Is Modern Art Really 'Art'?

BIGDAN · October 20, 2010

Hi Danny

If Tracy Emin can produce decent works of art, then why don't we get to see more of them? The answer is because what is required of art now is for it be controversial, to push the boundaries. Turner did this in the nineteenth-century but still managed to produce beautiful works of art. We've got to the point now though where art has become intoxicated with ugliness. Once we accept this ugliness as 'art' then I think we take a significant step backwards as a species. I don't think it has anything to do with class distinctions. Anyway I thought we were meant to be living in a classless society, at least that is what Tony Blair told us! Although I expect things are going to change a lot after today, but I'm not prepared to go into politics here!

Magic

Hi Magic,

Tracy Emin can and does produce decent works of Art, mostly on a Commission basis which is why you never get to see them. Art is Money, so Artists have to produce work that their patrons cherish and pay for much as we all do in our daily life when we work for someone.

In some ways we are all artists. I make everything that I can that goes in to my home, from Woodwork to Plumbing to Plastering, all are in some ways Art Forms, at the moment my pet project is a massive bird cage for my Budgies measuring 4ft by 3ft by 2ft.

If Tony Blair told you something/anything then you can take that to the Rubbish Dump, he is a god dam liar as are all Politicians who were once Lawyers.

If you don't believe in a Class System in this country then that's up to you, i for one know it exists, it exists in every society, always has, if you don't believe me then try to get an invitation to on of the Queens Garden Parties. My nephew goes a couple of times a year as he is a Patron of the Duke of Edinburgh's Awards Scheme, Me? I could only get in if my head were on a silver platter, so much for being Working Class hey?

Regards, Danny

PS, The working class are in essence Vulgar, and Damien Hurst is just "slumming it" when he turns out Works of Art that emulate "Crap" while Tracy Emin is staying close to her roots when she does the same.

Virginia · October 20, 2010

I don't get most modern art, but I guess art is in the eye of the beholder, so I won't say what is or isn't art. I took a few art history courses and all I paid attention to were the Impressionists and Italian Renaissance artists.

I was moved to tears seeing Michelangelo works in person. It's the architecture too; the churches, cathedrals; even the wall paintings and artifacts in Pompeii, or in the Perigord that I also find inspiring (not just in Italy or France either of course).

God help me if and when I get to Paris...

Jahfin · October 21, 2010

God help me if and when I get to Paris...

You will love it when you do. I had the good fortune to visit the Louvre with my family back in 1972. I still find it hard to believe I've seen the Mona Lisa with my own eyes. I do hope to return someday but I have other locales pulling on me.

Virginia · October 21, 2010

You will love it when you do. I had the good fortune to visit the Louvre with my family back in 1972. I still find it hard to believe I've seen the Mona Lisa with my own eyes. I do hope to return someday but I have other locales pulling on me.

It's definitely on my list

Magic Fills the Air · October 21, 2010

Hi Magic,

Tracy Emin can and does produce decent works of Art, mostly on a Commission basis which is why you never get to see them. Art is Money, so Artists have to produce work that their patrons cherish and pay for much as we all do in our daily life when we work for someone.

In some ways we are all artists. I make everything that I can that goes in to my home, from Woodwork to Plumbing to Plastering, all are in some ways Art Forms, at the moment my pet project is a massive bird cage for my Budgies measuring 4ft by 3ft by 2ft.

If Tony Blair told you something/anything then you can take that to the Rubbish Dump, he is a god dam liar as are all Politicians who were once Lawyers.

If you don't believe in a Class System in this country then that's up to you, i for one know it exists, it exists in every society, always has, if you don't believe me then try to get an invitation to on of the Queens Garden Parties. My nephew goes a couple of times a year as he is a Patron of the Duke of Edinburgh's Awards Scheme, Me? I could only get in if my head were on a silver platter, so much for being Working Class hey?

Regards, Danny

PS, The working class are in essence Vulgar, and Damien Hurst is just "slumming it" when he turns out Works of Art that emulate "Crap" while Tracy Emin is staying close to her roots when she does the same.

