Wisconsin?!

[ally]

I gotta ask these questions...If the State of Wisconsin and the other states that are lining up are successful in passing this bill , what's the end result ? What does it mean for those public emplyoyees and what does it mean for the average JOE who's employed in the private sector and those who are unemployed ? Does this bill solve the problem ?

Well, since nobody seems to be willing or able to answer my questions, I'll just go ahead and throw my two cents worth into the mix.

What I see happening here is a transfer of taxpayer money going from the public sector to the private sector on the assumption that the private sector can do a better and more efficiant job of running those services. My problem with this is that all I see is that same taxpayer money being transfered from one monopoly to another ( Koch Brothers ) and a greater percentage of that money going into profit for them and less going into service and wages for the people...union or non union.. who actually perfom the work. IMHO, even if one was to agree with reducing or eliminating the states responsability to provide those services and eliminate the cost of it's unionized workforce, why pass it on to a large corporation ? Why not really go for it and put ALL of those services up for tender . As they say, a little competition never hurts... right !

[Silver Rider]

Well, since nobody seems to be willing or able to answer my questions, I'll just go ahead and throw my two cents worth into the mix.

What I see happening here is a transfer of taxpayer money going from the public sector to the private sector on the assumption that the private sector can do a better and more efficiant job of running those services. My problem with this is that all I see is that same taxpayer money being transfered from one monopoly to another ( Koch Brothers ) and a greater percentage of that money going into profit for them and less going into service and wages for the people...union or non union.. who actually perfom the work. IMHO, even if one was to agree with reducing or eliminating the states responsability to provide those services and eliminate the cost of it's unionized workforce, why pass it on to a large corporation ? Why not really go for it and put ALL of those services up for tender . As they say, a little competition never hurts... right !

You'll be happy to know that the Koch Brothers sponsor 4-H activities. This loss of money going from the public sector to the private sector is not a transfer of taxpayer money; it's a tax cut for big business resulting in a substantial loss of revenue to the state of Wisconsin. The public sector will not even see those funds on its ledger. Maybe the 4-H will see an increase in corporate donations. As for the assumption that the private sector will do a better and more efficient job of providing services, good luck with that unless it is farm related. Wisconsin will see a cut in services. Services will be individually fee-based. Maybe the majority of the voters just wants to learn the hard way?

News commentators persist in applying the misnomer of “conservative” to the strikebreaking forces now mobilizing in Wisconsin and many other states. This is scientifically inaccurate, and also a huge public relations gift to the union busters. In Wisconsin in particular, public-sector unions have had the right of collective bargaining for more than half a century. The forces controlled by Koch and his ilk would now like to turn the clock all the way back to the early 19th century, when trade unions were banned as a conspiracy in restraint of free trade. The union busters have no respect for tradition, no regard for the status quo, no interest in organic growth, and no patience with notions of gradual reform in any direction. They are right wing radicals, militant reactionaries, or right wing extremists, destined as such to gravitate into proto-fascist directions as the world economic depression deepens and the special privileges of the legions of greed are threatened.

Whatever the “Tea Party” might have been when it got started in early 2009, it has by now been totally absorbed into the Koch machine, meaning the militant extremist and reactionary wing of finance capital. This is an extremely ominous development. Back in the 1930s, fascist millionaires like Pew of Sun Oil, Pitcairn of Pittsburgh Plate Glass, and DuPont financed strikebreaking organizations like the Silver Shirts, the Sentinels of the Republic, the Crusaders, and the Southern Committee for the Constitution. This is where the Tea Party is headed. When you get right wing goon squads who are paid and deployed against worker demonstrations and strikes by super-rich moneybags, then you are on the road to Italy in 1922 and Germany in 1933, when fascist movements took power.

