BIGDAN Posted October 20, 2010 Posted October 20, 2010 Hi Danny If Tracy Emin can produce decent works of art, then why don't we get to see more of them? The answer is because what is required of art now is for it be controversial, to push the boundaries. Turner did this in the nineteenth-century but still managed to produce beautiful works of art. We've got to the point now though where art has become intoxicated with ugliness. Once we accept this ugliness as 'art' then I think we take a significant step backwards as a species. I don't think it has anything to do with class distinctions. Anyway I thought we were meant to be living in a classless society, at least that is what Tony Blair told us! Although I expect things are going to change a lot after today, but I'm not prepared to go into politics here! Magic Hi Magic, Tracy Emin can and does produce decent works of Art, mostly on a Commission basis which is why you never get to see them. Art is Money, so Artists have to produce work that their patrons cherish and pay for much as we all do in our daily life when we work for someone. In some ways we are all artists. I make everything that I can that goes in to my home, from Woodwork to Plumbing to Plastering, all are in some ways Art Forms, at the moment my pet project is a massive bird cage for my Budgies measuring 4ft by 3ft by 2ft. If Tony Blair told you something/anything then you can take that to the Rubbish Dump, he is a god dam liar as are all Politicians who were once Lawyers. If you don't believe in a Class System in this country then that's up to you, i for one know it exists, it exists in every society, always has, if you don't believe me then try to get an invitation to on of the Queens Garden Parties. My nephew goes a couple of times a year as he is a Patron of the Duke of Edinburgh's Awards Scheme, Me? I could only get in if my head were on a silver platter, so much for being Working Class hey? Regards, Danny PS, The working class are in essence Vulgar, and Damien Hurst is just "slumming it" when he turns out Works of Art that emulate "Crap" while Tracy Emin is staying close to her roots when she does the same. Quote
Virginia Posted October 20, 2010 Posted October 20, 2010 (edited) I don't get most modern art, but I guess art is in the eye of the beholder, so I won't say what is or isn't art. I took a few art history courses and all I paid attention to were the Impressionists and Italian Renaissance artists. I was moved to tears seeing Michelangelo works in person. It's the architecture too; the churches, cathedrals; even the wall paintings and artifacts in Pompeii, or in the Perigord that I also find inspiring (not just in Italy or France either of course). God help me if and when I get to Paris... Edited October 20, 2010 by Virginia Quote
Jahfin Posted October 21, 2010 Posted October 21, 2010 God help me if and when I get to Paris... You will love it when you do. I had the good fortune to visit the Louvre with my family back in 1972. I still find it hard to believe I've seen the Mona Lisa with my own eyes. I do hope to return someday but I have other locales pulling on me. Quote
Virginia Posted October 21, 2010 Posted October 21, 2010 You will love it when you do. I had the good fortune to visit the Louvre with my family back in 1972. I still find it hard to believe I've seen the Mona Lisa with my own eyes. I do hope to return someday but I have other locales pulling on me. It's definitely on my list Quote
Magic Fills the Air Posted October 21, 2010 Author Posted October 21, 2010 (edited) Hi Magic, Tracy Emin can and does produce decent works of Art, mostly on a Commission basis which is why you never get to see them. Art is Money, so Artists have to produce work that their patrons cherish and pay for much as we all do in our daily life when we work for someone. In some ways we are all artists. I make everything that I can that goes in to my home, from Woodwork to Plumbing to Plastering, all are in some ways Art Forms, at the moment my pet project is a massive bird cage for my Budgies measuring 4ft by 3ft by 2ft. If Tony Blair told you something/anything then you can take that to the Rubbish Dump, he is a god dam liar as are all Politicians who were once Lawyers. If you don't believe in a Class System in this country then that's up to you, i for one know it exists, it exists in every society, always has, if you don't believe me then try to get an invitation to on of the Queens Garden Parties. My nephew goes a couple of times a year as he is a Patron of the Duke of Edinburgh's Awards Scheme, Me? I could only get in if my head were on a silver platter, so much for being Working Class hey? Regards, Danny PS, The working class are in essence Vulgar, and Damien Hurst is just "slumming it" when he turns out Works of Art that emulate "Crap" while