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RIP-IT-UP

HEARTBREAKER SOLO: Spliced together from 10 tapes

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Interesting interview on www.bobbyowsinski.com; under the Mixing Engineer's Handbook, there is an excerpt from an interview with Jimmy Douglass, who worked for a day with Jimmy Page back in 1969 at Atlantic . Per the interview, Pagey showed-up with "10 1/4" reels of guitar solos"; both Douglass and Jimmy then "chopped away at the 10 reels" and eventually came up with the one final solo that was inserted into the middle of Heartbreaker for Zep II.

This is an interesting story, because I've always read in interviews with JP, or others, that Jimmy came up with the HB solo "on the spot"; i.e. that he probably recorded 3 separate takes, and then took the "best-one" for the album; but this interview implies that they spliced together bits and pieces from at least 10 takes! (not really the definition of spontaneous.) There's also stories that this was also done with the studio version of the STH solo, although again Jimmy himself sticks to the "best of 3" story...

Edited by RIP-IT-UP

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Heartbreaker Solo

Page's unaccompanied solo is pitched slightly higher than the rest of the song. The guitarist explained to Guitar World in 1998: "The interesting thing about the solo is that it was recorded after we had already finished 'Heartbreaker' – it was an afterthought. That whole section was recorded in a different studio and it was sort of slotted in the middle."

STH Solo

Rolling Stone magazine asked Jimmy Page how much of the guitar solo was composed before he recorded it. He replied: "It wasn't structured at all [laughs]. I had a start. I knew where and how I was going to begin. And I just did it. There was an amplifier [in the studio] that I was trying out. It sounded good, so I thought, "OK, take a deep breath, and play." I did three takes and chose one of them. They were all different. The solo sounds constructed - and it is, sort of, but purely of the moment. For me, a solo is something where you just fly, but within the context of the song."

Edited by TheStairwayRemainsTheSame

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The solo to me at least always sounded like he just plugged in and let it rip. I doubt there is 10 reels worth of guitar parts used here. It doesn't sound that way at all.

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It's possible, and I have evidence to back this up.

1. First of all, and this will ruffle feathers here, but Jimmy lies. All the time. Take what he says about recordings, amps, etc, with a grain of salt, because he says what he WANTS you to believe.

2. Here is my evidence. Studio outtakes from the Outrider sessions surfaced some time ago, and there were three complete takes of Prison Blues. Jimmy made it VERY clear in interviews at the time that that song was "Live in the studio, one take". Lies, lies, lies. Prison Blues is a mega splice job of Jimmy taking the best bits from each take and piecing together what you hear on the album.

3. Another bit of evidence (and this one hurt me). Outtakes from mean Business by the Firm surfaced, and Jimmy's epic spine chilling solo from Live in Peace, again, cobbled together from numerous takes to make the fluid masterpiece that you hear on the CD.

Jimmy is truly brilliant at editing stuff together, just look at TSRTS sounddtrack. There is at least some possibility to this claim.

3.

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He does seem to play it very fluidly live though, I do think this was all done in one take. However Jimmy is a mastermind at producing and he could have do it in 1000 takes and put the solo together perfectly, we will never know but I'd trust what he says. He is usually honest about his work in the studio and even said he was troubled by the Stairway solo at first.

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The point is moot. Even if he did splice it from 10 tapes - I don't think he would've needed to. He could easily have played it - as he's done live over and over.