- Webster G. Tarpley, Ph.D.

tarpley.net/2011/02/20/wisconsin-union-busting-drive/

Wisconsin has another side.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

A Canoe Voyage Up the Minnay Sotor

George William Featherstonhaugh

1835 (journals published in 1847)

From Green Bay up the Fox River to the Portage, down the Wisconsin River to Prairie du Chien and up the Mississippi River to Fort Snelling; a sharply observant, multi-lingual Englishman explores pre-territorial Wisconsin on his way to the 'Minnay Sotor'

"... Amongst their other qualifications, I had required that those who were to accompany me should be well acquainted with the popular Canadian airs, and be able to sing them after the old approved fashion of keeping time with their paddles."

library.wisc.edu/etext/WIReader/Contents/Voyage

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Racine is a city in and the county seat of Racine County, Wisconsin, United States...

On October 10, 1699, a fleet of eight canoes bearing a party of French explorers entered the mouth of Root River. These were the first Europeans known to visit what is now Racine County. Led by Jonathan Paradise, they founded a trading post in the area that eventually became a small settlement on Lake Michigan near where the Root River empties into Lake Michigan. "Racine" is French for "root".

absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Racine,_Wisconsin

[Anjin-san]

Hi all,

The UAW and Teamsters,did a wonderful job,eh?

KB

[cryingbluerain]

You'll be happy to know that the Koch Brothers sponsor 4-H activities. This loss of money going from the public sector to the private sector is not a transfer of taxpayer money; it's a tax cut for big business resulting in a substantial loss of revenue to the state of Wisconsin. The public sector will not even see those funds on its ledger. Maybe the 4-H will see an increase in corporate donations. As for the assumption that the private sector will do a better and more efficient job of providing services, good luck with that unless it is farm related. Wisconsin will see a cut in services. Services will be individually fee-based.

Oh boo hoo. Let's also lament the loss of money going to the Democratic Party through political contributions from taxpayer funded union dues.

[Uncle Bill]

Time for the lefty's to don their tinfoil hats to protect them from the black helicopters. (instructions included)

[Silver Rider]

Oh boo hoo. Let's also lament the loss of money going to the Democratic Party through political contributions from taxpayer funded union dues.

Union dues are taxpayer funded? How does that work?

[cryingbluerain]

Union dues are taxpayer funded? How does that work?

Where does the money come from to pay the state employees' wages where the union dues are deducted from?

[Silver Rider]

Where does the money come from to pay the state employees' wages where the union dues are deducted from?

You expected them to work for nothing? They earned that income. They can and should choose how to spend it. I am sure they paid taxes on that income.

We do have a law against slavery.

[ally]

You'll be happy to know that the Koch Brothers sponsor 4-H activities. This loss of money going from the public sector to the private sector is not a transfer of taxpayer money; it's a tax cut for big business resulting in a substantial loss of revenue to the state of Wisconsin. The public sector will not even see those funds on its ledger. Maybe the 4-H will see an increase in corporate donations. As for the assumption that the private sector will do a better and more efficient job of providing services, good luck with that unless it is farm related. Wisconsin will see a cut in services. Services will be individually fee-based. Maybe the majority of the voters just wants to learn the hard way?

Actually, I see this as being nothing more than a political payoff that will acomplish absolutely nothing positive....for anyone. " Meet the new boss...same as the old boss"

[Uncle Bill]

They can and should choose how to spend it.

That will be the case once this law is finally put into effect, it isn't the case now. The way it works now is, the state deducts union dues right from the workers checks and gives it to the union, the union then spends the money supporting democratic candidates whether the member wants that or not.

[cryingbluerain]

You expected them to work for nothing? They earned that income. They can and should choose how to spend it. I am sure they paid taxes on that income.

We do have a law against slavery.

This reasoning might hold some water if the payment of union dues was voluntary.

[Silver Rider]

Actually, I see this as being nothing more than a political payoff that will acomplish absolutely nothing positive....for anyone. " Meet the new boss...same as the old boss"

And the answer to that is...Now that the private sector is takng over, I wish them all the best. Sorry, Charlie, but the buck stops here.

Koch companies and their employees serve their communities in many ways – as volunteers, mentors or lending a helping hand to those in need.

.kochind.com/Community

Koch companies are committed to understanding the needs of the community, and participate in projects and activities that add value to their neighbors and improve the quality of life.