Tracy Emin is staying close to her roots when she does the same. Hi Danny Don't get me wrong, I DO believe that a class system exists in this country - I've seen and experienced poverty and social divisions myself. I completely agree with you about Blair, everything that comes out of his mouth is nothing more than rhetoric. I was being ironic when I referred to Blair's 'classless society'. After yesterday's spending cuts, I personally believe class divisions in this country are going to get even worse. I don't believe, though, that Damien Hirst and Tracy Emin are producing art that represent the 'working class' because their art is 'vulgar'. L.S. Lowry is a great example of an artist who painted urban working-class scenes, yet the nature of his subject doesn't make them 'dirty', 'ugly' or 'vulgar'. In fact, I think their is a delicate beauty in the way Lowry painted industrial life in Britain. I do consider people who make things to be 'artists'. My dad is a carpenter and I would say that he is an artist. I'm interested in crafts and make a lot of things myself. I would say that anything either you or I have spent lots of time creating is far superior in terms of its artistic value than a piece of contemporary art that involves someone walking into a dark room (and then falling over and suing the Tate Modern! ). I'm really interested to hear about your budgies. My mum used to have an aviary of budgies and bred them. They're lovely birds. Although the female ones have a really sharp peck! Magic Edited October 21, 2010 by Magic Fills the Air Quote
redrum Posted October 21, 2010 Posted October 21, 2010 I had a friend and his brother messed around with his 'ol lady. The 'messer arounder' brother had an old Harley Panhead and when the other brother found out about his shenanigans he proceeded to smash his beloved Harley to bits with a sledge hammer. I wonder if that could be considered 'Performance Art' complete with shattered cast iron and spilled oil? Quote
BIGDAN Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 Hi Danny Don't get me wrong, I DO believe that a class system exists in this country - I've seen and experienced poverty and social divisions myself. I completely agree with you about Blair, everything that comes out of his mouth is nothing more than rhetoric. I was being ironic when I referred to Blair's 'classless society'. After yesterday's spending cuts, I personally believe class divisions in this country are going to get even worse. I don't believe, though, that Damien Hirst and Tracy Emin are producing art that represent the 'working class' because their art is 'vulgar'. L.S. Lowry is a great example of an artist who painted urban working-class scenes, yet the nature of his subject doesn't make them 'dirty', 'ugly' or 'vulgar'. In fact, I think their is a delicate beauty in the way Lowry painted industrial life in Britain. I do consider people who make things to be 'artists'. My dad is a carpenter and I would say that he is an artist. I'm interested in crafts and make a lot of things myself. I would say that anything either you or I have spent lots of time creating is far superior in terms of its artistic value than a piece of contemporary art that involves someone walking into a dark room (and then falling over and suing the Tate Modern! ). I'm really interested to hear about your budgies. My mum used to have an aviary of budgies and bred them. They're lovely birds. Although the female ones have a really sharp peck! Magic Hi Magic, When I have finished my "Work of Art" Budgie cage I will post a picture, I predict it WILL be Vulgar to the untrained eye, but very functional and as always very BIG and STURDY, just like Me. Regards, Danny PS, All Female Budgies are Bitches. Quote
Magic Fills the Air Posted October 22, 2010 Author Posted October 22, 2010 Hi Magic, When I have finished my "Work of Art" Budgie cage I will post a picture, I predict it WILL be Vulgar to the untrained eye, but very functional and as always very BIG and STURDY, just like Me. Regards, Danny PS, All Female Budgies are Bitches. Hi Danny I look forward to seeing it, preferably with your budigies in it. Of course it won't be 'vulgar', it's a budige cage! Magic PS My guinea pig could do with an outdoor run for the summer months. Do you do commissions?! Quote
