in the 1960s discovered at least 10 fields that hold billions ofbarrels worth of estimated oil reserves. Proven reserves approach 42million barrels, or roughly 3 percent of the world's total."

http://www.upi.com/E...54261250271038/

"Libya is Africa's major oil producer and one of Europe's biggest NorthAfrican oil suppliers. Supplies from North Africa to Europedestinations have the advantage of being both timely and costeffective. According to the 2008 BP Statistical Energy Survey, Libyaproduced an average of 1847.7 thousand barrels of crude oil per day in2007, 2.2% of the world total and a change of 0.5 % compared to 2006.Libya's economy is based on oil and exports contribute between 75% and90% of State revenues."

http://www.mbendi.co...af/lb/p0005.htm

Libya needs the Money and the rest of the world needs the Oil, its just Business, i thought that the American Government would be the first to see that, and that an easy "Buck" could be made here, the rest is just Posturing.

Western Democracy=Money over Justice.

You either "Say What You See" like i do, or you start quoting "Politics", and as far as i'm concerned "All Politicians", along with "All Lawyers" (well at least those who become Politicians) should be "Hung, Drawn and Quartered" like in the Good Old Days, whenever that was!!!

Regards, especiALLY to you Ally, Danny

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"Iran Air Flight 655, also known as IR655, was a civilian airliner shot down by the United States Navy on Sunday 3 July 1988, over the Strait of Hormuz."

An Act of Terrorism? or a Fcuking Awfull Mistake? Depends which side your on, doesnt it?

Hi Ally,

I forgot you were Scotch, and one of me bestest mates on here, i feel like i let you down having a go at the Scotch, please feel free to bring up "Banockburn" or any other Anglo-Norman Defeat mate.

http://www.rampantsc...res/battles.htm

Ally no need to feel "embarassed" by the Fools that make up All Governments, and the People on here who think or believe that this was done as an "Act of Compassion" are even bigger Fools, IMHO.

He was released to help OIL the Machinery that is being put in to place so that the Big Oil Companies can get there dirty hands on the Libyan Oil Reserves.

"British energy giants Royal Dutch Shell, BG and BP signed preliminarydeals with the Libyan government to help develop the national oil andgas sector. BP announced a $900 million deal with Tripoli in 2007,while Shell moved on a similar deal in 2004 when the U.N. SecurityCouncil lifted weapons-related sanctions.

Britain expects to increase its energy imports to 80 percent by 2015 asNorth Sea reserves become depleted. Libya, for its part, needs foreigninvestments to ramp up production, down from 3.3 million barrels perday in 1970 to a current rate of just 1.8 million.

Libya in the 1960s discovered at least 10 fields that hold billions ofbarrels worth of estimated oil reserves. Proven reserves approach 42million barrels, or roughly 3 percent of the world's total."

http://www.upi.com/E...54261250271038/

"Libya is Africa's major oil producer and one of Europe's biggest NorthAfrican oil suppliers. Supplies from North Africa to Europedestinations have the advantage of being both timely and costeffective. According to the 2008 BP Statistical Energy Survey, Libyaproduced an average of 1847.7 thousand barrels of crude oil per day in2007, 2.2% of the world total and a change of 0.5 % compared to 2006.Libya's economy is based on oil and exports contribute between 75% and90% of State revenues."

http://www.mbendi.co...af/lb/p0005.htm

Libya needs the Money and the rest of the world needs the Oil, its just Business, i thought that the American Government would be the first to see that, and that an easy "Buck" could be made here, the rest is just Posturing.

Western Democracy=Money over Justice.

You either "Say What You See" like i do, or you start quoting "Politics", and as far as i'm concerned "All Politicians", along with "All Lawyers" (well at least those who become Politicians) should be "Hung, Drawn and Quartered" like in the Good Old Days, whenever that was!!!

Regards, especiALLY to you Ally, Danny

Oh hell Danny, I'm not offended at all by your opinion of us Scots.Besides, the banter is alway's good for a laugh or two. I will say though that I can't be counted amoung the anti English group that you were referring to in another thread. I've got too much family on both sides of Hadrians to be anti anything ...lol

On the subject at hand, It was a mistake to release this terrorist. Any Scot who thinks it was the right thing to do really needs to question the motivation behind this decision.

Jeez, and people wonder why I don't see Scottish independence as being a good thing for Scotland

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Oh hell Danny, I'm not offended at all by your opinion of us Scots.Besides, the banter is alway's good for a laugh or two. I will say though that I can't be counted amoung the anti English group that you were referring to in another thread. I've got too much family on both sides of Hadrians to be anti anything ...lol

On the subject at hand, It was a mistake to release this terrorist. Any Scot who thinks it was the right thing to do really needs to question the motivation behind this decision.

Jeez, and people wonder why I don't see Scottish independence as being a good thing for Scotland

Hi Ally, and thanks for your kind words and understanding of a very complex subject.

What you said about Scottish Independence will always remind me of this, when i look at the World i see Power Blocks everywhere. North America, Europe, Russia, China, Middle East, and although Scotland may have shaken off the Shackels of the Anglo-Norman Yoke, she will most surely sign up to a European Yoke which may end up more unpaletable the the one with the Anglo-Norman's.

