Jump to content
Slate Blackcurrant Watermelon Strawberry Orange Banana Apple Emerald Chocolate Marble
Slate Blackcurrant Watermelon Strawberry Orange Banana Apple Emerald Chocolate Marble
JTM

New box sets including unreleased material

Recommended Posts

No re-mastering? I welcome 21st century advances in digital music technology. These transfers will be the best I've ever heard.

As far as the extra material on LZ I....I think there is a decent amount. There's a handful of unreleased and alternate takes out there...who knows what else they might have tried out.

You may welcome 21st century advances in digital, but I'll guarantee you that the guy's who know HOW to record music... ie; Jimmy, Eddie Van Halen, etc... DON'T!!! Digital sucks the life right out of the music. Music needs to breathe, and with all the "technology" there's no room for that. It just dies a digital death. But consumers keep buying supposedly "new" renditions thinking they're getting something better. I've got news for you - go drop the needle on ANY Zeppelin album and it will blow the CD away. Just saying...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can someone point me to a website that explains what 5.1 is...I am serious. I never owned a stereo except in car/computer. Would these remasters also be in regular 2.0? I do have a blu ray player and pick 2.0 when I can Seems when it has to be 5:1 sound effects and music are blaring and voices quieter. Although I have the last 2 cd boxes I would have no place to play the vinyl as wife isnt into Zep but they probably do sound greater . My perspective just comes from the 88 Beatles cd's sounding so much better that 09 stereo remasters. But this is all from in-car experience Wasn't allowed stereo growing up so I have no frame of reference for high end systems...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You may welcome 21st century advances in digital, but I'll guarantee you that the guy's who know HOW to record music... ie; Jimmy, Eddie Van Halen, etc... DON'T!!! Digital sucks the life right out of the music. Music needs to breathe, and with all the "technology" there's no room for that. It just dies a digital death. But consumers keep buying supposedly "new" renditions thinking they're getting something better. I've got news for you - go drop the needle on ANY Zeppelin album and it will blow the CD away. Just saying...

Will a properly mastered, fresh tape transfer, on a new, properly alined, 2 track tape machine suck the life out of the recording? Fuck no. Giving it the push to 0db and compressing the shit out of it, yes....that will suck the life out of it.

When I say digital advances, I don't mean iPods and MP3s. I mean taking an analog tape, running it through a high quality reel to reel and capturing the sound at an amazingly high bit rate (much higher than we as consumers will ever see). Using state of the art editing software to make minimal adjustments, and finishing with a good, quality master and release.

What do you think the vinyl albums were cut from? Two inch analog tape at (at the very least) 15ips. A pure transfer from that very same tape straight to 24/192 wav would blow away any release.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can someone point me to a website that explains what 5.1 is...I am serious. I never owned a stereo except in car/computer. Would these remasters also be in regular 2.0? I do have a blu ray player and pick 2.0 when I can Seems when it has to be 5:1 sound effects and music are blaring and voices quieter. Although I have the last 2 cd boxes I would have no place to play the vinyl as wife isnt into Zep but they probably do sound greater . My perspective just comes from the 88 Beatles cd's sounding so much better that 09 stereo remasters. But this is all from in-car experience Wasn't allowed stereo growing up so I have no frame of reference for high end systems...

There's not much to explain -- the sound comes out of six speakers, one of which is mostly/entirely bass (the subwoofer), at least with music releases. The issue you mention is a sadly prevalent one: Stereo mixes are essentially no longer produced for feature films or TV shows, and you need a fairly good set-up to be able to hear the dialogue properly. There's a bigger issue with 5.1 mixes, in that...well, if you play them through a 2.0 set-up, you're actually losing (or rather, not being given) parts of the aural soundscape, which is a huge part of the reason why it seems so unbalanced -- ridiculously loud, then quiet, then loud again.

I'm not a fan of 5.1, really.

Btw: If you think the 1980 Beatles CDs sound better than the 2009 remasters, you might be better to shy away from any new Zeppelin releases.

You may welcome 21st century advances in digital, but I'll guarantee you that the guy's who know HOW to record music... ie; Jimmy, Eddie Van Halen, etc... DON'T!!! Digital sucks the life right out of the music. Music needs to breathe, and with all the "technology" there's no room for that. It just dies a digital death. But consumers keep buying supposedly "new" renditions thinking they're getting something better. I've got news for you - go drop the needle on ANY Zeppelin album and it will blow the CD away. Just saying...

Luddite much?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The bottom line is : There are enough releases of the Led Zeppelin catalog and unless you have a

dog's ear - one can hardly tell the difference between them sonically for the most part. This re-release

nonsense has to stop. To me the original albums still sound better than any re-release since.

IMO - Don't panic!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nothing I say is going to convince you or anyone else. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

There's what, 5 different masterings available? Diament, Marino, Classic Records, the exclusive Warner set, and the Mastered for iTunes. If I'm not mistaken the Mini LP and Cube sets use the Marino masters. I'm not saying there's not enough already, but if sonic improvements can be made, why not make them?