• Through the Georgia-Pacific Foundation, the company partners with many local and statewide organizations to improve the quality of life in communities where GP employees live and work. The GP Foundation focuses support in four key areas: education, enrichment of community, environment and entrepreneurship.
• Freedom Park Visitors and Learning Center in Prescott will expand its educational programs through a $10,000 grant from Flint Hills Resources. The center provides hands-on experimental learning programs integrated with local schools and other youth groups such as the Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts and 4-H clubs. The grant will extend the programs to children in Ellsworth and Hastings schools, and to home school groups.

kochind.com/factsSheets/WisconsinFacts

New to Wisconsin 4-H, or looking for more information on our programs?

4h.uwex.edu

[Silver Rider]

This reasoning might hold some water if the payment of union dues was voluntary.

The workers can always quit and take a job in the private sector industries, which I understand are just booming. The streets are paved with gold in the surrounding pleasant communities, and no none ever complains about anything, at least until the bubble bursts.

[cryingbluerain]

The workers can always quit and take a job in the private sector industries, which I understand are just booming. The streets are paved with gold.

That's what the left would have us believe. And they expect us employees in the "booming" private sector to continue to subsidize employees of the bloated, debt-ridden, parasitic state government system. What a deal.

[Silver Rider]

That's what the left would have us believe. And they expect us employees in the "booming" private sector to continue to subsidize employees of the bloated, debt-ridden, parasitic state government system. What a deal.

The Koch Brothers received a very substantial tax cut in Wisconsin. Maybe they'll give you a raise after they hire you, if they are hiring.

There is a company in Green Bay, WI that still has jobs available for engineers, maintenance people and factory. The company is Georgia-Pacific and they make paper and paper products: printer paper, paper towels, toilet paper, napkins, plates, containers, cutlery, soap, skin care products--some of it looks generic, some of it is produced under names we all know, like Brawny and Dixie. These are important jobs for the people of Green Bay, especially in these tough economic times, and they are grateful for them. No one who is working right now is likely to bad mouth their employers.

That is not the case when someone leaves Georgia Pacific, however. A reading of the website "GlassDoor.com" offers former mid-level employees a chance to express the good and the bad of having worked at GP. And there is a unanimous thread amongst the voices of the ex-GP employee, and it involves the upper management of the company and something they refer to as the "MBM" environment. Here are a couple of the comments, though you are welcome to read many more that say more or less the same thing.

"MBM is a good looking veneer...Leadership style has become manage by threat since Koch took over. It's sad to watch."

"MBM Principles are used more as punishment then (sic) guidelines."

" Koch philosophy of the MBM Guiding principles and upper Management's interpretation has destroyed employee morale, created divisions within the organization and allow upper Management to build their "inner circle" to insulate themselves from the organization. New philosophy is to pass the blame down and not be accountable. Upper Mgmt only practices the MBM framework when it works in their favor..."

MBM? KOCH philosophy? Yes, the MBM stands for "Market-Based Management" and is a real baby of the Koch Family.

dailykos.com

After reading that, do you still want to work there?

They value humility and respect so they can dominate the work force, not because they want to save your soul.

Koch Facts

Koch Industries, Inc. and its affiliates are founded upon – and committed to – their Guiding Principles that include integrity, humility, compliance and respect.

kochind.com/kochFacts

These guys are very old school.

But the Tea Party movement—and Koch family’s obscene wealth—go back more than half a century, all the way to grandpa Fredrick C. Koch, one of the founding members of the far-rightwing John Birch Society which was convinced that evil socialism was taking over America through unions, colored people, Jews, homosexuals, the Kennedys and even Dwight D. Eisenhower.

