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Meet the New Pope


Ace Of Spades

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Agreed...the word "know" should always be used very carefully by people......

additionally,

I think there are a lot of people, me included, that could benefit from remembering this in some instances....

"I know I believe, but, I don't believe that I know".......

:notworthy:

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I was reading some of the things the catholics here are saying about Jesus, but then was wondering if the guy was so important why do you say prayers to mary and other dead people too? And why do you confess to a priest when you can confess to god?

Just from the outside looking in, catholics have more things going that are not about Jesus than are about him.

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Maybe if I over used some dumbass emoticons, you would get the humor.

Oooh, guess I hit a nerve, with that lame-ass comeback of yours - or not, given your usual responses. Carry on Catholic soldier!

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I was reading some of the things the catholics here are saying about Jesus, but then was wondering if the guy was so important why do you say prayers to mary and other dead people too? And why do you confess to a priest when you can confess to god?

Just from the outside looking in, catholics have more things going that are not about Jesus than are about him.

We do pray to the Virgini Mary and to the Saints. You should realize that. But if you are not a Catholic perhaps you are not aware. You have been living under a rock if you have never heard the prayer to the virgin Mary. It starts out "Hail Mary full of grace, the Lord is with thee". I say it every night. And the member that mentioned Catholic charities is correct. They do an amaziing job helping out and so does Christian Heritage. To refer to Jesus as "the guy", like he was just some nobody, is simply a dumb statement. "If he is so important?" Over 1/3 of the worlds population believe he is the son of God. I would say that makes him somewhat important. I cant believe the things I read.

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I was reading some of the things the catholics here are saying about Jesus, but then was wondering if the guy was so important why do you say prayers to mary and other dead people too? And why do you confess to a priest when you can confess to god?

Just from the outside looking in, catholics have more things going that are not about Jesus than are about him

Fair questions Ace..

First things first ... It's all about Jesus Christ in the Catholic Church.

The Holy Trinity.. The Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

I can't and won't speak for all Catholics... but I don't pray to Saints,.. or Statues and never will.

I think of people that do this as asking someone (a Saint) to put in a good word on their behalf.. they're not praying to them and worshipping them, They're asking for help.. not really a big deal.

edit: Same with Praying to Mary, this is also asking Her to pray for us..

The Sacrament of Reconciliation involves Confession, Penance and Forgiveness.

But yeah a one on one conversation with God / Jesus obviously works..

See that.... We can be Civil about this...

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We do pray to the Virgini Mary and to the Saints. You should realize that. But if you are not a Catholic perhaps you are not aware. You have been living under a rock if you have never heard the prayer to the virgin Mary. It starts out "Hail Mary full of grace, the Lord is with thee". I say it every night. And the member that mentioned Catholic charities is correct. They do an amaziing job helping out and so does Christian Heritage. To refer to Jesus as "the guy", like he was just some nobody, is simply a dumb statement. "If he is so important?" Over 1/3 of the worlds population believe he is the son of God. I would say that makes him somewhat important. I cant believe the things I read.

I think you missed my point. I did not mean anything bad with my question, I was just looking for an answer as to why "Jesus" from an outsider's perspective (me), seems to be less in the spotlight than Mary, saints, popes and preists within the catholic church?

And you can't use what 1/3 of the world believes to convince anyone. I/3 follows Mohammed.

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Fair questions Ace..

First things first ... It's all about Jesus Christ in the Catholic Church.

The Holy Trinity.. The Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

I can't and won't speak for all Catholics... but I don't pray to Saints,.. or Statues and never will.

I think of people that do this as asking someone (a Saint) to put in a good word on their behalf.. they're not praying to them and worshipping them, They're asking for help.. not really a big deal.

edit: Same with Praying to Mary, this is also asking Her to pray for us..

The Sacrament of Reconciliation involves Confession, Penance and Forgiveness.

But yeah a one on one conversation with God / Jesus obviously works..

See that.... We can be Civil about this...

Thanks for the answer Chase. I have never said in this thread or at anytime that catholics are bad people. Some people here have slammed them pretty hard, but that wasn't me. I just don't understand organized religions and the way they put so many things in front of what they claim is the most important thing--- "christ"

I guess if praying to mary is just asking for help then that makes better sense. Same way a person might pray to a dead mother or father. When I think about a god/creator, I think about someone who can hear me talking without any preist or preacher man in the way. I think we can all agree that in ALL religions, the abuse begins when someone says you can get to God but you have to get to him through me, or through my book, or my "interpretation". Taking all the power from the simple message just opens the door for abuse.

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Oooh, guess I hit a nerve, with that lame-ass comeback of yours - or not, given your usual responses. Carry on Catholic soldier!

I will,Wally. In spite of your cleverness in posting I'll march onward like a good Christian Soldier, so you'll have more cannon fodder. How much self restraint did that take to not sign with a smilie? You could of used a frown but I am sure you are familiar with all those cute little guys.

