Stairway Backwards (Lyrics, Rumors, Possibilities)

[zero]

Quote:

"Why would you want to play such a beautiful song backwards?"

it's very beautiful backwards.

[leandar]

First, I'd like to thank LZ517 for digging up and posting my desription of Thelema and Page's use of ritual magick. Cheers!

I'd just like to add that as a Thelemite, Page was obviously not a Satanist. Why would a Thelemite write messages to Satan? It makes no sense from a motivation standpoint, regardless of whether it's possible. Now if the message were in praise of Isis, that would make sense, but Satan? No. He might as well be praising the tooth fairy.

I've come to believe in years that if the reversals were truly supposed to be satanic, then why wouldn't they be more overt and direct about trying to recruit people for satanism. Saying things like "Here's to my sweet Satan, the one who's little path who made me sad who's power is fake" doesn't seem very interested in recruiting for Satan. And calling Satan "sad" later on, doesn't fit the bill either.

Just like "Hotel California" as well. If it was truly supposed to be about the church of Satan and the reversal in it was supposed to be recruiting people to the church of Satan, wouldn't it have said something like "come and join us at the church of Satan?" I mean, I heard the reversal that's supposed to say "Yeah Satan organized his own religion" and I was thinking "So what?"

That's why I think it's just a combination of dumb luck and some choice imaginations as to what one hears with these "satanic messages."

[Horrorshow_Plant]

On the QueenOnline forum, I read an interpretation of the song that used tarot cards to explain the lyrics. The forum is down right now; otherwise I'd link to it.

[Wolfman]

"My sweet Satan!!!"....it's all true

P.S. I do like the solo in reverse

[Bong-Man]

"train himself to think backwards by external means, as set forth here following. (a) Let him learn to write backwards. ( Let him learn to walk backwards. © Let him constantly watch, if convenient, films and listen to records reversed."

"Ours is the Sevenfold Path of Initiation: thou shalt transmute the base lead into the subtle Aurum Solis by rising on the Stairway of the Heavens in thy Secret Laboratorium on earth. Here is the Excellent Way! The steps of the Stairway are seven; the Laboratorium is Our Holy House of Song and Our Holy Rose Garden, which thou knowest so well. Yet to those who are vulgar, it is a secret even though they themselves possess it.")

- Magick in Theory and Practice....by Aleister Crowley

"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law." "Although I don't agree with everything he said he was a visionary. I don't particularly want to go into it because it's a personal thing and isn't in relation to anything I do as a musician. Apart from that I've employed his system in my day to day life. ~ Jimmy Page

[Evster2012]

"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law." "Although I don't agree with everything he said he was a visionary. I don't particularly want to go into it because it's a personal thing and isn't in relation to anything I do as a musician. Apart from that I've employed his system in my day to day life. ~ Jimmy Page

Thanks!

Knew you'd be here sooner or later bro!

And the beat goes on...

[ZoSo88]

First, I'd like to thank LZ517 for digging up and posting my desription of Thelema and Page's use of ritual magick. Cheers!

I'd just like to add that as a Thelemite, Page was obviously not a Satanist. Why would a Thelemite write messages to Satan? It makes no sense from a motivation standpoint, regardless of whether it's possible. Now if the message were in praise of Isis, that would make sense, but Satan? No. He might as well be praising the tooth fairy.

Well, they were not praising Satan. But i agree what Page is in no way a satanist. But LZ have sung songs like In my time of dying, which they didn't write, that mentions jesus. And songs like No Quarter speak of Thor. I would imagine for that they look at Jesus and Satan as being just as mythological as Thor. Remember Most High? "David's seed talks through his paper crown?" Thats certainly a bash of Jesus in some respects. But i dont think they mean offense my any of this, its just mythology to them. The entire concept of heaven was created my christianity, not judasim or islam...it was added into christianity later. And we know Pagey isn't christian. So again, i view it as them singing about mythological things, which they have been inclined to.

But besides all that, you have to admit that if they didnt do it on purpose, there is alot of coincidence to say the least (look at the first post on the thread) and Hotel California and other alleged backmasking example are a sentence or two...not a whole song. If this is all make believe, someone should be able to make lyrics to other LZ songs with just as many words that could sound real..like they say about Stairway.

[Electrophile]

There is nothing Satanic about Hotel California. There is no backmasking in Hotel California. They were too fucked up to barely write the song one way, I hardly doubt they were coherent enough to do that shit too.