These days, the Kochs paint themselves as true-believer Libertarians of the Austrian School. Charles Koch, the elder brother who runs the family business in Wichita, Kansas, quotes the wisdom of proto-libertarian “economist” Ludwig von Mises, but also sees himself as a thinker in his own right. In 2007, Charles made his contribution to the body of free-market thought with an economic theory he calls Market-Based Management® (trademark protected, of course), which he lays out in a book titled the Science of Success. A Forbes reviewer seemed a bit disturbed by Charles’ overt socialist leanings, writing that the “author professes an almost Marxist faith in the ‘fixed laws’ that ‘govern human well-being.’”

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

“Once, my father ran a business in the ex-Soviet Union, and all engineers who worked with my father were imprisoned by Stalin later. My father, who had experienced this, became an anti-communist and thought the value of economical freedom and prosperity was more important than ever before,” Charles said during an interview with a Korean newspaper in 2008, leaving out the part how evil socialist cash is the foundation of the Koch family’s wealth.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Charles Koch’s racket was very simple, explained William. With its extensive oil pipe network, Koch Industries’ role as an oil middleman–it buys crude from someone’s well and sells it to a refinery–makes it easy to steal millions of dollars worth of oil by skimming just a little off the top of each transaction, or what they call “cheating measurements” in the oil trade. According to William, wells located on federal and Native American lands were the prime targets of the Koch scam.

“What Koch was doing was taking all these measurements and then falsifying them on the run sheets,” said Bill Koch. “If the dipstick measured five feet 10 inches and one half inch, they would write down five feet nine and one half inches.”

That may not sound like much, but Bill Koch said it added up. “Well, that was the beauty of the scheme. Because if they’re buying oil from 50,000 different people, and they’re stealing two barrels from each person. What does that add up to? One year, their data showed they stole a million and a half barrels of oil.”

In 1999, William decided to take his brothers down. He sued Koch Industries in civil court under the False Claims Act, which allows whistleblowers to file suit on behalf of the federal government. William Koch accused the company of stealing hundreds of millions of dollars in oil from federal lands.

The band of brothers settled the case two years later, with Charles agreeing to pay $25 million in penalties to the federal government to have the suit dismissed. It turned out to be a great deal for Charles and David, considering that in the 1980s their “adjustments” allowed Koch Industries to siphon off 300 million gallons of oil without paying. It was pure profit–free money–to the tune of $230 million.

At the trial, 50 former Koch gaugers testified against the company, some in video depositions. They said employees even had a term for cheating on the measurements.

“We in the company referred to it as the Koch Method because it was a system for cheating the producer out of oil,” said one of the gaugers, Mark Wilson.

Ah, finally! We’ve stumbled upon the secret to the family’s success! At the bottom of it all, the Koch Method that funds all the libertarians is nothing but good old-fashioned plunder.”

exiledonline.com

[Uncle Bill]

The Koch Brothers received a very substantial tax cut in Wisconsin.

Please site your source.

a reliable one, not dailykos, lol

[Silver Rider]

Please site your source.

a reliable one, not dailykos, lol

I remember reading about it a while ago, but here is one source.

Wisconsin's newly elected Republican Gov. Scott Walker is facing a growing backlash over his attempt to cut pay and eliminate collective bargaining rights for public employees in his state. Although Walker is claiming his power grab is an attempt to close a budget gap, the budget "crisis" was engineered by Walker as soon as he got into office. As Brian Beutler reported, half of the budget shortfall comes from Walker's own tax cuts for businesses and other business giveaways enacted in January. A number of the big business interests standing with Walker are beneficiaries of his administration's tax giveaways.

thinkprogress.org

and another...

For Gov. Scott Walker (R-WI) to attempt to blame his budget woes on public sector workers, to force them not only to take pay cuts, but to give up their collective bargaining rights, is wrong. And if you know that this same Republican governor created his own budget crisis via tax cuts for corporations the minute he took office, you know he has no moral ground to stand on in this face-off.

politicalruminations.com

The Kochs' sense of imperilment is somewhat puzzling. Income inequality in America is greater than it has been since the nineteen-twenties, and since the seventies the tax rates of the wealthiest have fallen more than those of the middle class.

newyorker.com

States rely heavily on sales and property taxes to fund their budgets. Some do not have income taxes (Wisconsin does). Corporations pay a tiny percentage of state income taxes—smaller than their share of federal income taxes. Until recently, separate company reporting helped them strip income out of states where they have customers to tax havens like Delaware, usually by locating intellectual property holding companies there.

