Tatty73 Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 When Celebration Day came out and the video promos were released for TV and the internet (you can check them on You Tube and this site), they noted it was the most demanded concert ticket in history and a band with over 300 million albums sold worldwide). That's what was said in the very beginning of the video. It was during the GTBT intro. Not sure where their accuracy is from, but it must have some substance, otherwise they wouldn't be there! Here it is and look in the beginning! Yeah, I've seen it, the 300m has also been quoted in magazines such as Billboard, but it has absolutely no substance whatsoever, I honestly do not know how they are getting to 300m, it is a truly ludicrous claim. Having worked in the Music Industry dealing with Copyright, Royalties and Publishing, I am well aware that what the PR Department of a Record Companies puts out there through Press (and then unfortunately the Press seem to take as Verbatim) is not always the actually truth or what has actually been sold or shipped. If you just think about it or look at logically, rather than just going by what a Record Company says (who are notorious for fluffing up their artists achievements) they have Certified Shipments of 111.5m in the US, which is under Certified, I think they should be more around 120m if all was properly Certified, but this actually equates to around 100m actual SHipments/Sales, when Multiple Disc Sets are reduced back to one. Taking in mind that the US is 1. By quite some way the largest music market and always has been and 2 Led Zeppelins biggest market and by quite some way, then trying to obtain 200m from the rest of the world just does not add up. If you take for example that the next biggest markets for Led Zeppelin are Canada and The UK, where they have Shipped around 10m each (I'd say), you see the difficulty in trying to get 200m from the ROW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagesbow Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) Not sure where their accuracy is from, but it must have some substance, otherwise they wouldn't be there! Here it is and look in the beginning! It wasn't from Tatty73, so. I'm kidding, he's probably right and we'll just have to accept that Queen are the biggest rock band of all-time and that Celine Dion is also bigger than Zep ever was. Edited July 5, 2013 by Pagesbow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenog Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Well said I don't know why you are acting like a smart arse about this and posting stupid, pointless and no good to anybody remarks, about what I'm posting. I have actually done quite a bit of research into all this, do know what I am talking about (to a level) and am just trying to inform people on here, to how things actually are with regards to sales. Why can't you actually add to the debate with maybe some information, research or useful comments, as appose to just saying things are "silly" or being sarcastic as in "Since you know SO much" I don't claim to know everything, but I do know quite a bit about things like this and just want to impart some of this knowledge (about this band that I love) to others, without people like you getting all stroppy, because you don't like the facts that I offer you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatty73 Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 It wasn't from Tatty73, so. I'm kidding, he's probably right and we'll just have to accept that Queen are the biggest rock band of all-time and that Celine Dion is also bigger than Zep ever was. lol To the best of my knowledge, Pink Floyd have sold more albums than both Queen and Led Zeppelin, although I'd say Queen have sold more overall when taking Singles into consideration. I'd also say The Rolling Stones has probably sold more albums than Queen and Led Zeppelin, but less then Pink Floyd, but again more overall. Pink Floyd's catalog album sales are amazing, they really do put Zeppelins in the shade, in fact catalog wise they put everybody in the shade, with the exception of The Beatles. I wouldn't say "bigger" but Celine Dion does have some very successful albums, I think she has two that have sold over 30m. There are actually quite a lot of acts that are very close to each other in terms of worldwide albums sales, such as Madonna, Celine Dion, Mariah Carey, U2, Led Zeppelin, The Rolling Stones, Queen and probably a few more, with Pink Floyd being a bit ahead of this pack, Michael Jackson ahead a bit more, then Elvis and The Beatles out on their own. The thing is though, when adding up all sales (including singles) Led Zeppelin falls down quite a bit, as all of those acts (apart from Floyd and to a lesser extent U2) have been extremely successful singles sellers too, as well as albums. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezer Posted July 5, 2013 Author Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) Are we talking about overall sales? I'd say Pink Floyd edges Zep easily. Edited July 5, 2013 by Geezer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSH1127 Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 I watched a fairly new documentary about the Eagles. I'm not a fan but for some reason I'm a sucker for documentaries (especially about bands of all genres from the 70's). They claimed ( and I'm paraphrasing) that it was a "little known fact" that the Eagles sold more albums than any band from that decade. Something along the lines of their Greatest Hits record alone selling a million copies for 18 months straight. Throw in other bands like the Stevie Nicks/ Lindsey Buckingham -era Fleetwood Mac and I think it's a crap shoot to try to reasonably deduce any totally accurate number of record sales. All I know for sure is that Zeppelin sold and continue to sell a shit load of records and sold out a lot of shows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsh327 Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 Yeah, I've seen it, the 300m has also been quoted in magazines such as Billboard, but it has absolutely no substance whatsoever, I honestly do not know how they are getting to 300m, it is a truly ludicrous claim. Having worked in the Music Industry dealing with Copyright, Royalties and Publishing, I am well aware that what the PR Department of a Record Companies puts out there through Press (and then unfortunately the Press seem to take as Verbatim) is not always the actually truth or what has actually been sold or shipped. If you just think about it or look at logically, rather than just going by what a Record Company says (who are notorious for fluffing up their artists achievements) they have Certified Shipments of 111.5m in the US, which is under Certified, I think they should be more around 120m if all was properly Certified, but this actually equates to around 100m actual SHipments/Sales, when Multiple Disc Sets are reduced back to one. Taking in mind that the US is 1. By quite some way the largest music market and always has been and 2 Led Zeppelins biggest market and by quite some way, then trying to obtain 200m from the rest of the world just does not add up. If you take for example that the next biggest markets for Led Zeppelin are Canada and The UK, where they have Shipped around 10m each (I'd say), you see the difficulty in trying to get 200m from the ROW. Elvis Presley's estate (and maybe Michael Jackson) tended to stretch the truth when it came to gold records. Anything before Soundscan in '91 is questionable data. There's definitely "record company politics" involved when it comes to things like RIAA awards and the Rock Hall. Ahmet Ertegun being a part of the RRHOF put Led Zeppelin at an advantage, and there's a healthy amount of LZ influences that have never been inducted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezer Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 (edited) Ahmet Ertegun being a part of the RRHOF put Led Zeppelin at an advantageThen how would you explain The Who being inducted in 1990 and Zep not until 1995? Edited July 7, 2013 by Geezer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperDave Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 Then how would you explain The Who being inducted in 1990 and Zep not until 1995? Zeppelin released their first album in 1969, which in 1994 when they made the list is 25 years after is the criteria you need to make the hall. They did it in their first year of eligibility. The Who released their first album several years earlier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezer Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 I thought it was 15 years. Thanks for pointing out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezer Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 When Celebration Day came out and the video promos were released for TV and the internet (you can check them on You Tube and this site), they noted it was the most demanded concert ticket in history and a band with over 300 million albums sold worldwide). That's what was said in the very beginning of the video. It was during the GTBT intro. Not sure where their accuracy is from, but it must have some substance, otherwise they wouldn't be there! Here it is and look in the beginning!It's publicist craft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperDave Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 It's publicist craft. I'm sure in part it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geezer Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 It's a completely made-up figure. As Tatty73 demonstrated, Zep couldn't have sold 300 million records. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianzoso59 Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 They have sold 210mil and counting in the USA 350mil total !!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatty73 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 They have sold 210mil and counting in the USA 350mil total !!!! No they haven't Brian, those are just silly numbers, with absolutely no substance or truth attached to them. I'd love to see your breakdown of how they (or indeed you) get 210m outside the US and 130m for the US. This was my take on their US album sales (not Certified Shipment, as I do not like to multiply 2/3/4 etc sets) about a year ago (May 2013). I used known RIAA certs, Soundscan figures and educated guess work. Led Zeppelin 8,700,000Led Zeppelin II 12,900,000Led Zeppelin III 6,500,000Led Zeppelin IV 23,400,000Houses of the Holy 11,800,000Physical Grafitti 8,200,000Presence 3,300,000The Song Remains The Same 4,400,000In Through The Out Door 6,400,000Coda 1,800,000Box Set 2,900,000Remasters 2CD 450,000Remasters 3CD 600,000Box Set 2 250,000The