Many Scotts still live in the times of Bonnie Prince Charlie and that Treacherous Auld Allience with the Equally Treacherous French, but what they forget is this, the French were more about Destroying England than any Friendship with Scotland, or Ireland. In Europe they are as Selfish and Treacherous as they have always been, only now the Scotts are going to be a Competitor of France rather than a Enemy of England and will be treated as such. Mark my words Young Ally.

Its such a shame that both sides cant put away their Centuries Old Differences and Hatreds and become "Brothers against the World", we need each other as much now as we ever did, without the Scotts, and Irish, and Welsh, there would certainly have been no British Empire, no NHS, no British Rail or London Underground, we need to be "Inclusive" rather than "Reclusive" but we both need to at least think we are self governing. So can you please take back Blair, Brown and any other Scottish MP that has a Constituants in England, just for me and for the sake of the New Old Alliance. :lol:

Kind Regards,

PS, "Lang may yer lum reek"

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Hi Ally, and thanks for your kind words and understanding of a very complex subject.

What you said about Scottish Independence will always remind me of this, when i look at the World i see Power Blocks everywhere. North America, Europe, Russia, China, Middle East, and although Scotland may have shaken off the Shackels of the Anglo-Norman Yoke, she will most surely sign up to a European Yoke which may end up more unpaletable the the one with the Anglo-Norman's.

Many Scotts still live in the times of Bonnie Prince Charlie and that Treacherous Auld Allience with the Equally Treacherous French, but what they forget is this, the French were more about Destroying England than any Friendship with Scotland, or Ireland. In Europe they are as Selfish and Treacherous as they have always been, only now the Scotts are going to be a Competitor of France rather than a Enemy of England and will be treated as such. Mark my words Young Ally.

Its such a shame that both sides cant put away their Centuries Old Differences and Hatreds and become "Brothers against the World", we need each other as much now as we ever did, without the Scotts, and Irish, and Welsh, there would certainly have been no British Empire, no NHS, no British Rail or London Underground, we need to be "Inclusive" rather than "Reclusive" but we both need to at least think we are self governing. So can you please take back Blair, Brown and any other Scottish MP that has a Constituants in England, just for me and for the sake of the New Old Alliance. :lol:

Kind Regards,

PS, "Lang may yer lum reek"

Well Danny, us Scots seem to have too much difficulty getting along with each other to ever have any chance of being a united country. The old grievences that too many of us have with each other all too often rear their ugly head. Thatcher's Poll Tax didn't do the auld alliance any favours but for most Scots, save an afternoon session at the local boozer, the thought of disolving that alliance is unthinkable.

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Well Danny, us Scots seem to have too much difficulty getting along with each other to ever have any chance of being a united country. The old grievences that too many of us have with each other all too often rear their ugly head.

I had not really noticed, do you mean the Rangers-Celtic thing or am i missing something?

Thatcher's Poll Tax didn't do the auld alliance any favours but for most Scots, save an afternoon session at the local boozer, the thought of disolving that alliance is unthinkable.

She did for England what "Hitler" did for Germany as far as i'm concerned, the day she goes to meet her maker (Probably a Lizard) will be a day of rejoicing in my mind. I dont know any Politician who hated the Working Class of this Country as much as she did, Attila the Hun or even Genghis Khan could not have made a better job of enslaving a People the way she did, she even stoped giving Milk to School Children, and she called herself a Mother, she must have Broken out of Her Egg at a very early age, aye?

Kind Regards, Danny

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To our American Cousins... What about Lt William Calley. He has finally apologised (After 41 years) for commiting the worst atrocity in the Vietnam war. He (as i'm sure you already know) was responsible for the deaths of over 500 Men, Women and Children in the Mai Lai Massacre. He only seved THREE YEARS HOUSE ARREST. Something to remember whether or not you agree with Megrahis release.

Edited by johnthomasmoby
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Hi all,

To our American Cousins... What about Lt William Calley. He has finally apologised (After 41 years) for commiting the worst atrocity in the Vietnam war. He (as i'm sure you already know) was responsible for the deaths of over 500 Men, Women and Children in the Mai Lai Massacre. He only seved THREE YEARS HOUSE ARREST. Something to remember whether or not you agree with Megrahis release.

About the same way I felt about OJ v1.0 <_< Two wrongs don't make a right,and this is the kind of s#!* that is going to happen in a free society,.....

KB

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A little ditty I thought up sung to the Marin'e Hymn.

From the cells of Scotland ya-a-ard

To the shores of Trip-o-li

They released a true mass mur-der-er

His prostate made it hard to pee

He got a big hug from Gad-a-a-fi

When he stepped off from the plane

Where's a smart bomb now that we need it?

Those bleeding hearts are just insane!!!

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To our American Cousins... What about Lt William Calley. He has finally apologised (After 41 years) for commiting the worst atrocity in the Vietnam war. He (as i'm sure you already know) was responsible for the deaths of over 500 Men, Women and Children in the Mai Lai Massacre. He only seved THREE YEARS HOUSE ARREST. Something to remember whether or not you agree with Megrahis release.

Hi JTM,

I'm very glad you posted that question because i think both people, Calley and Megrahi, were both patsy's, the Bigger Fish on both occasions got away. Maybe thats why both "Patsy's" were Released early, makes you think doesnt it? ;)

Regards, Danny

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