States have fought back by adopting combined reporting, requiring any corporate group conducting a unitary business to allocate group income according to the proportion of sales made in the state. Wisconsin recently became a combined reporting state, as are the majority of states now. Combined reporting was first proposed by a Republican governor, Tommy Thompson.

During his campaign, Walker called for repeal of combined reporting, calling it a tax increase.

blogs.forbes.com

[Anjin-san]

So riddle me this,more pay,pensions,insurance,...on the public dime,this is good?

Thanks JFK!

KB

[Uncle Bill]

I remember reading about it a while ago, but here is one source.

Quoting talking points from lefty sites isn't the same as siting your source for "The Koch Brothers received a very substantial tax cut in Wisconsin." You want to give that another try?

The only tax cuts I'm aware of are the ones for small businesses and company's that create or move new jobs to our state as outlined here (and passed w/ bipartisan support):

Tax cut for job creators advances

Madison — The Assembly Tuesday approved Gov. Scott Walker's tax cut bill for businesses, and the Senate sent the Republican governor two more tax incentive measures ahead of his "state of the state" speech next week.

A key part of Walker's special legislative session on job creation, the tax cut bill was scaled back by the governor from a campaign proposal for small businesses and then went through further changes by Republican lawmakers before its passage.

The other two bills given final passage by the Senate in bipartisan votes Tuesday included a measure to add $25 million in tax credits to an economic development program and another to wipe away the taxes for two years of businesses moving to the state.

http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/114586774.html

[Silver Rider]

Quoting talking points from lefty sites isn't the same as siting your source for "The Koch Brothers received a very substantial tax cut in Wisconsin." You want to give that another try?

The only tax cuts I'm aware of are the ones for small businesses and company's that create or move new jobs to our state as outlined here (and passed w/ bipartisan support):

Tax cut for job creators advances

Madison — The Assembly Tuesday approved Gov. Scott Walker's tax cut bill for businesses, and the Senate sent the Republican governor two more tax incentive measures ahead of his "state of the state" speech next week.

A key part of Walker's special legislative session on job creation, the tax cut bill was scaled back by the governor from a campaign proposal for small businesses and then went through further changes by Republican lawmakers before its passage.

The other two bills given final passage by the Senate in bipartisan votes Tuesday included a measure to add $25 million in tax credits to an economic development program and another to wipe away the taxes for two years of businesses moving to the state.

http://www.jsonline..../114586774.html

While it may seem unfair to come down on Walker as county executive of Milwaukee for a problem that is obviously widespread, but particularly bad under his leadership in Milwaukee, the fact of the matter is that Walker has been nattering on about what a fiscal conservative he is and how he stands for the taxpayer. He keeps claiming over and over again that he is cutting collective bargaining for the taxpayer, he is cutting union benefits for the taxpayer, etc. But obviously, if Scott were concerned about the taxpayer, all he would have to do is assess these properties correctly and he’d save the taxpayer $800.00 a year on average. As it stands, his cuts to unions aren’t saving taxpayers a dime, because he gave that money to the Koch brothers et al in tax cuts.

politicususa.com

[Uncle Bill]

Quoting talking points from lefty sites isn't the same as siting your source for "The Koch Brothers received a very substantial tax cut in Wisconsin." You want to give that another try?

That's what I thought, you just made that up. lol

[Silver Rider]

That's what I thought, you just made that up. lol

No, I remember reading it somewhere.

And there are these other items. I've also read that they will target Australia next with their agenda. They are a multi-national company doing business in 70 locations. Someone's going to make a movie out of this story someday. Interesting ancestry...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Koch Industries Lawyer to White House: How Did You Get Our Tax Information?