I understand some people can't tell the difference. I can. The Marino versions are clearer than the Diament, and the MFiT beats both in clarity. Sure, ultra resolution is kind of a waste since I can't hear that high, but why short change what could very well be the final release of the catalog?

Edited by Glyn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank u for your answer which was polite and clear. I'll have to wait and see on remasters because I do have faith in Jimmy's ability to work magic that George Martin at his age with son assisting was unable to. Jimmy may aim these at the full- sounding cd market. Sounded almost like the Beatles' were aimed at being uploaded in an ipod crowd. Having both is nice...have to wait and see...its like I am not in favor of trying to recreate the 07 show several times on another "reunion" tour but how can I say i wouldnt be there If I could afford it...I probably would. Thanks for the answer ...I have a friend that has 5.1 but never really got what it was other than the sound was all around me. It didn't enhance my experience at all but he enjoys the heck out of his system so it's all down to one's preference. I have to think of a car update before anything...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank u for your answer which was polite and clear. I'll have to wait and see on remasters because I do have faith in Jimmy's ability to work magic that George Martin at his age with son assisting was unable to. Jimmy may aim these at the full- sounding cd market. Sounded almost like the Beatles' were aimed at being uploaded in an ipod crowd. Having both is nice...have to wait and see...its like I am not in favor of trying to recreate the 07 show several times on another "reunion" tour but how can I say i wouldnt be there If I could afford it...I probably would. Thanks for the answer ...I have a friend that has 5.1 but never really got what it was other than the sound was all around me. It didn't enhance my experience at all but he enjoys the heck out of his system so it's all down to one's preference. I have to think of a car update before anything...

No problem! I think the "issue" with the Beatles remasters is that, like any of the better "remaster" projects, it actually brought clarity to some of the aural defects inherent in the recording techniques used forty/fifty years ago...or maybe not. I compared them extensively with my favourites up to that point (the Dr. Ebbetts vinyl rips) and the difference between them was usually very slight, and (at least to my ears) always in favour of the 2009 CDs. To each his/her own, of course!

5.1 can be good...I liked the 5.1 mixes included on the 2003 LZ DVD, and Hendrix can sound quite cool/trippy. But feature films or TV? It's just awful.

A rumour is floating around, btw, that a stop order has been issued on the first four Zeppelin albums -- meaning that Warner [?] has effectively cut off the supply for the currently available Marino remasters. If true, we should get some concrete details about at least a few of the remaster projects in the coming months.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it would be nice if jimmy would bring to every remastered album a extra dvd with some film footage from the songs. What do you think? ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it would be nice if jimmy would bring to every remastered album a extra dvd with some film footage from the songs. What do you think? ;)

Bravo! Nobody has thought of that one before! You should write a book...

(No offence)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

im waiting for the remaster of the remasters

Already done with the 2008 mini-LP release.

I don't understand the snarky comments or the negativity -- if you don't want these sets, or aren't interested in them, don't buy them. Don't begrudge anyone else their enjoyment.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No re-mastering? I welcome 21st century advances in digital music technology. These transfers will be the best I've ever heard.

As far as the extra material on LZ I....I think there is a decent amount. There's a handful of unreleased and alternate takes out there...who knows what else they might have tried out.

And I may be joining you!!! How is your ZEP-COLLECTION???

Glyn: Sorry, you MISINTERPRETED what I was saying. I didn't mean the albums should NOT be re-mastered, just that they needn't be re-mastered all at ONCE if it was gonna hold up releasing at least ONE album.

gstritzi: As for my Zep collection, I have BOTH box sets, the greatest hits one, and the COMPLETE one. Been wanting to sell off the greatest hits one for a while, but I'm not just gonna give it away! Like I said, at the rate they're going, I just might stick with the COMPLETE one and go on with my life!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Already done with the 2008 mini-LP release.

I don't understand the snarky comments or the negativity -- if you don't want these sets, or aren't interested in them, don't buy them. Don't begrudge anyone else their enjoyment.

I think it is a case of the waiting game, so rather than go stir crazy we have a little joke or two to pass the (Zeppelin) time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Glyn: Sorry, you MISINTERPRETED what I was saying. I didn't mean the albums should NOT be re-mastered, just that they needn't be re-mastered all at ONCE if it was gonna hold up releasing at least ONE album.

Sorry about that. If that's what you meant, I completely agree with you. As it looks right now they are going to release them separately - but at the same time (well the first four anyway).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

...A rumour is floating around, btw, that a stop order has been issued on the first four Zeppelin albums -- meaning that Warner [?] has effectively cut off the supply for the currently available Marino remasters. If true, we should get some concrete details about at least a few of the remaster projects in the coming months...

