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jim6225

Lawsuit over Stairway to Heaven

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One new controversy arising from the trial is the press's insistence that the "myth" of STH being written at Bron-yr-aur has been "exploded."  But I'm wondering, who's ever said that the song was completely written by Page and Plant in Wales?  My understanding is that Page brought the earliest run-throughs of the song from Wales to Headley Grange, where it was more fully arranged with Jones and Bonham, and that the final recording was perfected at Island Studios in London, where Plant added his complete set of lyrics.  So what's this "myth" of the work being created, music and words all, in the Welsh countryside? 

 

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3 minutes ago, GeorgeC said:

One new controversy arising from the trial is the press's insistence that the "myth" of STH being written at Bron-yr-aur has been "exploded."  But I'm wondering, who's ever said that the song was completely written by Page and Plant in Wales?  My understanding is that Page brought the earliest run-throughs of the song from Wales to Headley Grange, where it was more fully arranged with Jones and Bonham, and that the final recording was perfected at Island Studios in London, where Plant added his complete set of lyrics.  So what's this "myth" of the work being created, music and words all, in the Welsh countryside? 

 

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I also didn't realize that early 70's interviews with the likes of Creem and the Trouser Press were under oath! ?

The Bron Yr Aur stories were better stories but completely irrelevant to the case anyway..

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38 minutes ago, the chase said:

Great news for the boys!! 

Did the jury mention anything about Strider forgetting his wallet?

Now that made me laugh.

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37 minutes ago, GeorgeC said:

One new controversy arising from the trial is the press's insistence that the "myth" of STH being written at Bron-yr-aur has been "exploded."  But I'm wondering, who's ever said that the song was completely written by Page and Plant in Wales?  My understanding is that Page brought the earliest run-throughs of the song from Wales to Headley Grange, where it was more fully arranged with Jones and Bonham, and that the final recording was perfected at Island Studios in London, where Plant added his complete set of lyrics.  So what's this "myth" of the work being created, music and words all, in the Welsh countryside? 

Yeah that was really confusing, and the bad writing in Rolling Stone by Matt Diehl mashed that up even further.  I can kinda remember thinking long ago that it might have been started or inspired at Bron-Yr-Aur, but that was just romantic imagery on my part -- I don't remember ever reading that, not even from Stephen Davis.  "There's a feeling I get when I look to the west, and my spirit is crying for leaving" was said by Plant to be inspired by Wales, but the fact that Page brought the music in and introduced it to the band at Headley Grange was made pretty clear in the many books about Led Zep and Page.  It goes hand in hand with the legend of Plant's "automatic writing" experience while Page was teaching the arrangement to Jones -- so how did the story get moved from Headley Grange to Wales?

Information, it seems, just isn't what it used to be, not in today's media culture. 

Edited by Mercurious

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Yay!!!!!!!!!!!!

And thatBron-Yr-Aur nonsense is crap anyhow. Numerous quotes and interviews have made it clear that the song was assembled at Headly Grange. It was all just idiot "journalists" who assumed myth=band testimony or some such thing.

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2 hours ago, TheGreatOne said:

LOL, as much as Robert haaaaaaaaaaated Stairway, can only wonder what went through his mind during this madness.

I was thinking the same thing. I bet he dislikes it even more now and never sings it again..lol

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I'm so happy for them. After all they already had to go through with being rejected by people and being strange and loony, while being so 

very obviously humble and just such in depth people, I'm so glad this ended the right way.  Music has touched their hearts with all it's variations 

through the centuries and it's like suing someone for percepting the universe, or someone being similar to someones looks, while accidentally playing guitar.

 

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Randy's  2 sisters.  Sighhh.  I think enough money has been wasted on this lawsuit.  They look
money hungry at this point.  They had a trial, they are lucky a judge allowed it to get this far.      

The estate for Randy are speaking as if the jury wasn't able to compare,  as if  Taurus  wasn't
demonstrated by musical experts,   and instead they played the intro to  Old MacDonald Had A
Farm
  vs.  Stairway To Heaven  and then  asked:   Do these sound the same? 

The plaintiff's  musical experts played both songs openings for the jury.   Defendant's
musical experts  played both songs openings for the jury.   The jury heard both intros at
that point.  Apples to apples were compared right there,   all  before the full studio version of
Stairway To Heaven  - which I deep down did not want them to hear,  but I think it was move
by  Anderson to have the jury hear the iconic piece from start to finish.   To show how after
the intro it was this well crafted piece of music and not 2 minutes of elevator / doctor's
office waiting room music -  that is Taurus.    

It should have always been about the sheet music only for both songs.  The notes /chords
that are written on the paper.  Compare those side by side.    Listening is too tricky based on
the fact we have no clue  if 3 of the jury members are tone deaf,   don't have trained ear for
music,  or even simply can't hear well.    With the sheet music there is only one way to read it.    
A is A,  B is B,  D is D and so forth.  


And somebody did tweet that Jimmy and Robert hugged it out,  Awww I knew they would.  The
correct team won today. :D 

Edited by KellyGirl
Errmm spellcheck isn't always right!

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4 minutes ago, KellyGirl said:

Randy's  2 sisters.  Sighhh.  I think enough money has been wasted on this lawsuit.  They look
money hungry at this point.  They had a trial, they are lucky a judge allowed it to get this far.      

The estate of Randy are speaking as if the jury wasn't able to compare,  as if  Taurus  wasn't
demonstrated by musical experts,   and instead they played the intro to  Old MacDonald Had A
Farm
  vs.  Stairway To Heaven  and then  asked:   Do these sound the same? 