[spatdrastik]

You want more backmasking shit than you can handle?

do a youtube search for the user iamaphony

it's the whole Paul is dead/love code thing

don't say I didn't warn you

[TenYearsGone75]

I'm sick of this crap! I'd rather discuss the arbitrary concept of signficant digits than backmasking found not only in Led Zeppelin music, but in any other band's music for that matter! How trite and idiotic can we become?

In the words of Plato, "Ignorance, the root and stem of every evil."

[Aquamarine]

Whereas wisdom, of course, grows from the soil of Louisiana.

<<

[SteveAJones]

In the words of Plato, "Ignorance, the root and stem of every evil."

I bet that's a good bootleg.

[SteveAJones]

Whereas wisdom, of course, grows from the soil of Louisiana.

<<

I was in the French Quarter of New Orleans about a month ago. I can see why Robert Plant is so enamored with New Orleans. Lots of Zep sights to see around town.

[ZoSo88]

I'll make everyone a deal. Since I started this thread this is my fault. Some people found the content and discussion very interesting...and i thank everyone for joining in. But for those who either disagree or hate the topic, i've picked up that this subject is really not to be spoken of with many Zep fans. I personally think because alot of loyal fans do not want the band attatched to anything that might seem satanic, even though this isn't. But here is the deal. So far all of us have pretty much reached this.

A: You hear and believe its possible they created this on purpose somehow.

B: You think its pure coincidence

C: You things its a bunch of crap and foolish to get worked up in.

But with the aide of the alleged lyrics, all of us can hear a great deal that at least sounds like something, to what degree varies from person to person.

But for those who say its BS, coincidence, etc...I will never speak of this topic ever again, i'll bury it if and only if you can do this.

*Pick any other Led Zeppelin song...reverse it, and make up lyrics that sound either satanic or occultic in any fashion, so long as it sounds as close with your lyrics and Stairway does with its alleged lyrics. If you can do that..concider the topic dead, untill then..the mystery goes on.

[SteveAJones]

*Pick any other Led Zeppelin song...reverse it, and make up lyrics that sound either satanic or occultic in any fashion, so long as it sounds as close with your lyrics and Stairway does with its alleged lyrics. If you can do that..concider the topic dead, untill then..the mystery goes on.

What about the issue of no scientific evidence whatsoever that the human mind can "receive" backmasked lyrics? If this were true, wouldn't every album have "You must

buy this record" backmasked on it? What about Page & Plant refuting the allegation?

Why isn't their word good enough for you?

[Electrophile]

i've picked up that this subject is really not to be spoken of with many Zep fans. I personally think because alot of loyal fans do not want the band attatched to anything that might seem satanic, even though this isn't.

Actually, I bet that's not why. I bet it has to do with the fact this concept/idea has been done to death and it's never been proven 100% and that this thread gets posted about 384389734 times a year.

[bouncing~ship]

Its just like talking about the "Dark Side of Oz"... a coincidence perhaps but we will never know

[Tea For One]

What about the issue of no scientific evidence whatsoever that the human mind can "receive" backmasked lyrics? If this were true, wouldn't every album have "You must

buy this record" backmasked on it? What about Page & Plant refuting the allegation?

Why isn't their word good enough for you?

But what if the messages weren't meant to be picked up when played forwards? We've already established that Crowley was urging people to listen to music backwards. I don't think that whether or not the human mind can pick up backwards messages is an issue.

By the way, I'm still holding the view that this is coincidence.

[ZoSo88]

What about the issue of no scientific evidence whatsoever that the human mind can "receive" backmasked lyrics? If this were true, wouldn't every album have "You must

buy this record" backmasked on it? What about Page & Plant refuting the allegation?

Why isn't their word good enough for you?

1: The Human mind can not recieve backwards lyrics?

when you play this backwards you can hear plenty of words that make sense. Never claimed it was subliminal. Crowley taught to listen backwards to think forwards. Its a matter of things sounding when you reverse it, not picking up magical subliminal things. That point of view is just attempting to make the topic look less legit.

2: Page & Plant refuting?

Admiting you created something like this would get you blackballed in the music community. Much better to leave it up to wonder. And secondly, Plant said Stairway was written with the best intentions, leacing messeges backwards in not how you make music. He never said..no we did not do that, its pure coincidence, etc.. Also no one has found a link fro Jimmy denying anything.

3: Is anyone going to find another Zep song with backwards lyrics...shouldn't be that difficult is Stairway was coincidence.

[SteveAJones]

Round and round it goes. If a deaf person plays it backwards does it make any sound?

If a non-English speaking listener plays it backwards what do they hear? Do I care? No.

[TheBulle]

I searched for 'reversed' songs on youtube!...Hilarious! but seriously...some people are creepy! I read the comments on the videos and some people are really gullible. Apparently Courtney sang about killing Kurt in Violet...

