LedZeppfan77 Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 My apologies for the strong words. However, I strongly disagree with you that fire is best fought with fire. That is fine, but when a guy shoots little kids, what are you going to do to stop a maniac with a gun? You must shoot him or he will shoot you. I am going to get my 9 ,mm while I still can. Gotta run. I am sure that breaks your hearts. Have a good day if possible. I will pray for those victims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hecube Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 That is fine, but when a guy shoots little kids, what are you going to do to stop a maniac with a gun? You must shoot him or he will shoot you. I am going to get my 9 ,mm while I still can. Gotta run. I am sure that breaks your hearts. Have a good day if possible. I will pray for those victims. Prevention, prevention, prevention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 This guy had a Glock and a Sig Saur (German police use) both 9mm and both cost about $700 plus and automatic weapon. You can contol the auto but you are not taking my handguns away from me because some asshole like this had an agenda. He would have gotten a gun no matter how he had to do it.\\ 1200 people have jumped from the Golden Gate bridge. Should we knock the bridge down? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the chase Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 1200 people have jumped from the Golden Gate bridge. Should we knock the bridge down? No, But they could put up some sort of barrier.. It wouldn't look as good, we'd be defacing an historical landmark but too bad, it would save some lives.. People used to jump off the Empire State Building (and a large Ape even fell off it once)..till they put up that ugly fencing with spikes and whatever on top. It looks bad but it saves lives. It's way too easy for nut jobs to get weapons...I'm not sure what we can do about and I don't want to tread on anybody's right to bear arms blah blah blah ... But it is obviously a serious problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the chase Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 So sad....there is time to debate gun control....I'm grieving for those poor children being subjected to such a horrible, life changing event at such a young age and the families who will have to do the unthinkable - bury your own child! I am completely distraught over reading this.... it's terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justawoman Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 People, this is not a time for political debate, this is a time for prayer and reflection. Hug and kiss your loved ones. Show them love always because you never know when they may be taken from you. Pray for the families who lost theirs today. Pray for the parents. There is no pain greater than that of a parent who loses a child. These children were just babies, so innocent. Please, pray for their parents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stryder1978 Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 On that I can agree. Thoughts and prayers to the souls of the victiims and their families. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cofa Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 People, this is not a time for political debate, this is a time for prayer and reflection. Hug and kiss your loved ones. Show them love always because you never know when they may be taken from you. Pray for the families who lost theirs today. Pray for the parents. There is no pain greater than that of a parent who loses a child. These children were just babies, so innocent. Please, pray for their parents. So true. It is certainly not the time to be talking about the specific details of your own gun collection! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zepscoda Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 I'm not going to watch the news for a few days. This story freaks me out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hecube Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 People, this is not a time for political debate, this is a time for prayer and reflection. Hug and kiss your loved ones. Show them love always because you never know when they may be taken from you. Pray for the families who lost theirs today. Pray for the parents. There is no pain greater than that of a parent who loses a child. These children were just babies, so innocent. Please, pray for their parents. So when is it? It's never the time for THIS political debate. When is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anjin-san Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 So when is it? It's never the time for THIS political debate. When is it? Can we bury the murdered first? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justawoman Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 So when is it? It's never the time for THIS political debate. When is it? After the dead are buried and the wound is not so raw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP78 Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 they are saying the guns were registered in his mother's name. he got them from home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the body electric Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 It keeps happening here because it's too easy to get a gun and we don't know how to treat mental illness effectively. The profile is almost always men with paranoid schizophrenia who have easy access to guns. It wouldn't be "mass" without that method. Guns will never be outlawed in the US. Too many coward politicians afraid to go against the NRA and too many people who believe owning a gun is a human right. And we're too afraid as a country to discuss mental illness with any level of sophistication or empathy. Yes Yes Yes and Yes. The mistake the gun lobby and Libertarians make is the assumption that people basically behave rationally. They don't and never will. Mental illness is stigmatized and our county is awash in guns. Perhaps not too late to change the first, definitely too late to change the second. If you rush out to buy a 9MM you are part of the problem, not the solution. At the core of gun ownership is fear. Something is going to go down eventually and I am going to be ready. In The Light since 1972. Trampled Under Foot. My life with Led Zeppelin. http://petedelorean.tumblr.