LedZebedee Posted May 24, 2013 Posted May 24, 2013 (edited) I can't believe what I'm reading in this thread TBH. One book seems to have suddenly turned the guys in this band into the worst bastards in the world. Take a few steps back people this is NOT the whole picture. I never have and never will argue that these guys were perfect angels, but the way this thread has been heading lately just depresses me every time I come here. Of course it's not the whole picture! Who said it was? It would be naive to think that. It's only a small part - the period '77-80 when things got really out of control i was referring to! Anyway i'm off to read for a second time this week - yes it's that good! Edited May 24, 2013 by LedZebedee Quote
LedZebedee Posted May 24, 2013 Posted May 24, 2013 I suggest you stick with discussing the music of the band. You clearly have no rational analysis of their personalities and making statements like these show a lack of rational to your own. And i suggest you read the book before you judge me! Quote
zeppy668 Posted May 24, 2013 Posted May 24, 2013 And i suggest you read the book before you judge me! I have read the book. I think it's one of the best books written about the band but I don't pretend to know how these men acted on a day to day basis by making half baked comments on a message board. Quote
Knebby Posted May 24, 2013 Posted May 24, 2013 And i suggest you read the book before you judge me!Read. your previous post is still offensive. Quote
Sagittarius Rising Posted May 24, 2013 Posted May 24, 2013 (edited) John Bonham was playing in bands since he was 15. How you can make a statement like that is beyond ridiculous. Perhaps his drinking on the road had less to do with reverse narcissism and more to do with the fact that he had a wife he absolutely adored; finally had the means to raise his young family in a proper setting after starting out dirt poor and the relentless party scene around the band was increasingly boring to him. He certainly maintained a personality away from his family. The guy wasn't always drunk and certainly wasn't always a bastard. Why write a book about all the times John Bonham wasn't misbehaving and sat down in a chair and had a quiet conversation with someone over a cup of tea? He had a good upbringing. Jacko and Joan for loving parents, considering John was always a rambunctious child. First off, he didn't join a successful touring band. His talents contributed to Led Zeppelin becoming successful. And they helped create the scene around them. You make Bonham sound like someone who was gullible and couldn't for-see the 1970s drug culture. Were other rock stars mind readers? I suggest you stick with discussing the music of the band. You clearly have no rational analysis of their personalities and making statements like these show a lack of rational to your own. Hey now, I was not saying anything disrespectful nor not said by the man (Bonham) himself. HE said he hated the road, I did not speculate, it's in print. Pre- Zeppelin he never left Britain, his limited touring kept him away from his family maybe a day or two at a time, not three to six months overseas like Zeppelin did. It appears to me he had quite a pronounced duality, that is to say you are correct, for the first time he could provide for his family in the manner he wished, however the flip side was he had to sell his soul (be away from his family) to do it. He was being pulled apart psychologically, it does not take a therapist to understand that. I simply think this brilliant, sensitive, and ultimately kind man would have done much better as a homebody who played the occasional one-off gig while being an active studio musician the majority of the time. Home and hearth with the family. In reply to Steve, yes, it was Bonham who talked Robert into re-joining the band. This totally baffles me and I have no idea why as it goes contrary to Bonham's nature, that is to say touring. Maybe the original plan was to do a Steely Dan and simply produce albums and not tour. Maybe Knebworth was supposed to be a one-off and they had no intention to tour again, but were talked into the 80' tour by Grant, I have no clue. Without clarification and additional details I am completely stumped. Edited May 24, 2013 by Sagittarius Rising Quote
Knebby Posted May 24, 2013 Posted May 24, 2013 Of course it's not the whole picture! Who said it was? It would be naive to think that. It's only a small part - the period '77-80 when things got really out of control i was referring to!Anyway i'm off to read for a second time this week - yes it's that good!Your post was one of the worst. Quote
clw Posted May 24, 2013 Posted May 24, 2013 Ditto I can't believe what I'm reading in this thread TBH. One book seems to have suddenly turned the guys in this band into the worst bastards in the world. Take a few steps back people this is NOT the whole picture. I never have and never will argue that these guys were perfect angels, but the way this thread has been heading lately just depresses me every time I come here. Quote
Disco Duck Posted May 24, 2013 Posted May 24, 2013 Hoskyn's book is a warts and all history of Led Zeppelin in the words of the band members and people who knew them. It was always going to generate dissection and heated discussion. Quote
Knebby Posted May 24, 2013 Posted May 24, 2013 Hoskyn's book is a warts and all history of Led Zeppelin in the words of the band members and people who knew them. It was always going to generate dissection and heated discussion.No shit?This discussion seems to be particularly one-sided, however. Quote
ListenToThis Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Call for peace. There are some who have a stronger knowledge and investment with the band, and some who have not had the years of following yet to gain that more comprehensive appreciation. Those who know a relatively limited amount may be shocked by some of the things they read, due in part to a young age of the reader or a still developing study of the mighty Zep. There is generally a limited number of people who participate here that I pay mind to. They know who they are. Quote