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Interesting interview on www.bobbyowsinski.com; under the Mixing Engineer's Handbook, there is an excerpt from an interview with Jimmy Douglass, who worked for a day with Jimmy Page back in 1969 at Atlantic . Per the interview, Pagey showed-up with "10 1/4" reels of guitar solos"; both Douglass and Jimmy then "chopped away at the 10 reels" and eventually came up with the one final solo that was inserted into the middle of Heartbreaker for Zep II. This is an interesting story, because I've always read in interviews with JP, or others, that Jimmy came up with the HB solo "on the spot"; i.e. that he probably recorded 3 separate takes, and then took the "best-one" for the album; but this interview implies that they spliced together bits and pieces from at least 10 takes! (not really the definition of spontaneous.) There's also stories that this was also done with the studio version of the STH solo, although again Jimmy himself sticks to the "best of 3" story...
10 reels of tape for a 45 second solo....really? All I can say is, listen to the solo, its 'very' loose (a little sloppy) and has no discernible cuts in it, much less 10. "Chopping away" at 10 reels is gonna' take more than one day, I can tell you that, I have a few tape decks,

it takes time, and back then they had to physically cut tape as well. It sounds like the best of three to me.

Edited by snapper

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very interesting, some cats can splice tape so fast and clean you would never know, as far as choosing bits from multiple takes-its a vibe thing - splicing the vibes together, I could see it

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Gilmour has always openly admitted editing multiple takes into one solo...I think Jeff Beck has too; but Jimmy apparently likes (us) to believe the studio solos were done "on the fly". It does appear that some were...SIBLY...apparently he recorded a guide solo, but could never top it after..and that's what you hear on the Album (except for the change of one note near the climax) (as revealed again by a boot version). Interestingly, "live", Page could usually top the studio versions: listen to the FIRM Live at the Hammersmith Odeon 12/84 version of "Live in Peace" (as seen in MTV concert video): solo is better than the Mean Business version (IMHO); Also, the live version of "Prison Blues" , ( professionally recorded and broadcast by Westwood One in 1988), is even better than the Outrider version. I guess that's why were all "JP" fans here...when he was "ON", and live, he could really deliver , especially in the earlier years. But it does bother me if he is deliberately fabricating stories about the studio solos, if they really are pieced together.

Edited by RIP-IT-UP

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I'm not buying it.

Pieced together from three or four takes? Yes, that's probable. BUT 10 takes?!? While the band was touring non-stop in 1969 and trying to fit in studio time on the fly? Sorry, I just don't see how they had the time, and were in one place long enough to splice together 10 different takes.

As Jack would say...

http://youtu.be/Tgz5-8chSlk

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I'm not buying it.

Pieced together from three or four takes? Yes, that's probable. BUT 10 takes?!?

Remember, it was "10 1/4" reels of guitar solos", not "10 take's". 10 reels of tape probably holds close

to 4 hours of recording time.

You could put 20 take's of the Heartbreaker solo on one tape....easily.

I'm not buying it either.

Edited by snapper

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Part of the joy of listening to Heartbreaker for all these years is the fact that I always thought this solo was a one off plug in and let it rip type of thing. If this solo actually was compiled from 10 reels of takes.......and it ended up sounding like this...........after ten reels of splicing various takes...............

Man it would be time to re-evaluate then.

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The Heartbreaker solo is one of Page's sloppiest solo's on a Led Zeppelin studio record, if not the sloppiest. I find it hard to believe he would have edited 10 1/4 reels of tape to have a solo sound that sloppy. The energy in that solo comes from that it is in constant motion & quite frankly I don't think that can be faked or edited, it's a beautiful train wreck. Now if this accusation were put to the Tea For One solo, sure it's supposedly one take according to Page but I could doubt it, in this Heartbreaker scenario I have no doubts.

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The solo is quite sloppy on the studio version. It's much better on the liver versions. Especially on the '71 and '72 tours.

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This is obviously bullshit.

If he spliced them with 10 FUCKING REELS He would have no bothers overdubbing it.

I prefer to think of it as a loose crazy solo not a sloppy(<This word bores me)one.

BTW I'm talking about the first half the second part is clearly attached on there as everything stops for half a second then the chords kick in following another solo.

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Who knows? Must go to the source to find the real answer. I'd say no to ten spliced versions. Highly unlikely.

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Thats the truth.

Imo Why even bother Splicing it if you can play it better live?It makes no sense

Exactly! :D

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