I'm not sure what you mean above. Is Warner stopping Page from reissuing the first four albums again? How does Warner even figure into this? I thought Atlantic was the label that owns Zeppelin's catalog. Did Warner buy out Atlantic?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not sure what you mean above. Is Warner stopping Page from reissuing the first four albums again? How does Warner even figure into this? I thought Atlantic was the label that owns Zeppelin's catalog. Did Warner buy out Atlantic?

Probably with the box set releases possibly now scheduled for release, that Warner has halted the production of the releases of the first four albums. I'm sure you can get them in a store, but future production may have been halted and I'm sure they have a genuine idea of the inventory that is out there. And also that these new releases may be of better quality whether on their own or with the extras. But this is just an educated guess on my part, without lack of backed up information. We'll see!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Probably with the box set releases possibly now scheduled for release, that Warner has halted the production of the releases of the first four albums. I'm sure you can get them in a store, but future production may have been halted and I'm sure they have a genuine idea of the inventory that is out there. And also that these new releases may be of better quality whether on their own or with the extras. But this is just an educated guess on my part, without lack of backed up information. We'll see!

My concern with this project is how good are Pagey's ears these days, are they sensitive and attuned enough to know what is a good sonic decision and what isn't regarding the mixing? If he is being supported by other technical people, who are they and what credentials do they have? I think you have to have "old school" ears (like a George Marino or Peter Mew - Free, The Beatles remasters, etc) for a project like this, not someone like Kevin Shirley who may be a technically proficient sound engineer/producer, but can he truly understand the original space dynamics of the recordings? A key part of an exercise is knowing what not to do to mix the recordings rather than knowing what to do. I sincerely hope they refrain from the commercial temptation to master the recordings in a "modern" way geared for MP3/MP4/iTunes, or at least if they do keep it is a separate project and not the core approach. The Mobile Fidelity and Audio Fidelity reissue labels' mixing/remastering strategies highlight perfectly the distinction I am attempting to convey. I'd be more reassured if they are electing to use more sophisticated transfer equipment to bounce the music from the original multi-track tapes and not messing with the mix, except a few tweaks here and there, rather than trying to "improve" and re-shape the sound stage.

Cheers,

Indi

Edited by indigomoonbeam

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not sure what you mean above. Is Warner stopping Page from reissuing the first four albums again? How does Warner even figure into this? I thought Atlantic was the label that owns Zeppelin's catalog. Did Warner buy out Atlantic?

Basically Warner* has stopped allowing stores to order the first four Led Zeppelin cds. This usually happens so that stores can sell out old stock to make room for new releases. Warner doesn't want to compete with previous Led Zeppelin releases.

Edit: *I'm assuming Warner because they are the parent company of Atlantic/Swan Song

Edit 2: This info is all from a friend of a friend and so on. Nothing really concrete.

Edited by Glyn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My concern with this project is how good are Pagey's ears these days, are they sensitive and attuned enough to know what is a good sonic decision and what isn't regarding the mixing? If he is being supported by other technical people, who are they and what credentials do they have? I think you have to have "old school" ears (like a George Marino or Peter Mew - Free, The Beatles remasters, etc) for a project like this, not someone like Kevin Shirley who may be a technically proficient sound engineer/producer, but can he truly understand the original space dynamics of the recordings? A key part of an exercise is knowing what not to do to mix the recordings rather than knowing what to do. I sincerely hope they refrain from the commercial temptation to master the recordings in a "modern" way geared for MP3/MP4/iTunes, or at least if they do keep it is a separate project and not the core approach. The Mobile Fidelity and Audio Fidelity reissue labels' mixing/remastering strategies highlight perfectly the distinction I am attempting to convey. I'd be more reassured if they are electing to use more sophisticated transfer equipment to bounce the music from the original multi-track tapes and not messing with the mix, except a few tweaks here and there, rather than trying to "improve" and re-shape the sound stage.

Cheers,

Indi

Marino? The intricacies of his mastering were always ruined by his CDs being too loud.

If you want a glimpse of how the new mastering should sound, check out the "Mastered for iTunes" tracks.

Basically Warner* has stopped allowing stores to order the first four Led Zeppelin cds. This usually happens so that stores can sell out old stock to make room for new releases. Warner doesn't want to compete with previous Led Zeppelin releases.

Edit: *I'm assuming Warner because they are the parent company of Atlantic/Swan Song

Edit 2: This info is all from a friend of a friend and so on. Nothing really concrete.

Sorry for not making this clear before -- Glyn's right. And Warner has owned Atlantic for years now...

Edited by Melcórë

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My concern is that they reissue the LP's with great sound quality on vinyl...and be affordable!

(somewhat) patiently waiting...

:stereo:

Edited by Cymru629

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My concern is that they reissue the LP's with great sound quality on vinyl...and be affordable!

(somewhat) patiently waiting...

:stereo:

I'm not entirely sure about the degree to which artists have control over pricing. I'd expect vinyl reissues to be set at the normal going rate -- anywhere from $20-$30.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×