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cheesehead1204

Best Led Zeppelin Tour

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North America Tour Summer 1970

There were other tours where one, two or three members would be hitting their potential, but this was the only tour where all four were at their best every single night (that we know of.) Every song is played with expertise and emotion.

North America Tour 1977

Has a band ever toured with better songs?

North America Tour 1973

The peak compromise between quality of songs and performance of the band. With the introduction of No Quarter, the setlist becomes impregnable, and the band gives no quarter either. Sadly, the film crew wasn't there at the right time. If only they'd been in Providence, or California.

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To some degree I can see merits and "demerits" to all tours, but '75 is it for me. Personally, the only advantage '77 has is Achilles, Nobody's Fault, and Ten Years Gone. Those are definite advantages, but I find '75-era NQ, TSRTS, RS, Kashmir and OTHAFA to be superior to other tours, and of course Dazed is gone after '75. If SIBLY was a more regular component of the '75 show, it would be perfect, IMHO.

I'd go with '73 as a close second.

I agree; I also love Europe '73.

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North America Tour Summer 1970

There were other tours where one, two or three members would be hitting their potential, but this was the only tour where all four were at their best every single night (that we know of.) Every song is played with expertise and emotion.

North America Tour 1977

Has a band ever toured with better songs?

North America Tour 1973

The peak compromise between quality of songs and performance of the band. With the introduction of No Quarter, the setlist becomes impregnable, and the band gives no quarter either. Sadly, the film crew wasn't there at the right time. If only they'd been in Providence, or California.

One band has toured with better songs and it's Zeppelin in '79, Copenhagen to be exact

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One band has toured with better songs and it's Zeppelin in '79, Copenhagen to be exact

You're not the first person I've seen say that that year had the best setlist but, personally, I've yet to be able to make it through an entire show from either of those nights in one sitting. It always turns out to be the first hour in the morning, and the rest in the afternoon or next day when I feel like listening to Copenhagen 79. That's not an indicator of an optimized setlist.

My theory is that the front end is loaded with two many faster-paced rockers in a row. In 77, we're at the coolant of No Quarter by the sixth song, and it's right after the slow burn of Since I've Been Loving You. In 79, this doesn't happen until eight songs in...by that point, I'm pretty exhausted. It probably would have been best to have Since I've Been Loving You and No Quarter as the fourth and fifth songs in a set using these songs, so 77 isn't perfect, but much better than 79. To be fair, this fatigue might also have to do with the sound quality of the recordings I have, which aren't great, and therefore demand closer attention/active listening versus the numerous higher-quality recordings of 77.

As for the songs in the setlist itself, not only would be splitting hairs, but it would come down to personal preference. In 1979 you lose the whole acoustic set, but they bring back some oldies and two new songs. Here's my opinion: Misty Mountain Hop, The Rain Song, Celebration Day and In The Evening are all great but the acoustic set was greater than the sum of its parts. Besides good music, it served as a breather partway through the show, a chance for the audience to quiet down and relax between the heavier, louder arms. So, 79 might have had slightly better songs, but 77 had them in a better order.

In any case, I don't even consider what happened 79 a tour. It's just two secret warmup shows, then two festival appearances a week apart. European Tour 1971 is similar...it and 79 aren't tours in my opinion, just shows that happened between tours. For all those reasons, I consider the 77 tour superior to their four shows in 79.

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As for the songs in the setlist itself, not only would be splitting hairs, but it would come down to personal preference. In 1979 you lose the whole acoustic set, but they bring back some oldies and two new songs. Here's my opinion: Misty Mountain Hop, The Rain Song, Celebration Day and In The Evening are all great but the acoustic set was greater than the sum of its parts. Besides good music, it served as a breather partway through the show, a chance for the audience to quiet down and relax between the heavier, louder arms. So, 79 might have had slightly better songs, but 77 had them in a better order.

I still think the acoustic set in '77 could have stood having a couple more songs in it, and as far as pacing the '77 performances they still had to go and blow it by doing the drum and Noise solos back to back most night, completely destroying any momentum they performance had built up over the previous two hours...a setlist planning error as bad as the "Rain Song"/"Hot Dog"/"All My Love" trio in 1980.