[ZoSo88]

Round and round it goes. If a deaf person plays it backwards does it make any sound?

If a non-English speaking listener plays it backwards what do they hear? Do I care? No.

Well we know you don't believe in it, that was not the matter in question. All I asked was for you refute the points i made in the fist post of the thread..which you have yet to do. And find another Zeppelin song with backwards lyrics, or anything alleged that you could make up..which you have also yet to do. That does not make me wrong and you right.

[DreamyKnight]

I applaud your diligence to properly frame your point of view, but suffice to say there is not one iota

of scientific evidence the human mind can interpret backwards-masked audio passages. It's like

trying to teach a pig to tell time. It simply can't.

Anyway, the seeds of this debate are found not in the Old Testament but within the Spring 1982 agenda of the California State Legislature. Some committee members needed a platform to push

their larger agenda of censorship and they found it in this controversy. Ultimately, as you may

recall audio and video recordings did receive ratings labels as a by-product of these beauracrat's mispent middle age.

If you've got $20 burning a hole in your pocket purchase the book 'Fallen Angel: The Untold Story

of Jimmy Page' by Tom Friend. Poor Tom will delight you with tales of evil-doing by "the four most

dangerous Satanists" on the planet. Yada-yada-yada. A number of concert photographs I took are

also in that book, but only under the stict condition they not be captioned.

If you learn anything you'll learn that if your looking hard enough you'll find the devil in anything.

Bottom line here is both Jimmy Page and Robert Plant have consistently refuted these allegations.

First off I totally agree with most of what you stated. However on your first paragraph- The mind cannot interpret backward masking audio passeges. That is true unless of course you play the tune backwards.

In recording, in the old days anyway (analog) the tape has basically two parts to it on the release verison; side a and side b. When doing multiple track recording each side is broken down into further multiple tracks.....when recording backwards those tracks get burried in the background when over dubbed with newer tracks on a normal forward recording.

I'd say they probebly did it as per all the hints on that album of hidden things, like JP's silloette hidden within the front cover painting of the Hermit, also the mirror thing with the inside jacket.

However, to truely understand whats being said one would have to study multiple mystical teachings.

And for the record the number "666" is the biggest typo in world history....that was not the number of the beast, but a biblical typo when they first transcribed the bible into english some hundreds and hundreds of years ago as the first known printings of the bible has a different number. I'm not sharing that number in a public forum as we have already seen what happens when idiots get ahold of such information...hence the mystical saying "We protect God's wisdom from the profane".

It only makes sense though, frontwards is a stairway to heaven...backwards ummmmm. There has to be a middle path somewhere,lol.

Led Zeppelin has to be the best Christian Band in the world.....whattya you think?

(takes cover-knows his getting flack for that)

[Bong-Man]

Thanks!

Knew you'd be here sooner or later bro!

And the beat goes on...

Shall we begin where we left off ?

An article from the Q Magazine Zeppelin Special Edition (2003).....

Jimmy Page was a rather different entity. With the Vietnam War raging and the 60's dream faltering, the associated mysticism of the time grew darker. "Jimmy Page was checking everything out," recalls Pamela Des Barres. "He was a young gorgeous guy who could do anything he wanted."

By the time of the 1970's, Page had time and the resources to pursue his occult interests properly. He peppered the inside sleeve of the band's fourth album with runes, opened the Equinox occult bookshop in London in 1976, and built the second largest collection of Crowley artifacts in the world."He had an incredible collection of capes, wands, and boots." recalls BP Fallon, "but it was tucked away. It wasn't a case of Roll up, roll up, come and see." Page topped this by purchasing the ultimate Crowley artifact: the magus's former residence Boleskine House, beside Loch Ness in Scotland in 1970. In an attempt to restore Boleskine to its condition at the time of Crowley's rituals, Page even engaged Satanist Charles Pace to paint murals. "It's not an unfriendly place when you walk into it," said Page at the time, "it just seems to have this thing....I'm attracted by the unknown."