Hi Danny

Don't get me wrong, I DO believe that a class system exists in this country - I've seen and experienced poverty and social divisions myself. I completely agree with you about Blair, everything that comes out of his mouth is nothing more than rhetoric. I was being ironic when I referred to Blair's 'classless society'. After yesterday's spending cuts, I personally believe class divisions in this country are going to get even worse.

I don't believe, though, that Damien Hirst and Tracy Emin are producing art that represent the 'working class' because their art is 'vulgar'. L.S. Lowry is a great example of an artist who painted urban working-class scenes, yet the nature of his subject doesn't make them 'dirty', 'ugly' or 'vulgar'. In fact, I think their is a delicate beauty in the way Lowry painted industrial life in Britain.

I do consider people who make things to be 'artists'. My dad is a carpenter and I would say that he is an artist. I'm interested in crafts and make a lot of things myself. I would say that anything either you or I have spent lots of time creating is far superior in terms of its artistic value than a piece of contemporary art that involves someone walking into a dark room (and then falling over and suing the Tate Modern! ).

I'm really interested to hear about your budgies. My mum used to have an aviary of budgies and bred them. They're lovely birds. Although the female ones have a really sharp peck!

Magic

redrum · October 21, 2010

I had a friend and his brother messed around with his 'ol lady. The 'messer arounder' brother had an old Harley Panhead and when the other brother found out about his shenanigans he proceeded to smash his beloved Harley to bits with a sledge hammer. I wonder if that could be considered 'Performance Art' complete with shattered cast iron and spilled oil?

BIGDAN · October 22, 2010

Hi Danny

Don't get me wrong, I DO believe that a class system exists in this country - I've seen and experienced poverty and social divisions myself. I completely agree with you about Blair, everything that comes out of his mouth is nothing more than rhetoric. I was being ironic when I referred to Blair's 'classless society'. After yesterday's spending cuts, I personally believe class divisions in this country are going to get even worse.

I don't believe, though, that Damien Hirst and Tracy Emin are producing art that represent the 'working class' because their art is 'vulgar'. L.S. Lowry is a great example of an artist who painted urban working-class scenes, yet the nature of his subject doesn't make them 'dirty', 'ugly' or 'vulgar'. In fact, I think their is a delicate beauty in the way Lowry painted industrial life in Britain.

I do consider people who make things to be 'artists'. My dad is a carpenter and I would say that he is an artist. I'm interested in crafts and make a lot of things myself. I would say that anything either you or I have spent lots of time creating is far superior in terms of its artistic value than a piece of contemporary art that involves someone walking into a dark room (and then falling over and suing the Tate Modern! ).

I'm really interested to hear about your budgies. My mum used to have an aviary of budgies and bred them. They're lovely birds. Although the female ones have a really sharp peck!

Magic

Hi Magic,

When I have finished my "Work of Art" Budgie cage I will post a picture, I predict it WILL be Vulgar to the untrained eye, but very functional and as always very BIG and STURDY, just like Me.

Regards, Danny

PS, All Female Budgies are Bitches.

Magic Fills the Air · October 22, 2010

Hi Magic,

When I have finished my "Work of Art" Budgie cage I will post a picture, I predict it WILL be Vulgar to the untrained eye, but very functional and as always very BIG and STURDY, just like Me.

Regards, Danny

PS, All Female Budgies are Bitches.

Hi Danny

I look forward to seeing it, preferably with your budigies in it. Of course it won't be 'vulgar', it's a budige cage!

Magic

PS My guinea pig could do with an outdoor run for the summer months. Do you do commissions?!

Kiwi_Zep_Fan87 · October 22, 2010

Hi Kiwi and Magic,

The difference between "Working Class Art" and "Upper Class Art" is as clear as crystal to me in those examples you show us, the difference between Chaos and Order, Light and Dark, Yin and Yang, Toothpaste and Dog Shit, I get the picture, do you?