Edited by Nutrocker

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I still think the acoustic set in '77 could have stood having a couple more songs in it, and as far as pacing the '77 performances they still had to go and blow it by doing the drum and Noise solos back to back most night, completely destroying any momentum they performance had built up over the previous two hours...a setlist planning error as bad as the "Rain Song"/"Hot Dog"/"All My Love" trio in 1980.

Definitely among their worst errors. Unless it was strongly recommended, I always, always skip that 20 to 40 minute section of the show.

I'd say their biggest touring mistake ever was letting the setlist expand in 1975. The trimming that happened in 1980 should have started then, arguably even sooner. Between 25 January and 10 February 1975, they let the show bloat up from less than two hours to over three hours. They were a great band...but is almost four hours a night at Earls Court really reasonable for themselves or the audience? They also made the mistake of giving up on The Wanton Song and When the Levee Breaks, making it less distinct from 1973.

I've been thinking about giving the "cut the waffle" treatment to every tour and posting a thread about my findings. I could talk about this stuff all day!

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I couldn't disagree more. It worked in 1980 but I could never part with the "waffle" from the mid '70's. Three hours every night is an amazing feat, especially when they were hot. The improv was unique most nights, and helped build up the legendary status they held as a live act. Like it or not the waffle was their greatest strength.

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Definitely among their worst errors. Unless it was strongly recommended, I always, always skip that 20 to 40 minute section of the show.

I'd say their biggest touring mistake ever was letting the setlist expand in 1975. The trimming that happened in 1980 should have started then, arguably even sooner. Between 25 January and 10 February 1975, they let the show bloat up from less than two hours to over three hours. They were a great band...but is almost four hours a night at Earls Court really reasonable for themselves or the audience? They also made the mistake of giving up on The Wanton Song and When the Levee Breaks, making it less distinct from 1973.

I've been thinking about giving the "cut the waffle" treatment to every tour and posting a thread about my findings. I could talk about this stuff all day!

For me when it comes to listening to 1980 shows, if it's just a case of casual listening -as opposed to digesting/analyzing the performance- I always skip from "In The Evening" to "Trampled Under Foot". IMO "Rain Song" just seemed outta place in that setlist, I can't take "Hot Dog" seriously at all and "All My Love" was very hit or miss onstage.

As for setlist/performance "bloat"...as I've always said, it's one thing to wow your audience with massive excess -and here's the caveat- as long as the band has the chops to do it. The trouble with the huge epic performances Zeppelin would put on in L.A. or Earls Court was a lot of nights they didn't have the chops (especially Page). I've said it before: my main issue with the 1975 shows is they tend to go full on for the first two thirds of the performance, but after "Moby Dick" for whatever reason the same intensity just ain't there and the last third just tends to drag (again, my opinion). 1977 wasn't quite as bad for that but the nights when they broke the drum and noise solos up by playing "Heartbreaker" in between was a good idea.

And yeah, "Wanton Song" definitely should have stayed in the setlist in '75, as should have "How Many More Times" in place of "Dazed and Confused".

I couldn't disagree more. It worked in 1980 but I could never part with the "waffle" from the mid '70's. Three hours every night is an amazing feat, especially when they were hot. The improv was unique most nights, and helped build up the legendary status they held as a live act. Like it or not the waffle was their greatest strength.

Again, there's that caveat...when the band was hot a three hour performance just zips by. But on nights when Page and/or Bonham were struggling it can be pretty heavy going. Sue, I believe you were working on the 28 May '77 Landover show a while back...now that's been well established as being an off night for both Jimmy and Bonzo (possibly the worst overall performance of the tour as a matter of fact). I haven't listened to that show in its entirety in a long time...I can't imagine how tedious that must have been for you remastering it :lol:

The waffle was indeed part of their legend but you can sorta see why the punks wanted to hack a big loogie in Led Zeppelin's general direction as a result...mind ya, even other Zeppelin fans on this forum have made the valid argument that instead of all that waffle they could have played two or three actual songs in place of it. Six of one, half a dozen of the other, says I...

Edited by Nutrocker

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The post Plant/flu & Page/finger injuriy '75 U.S. tour Feb-Mar : Extravaganza ... Improvisations .... awesome sound ... long and rich setlist ...

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I couldn't disagree more. It worked in 1980 but I could never part with the "waffle" from the mid '70's. Three hours every night is an amazing feat, especially when they were hot. The improv was unique most nights, and helped build up the legendary status they held as a live act. Like it or not the waffle was their greatest strength.