Prefiguring the experimentation of the 60's, the occult excited new interest in the late 19th century. Aleister Crowley was a child of his time. Born in 1875 to rich parents from a strict Christian cult, the Plymouth Brethren, Crowley claimed his parents drove him to dissention, to become a teenage rebel a century early. Crowley claimed to have been visited by an Egyptian spirit who dictated "THE BOOK OF THE LAW" to him in a vision in 1904. In essence, this cherry-picked from the occult menu (specifically Rosicrucianism, Egyptian myth, and yoga) to create a new "religion". Crowley called it "Thelema" : "the science and art of causing change in conformity with will". While this did involve "magick" (Crowley spent a year trying and failing to make his image in a mirror disappear), it was more to do with personal liberation. Crowley's Thelemite maxim was "do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law" and with the spirit telling him "To worship me, take wine and strange drugs. Lust, enjoy all things of sense and rapture," Crowley's religion was essentially a ritualisation of orgiastic sex and drug taking. As such, Crowley was a Satanist in so much as he took the idea of Lucifer as agent of intellectual and spiritual freedom, rather than the personification of evil. Just to blur the issue, score himself some free publicity and annoy his parents, Crowley liked to call himself "The Great Beast 666".

"I do not worship the devil," Page told Rolling Stone. "But I am interested in magic. I feel Aleister Crowley is a misunderstood genius. Because his whole thing was liberation of the person, of the entity, and that restriction would foul you up, lead to frustration which leads to violence, crime, and mental breakdown." Crowley's libertarian credo chimed perfectly with the 60's libertarian philosophy Led Zeppelin were living to the full in their sex and drug-fueled heyday. What's more, Crowley's attitude towards personal achievement and fulfillment must have appealed to the super-successful Zeppelin in an often anti-materialistic age. Indeed, Page had "Do What Thou Wilt" inscribed into Led Zeppelin III's run-out groove. "When you've discovered your true will you should forge ahead like a steam train," said the guitarist. "If you put all your energies into it there's no doubt you'll succeed because that is your true will." Hardly a pact with the devil, but certainly evidence of unapologetic ambition.

According to BP Fallon (Zeppelin's publicist), Page kept his occult interests private. "He believed his philosophies and it shaped how he acted, but it wasn't directing every iota of his life. I don't know how far he took it. I never observed him conducting any rituals. In my experience he didn't even practice yoga. He certainly wasn't sacrificing virgins at Midnight....He couldn't find any !

Michael Des Barres (married to Pamela from 77-91), formerly vocalist with fellow Swan Song band Detective and a friend of Page's told Zeppelin biographer Michael Yorke : "Like an idiot I was dabbling with the Crowley thing at the time. I used to go down and see Jimmy at Plumpton Manor and he'd pull out Crowley robes, Crowley's Tarot deck, and all of the Crowley gear he's collected. I thought it was great - it was all so twisted and debauched."

Was it just dressing up box stuff then ? Pamela Des Barres believes Page sought a decadent frisson. "I think Jimmy liked to fancy Crowley was all involved in the darkness. He was curious about the dark aspects, he carried his whips around and he like to inflict a little damage on willing girls." Nevertheless, both B.P. Fallon and Pamela Des Barres both believe Page was sincere in his interests. "I think Jimmy really believed the Crowley stuff," says Des Barre. "He gleaned a lot from it. It helped create his aura and the mystique . Sure there was an element of play-acting, flapping around those big halls in Crowley's cape. But you don't buy someone's Castle [sic] if you're just fucking around. Besides, he's a notorious tight wad, he had to be totally into something to pay for it !"

The rumors of Satanism did not end with Led Zeppelin's demise. In the 80's, a prominent American Baptist used his radio pulpit to preach that "Stairway to Heaven" carried subliminal backward messages. Then, in April 1982, the California State Assembly played a tape of the song backwards in public session. Stairway - along with songs by The Eagles, ELO, and Lynyrd Skynyrd - was accused of containing satanic messages.

Certainly there's no denying that if you play "There's still time to change the road you're on" backwards it sounds like "Here's to my sweet Satan". A joke then ? Or mere coincidence ? Plant found the accusations foul - "The intentions of that song were so positive". On a more practical level, Stairway to Heaven engineer Andy Johns has declared the backwards recording process impossible.

"A lot of the mystical stuff was a pose," says Pamela Des Barres. "The myth was self created to make themselves look intriguing." It certainly worked. Perhaps, though, it's best to defer to Robert Plant for the final word. As the singer told Q magazine : "It's all crap that devil stuff, but the less you said to people the more they would speculate. And we never said fuck-all to anybody. The only deal I think we made was with some of the girls high schools in San Fernando Valley."

[Alice]

Well I don't believe that stuff. I looked at this occultism, it doesn't say that occultistic people are satanistic. Occultism is a subrange of esoteric and has to do with magic, calling spirits, healing powers and so on.

I'm sure Jimmy wouldn't abuse music like that. And I'm really sure, Robert hasn't got to do with any of this stuff, not even a tiny bit.

As said, it's a great thing to make a big story of and make Led Zeppelin fans unsure.