Complete Studio 295,000BBC Sessions 1,400,000Early Days 1,200,000Latter Days 400,000Early Days/Latter Days 1,600,000How The West Was Won 900,000Mothership 1,800,000Definitive Collection 25,000Celebration Day 430,000Total 99,650,000 add in their single sales/downloads and you'd probably get to around 110m for the US. As for the rest of the world, I'd say they've done around 10m in each of the UK & Canada, easily their next biggest markets. Places like Germany, France & Japan are probably around 5m each. All in all Worldwide, I reckon around 160m-170m and even that might be a bit high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henrybonzo Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 (edited) A lot!! Led Zeppelin IV 23,400,000 Unreal Edited June 6, 2014 by henrybonzo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagefan55 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 No they haven't Brian, those are just silly numbers, with absolutely no substance or truth attached to them. I'd love to see your breakdown of how they (or indeed you) get 210m outside the US and 130m for the US. This was my take on their US album sales (not Certified Shipment, as I do not like to multiply 2/3/4 etc sets) about a year ago (May 2013). I used known RIAA certs, Soundscan figures and educated guess work. Led Zeppelin 8,700,000Led Zeppelin II 12,900,000Led Zeppelin III 6,500,000Led Zeppelin IV 23,400,000Houses of the Holy 11,800,000Physical Grafitti 8,200,000Presence 3,300,000The Song Remains The Same 4,400,000In Through The Out Door 6,400,000Coda 1,800,000Box Set 2,900,000Remasters 2CD 450,000Remasters 3CD 600,000Box Set 2 250,000The Complete Studio 295,000BBC Sessions 1,400,000Early Days 1,200,000Latter Days 400,000Early Days/Latter Days 1,600,000How The West Was Won 900,000Mothership 1,800,000Definitive Collection 25,000Celebration Day 430,000Total 99,650,000 add in their single sales/downloads and you'd probably get to around 110m for the US. As for the rest of the world, I'd say they've done around 10m in each of the UK & Canada, easily their next biggest markets. Places like Germany, France & Japan are probably around 5m each. All in all Worldwide, I reckon around 160m-170m and even that might be a bit high. Great work, Tatty73 I'd be interested to know how many albums the Stones and Floyd have sold at this point. My (totally uneducated) guess would be maybe 210m and 230m respectively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pb! Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 There are a couple oddities in Tatty's list - it seems the number for Presence is low; it doesn't seem likely the 'Song Remains...' set would outsell it. Also, why would 'Early Days' outsell 'Later Days' 3 to 1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the chase Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 (edited) If Physical Graffiti has sold 8.2 millions copies ... being a double album is considered 16X Platinum. 16,400,000 give or take. There is no way PG sold only 4.1 million copies in the States to get to 8,200,000.. That's an 8 million plus increase to the overall number right there. If the other multi disc's are counted as 1 unit sold, that is going to greatly reduce the overall number.. Either way, it's a shit load of albums.. Nice job! Edited June 7, 2014 by the chase Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagefan55 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 (edited) A few observations: a) I'm fairly certain Presence has been outsold by TSRTS. (btw, also a double album -- 8.8m?) The Early Days/Later Days 3 to 1 ratio does indeed seem odd. c) As the Chase pointed out, PG is probably about 16X, and the overall numbers increase greatly if you count multi discs d) If each of these above factors are taken into account, then Zep probably still remains right up near/alongside the Stones in terms of sales Edited to add: I agree that both the Presence and TSRTS numbers seem a bit low Edited June 7, 2014 by Pagefan55 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 Great work, Tatty73 I'd be interested to know how many albums the Stones and Floyd have sold at this point. My (totally uneducated) guess would be maybe 210m and 230m respectively. Led Zeppelin has sold more albums than either the Rolling Stones or Pink Floyd. They may be close in the UK but last I checked, Zeppelin was far ahead in the U.S.; nearly 2 to 1 ahead of the Stones. The closest bands to Led Zeppelin in album sales are the Eagles, AC/DC and I think Metallica is getting up there, too. The Beatles, of course, remain #1 everywhere. Elvis Presley, Garth Brooks, and Michael Jackson are also in the mix. Given the vagaries of accounting figures, especially in Third World countries, it's nearly impossible to nail down an exact figure for "worldwide sales" for any band. The U.S., Canada, and U.K. are the only reliable figures pre-Soundscan era. In Led Zeppelin's heyday, the band's top markets were the U.S., U.K., Canada, Japan, and Australia/New Zealand. France and Germany probably followed after that...with Netherlands and a few Scandinavian countries scattered behind. If you added all those sales together it wouldn't equal the total Led Zeppelin sold in the U.S. So, I would estimate Led Zeppelin's worldwide sales as something less than 300 million but definitely more than the 70 million that Paul Rees claims in his absurd Robert Plant biography. Tatty73's list is pretty accurate...but as the chase pointed out, just multiply the PG and TSRTS figures by 2 to get the correct RIAA total. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streetparade Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 So based on the excellent information above it looks like the U.S. total would be 132.8 million to date. This would take into account the more expensive doubles/triples and boxed sets by counting each unit. Which is how they are certified (e.g. PG = 8 million units / 16X Platinum). And that's all albums. I know singles count the same as an album in the sales totals but I think a 3 singles to 1 album is a much better comparison given the relative cost of each. The U.S. is 30% of the world market now (I'm sure it was more in the past but that's the data I have). So if you tripled that total for the rest of the world you get 400 million. All agree, Zeppelin was most popular in North America so let's account for that by doubling instead of tripling. That's 265 million. Throw in worldwide sales of singles and the DVDs and 280 - 300 million seems a pretty good ballpark. The U.S. and Japan account for almost 1/2 of all sales of recorded music. So if you're not big in one or the other or both it's difficult to see how you'd get too far up the worldwide rankings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperDave Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 (edited) Led Zeppelin has sold more albums than either the Rolling Stones or Pink Floyd. They may be close in the UK but last I checked, Zeppelin was far ahead in the U.S.; nearly 2 to 1 ahead of the Stones. The closest bands to Led Zeppelin in album sales are the Eagles, AC/DC and I think Metallica is getting up there, too. The Beatles, of course, remain #1 everywhere. Elvis Presley, Garth Brooks, and Michael Jackson are also in the mix. Given the vagaries of accounting figures, especially in Third World countries, it's nearly impossible to nail down an exact figure for "worldwide sales" for any band. The U.S., Canada, and U.K. are the only reliable figures pre-Soundscan era. In Led Zeppelin's heyday, the band's top markets were the U.S., U.K., Canada, Japan, and Australia/New Zealand. France and Germany probably followed after that...with Netherlands and a few Scandinavian countries scattered behind. If you added all those sales together it wouldn't equal the total Led Zeppelin sold in the U.S. So, I would estimate Led Zeppelin's worldwide sales as something less than 300 million but definitely more than the 70 million that Paul Rees claims in his absurd Robert Plant biography. Tatty73's list is pretty accurate...but as the chase pointed out, just multiply the PG and TSRTS figures by 2 to get the correct RIAA total. Great work Strider on this. My guess it's somewhat accurate. BTW, I went to to my local wine stor9(good size store with a wide selection) and couldn't find that Zeppelin wine, that you picked up the other day. Looks like a great companion to the box sets. I hope it was good. If you could give me some info on it, I would be much obliged!. Hope it wasn't crap! I wanted a good drink to listen to Zep I (will be doing this one again in minutes) and the Zeppelin wine would have been good. Instead, I picked up a bottle of Grand Marnier, which I love. More expensive, but just need to go easy on it as it goes down too fast with the sweetness rather than your standard cognac. It will be vinyl tonight! I moved recently, so just hooked up the stereo this afternoon for obvious reasons! Been living off cds and iTunes downloads for some time and Zep concerts within there too! Hope to talk soon! Edited June 8, 2014 by SuperDave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 Great work Strider on this. My guess it's somewhat accurate. BTW, I went to to my local wine stor9(good size store with a wide selection) and couldn't find that Zeppelin wine, that you picked up the other day. Looks like a great companion to the box sets. I hope it was good. If you could give me some info on it, I would be much obliged!. Hope it wasn't crap! I wanted a good drink to listen to Zep I (will be doing this one again in minutes) and the Zeppelin wine would have been good. Instead, I picked up a bottle of Grand Marnier, which I love. More expensive, but just need to go easy on it as it goes down too fast with the sweetness rather than your standard cognac. It will be vinyl tonight! Holy crap, it took me forever to find your post! Haha. I remember you asking about the wine, Super Dave, but then couldn't remember the thread I saw your post in. At last, here it is... The wine was pretty good. I had the Shiraz...looking to try their Riesling next. They are from Australia. Here's the info:http://echelonwine.com.au/wine/zeppelin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperDave Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Holy crap, it took me forever to find your post! Haha. I remember you asking about the wine, Super Dave, but then couldn't remember the thread I saw your post in. At last, here it is... The wine was pretty good. I had the Shiraz...looking to try their Riesling next. They are from Australia. Here's the info:http://echelonwine.com.au/wine/zeppelin Thanks for the info. Hopefully, I'll come across it one day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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