I agree that improvisation was what made them a great live act, and I think shortening the setlist would have enhanced their creativity, as well as their energy. Why not use the success of a good night to build excitement for the next night rather than going out for a second and third encore? That's exactly how touring became so dreadful and daunting for them in the later years.

Instead of holding onto a little excitement from a good performance, they'd go and burn it all that night...then they'd try to recreate that every night and it would just drag on and on sometimes.

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Waffle is one thing, a 40 minute drum solo or a 15 minute noise / avant garde / guitar solo is just crazy. I loves me some nice soloing and good drum work but c'mon, that is just stupid IMO, especially the drum solo. Bonzo should have still done the solo for certain nights but the time limit should have been around 10 min max, anything longer than that is just torture. The other aspect of the waffle was in HMMT, WLL, D&C, & NQ the jamming was within the framework of a proper song which made the jams interesting. A drum solo is not a song, its a damn drum solo. Jimmy's noise solo was also stupid and weird...in a bad way (sorry Sue, I know you like them). Jimmy should have incorporated a truncated version of it within another song, or just dropped the damn thing all together since it really had no structure, it was kinda Jimmy's Yoko Ono moment so to speak.

All being said I think the Late Feb - May 75' Zep shows were the best and most consistent of the later years and 71' of the early years. However the best tour hands down in regard to good, powerful, and exciting shows was 72'. I think they tried to recreate 72' in 77' but Page was too out of it part of the time to pull it off. 77' could have, and SHOULD have been the best tour period, and for several of the shows it was, but the law of averages brings it down...If you were in LA, NY, Cleveland, Pontiac, etc in 77' you hit the friggin jackpot; if you were at Seattle or Tempe you were probably pretty pissed off and would have kicked Jimmy in the nuts if chance be had.

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Waffle is one thing, a 40 minute drum solo or a 15 minute noise / avant garde / guitar solo is just crazy. I loves me some nice soloing and good drum work but c'mon, that is just stupid IMO, especially the drum solo. Bonzo should have still done the solo for certain nights but the time limit should have been around 10 min max, anything longer than that is just torture. The other aspect of the waffle was in HMMT, WLL, D&C, & NQ the jamming was within the framework of a proper song which made the jams interesting. A drum solo is not a song, its a damn drum solo. Jimmy's noise solo was also stupid and weird...in a bad way (sorry Sue, I know you like them). Jimmy should have incorporated a truncated version of it within another song, or just dropped the damn thing all together since it really had no structure, it was kinda Jimmy's Yoko Ono moment so to speak.

All being said I think the Late Feb - May 75' Zep shows were the best and most consistent of the later years and 71' of the early years. However the best tour hands down in regard to good, powerful, and exciting shows was 72'. I think they tried to recreate 72' in 77' but Page was too out of it part of the time to pull it off. 77' could have, and SHOULD have been the best tour period, and for several of the shows it was, but the law of averages brings it down...If you were in LA, NY, Cleveland, Pontiac, etc in 77' you hit the friggin jackpot; if you were at Seattle or Tempe you were probably pretty pissed off and would have kicked Jimmy in the nuts if chance be had.

Well to be fair the drum solo never reached 40 minutes and only crossed the 30 minute mark on a few occasions, believe it or not.

I agree with respect to the consistency of the Feb-May '75 shows--starting from 2/12 at MSG it's 23 shows in a row ranging mostly from good to excellent in performance quality, with a few such as 3/21 Seattle being beyond excellent.

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Waffle is one thing, a 40 minute drum solo or a 15 minute noise / avant garde / guitar solo is just crazy. I loves me some nice soloing and good drum work but c'mon, that is just stupid IMO, especially the drum solo. Bonzo should have still done the solo for certain nights but the time limit should have been around 10 min max, anything longer than that is just torture. The other aspect of the waffle was in HMMT, WLL, D&C, & NQ the jamming was within the framework of a proper song which made the jams interesting. A drum solo is not a song, its a damn drum solo. Jimmy's noise solo was also stupid and weird...in a bad way (sorry Sue, I know you like them). Jimmy should have incorporated a truncated version of it within another song, or just dropped the damn thing all together since it really had no structure, it was kinda Jimmy's Yoko Ono moment so to speak.