Susan Gibson Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 I am also a new member of this forum (though not a new fan of the band) and as such, certainly do not want to offend anyone. I started to read this thread because I was interested in finding out if this book was a good read before purchasing it. Some of these posts are unbelievable. One of the posts even says that Page and Plant were nothing but poster boys while Jones and Bonham were the only good musicians. Another one calls LZ a “reasonably successful” band. And a comment that the band should have broken up sooner and saved itself from a “mediocre” album (ITTOD). It certainly was different from their other albums (and wasn’t that the point?), but mediocre? Was it not 6x platinum in the US? In what universe was anything LZ did mediocre or reasonably successful? As far as being just poster boys, haven’t Plant and Page been repeatedly voted as among the best, if not THE BEST, at what they do in a multitude of polls and magazines over the years? I know everyone is entitled to his or her own opinion. I just cannot believe that they come from LZ fans, even newer fans without much knowledge about the band. There is also much time spent analyzing behaviors and such related to drug and alcohol use. I personally have had several family members succumb to the ill effects of heavy drug and alcohol use. I would not even venture to speculate on their thoughts or behaviors and I lived around them on a daily basis for years. Why is it that anyone would want to spend time ridiculing and insulting people who they do not know about issues that they know nothing about? Especially when the fact remains that these four individuals were ALL incredibly talented, gifted musicians who were far ahead of their time and left us with music of such high quality and depth that it has clearly stood the test of time?? I have never had the honor of meeting any band members or even seeing them in concert because I was only 7 when JB passed. But I know that, if I ever did have the chance to speak to any of them, my conversation would be related to their music and not their personal issues which are frankly none of my business. I know these stories are all part of the history of LZ and I enjoy reading anything about their history. However, I have always been told that somewhere between two versions of a story lies the truth and it is not fair to judge based on only one side. And frankly, what does it matter? I still have a great degree of admiration and respect for JP, RP, JPJ, and JB for everything that they were able to accomplish (and still accomplish) and how many people their music has affected. The rest are just stories. Quote
Sagittarius Rising Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 ^ Welcome Sue, and might I add an excellent post. Quote
Susan Gibson Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Thank you! I still don't know whether or not to read this book but at least I got that off my chest. ^ Welcome Sue, and might I add an excellent post. Quote
Sagittarius Rising Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 ^ Definitely, read it but take it for what it is. Quote
LedZebedee Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Read. your previous post is still offensive. Ok i accept now i have over-stepped the mark so will apologise unreservedly for any offence caused. Quote
Cecil. Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 I know this is turning into a online "frank & open exchange of views", but is the book a worthwhile read....? Quote
kenog Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Definitely Cecil. There is something on every page that was new to me, and I've read a good many of the LZ books available. Obviously, the interviewees are giving their perspective on events which happened up to forty years ago, but it is still useful to hear from people 'who were there'. The sections on the group members' early careers are worth the book price alone. You have to keep in mind that a number of the contributors are disgruntled former employees. It begs the question why did they stick around? Fame by association? There were surely other posts available in the music industry, or in any other industry in London/US. As I have said before, I would love to have seen any comments which Hoskyns' publisher will have had to omit for fear of legal action. I know this is turning into a online "frank & open exchange of views", but is the book a worthwhile read....? Quote
kenog Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Some members on the site knew/know the band, and to those members, what is written in a book is not necessarily a balanced picture of their friends. Ok i accept now i have over-stepped the mark so will apologise unreservedly for any offence caused. Quote
LedZebedee Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Some members on the site knew/know the band, and to those members, what is written in a book is not necessarily a balanced picture of their friends. I know, i know! (hangs head in shame) (: I really got sucked into the book and let it sway my judgement too easily - apologies again! Quote
kenog Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 LedZebedee, I wasn't looking for you to apologise - you have already done so earlier in the thread unreservedly. So often on this site, people say offensive things and they don't have the courtesy to do what you have done. The book is well worth discussing, so let's carry on with other areas. One of my concerns was the treatment of signed Swansong artists like Maggie Bell and Dave Edmunds. One of the saddest points of the book for me was Ms Bell locking herself in the toilets at 484 Kings Road when the office was being emptied out. Both Maggie and Dave had a lot of potential as artists, but they didn't seem to get the requisite support and development from SwanSong. I don't think Maggie Bell's career ever recovered after being signed to them. I know, i know! (hangs head in shame) (: I really got sucked into the book and let it sway my judgement too easily - apologies again! Quote
Knebby Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 LedZebedee, I wasn't looking for you to apologise - you have already done so earlier in the thread unreservedly. So often on this site, people say offensive things and they don't have the courtesy to do what you have done. The book is well worth discussing, so let's carry on with other areas. One of my concerns was the treatment of signed Swansong artists like Maggie Bell and Dave Edmunds. One of the saddest points of the book for me was Ms Bell locking herself in the toilets at 484 Kings Road when the office was being emptied out. Both Maggie and Dave had a lot of potential as artists, but they didn't seem to get the requisite support and development from SwanSong. I don't think Maggie Bell's career ever recovered after being signed to them.Agree on all counts. Quote
Cecil. Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Thank you Kenog, Music biographies are always a bit pay your money and take you choice.... I will read the book. Quote
ledded1 Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Some here spent days psycho-analysing their inter-personal relationships based upon the seating arrangement at a press conference. Spare yourself from yet another waste of time and emotion. Spot on Steve. Quote
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