Kiwi_Zep_Fan87 Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 (edited) Hi Kiwi and Magic, The difference between "Working Class Art" and "Upper Class Art" is as clear as crystal to me in those examples you show us, the difference between Chaos and Order, Light and Dark, Yin and Yang, Toothpaste and Dog Shit, I get the picture, do you? I met Tracy Emin once, she seemed as mad as a hatter and had no control of her emotions at that time, I suppose that's what makes someone a Great Artist, I THINK NOT, but on browsing around her studio I found some really good art work in the forms of models and sculptures that she had done, so don't judge her to quickly or harshly by what you have seen of her work, as there is so much more of her work that you haven't seen. Regards, Danny PS. Michelangelo=Sistine Chaple Tracy Emin=Piss Stained Bed Both can claim to be Art, but one is like a "Lovely Smelling Rose" while the other is like a "Drunkards Fart" Who can tell which is which? Hi Danny, Looking at it from your point of view, I guess Tracy Emin wants us all to interpret that "filthy" work of art as the work (or should I say misdeed, because jokes apart, I wouldn't even consider thrashing my room like that or turning my warm and cozy bed into a pig-sty! ) of a very angry woman who pretty much thrashed her room to express herself and convey to the world that life is a bitch and that things aren't going her way? That's the only ummm sensible "interpretation" I can think of at the moment. I feel she could have just taken a picture of someone throwing a T.V set or computer out of the window to express feelings of frustration! It would have made much more sense to me! Just my two cents! I also think that Tracy Emin can be termed as the ummm "Lady Gaga" of the "modern" art world? (I might change my mind about Tracy if she exhibits some those sculptures you were speaking of) Because while many folks out there consider Lady Gaga's music to be "modern art", I consider it to be absolute thrash and luckily for every Lady Gaga, there is a Led Zeppelin! The world can keep their Lady Gagas! As long as there are bands like Zep out there, I think I've been more than compensated! Edited October 22, 2010 by Kiwi_Zep_Fan87 Quote
Magic Fills the Air Posted October 22, 2010 Author Posted October 22, 2010 (edited) Hi Danny, Looking at it from your point of view, I guess Tracy Emin wants us all to interpret that "filthy" work of art as the work (or should I say misdeed, because jokes apart, I wouldn't even consider thrashing my room like that or turning my warm and cozy bed into a pig-sty! ) of a very angry woman who pretty much thrashed her room to express herself and convey to the world that life is a bitch and that things aren't going her way? That's the only ummm sensible "interpretation" I can think of at the moment. I feel she could have just taken a picture of someone throwing a T.V set or computer out of the window to express feelings of frustration! It would have made much more sense to me! Just my two cents! I also think that Tracy Emin can be termed as the ummm "Lady Gaga" of the "modern" art world? (I might change my mind about Tracy if she exhibits some those sculptures you were speaking of) Because while many folks out there consider Lady Gaga's music to be "modern art", I consider it to be absolute thrash and luckily for every Lady Gaga, there is a Led Zeppelin! The world can keep their Lady Gagas! As long as there are bands like Zep out there, I think I've been more than compensated! I think you've interpreted Tracy's Emin's work quite well Kiwi, and you're right, from what I have seen of her work, she is the artistic equivalent of Lady Gaga. Throwing a TV out of a window wouldn't be 'filthy' enough for her. All her work has to be about her, and her life, that is what the 'bed' represents. Another of her most famous works is a tent with a patchwork of names sewn on it, it's called 'Everyone I Have Ever Slept With 1963 - 1995' (sadly it was destroyed in a warehouse fire ) and she's refused to re-create it because she says it would be 'morally wrong'. See it below in all its glory: http://faculty.vassar.edu/jamundy/Everyone1.html This tent and her 'bed' is nothing more than self-indulgent tripe. I read somewhere that she plans to open a museum of her work when she's dead. I hope it exhibits some of her better art that Danny was talking about rather than all the other rubbish she produced. Edited October 22, 2010 by Magic Fills the Air Quote
Cecil. Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 When it comes art for most part you understood either the skill or the message just by sight. When it comes to Modern art there will be "message" that involves someone who might be in PR explaining to you what the artist meant... Quote
aeonblue Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 Modern art? Well, i just think that any form of art is a true reflection of what humanity is discovering or passing trough or whatever you may call it, you cannot expect to find michelangelos in art galleries now. That´s not what humanity has to offer now by disgrace. Too much technology. Too much distraction. But don´t get me wrong, i´m not being pesimistic there´s good stuff and you will find it if you´re willing to look for it. Anyway Magic i post this links that you might like, i hope you do.... http://www.vacher.co...vas-watercolors http://www.swanbones...inggallery.html http://www.di-maccio...ngs.php?lang=en Quote