There was no way they would have dropped Jimmy's bowed guitar bit- that was as much of a Page/Zeppelin trademark as anything (hell, he still whipped out the bow during the Firm and Outrider tours!) but I agree that anything more than ten minutes of making weird noises with your guitar is too much...especially when it came on the heels of a twenty odd minute drum solo as it did most nights in '77. I don't mind the drum solos myself; hell, if anything they gave the crowd a nice long break to piss or grab munchies or whatnot, so depending on how you look at it they were sort of a 'necessary evil' :lol: . And as for the long solos within the songs, they could be as long as they wanted as long as the band was into it and had the chops on the night. A thirty minute "No Quarter" is great, as long as a) Jonesy's piano solo isn't boring and repetitive and b ) Page was with it enough that his guitar solo had some coherence and wasn't just a bunch of noodling once he got past the main themes.

77' could have, and SHOULD have been the best tour period, and for several of the shows it was, but the law of averages brings it down...If you were in LA, NY, Cleveland, Pontiac, etc in 77' you hit the friggin jackpot; if you were at Seattle or Tempe you were probably pretty pissed off and would have kicked Jimmy in the nuts if chance be had.

Thing is, even with shows like Tempe you don't hear any booing on the recordings or hear about huge demand for refunds...I think even if they were having an off night in '77 (and IMO only a handful of 1977 shows really and truly qualify as off nights) the actual scope of the event itself made up for any mediocre performance (Strider and other 1977 eyewitness can likely testify to this)

Edited by Nutrocker

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Definitely among their worst errors. Unless it was strongly recommended, I always, always skip that 20 to 40 minute section of the show.

I'd say their biggest touring mistake ever was letting the setlist expand in 1975. The trimming that happened in 1980 should have started then, arguably even sooner. Between 25 January and 10 February 1975, they let the show bloat up from less than two hours to over three hours. They were a great band...but is almost four hours a night at Earls Court really reasonable for themselves or the audience? They also made the mistake of giving up on The Wanton Song and When the Levee Breaks, making it less distinct from 1973.

I've been thinking about giving the "cut the waffle" treatment to every tour and posting a thread about my findings. I could talk about this stuff all day!

I couldn't disagree more. It worked in 1980 but I could never part with the "waffle" from the mid '70's. Three hours every night is an amazing feat, especially when they were hot. The improv was unique most nights, and helped build up the legendary status they held as a live act. Like it or not the waffle was their greatest strength.

For me when it comes to listening to 1980 shows, if it's just a case of casual listening -as opposed to digesting/analyzing the performance- I always skip from "In The Evening" to "Trampled Under Foot". IMO "Rain Song" just seemed outta place in that setlist, I can't take "Hot Dog" seriously at all and "All My Love" was very hit or miss onstage.

As for setlist/performance "bloat"...as I've always said, it's one thing to wow your audience with massive excess -and here's the caveat- as long as the band has the chops to do it. The trouble with the huge epic performances Zeppelin would put on in L.A. or Earls Court was a lot of nights they didn't have the chops (especially Page). I've said it before: my main issue with the 1975 shows is they tend to go full on for the first two thirds of the performance, but after "Moby Dick" for whatever reason the same intensity just ain't there and the last third just tends to drag (again, my opinion). 1977 wasn't quite as bad for that but the nights when they broke the drum and noise solos up by playing "Heartbreaker" in between was a good idea.

And yeah, "Wanton Song" definitely should have stayed in the setlist in '75, as should have "How Many More Times" in place of "Dazed and Confused".

Again, there's that caveat...when the band was hot a three hour performance just zips by. But on nights when Page and/or Bonham were struggling it can be pretty heavy going. Sue, I believe you were working on the 28 May '77 Landover show a while back...now that's been well established as being an off night for both Jimmy and Bonzo (possibly the worst overall performance of the tour as a matter of fact). I haven't listened to that show in its entirety in a long time...I can't imagine how tedious that must have been for you remastering it :lol:

The waffle was indeed part of their legend but you can sorta see why the punks wanted to hack a big loogie in Led Zeppelin's general direction as a result...mind ya, even other Zeppelin fans on this forum have made the valid argument that instead of all that waffle they could have played two or three actual songs in place of it. Six of one, half a dozen of the other, says I...