By John McCormack

weeklystandard.com

According to Mark Holden, senior vice president and general counsel of Koch Industries, a senior Obama administration official told reporters at an August 27 on-the-record background briefing on corporate taxes:

So in this country we have partnerships, we have S corps, we have LLCs,

we have a series of entities

that do not pay corporate income tax, s

ome of which are really giant firms. You know Koch Industries is a multibillion dollar business

. So that creates a narrower base because we've literally got something like 50 percent of the business income in the U.S. is going to businesses that don't pay any corporate income tax. They point out [in the report] you could review the boundary between corporate and non-corporate taxation as a way to broaden the base.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Who's Creating Walker's Playbook?

National and local right-wing groups want to weaken workers

By Lisa Kaiser

expressmilwaukee.com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Today, Fred's sons David and Charles Koch are perhaps best known for founding and funding Americans for Prosperity, a Tea Party-esque group that prides itself on anti-socialist rhetoric. In reality, the Koch brothers are less about fighting socialism. Their real goal is to eliminate government oversight. In the year 2000 alone, Koch Industries had to pay a record $30 million in fines resulting from more than 300 oil spills.

politics.gather.com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Koch brothers’ influence will reach Australia to fight carbon tax

antinuclear.net

Koch and Koch are oil barons who run the largest private company in the USA

and there is another aspect of reducing benefits to Wisconsin's public employees. They will have a diminished ability to act as shareholders in Georgia Pacific, a Koch-owned company. That could give increased control over stock ownership and decision-making power to the Koch brothers themselves. A part of the pensions earned by public employees in Wisconsin is invested in stock issued by Georgia Pacific. This is how the Koch brothers can shed their company of the burden of having to divide control with company shareholders who are also public employees. That is if they were ever voting shareholders at all.

According to the State of Wisconsin Investment Board (SWIB), the Wisconsin Retirement System owns $5.5 million in Georgia Pacific corporate bonds. (Georgia Pacific is owned by Koch Industries.) This is the retirement system in which the overwhelming majority of state and local employees participate. These are the pension benefits that public employees are trying so hard to protect.

sweetness-light.com/archive/wi-state-pension-fund-owns-koch-stock

Charles and David H. Koch each own 42% of Koch Industries, and Charles has stated that the company will publicly offer shares "literally over my dead body".

- Fisher, Daniel (Mar. 13, 2006). "Mr. Big", pp. 24–26. Forbes

wiki

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Harry Koch, 40th president, was born in Holland. When he turned 21 he came to the United States and after prospecting for three years moved to Quanah.He purchased the Quanah Chief in 1891 and three years later acquired the Quanah Tribune. He consolidated the two papers under the name Tribune-Chief in 1897. His oldest son, Anton, worked with him at the Tribune-Chief as advertising manager. The Koch family owned the newspaper until 1978.

texaspress.com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

How did Harry Koch, a new immigrant from the Netherlands ever end up in Quanah, Texas? Little is known about that part of the family history.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Along the way Harry Koch got married, and his son Frederick Chase [Fred] Koch was born in 1900.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Following graduation, Fred worked for several oil process engineering companies, and in 1925 joined two of his MIT class mates to form their own oil process engineering company, named Keith-Winkler-Koch Engineering. In 1926, the name of the firm was changed to Winkler-Koch Engineering after one of the partners left. Shortly thereafter, Fred developed an improved and more efficient process for oil refining. But his firm could not convince the established oil companies to adopt the new process, because the oil firms were already heavily invested in the oil refining process then used by the oil refining firms. So the two partners sold their services to install the new oil refining process to foreign producers, notably in the then industrially developing Soviet Union. So during the late 1920’s and early 1930’s, Fred Koch spent a large amount of time in the Soviet Union, where his engineering firm developed and helped install the new oil refining process in 12 oil refineries.