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I was in the Vatican in 2001, I attended some sort of Papal activity on a Wednesday, as a tourist really, I remember there were long lines to enter the Sistine Chapel, but it was worth the wait. My father took us to Czestochowa (pardon the incorrect spell) and I also visited some monasteries in the Balkans in the same year, but I'm actually not a religious person, nor my father was, he just liked to travel to other countries and see different cultures -so do I.

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The church should have a PG13 warning label, no admittance to anyone under 13 unless accompanied by mom and dad

I prefer not to go this route, even when there is a lot of truth to what you're insinuating about.

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When will you begin liquidating everything in your home for the sake of the poor?. Practice what you preach.

Gee Steve, I don't believe anyone here claims to be the direct conduit to god and therefore the vicar of christ on earth. That is the big difference, the church claims it is better than everyone else, that we need their guidance as intermediary between us and god for salvation, and that they are infallible. So, I believe since they have taken this stance since 325 AD they should model themselves after the very figure (Jesus) they claim to represent. Get it now Steve??? If one claims to be the nexus of moral authority, well, start walking the walk.

The above aside, if this pope really wants to make a difference he will:

1. Make celibacy a choice LIKE IT WAS FOR 1,000 YEARS BEFORE THEY CHANGED IT, in an effort to steal as much land in Europe as possible. They succeeded, time to move on.

2. Allow women to be priests, LIKE IT WAS FOR 200 YEARS BEFORE THE COUNCIL OF NICEA.

3. Defrock all pedophile priests, bishops, and cardinals and then turn them over to local authorities for prosecution.

4. Dissolve the vatican bank and give the bulk of the cash to the poor, also turn over bank managers to police for prosecution in laundering drug money for the past 60 years.

5. Admit they turned a blind eye (and probably worst) during WWII and publicly apologize to the jews for being massive pricks for 1,800 years.

Anything short of that is pure bullshit.

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5. Admit they turned a blind eye (and probably worst) during WWII and publicly apologize to the jews for being massive pricks for 1,800 years.

Anything short of that is pure bullshit.

The Nazis also targeted some religious groups... In some countries Roman Catholic bishops and even Catholics themselves had openly protested and attacked Nazi policies. For instance, in the Netherlands and Poland, where bishops and priests had protested the deportation of Jews, the clergy was either threatened with deportation themselves and kept in custody (as in the case of German bishop Clemens von Galen), or directly deported to concentration camps (as in the cases of the Dutch Carmelite priest Titus Brandsma and Polish Fr. Maximilian Kolbe, who was later canonized). The Catholic Church was particularly suppressed in Poland: between 1939 and 1945, an estimated 3,000 members (18%) of the Polish clergy, were murdered; of these, 1,992 died in concentration camps.[27] In the annexed territory of Reichsgau Wartheland it was even more harsh: churches were systematically closed and most priests were either killed, imprisoned, or deported to the General Government. Eighty per cent of the Catholic clergy and five bishops of Warthegau were sent to concentration camps in 1939; 108 of them are regarded as blessed martyrs.[27] Religious persecution was not confined to Poland: in Dachau concentration camp alone, 2,600 Catholic priests from 24 different countries were killed.[27] (Wikipedia)

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The Church has become the guardians of those treasures for the whole world. They are made available for pilgrims and tourists alike to enjoy when visiting such places as the Sistine Chapel in St. Peter’s Basilica and the various Vatican museums. The Church has also allowed it's art holdings to be used in tours to countries like the United States, for those who cannot visit Italy and elsewhere. Then the revenue obtained by displaying these items is used to assist the needs of people everywhere.

I'm not surprised there are some here who would like to see the Church become destitute, just disappointed they don't have the intellectual horsepower to understand a destitute Church cannot serve those in need. How many urban homeless shelters - for just one example - would a destitute Church be required to close forever? How many outreaches cancelled? Much of the Church's inner-city real estate holdings have became signatificantly devalued over time. A destitute church could not offset such losses in the future.

So only a simpleton would even suggest selling irreplaceble treasures that also serve as perpetual sources of church revenue. As a by the way, the Church sold some of its gold reserves to stave off the extermination of many Jews during World War II. During that period, the Church also offered Jewish refugees shelter in convents, monasteries, and churches.

I do get it. I've always gotten it.

If I've learned anything from this thread it that you don't have to be a Christian to be a hypocrite.

you did n't answer the following

1. Make celibacy a choice LIKE IT WAS FOR 1,000 YEARS BEFORE THEY CHANGED IT, in an effort to steal as much land in Europe as possible. They succeeded, time to move on.

2. Allow women to be priests, LIKE IT WAS FOR 200 YEARS BEFORE THE COUNCIL OF NICEA.

3. Defrock all pedophile priests, bishops, and cardinals and then turn them over to local authorities for prosecution.

4. Dissolve the vatican bank and give the bulk of the cash to the poor, also turn over bank managers to police for prosecution in laundering drug money for the past 60 years.

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