Waffle is one thing, a 40 minute drum solo or a 15 minute noise / avant garde / guitar solo is just crazy. I loves me some nice soloing and good drum work but c'mon, that is just stupid IMO, especially the drum solo. Bonzo should have still done the solo for certain nights but the time limit should have been around 10 min max, anything longer than that is just torture. The other aspect of the waffle was in HMMT, WLL, D&C, & NQ the jamming was within the framework of a proper song which made the jams interesting. A drum solo is not a song, its a damn drum solo. Jimmy's noise solo was also stupid and weird...in a bad way (sorry Sue, I know you like them). Jimmy should have incorporated a truncated version of it within another song, or just dropped the damn thing all together since it really had no structure, it was kinda Jimmy's Yoko Ono moment so to speak.

All being said I think the Late Feb - May 75' Zep shows were the best and most consistent of the later years and 71' of the early years. However the best tour hands down in regard to good, powerful, and exciting shows was 72'. I think they tried to recreate 72' in 77' but Page was too out of it part of the time to pull it off. 77' could have, and SHOULD have been the best tour period, and for several of the shows it was, but the law of averages brings it down...If you were in LA, NY, Cleveland, Pontiac, etc in 77' you hit the friggin jackpot; if you were at Seattle or Tempe you were probably pretty pissed off and would have kicked Jimmy in the nuts if chance be had.

There was no way they would have dropped Jimmy's bowed guitar bit- that was as much of a Page/Zeppelin trademark as anything (hell, he still whipped out the bow during the Firm and Outrider tours!) but I agree that anything more than ten minutes of making weird noises with your guitar is too much...especially when it came on the heels of a twenty odd minute drum solo as it did most nights in '77. I don't mind the drum solos myself; hell, if anything they gave the crowd a nice long break to piss or grab munchies or whatnot, so depending on how you look at it they were sort of a 'necessary evil' :lol: . And as for the long solos within the songs, they could be as long as they wanted as long as the band was into it and had the chops on the night. A thirty minute "No Quarter" is great, as long as a) Jonesy's piano solo isn't boring and repetitive and b ) Page was with it enough that his guitar solo had some coherence and wasn't just a bunch of noodling once he got past the main themes.

Thing is, even with shows like Tempe you don't hear any booing on the recordings or hear about huge demand for refunds...I think even if they were having an off night in '77 (and IMO only a handful of 1977 shows really and truly qualify as off nights) the actual scope of the event itself made up for any mediocre performance (Strider and other 1977 eyewitness can likely testify to this)

It was billed as "An EVENING with Led Zeppelin" for a reason. It wasn't "90 minutes with Led Zeppelin" or "Led Zeppelin Plays the Hits". Whenever I try to explain to kids today what Led Zeppelin concerts were like, this is the one concept that is hardest to make clear to them and for the uninitiated to fully understand.

You see, almost alone among bands, Led Zeppelin was unique when it came to their concerts...you might say brutally unique. They weren't a feel-good-play-the-hits-hype-the-crowd jukebox like the Stones, Elton John and most top-drawing bands. Nor were they like the progressive bands such as Yes and Pink Floyd that studiously stood still and painfully recreated their songs note-for-note, eliminating any sort of spontaneity or life from their concerts. There were hard rock/metal bands that played loud...Deep Purple, Black Sabbath, AC/DC, Motorhead, Aerosmith, Van Halen...but they all played pretty much 90 minutes and stayed within their set parameters song-wise. Even their on-stage banter was scripted the same night-to-night. Even a band like the Grateful Dead, who also played long shows and improv'd long jams, didn't have the sonic impact of Led Zeppelin. The Grateful Dead had two drummers and two guitarists and most of their songs were easy-loping type of boogies...they had it easy compared to Led Zeppelin. To watch Jimmy Page, John Bonham, John Paul Jones, and Robert Plant push themselves to the physical limit for three hours was unreal.

Led Zeppelin gave no quarter and they asked no quarter. A Led Zeppelin concert was a pact between band and audience for an intense sonic journey that would leave both band and audience bloodied and exhausted, as if they had fought a 15-round fight...or had a good 3-hour shag. Buy a ticket, take the ride...and if you didn't have the stamina, exit stage left during "Moby Dick". I have seen more than 1,000 bands in my lifetime and in no uncertain terms has there ever been any band whose concerts assaulted your body and senses the way Led Zeppelin's did. They asked more from an audience than any band ever...but they also delivered a complete psychic and physical experience unlike any band ever. There were some nights I thought my body would collapse from the pummeling...if my head didn't explode first.