nnp.org/nni/Publications/Dutch-American/dabook/Chapter%2010.pdf

Erich Koch (a high level Nazi official in charge of Prussia) invites Fred Koch to sell his oil in Nazi Germany when he is banned from doing business in the US. After the fall of Nazi Germany, Erich Koch and Fred expand the oil empire to the Soviet Union. Erich Koch had been in charge of Prussia for Hitler so his ties to the Soviet Union ran deep. A few years later the Soviets took Fred Koch’s oil and prosecuted Erich for war crimes – Fred Koch returned to the US, became anti-communist, and was allowed to do business in the States again.American Fred Koch, and through association the Kochs from Germany, establish the John Birch Society in the 1950s in NY, which becomes the policy center for American conservatives.

unknownjournal.wordpress.com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

During the Second World War Erich Koch proved himself one of Hitler’s cruellest administrators in the conquered eastern territories, his brutal rule, caused the death of untold numbers of innocent men, women and children, who were deported to concentration and labour camps, and the destruction of countless numbers of villages, which were burnt to the ground.

holocaustresearchproject.org

[Uncle Bill]

I'm still not seeing anything to back up your claim that "The Koch Brothers received a very substantial tax cut in Wisconsin."

[Uncle Bill]

Back on the topic of this thread:

This article sums it up pretty well, (as long as we are posting walls of text from partisan sources)

The Basics

Last November, for the first time in a long time, Wisconsin voters went to the polls and gave Republicans control of the assembly, senate, and governorship. Governor Scott Walker, the former County Executive of Milwaukee, ran as a reformer, inherited a crushing deficit, and drafted a Budget Repair Bill that would allow him to do two vital things. His first priority was to not lay off any public employees. His second priority was to create long-term, sustainable fixes to the state budget. One of the only ways he could do this was to increase the percentage public employees pay for their health insurance coverage from 6% to 12.6% (still half the national average) and their pension contribution from 0% to 5.8% (most Americans don’t even get pensions). By far, though, the most controversial and necessary part of the bill is the stripping away of public employee collective bargaining rights in all matters other than wages. Opponents say collective bargaining has nothing to do with the budget, that it’s just an attack on workers’ rights.

That’s a lie. And here’s why they’re telling that lie.

How Public Employee Unions Elect Democrats With Your Tax Dollars

Currently, if you’re any kind of public employee in Wisconsin, union membership is compulsory. If you want to work for the State, you are forced to join the union and therefore you must pay dues that average around $800 a year. These dues are not only the lifeblood of public union power, they are the lifeblood of power for elected Democrats in WI (and nationwide). Using dues forcibly taken from public employees (right out of their paychecks), in 2008 public unions gave almost all of their political donations to local Democrats. Furthermore, three national public unions dropped almost $3 million into WI Democrat coffers in the form of straight-forward political donations and television ads in support of Democrats.

For instance, among the 14 Senate Democrats who fled the state to avoid voting for Governor Walker’s Budget Repair Bill, public unions represented anywhere from 5% to 66% of their total campaign contributions from ‘07 to ‘10. Nationwide the numbers are even more staggering. Unions, mostly public employee unions, gave a staggering $400 million to Democrats in 2008 alone.

Taxpayers — Republicans, Independents, and Democrats alike — pay for all of this. This is our money being used in a corrupt laundering racket to funnel money from our pockets to public employees to their unions and then, ultimately, straight into the coffers of Democrats throughout the country and at every level of government — from your local school board to the President of the United States.

How Collective Bargaining Bankrupts States

As we’ve already established, elected Democrats rely on public union donations to win office which, of course, means they are then beholden to these unions once they reach office. Well, guess who the public unions then do their collective bargaining with? Yes, with the very same Democrats who rely on public unions in order to get them elected.

It doesn’t get any more corrupt than this.

Furthermore, what are elected Democrats using to please their important public union contributors? Your tax dollars. This isn’t like a private business where sitting across the table from union officials are hard-nosed negotiators worried about the bottom line, stockholders, and their own profits. If they give away the store they go out of business. Wisconsin, on the other hand, can’t and won’t go out of business. Therefore, elected Democrats have no stake in protecting the taxpayers and so they do give away the store. That’s why public employees have Cadillac benefits and you and I don’t. That’s why it’s impossible to fire bad teachers. That’s why it’s a contract violation to clear your streets of snow even when the unions won’t. That’s why states across the country are going bankrupt.