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anjin-san Posted December 15, 2012 Share Posted December 15, 2012 The morons come out,....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DE12 Posted December 15, 2012 Share Posted December 15, 2012 So when is it? It's never the time for THIS political debate. When is it? Thank you for saying this. That's not meant as a diss to those who feel differently. Being respectful to those who have died and those suffering doesn't mean we turn our brains off. Everyone said the same thing on 9/11. But as I sat there waiting to hear if my colleagues and friends were alive and trying to get through to my family, not knowing what the fuck was going on, I knew that a deeper conversation about our foreign policy had to happen. Luckily, I was with an older British executive who had a sophisticated understanding of the world and assured me my thoughts weren't unpatriotic or inappropriate or stupid. Talking is part of the healing process for some- including asking - why does this keep happening? what can we do to prevent it? But the truth is - no one can convince me that ownership of guns is a human right or has anything to do with our freedom as human beings. I personally know way too many people and way too many situations where guns did nothing to protect and only caused irreparable harm. Those who want their guns will continue to say it's their right as an "AMERICAN" to have a gun because of words written when the most-used weapon was, what a musket? Not something that shot off 100 rounds of ammunition at a time and that a very sick 20-year old could easily and legally buy. After the dead are buried and the wound is not so raw. I understand well and respect what you are saying but it simply isn't true. A few months ago, how many were killed in a movie theatre? In a mall the other day? Another poster said 61 shootings (hundreds dead and wounded) since 1982 is "infinitesimal." But while that is statistically true, no loss of life will ever be enough for some (about 1/2 the US) to budge on their ownership of a thing whose ONLY purpose is to harm. The hunger for a false sense of safety and control that guns give many people won't go away because in a few weeks, when some think it's a more appropriate time to have this discussion, Americans will be too immersed in Christmas, then New Years, etc. Then before you know it, another mass shooting will be in the news. And since we are country that walks in fear (gun sales go up after a mass shooting- there's always an economic benefit to someone's suffering) and instead of talking about it and doing something about it, we'll be very sad for a few weeks. Then back to every day life. Thanks for a place to express my opinions and learn more about (sometimes way too much!) about the band. I'm out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anjin-san Posted December 15, 2012 Share Posted December 15, 2012 The victims have NOT been ID yet,thanks,......shit-oles! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivingLovingHeartbreaker Posted December 15, 2012 Share Posted December 15, 2012 What really gets me is these idiots always have to take innocent people down with them, you got the problem take your damn self out. for these poor families. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebk Posted December 15, 2012 Share Posted December 15, 2012 As always, fdm, a rational, well written post. Thank you. I grieve for those who lost loved ones. And I truly believe that the only way we can attempt to stop this insanity is to have civil discussions about the problems and possible solutions. And better to have those discussion sooner rather than after the event is pushed out of our minds and something else happens. There is no better way to honor those who have been needlessly taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadecatcher Posted December 15, 2012 Share Posted December 15, 2012 No, But they could put up some sort of barrier.. It wouldn't look as good, we'd be defacing an historical landmark but too bad, it would save some lives.. People used to jump off the Empire State Building (and a large Ape even fell off it once)..till they put up that ugly fencing with spikes and whatever on top. It looks bad but it saves lives. It's way too easy for nut jobs to get weapons...I'm not sure what we can do about and I don't want to tread on anybody's right to bear arms blah blah blah ... But it is obviously a serious problem. Completely agree, In Toronto the most jumped-off bridge over the parkway was fitted with a suicide prevention fence years ago and it stopped all future jumpers. Sure if someone is intent on taking their life, they will find a way but no longer onto traffic below that bridge. My heart does go out to anyone so depressed they consider suicide and big signs stand either side of that bridget with help line numbers and plea for them to call and talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZEPFAN17 Posted December 15, 2012 Share Posted December 15, 2012 Such a senseless tragedy,Thoughts and prayers going out to the victims and their families. Why didn't the shooter just blow his own head off. The count now is 20 children have lost their lives and 6 adults including the shooters mother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadecatcher Posted December 15, 2012 Share Posted December 15, 2012 Police and/or military presence doesn't always have to mean "fear". They are there as protection and should be viewed as a "friend" and "protector", to feel safe in a situation as this, or any other...in a school full of kids. Not as a mindset that "somethings about to happen".... They can be brought into the system (properly presented/introduced along with the correct education towards the students on "why") for the good reasons...not just as the thought of a possible mass murder spree. Hell, they even use rent-a-cops (deputies on-call) at local school dances, etc. They are there as a "just-in-case" situation.....It could be just to prevent or stop a fight. Anything. Better safe than sorry. Yet again it's the same old argument - be proactive and treat the cause or reactive and treat the disease. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted December 15, 2012 Share Posted December 15, 2012 Thank you for saying this. That's not meant as a diss to those who feel differently. Being respectful to those who have died and those suffering doesn't mean we turn our brains off. Everyone said the same thing on 9/11. But as I sat there waiting to hear if my colleagues and friends were alive and trying to get through to my family, not knowing what the fuck was going on, I knew that a deeper conversation about our foreign policy had to happen. Luckily, I was with an older British executive who had a sophisticated understanding of the world and assured me my thoughts weren't unpatriotic or inappropriate or stupid. Talking is part of the healing process for some- including asking - why does this keep happening? what can we do to prevent it? But the truth is - no one can convince me that ownership of guns is a human right or has anything to do with our freedom as human beings. I personally know way too many people and way too many situations where guns did nothing to protect and only caused irreparable harm. Those who want their guns will continue to say it's their right as an "AMERICAN" to have a gun because of words written when the most-used weapon was, what a musket? Not something that shot off 100 rounds of ammunition at a time and that a very sick 20-year old could easily and legally buy. I understand well and respect what you are saying but it simply isn't true. A few months ago, how many were killed in a movie theatre? In a mall the other day? Another poster said 61 shootings (hundreds dead and wounded) since 1982 is "infinitesimal." But while that is statistically true, no loss of life will ever be enough for some (about 1/2 the US) to budge on their ownership of a thing whose ONLY purpose is to harm. The hunger for a false sense of safety and control that guns give many people won't go away because in a few weeks, when some think it's a more appropriate time to have this discussion, Americans will be too immersed in Christmas, then New Years, etc. Then before you know it, another mass shooting will be in the news. And since we are country that walks in fear (gun sales go up after a mass shooting- there's always an economic benefit to someone's suffering) and instead of talking about it and doing something about it, we'll be very sad for a few weeks. Then back to every day life. Thanks for a place to express my opinions and learn more about (sometimes way too much!) about the band. I'm out. There are many many responsible gun owners. One maniac does this and some people want to blame the guns? If he did not have a gun he would have used a hatchet or a bomb. Wake up and realize its not the fault of the guns and the average gun owner is responsible and has a right to defend his home against intrusion. They can get guns on the streets anyway. Everyone knows that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shnflacwav Posted December 15, 2012 Share Posted December 15, 2012 Chances are this 20 year old maniac bought this gun on the street or on the black market. I hear he used an assault rifle and I am for putting control on these type of weapons. But not all. I am waiting to learn if the coward shot himself like they usually do or if the police took him out? Unfortunately, the guns were registered to his mother. It was reported his brother stated the gunman had a history of mental illness. If that is true, the mother unfortunately is the irresponsible gun owner by not having them locked up away from the sick kid. As a gun owner, I support stricter guidelines for allowing certain people access to them. But that won't prevent them from getting them through illegal channels. Terrible tragedy, my heart goes out to the parents and families. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock Historian Posted December 15, 2012 Share Posted December 15, 2012 Yet again it's the same old argument - be proactive and treat the cause or reactive and treat the disease. Yeah...OK. So I guess having an "officer friendly" presence in schools in a positive way, no matter how major or minor the reason - is a bad, unrealistic idea, right? I thought that's what police do....? Protect and serve, right? Sometimes, they are only a reaction to the crime after the fact, but hey-there is nothing wrong with displaying a presence to possibly deter those who attempt such crimes. I don't think it's that far fetched (that crazy) of an idea. As a matter a fact, maybe you are foreign to this kind of thing, but they already have police officers in some schools in New Orleans (middle schools) where kids have brought weapons in the past. I did some work in one of the schools I'm referring to, for the Electric company I was working for at the time. An officer would be at the door where the students come in, in the morning and do a "pat down" in addition to one of those scanners you see at the airport...Sounds terrible huh? Well, it comes with the territory. It's either that, or have the government officials go house to house an take away every single gun anyone owns....good luck. Take Care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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