This is probably the one aspect above others that would make a Led Zeppelin impossible in today's world. People today just aren't ready for the physical demands a Led Zeppelin concert asks of them. Audiences are used to being coddled, spoiled. Hell, even Led Zeppelin themselves aren't that band anymore...the 2007 O2 show was far more user-friendly than the old Zep.

"Cut the waffle" was probably a necessary survival tactic in 1980. But "cut the waffle" in 1975?!? NEVER!!!! I wouldn't dream of such a thing.

Edited by Strider

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It was billed as "An EVENING with Led Zeppelin" for a reason. It wasn't "90 minutes with Led Zeppelin" or "Led Zeppelin Plays the Hits". Whenever I try to explain to kids today what Led Zeppelin concerts were like, this is the one concept that is hardest to make clear to them and for the uninitiated to fully understand.

You see, almost alone among bands, Led Zeppelin was unique when it came to their concerts...you might say brutally unique. They weren't a feel-good-play-the-hits-hype-the-crowd jukebox like the Stones, Elton John and most top-drawing bands. Nor were they like the progressive bands such as Yes and Pink Floyd that studiously stood still and painfully recreated their songs note-for-note, eliminating any sort of spontaneity or life from their concerts. There were hard rock/metal bands that played loud...Deep Purple, Black Sabbath, AC/DC, Motorhead, Aerosmith, Van Halen...but they all played pretty much 90 minutes and stayed within their set parameters song-wise. Even their on-stage banter was scripted the same night-to-night. Even a band like the Grateful Dead, who also played long shows and improv'd long jams, didn't have the sonic impact of Led Zeppelin. The Grateful Dead had two drummers and two guitarists and most of their songs were easy-loping type of boogies...they had it easy compared to Led Zeppelin. To watch Jimmy Page, John Bonham, John Paul Jones, and Robert Plant push themselves to the physical limit for three hours was unreal.

Led Zeppelin gave no quarter and they asked no quarter. A Led Zeppelin concert was a pact between band and audience for an intense sonic journey that would leave both band and audience bloodied and exhausted, as if they had fought a 15-round fight...or had a good 3-hour shag. Buy a ticket, take the ride...and if you didn't have the stamina, exit stage left during "Moby Dick". I have seen more than 1,000 bands in my lifetime and in no uncertain terms has there ever been any band whose concerts assaulted your body and senses the way Led Zeppelin's did. They asked more from an audience than any band ever...but they also delivered a complete psychic and physical experience unlike any band ever. There were some nights I thought my body would collapse from the pummeling...if my head didn't explode first.

This is probably the one aspect above others that would make a Led Zeppelin impossible in today's world. People today just aren't ready for the physical demands a Led Zeppelin concert asks of them. Audiences are used to being coddled, spoiled. Hell, even Led Zeppelin themselves aren't that band anymore...the 2007 O2 show was far more user-friendly than the old Zep.

"Cut the waffle" was probably a necessary survival tactic in 1980. But "cut the waffle" in 1975?!? NEVER!!!! I wouldn't dream of such a thing.

Not just any fanboy. Undisputed heavyweight king of the fanboys.

More badass than Motorhead? Bitch please.

And to address this thread; Europe '73. That's EUROPE - 1973. Check it out sometime.

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Not just any fanboy. Undisputed heavyweight king of the fanboys.

More badass than Motorhead? Bitch please.

And to address this thread; Europe '73. That's EUROPE - 1973. Check it out sometime.

Fanboy? That's the best you got?

Look, I am not slagging Motorhead by any means. Nor Van Halen or AC/DC. They were terrific bands in concert. But they just didn't make the demands on an audience that Led Zeppelin did. I am not saying they weren't loud and pummeling bands in their own right, and Motorhead certainly is in the running for loudest band ever. But that wasn't my sole criteria. Sorry if you've missed the point.

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Settle down, I got your point alright. Fanboy = unable to be objective. Can you dig it? There's worse places to be than lost in a haze of Zeppelin. Don't sweat it.

And for real, is it the lack of soundboards that's fogging the judgement around here. Three pages and not a mention of Europe '73? Lots of bitchin' bout what should've happened though.