Lake of Shadows Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Is Modern Art Really 'Art'? Yes, it is. ~~~~~~~~ Electrophile's post comes the closest to 'correct' when it comes right down to it. FWIW, IMO photography can most definitely be "art". Some books are profound, some are mind candy. The same is true of music, other performing arts, fine arts, etc. Some art is "Art", and some is not. Whether it's something profound or mind candy, it can have validity as art. I get the feeling though that this isn't supposed to be one of those deep philosophical questions of What Is Art, so I'll just stop there. It's all just my opinion, of course... Quote
Kiwi_Zep_Fan87 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 (edited) I think you've interpreted Tracy's Emin's work quite well Kiwi, and you're right, from what I have seen of her work, she is the artistic equivalent of Lady Gaga. Throwing a TV out of a window wouldn't be 'filthy' enough for her. All her work has to be about her, and her life, that is what the 'bed' represents. Another of her most famous works is a tent with a patchwork of names sewn on it, it's called 'Everyone I Have Ever Slept With 1963 - 1995' (sadly it was destroyed in a warehouse fire ) and she's refused to re-create it because she says it would be 'morally wrong'. See it below in all its glory: http://faculty.vassa.../Everyone1.html This tent and her 'bed' is nothing more than self-indulgent tripe. I read somewhere that she plans to open a museum of her work when she's dead. I hope it exhibits some of her better art that Danny was talking about rather than all the other rubbish she produced. LOL! Thanks Magic! I pretty much put down what came to mind! I really do wonder what made Tracy feel that it was "morally wrong" to re-create that rather revealing piece? Magic, be sure to check out some these art works right here (it's by one of the members on this very forum. Her nickname is "justawoman") : http://www.katcrosbyart.com/ Look out for the traditional pieces. Like this one : This put a smile on my face! I think there is one Led Zeppelin inspired piece too! Good stuff! Edited October 23, 2010 by Kiwi_Zep_Fan87 Quote
Magic Fills the Air Posted October 23, 2010 Author Posted October 23, 2010 Modern art? Well, i just think that any form of art is a true reflection of what humanity is discovering or passing trough or whatever you may call it, you cannot expect to find michelangelos in art galleries now. That´s not what humanity has to offer now by disgrace. Too much technology. Too much distraction. But don´t get me wrong, i´m not being pesimistic there´s good stuff and you will find it if you´re willing to look for it. Anyway Magic i post this links that you might like, i hope you do.... http://www.vacher.co...vas-watercolors http://www.swanbones...inggallery.html http://www.di-maccio...ngs.php?lang=en I think the links you've posted display that there are still great artists out there with talent. The artwork in the first link is astounding. I would gladly hang any of those painting on my wall. Thank you for posting the link, I really enjoyed looking through the artwork. Quote
Magic Fills the Air Posted October 23, 2010 Author Posted October 23, 2010 (edited) I disagree. Art is universal, and if it doesn´t provoke you admiration at least has to make you feel respect. Apreciation is subjective, art is not. I couldn't agree with you more. In all art there must be some level of visual appreciation or at least respect for the artist's talents and as I said previously this will usually entail beauty in some shape and form. There is no visual appreciation in Damien Hirst's pickled cow or those explicit photos of children that CostalZone posted as 'art'. Can CostalZone tell me how those photos are different to paedophilia, apart from them being labelled as 'art', and would you mind any children in your family being photographed like that? I personally find them to be extremely offensive. Edited October 23, 2010 by Magic Fills the Air Quote
Reggie29 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 This is some good modern art by Vasil. Try and figure out what the picture is all about, it ain't that hard? Quote