I met Tracy Emin once, she seemed as mad as a hatter and had no control of her emotions at that time, I suppose that's what makes someone a Great Artist, I THINK NOT, but on browsing around her studio I found some really good art work in the forms of models and sculptures that she had done, so don't judge her to quickly or harshly by what you have seen of her work, as there is so much more of her work that you haven't seen.

Regards, Danny

PS.

Michelangelo=Sistine Chaple

Tracy Emin=Piss Stained Bed

Both can claim to be Art, but one is like a "Lovely Smelling Rose" while the other is like a "Drunkards Fart" Who can tell which is which?

Hi Danny,

Looking at it from your point of view, I guess Tracy Emin wants us all to interpret that "filthy" work of art as the work (or should I say misdeed, because jokes apart, I wouldn't even consider thrashing my room like that or turning my warm and cozy bed into a pig-sty! ) of a very angry woman who pretty much thrashed her room to express herself and convey to the world that life is a bitch and that things aren't going her way? That's the only ummm sensible "interpretation" I can think of at the moment. I feel she could have just taken a picture of someone throwing a T.V set or computer out of the window to express feelings of frustration! It would have made much more sense to me! Just my two cents!

I also think that Tracy Emin can be termed as the ummm "Lady Gaga" of the "modern" art world? (I might change my mind about Tracy if she exhibits some those sculptures you were speaking of) Because while many folks out there consider Lady Gaga's music to be "modern art", I consider it to be absolute thrash and luckily for every Lady Gaga, there is a Led Zeppelin! The world can keep their Lady Gagas! As long as there are bands like Zep out there, I think I've been more than compensated!

Magic Fills the Air · October 22, 2010

Hi Danny,

Looking at it from your point of view, I guess Tracy Emin wants us all to interpret that "filthy" work of art as the work (or should I say misdeed, because jokes apart, I wouldn't even consider thrashing my room like that or turning my warm and cozy bed into a pig-sty! ) of a very angry woman who pretty much thrashed her room to express herself and convey to the world that life is a bitch and that things aren't going her way? That's the only ummm sensible "interpretation" I can think of at the moment. I feel she could have just taken a picture of someone throwing a T.V set or computer out of the window to express feelings of frustration! It would have made much more sense to me! Just my two cents!

I also think that Tracy Emin can be termed as the ummm "Lady Gaga" of the "modern" art world? (I might change my mind about Tracy if she exhibits some those sculptures you were speaking of) Because while many folks out there consider Lady Gaga's music to be "modern art", I consider it to be absolute thrash and luckily for every Lady Gaga, there is a Led Zeppelin! The world can keep their Lady Gagas! As long as there are bands like Zep out there, I think I've been more than compensated!

I think you've interpreted Tracy's Emin's work quite well Kiwi, and you're right, from what I have seen of her work, she is the artistic equivalent of Lady Gaga. Throwing a TV out of a window wouldn't be 'filthy' enough for her. All her work has to be about her, and her life, that is what the 'bed' represents. Another of her most famous works is a tent with a patchwork of names sewn on it, it's called 'Everyone I Have Ever Slept With 1963 - 1995' (sadly it was destroyed in a warehouse fire ) and she's refused to re-create it because she says it would be 'morally wrong'. See it below in all its glory:

http://faculty.vassar.edu/jamundy/Everyone1.html

This tent and her 'bed' is nothing more than self-indulgent tripe.

I read somewhere that she plans to open a museum of her work when she's dead. I hope it exhibits some of her better art that Danny was talking about rather than all the other rubbish she produced.

Cecil. · October 22, 2010

When it comes art for most part you understood either the skill or the message just by sight.

When it comes to Modern art there will be "message" that involves someone who might be in PR explaining to you what the artist meant...

aeonblue · October 22, 2010

Modern art? Well, i just think that any form of art is a true reflection of what humanity is discovering or passing trough or whatever you may call it, you cannot expect to find michelangelos in art galleries now. That´s not what humanity has to offer now by disgrace. Too much technology. Too much distraction. But don´t get me wrong, i´m not being pesimistic there´s good stuff and you will find it if you´re willing to look for it.

Anyway Magic i post this links that you might like, i hope you do....