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I know Plant's voice wasn't great, but I dig US 1973 and the Germany March 1973 shows. Instrumentally on fire, best versions of Dazed & Confused, and overall awesome set list.

Oops. There it is. Spot on. Nice work, Now you can resume playing fantasy do-over with Led Zeppelin's career.

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Fanboy? That's the best you got?

Look, I am not slagging Motorhead by any means. Nor Van Halen or AC/DC. They were terrific bands in concert. But they just didn't make the demands on an audience that Led Zeppelin did. I am not saying they weren't loud and pummeling bands in their own right, and Motorhead certainly is in the running for loudest band ever. But that wasn't my sole criteria. Sorry if you've missed the point.

^wow, what an asshole :bait:

lol, I see you two have met Badgeholder Still... ;)

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^wow, what an asshole :bait:

:yesnod: As has been established in his various incarnations.

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Oops. There it is. Spot on. Nice work, Now you can resume playing fantasy do-over with Led Zeppelin's career.

I don't think anyone is playing fantasy do-over, just pointing out, after the fact, what worked and what may not have worked so well. I believe Strider is close to spot on regarding his observations, my only disagreement being Moby Dick & The Noise Solo in 77', other than that I agree. There is also the little fact Strider attended several Zeppelin concerts from 72' - 77', thus as a first hand observer I defer to his experience.

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I'm interested in objectivity to the point of playing devil's advocate. I don't know Strider, i don't know what he was on when he attended shows, i I have very little to go on as far as how he comes to the conclusions he does. I take everything with a grain of salt. Making blanket statements saying Zeppelin smoked every band ever is ridiculous and adversely affects his credibility in my view. I'm a fanatic too but i've heard too much great music in my day to believe that Zep stood alone even on their best day. 40-50 year old faded memories are great and interesting but hardly conclusive evidence. I've got recordings and ears for that.

Why would anyone with a FF button need to get uptight about MD or the noise solo to the point where you need to call them stupid or pointless. I'ts 2015. Make a playlist of your favorite stuff, kick back and enjoy. Playing Monday morning QB to concerts that happened 45 years ago is pointless and stupid. And disrespectful to the band which gave you these gifts.

I might favor Europe 73 a bit but i love every tour every show warts and all. The shows where they weren't in top form have value for me as they give perspective to the great shows and the band in general. The idea of "better" setlists or redoing Physical Graffit is f'n ponderous. What happened happened. Live with it already. This isn't a video game where you restart in the middle because things didn't happen perfectly. I mean you love the band but feel the need to second guess every move they ever made. Stop being ungrateful twits. Better yet start your own band and go conquer the world.

And from a purely objective point of view, Moby Dick and the noise solo were fuckin' awesome. Forever a part of Led Zeppelin, I wouldn't change a damn thing about LZ. And not just because i can't.

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I'm interested in objectivity to the point of playing devil's advocate. I don't know Strider, i don't know what he was on when he attended shows, i I have very little to go on as far as how he comes to the conclusions he does. I take everything with a grain of salt. Making blanket statements saying Zeppelin smoked every band ever is ridiculous and adversely affects his credibility in my view. I'm a fanatic too but i've heard too much great music in my day to believe that Zep stood alone even on their best day. 40-50 year old faded memories are great and interesting but hardly conclusive evidence. I've got recordings and ears for that.

Why would anyone with a FF button need to get uptight about MD or the noise solo to the point where you need to call them stupid or pointless. I'ts 2015. Make a playlist of your favorite stuff, kick back and enjoy. Playing Monday morning QB to concerts that happened 45 years ago is pointless and stupid. And disrespectful to the band which gave you these gifts.

I might favor Europe 73 a bit but i love every tour every show warts and all. The shows where they weren't in top form have value for me as they give perspective to the great shows and the band in general. The idea of "better" setlists or redoing Physical Graffit is f'n ponderous. What happened happened. Live with it already. This isn't a video game where you restart in the middle because things didn't happen perfectly. I mean you love the band but feel the need to second guess every move they ever made. Stop being ungrateful twits. Better yet start your own band and go conquer the world.

And from a purely objective point of view, Moby Dick and the noise solo were fuckin' awesome. Forever a part of Led Zeppelin, I wouldn't change a damn thing about LZ. And not just because i can't.

It seems the only person getting uptight here is you, the rest of us are simply engaging in friendly conversation regarding their tours. If that bothers you its your problem, not ours.

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