Magic Fills the Air Posted October 23, 2010 Author Posted October 23, 2010 (edited) LOL! Thanks Magic! I pretty much put down what came to mind! I really do wonder what made Tracy feel that it was "morally wrong" to re-create that rather revealing piece? Magic, be sure to check out some these art works right here (it's by one of the members on this very forum. Her nickname is "justawoman") : http://www.katcrosbyart.com/ Look out for the traditional pieces. Like this one : This put a smile on my face! I think there is one Led Zeppelin inspired piece too! Good stuff! Hi Kiwi, the first word that came to my mind when I saw Tracy Emin's tent for the first time was 'slut'! I think she knows in her own mind she probably went a bit far with that one. Those paintings you posted are really impressive. They're very vibrant and have a really upbeat feel to them. They remind me of Van Gogh's work in their use of colour, and think they're even more amazing that a member here created them! This is what I find so annoying about modern art, is that talentless morons like Damien Hirst become millionaires by creating rubbish, and people with real artistic talent go through the world unrecognised. I have a friend who is an artist, he went to art college and he's so talented, but he can't get a job using his artistic talent. Instead he's an accountant when all he wants to do is be creative. Edited October 23, 2010 by Magic Fills the Air Quote
Magic Fills the Air Posted October 23, 2010 Author Posted October 23, 2010 (edited) This is some good modern art by Vasil. Try and figure out what the picture is all about, it ain't that hard? Stairway to Heaven perhaps? 'In a tree by a brook there's a songbird that sings', 'There are two paths you can go by, but in the long run there's still time to change the road you're on', 'The forest will echo with laughter' and so on. They're all in the painting. Although when I saw that yellow path I did initially think 'The Wizard of Oz'! Edited October 23, 2010 by Magic Fills the Air Quote
Reggie29 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Rings of smoke through the trees. There's a reference to another song too? Quote
Magic Fills the Air Posted October 23, 2010 Author Posted October 23, 2010 (edited) Rings of smoke through the trees. There's a reference to another song too? Is it Misty Mountain Hop? Those mountains look a bit misty to me. It's a great painting by the way. Edited October 23, 2010 by Magic Fills the Air Quote
Reggie29 Posted October 24, 2010 Posted October 24, 2010 Is it Misty Mountain Hop? Those mountains look a bit misty to me. It's a great painting by the way. OK, make that two songs! Quote
Magic Fills the Air Posted October 24, 2010 Author Posted October 24, 2010 OK, make that two songs! What there's another song in there? Over the Hills and Far Away?? Quote
Magic Fills the Air Posted October 24, 2010 Author Posted October 24, 2010 I'm just about sure the perverts are salivating over that pic. My thoughts exactly. I wonder how that little girl will feel being photographed like that when she's older. Quote
Kiwi_Zep_Fan87 Posted October 24, 2010 Posted October 24, 2010 (edited) Hi Kiwi, the first word that came to my mind when I saw Tracy Emin's tent for the first time was 'slut'! I think she knows in her own mind she probably went a bit far with that one. Those paintings you posted are really impressive. They're very vibrant and have a really upbeat feel to them. They remind me of Van Gogh's work in their use of colour, and think they're even more amazing that a member here created them! This is what I find so annoying about modern art, is that talentless morons like Damien Hirst become millionaires by creating rubbish, and people with real artistic talent go through the world unrecognised. I have a friend who is an artist, he went to art college and he's so talented, but he can't get a job using his artistic talent. Instead he's an accountant when all he wants to do is be creative. LOL! Magic, I was thinking more of the word "tramp" but "slut" is spot on! And looks like Tracy Emin (like Gaga) is known to be a woman who crosses all the lines of decency and keeps pushing and pushing until absolutely nothing will be left to shock society anymore! I got such a good and positive vibe from those paintings too! What's amazing is the fact that, the subjects are something so simple and something which we come across in our daily lives (like a vase, some fruit, etc.) But the way it's been depicted by the artist concerned is pretty much what captures our attention! And I agree with you completely about there being so many artists who have genuine talent but who sadly do not get a chance to show their work! It's such a sad state of affairs! And I am sorry to hear about your friend! He should be doing what he loves and creating works of art and not be sitting in some boring old office all day doing something which he isn't particularly fond of just to make a living! It is pretty much like the music industry where stupid bands like "Green Day" and "Kings of Leon" get all the attention while there are so many brilliant indie bands out there with genuine talent, whose work goes unrecognised and who remain under-appreciated! Edited October 24, 2010 by Kiwi_Zep_Fan87 Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.