And believe it or not, it gets worse…

The Wisconsin Education Association Council (WEAC), the state’s largest teachers union, has used collective bargaining to muscle school districts into purchasing their own over-priced health insurance coverage program. Yes, the very same teachers union that spent $1.6 million to elect Democrats then sits down with Democrats to collective bargain regarding which health insurance provider the various districts will purchase from — and lo and behold a number of school districts throughout the state have their benefits administered through the union’s own WEA Trust. By most accounts this is a Cadillac benefits plan that costs the state millions more than it should — a lucrative plan that we private sector employees could only dream of.

Worse still, there’s no serious competition for a less expensive, more reasonable plan. Why would there be? Elected officials aren’t spending their own money or their company’s money. They’re spending your money. Their only incentive is to please the same unions that fund their campaigns — and collective bargaining rules makes all of this look perfectly acceptable and legal.

This is nothing more than legalized graft and racketeering.

Franklin Roosevelt was exactly right about the dangers of collective bargaining in the public sector when he said:

"All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service. It has its distinct and insurmountable limitations when applied to public personnel management. The very nature and purposes of Government make it impossible for administrative officials to represent fully or to bind the employer in mutual discussions with Government employee organizations. The employer is the whole people, who speak by means of laws enacted by their representatives in Congress. Accordingly, administrative officials and employees alike are governed and guided, and in many instances restricted, by laws which establish policies, procedures, or rules in personnel matters."

Why Democrats and Public Unions are Terrified of Governor Walker’s Bill

Governor Walker’s bill hits at the very heart of this legalized graft and racketeering by stripping away the collective bargaining that burdens Wisconsin taxpayers with programs like WEA Trust — which is a cash cow for the public sector unions and therefore a cash cow for elected Democrats. The more money public unions receive, the more money they have to help elect Democrats.

What most frightens the unholy duo of Democrats and public unions, though, is that Walker’s Budget Repair Bill is a victory for workers rights inasmuch as it ends, not only the forcing of public workers into the union, but also the garnishment of their pay checks to pay union dues.

Once you give public employees the God-given right to opt out of the union and force unions to collect their own dues, there’s no doubt some people’s eyes will open just as they have in the private sector. The result is that public union membership will wither on the vine just as private union membership has. The result…

Public unions lose their power, elected Democrats lose a crucial ally funded with your taxpayer dollars, and this viciously corrupt circle takes its rightful place on the ash-heap of history.

Finally, this will also create something of a cultural shift. Without wildly influential public unions spreading their disgusting entitlement mentality, fewer idiots will be brainwashed into thinking they deserve something for nothing. And if anything best describes the Democratic base, it’s “entitled idiots who think they deserve something for nothing.”

Why Obama Has a Dog In the Wisconsin Fight

Wisconsin is a vital swing state for Obama. In 2008 he won the state by an impressive margin, but 2010 saw a sea change in the state’s electorate that created a tidal wave in favor of Republicans, a tidal wave that could extend to 2012 and cost the president his re-election.

The more unpopular Republicans are in Wisconsin, the better chance Obama has of winning the state. By using this bill as a way to toxify Governor Walker and the Republican Party in general, by waging a sort of psy-ops war on the population with all the divisive tension and anguish the protests and the 24/7 news coverage cause (think of the 2000 presidential election recount times 100), the idea is to lay the groundwork for an Obama victory in a state that just a few months ago had turned on him.

http://biggovernment.com/jjmnolte/2011/03/27/april-5th-will-decide-who-governs-wisconsin-the-voters-or-4-judges/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+BigGovernment+%28Big+Government%29&utm_content=Twitter

[ally]

Well, corporate donations dwarf anything coming from labour and as we can see, they have their effect too. If your an employee working for a company in the private sector, I seriously doubt that you had much say in which party they donated to either. We're all just working stiffs in this game of politics and all too often I see us being pitted against each to the detriment of ourselves and the betterment of others.

That's all I have left to say on the subject