The plaintiff's  musical experts played both songs openings for the jury.   Defendant's
musical experts  played both songs openings for the jury.   The jury heard both intros at
that point.  Apples to apples were compared right there,   all  before the full studio version of
Stairway To Heaven  - which I deep down did not want them to hear,  but I think it was move
by  Anderson to have the jury hear the iconic piece from start to finish.   To show how after
the intro it was this well crafted piece of music and not  2 minutes elevator / doctor's
office waiting room music -  that is Taurus.    

It should have always been about the sheet music only for both songs.  The notes /chords
that are written on the paper.  Compare those side by side.    Listening is too tricky based on
the fact we have no clue  if 3 of the jury members are tone deaf,   don't have trained ear for
music,  or even simply can't hear well.    With the sheet music there is only one way to read it.    
A is A,  B is B,  D is D and so forth.  


And somebody did tweet that Jimmy and Roberts hugged it out,  Awww I knew they would.  The
correct team won today. :D 

+1

:thumbsup: 

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Delighted to hear the verdict.

Somewhat disappointed to hear the above internet warriors calling for a countersuit - as if such a vengeful and mean spirit (ho ho) has anything to do with the joyous essence of Zeppelin.  Messrs Page and Plant do not come from as litigious a culture as America. As their statement indicates, they're moving on.

Peace, out.

Edited by FavouriteTipple

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1 hour ago, the chase said:

Great news for the boys!! 

Did the jury mention anything about Strider forgetting his wallet?

 

We'll have to wait for the kingzoso lawsuit. 

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8 minutes ago, KellyGirl said:

And somebody did tweet that Jimmy and Roberts hugged it out,  Awww I knew they would.  The
correct team won today. :D 

Hip hip hooray! Hip hip hooray!

For the correct verdict.  And the hug. :) 

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Another ugly article in Rolling Stone, including a post to some damning vid on youtube, much of it ill-informed BS.  Given the length of the article, much of it had to be written before the verdict, which does not seem to be the one they expected.  (I say "they" because it's now a different writer than Matt Diehl on the case.)  It goes quickly from a straight news tone up top to a lengthy retrying of the case from the plaintiff's perspective. - Where is David Fricke when we need him?

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/led-zeppelin-prevail-in-stairway-to-heaven-lawsuit-20160623?page=2

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Great news; very happy to see this today! :)

 

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Indeed, great news.

agree, no need to counter sue, don't join the insanity that we are all railing against.

also I would hope Skidmore's deal WAS along the lines of "you don't pay if we don't win".  Pretty common.

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LA Times report:  http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-led-zeppelin-copyright-20160623-snap-story.html

'Jurors rejected the claim of infringement. But they believed the plaintiffs’ argument that the estate of Wolfe, a.k.a. Randy California, was the rightful holder of the copyright on “Taurus,” a claim that Zeppelin’s team disputed.

They also did not buy the defense team’s argument that Page and Plant had not had reasonable opportunity to have heard “Taurus” before they wrote “Stairway to Heaven.”

Michael Skidmore, a trustee of Wolfe’s estate who brought the case, said they lost on the issue of the “extrinsic test” of similarity: whether the two musical compositions share enough of the same elements for one song to be judged “substantially similar” to another.'

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Countersue, people may not realize what a draining experience being trapped in a courtroom can be , even if you have

already won the initial dispute. Don't know if Page or Plant still party a bit(just some moderate drinking)  but certainly

there should be some notable celebration of some kind. VIP guests of course. I think there should be celebrations

around the world, as preposterous as that may seem. Of course Zep has plagiarized certain things, many examples

as posters have pointed out, but of course those "lifts" simply wouldn't bring in much $. White Summer/BMS ?

semi-trad, but even then a loss would be a spit in a bucket. Maybe now Jimmy and Robert get closer ??

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^ which is the essence of plagerism.  If they aren't the same, they aren't the same.  Proven.

Rolling Stone magazine never ceases to amaze me when it comes to Zeppelin. :rolleyes: 

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2 hours ago, sam_webmaster said:

Official statements:

"We are grateful for the jury's conscientious service and pleased that it has ruled in our favor, putting to rest questions about the origins of 'Stairway to Heaven' and confirming what we have known for 45 years. We appreciate our fans' support and look forward to putting this legal matter behind us." - Jimmy Page & Robert Plant.

"At Warner Music Group, supporting our artists and protecting their creative freedom is paramount. We are pleased that the jury found in favor of Led Zeppelin, reaffirming the true origins of 'Stairway to Heaven.' Led Zeppelin is one of the greatest bands in history, and Jimmy Page and Robert Plant are peerless songwriters who created many of rock's most influential and enduring songs." - Warner Music Group.

Best news ever. :) xoxoxo

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3 hours ago, sam_webmaster said:

Official statements:

"We are grateful for the jury's conscientious service and pleased that it has ruled in our favor, putting to rest questions about the origins of 'Stairway to Heaven' and confirming what we have known for 45 years. We appreciate our fans' support and look forward to putting this legal matter behind us." - Jimmy Page & Robert Plant.

"At Warner Music Group, supporting our artists and protecting their creative freedom is paramount. We are pleased that the jury found in favor of Led Zeppelin, reaffirming the true origins of 'Stairway to Heaven.' Led Zeppelin is one of the greatest bands in history, and Jimmy Page and Robert Plant are peerless songwriters who created many of rock's most influential and enduring songs." - Warner Music Group.

Yes, the masterpiece is, was and always will be theirs!  Our band...THE BEST EVER!!! Proud fan, party of one here:-)        

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I was listening to The Rain Song from the Berlin 7/7/80 show. Specifically, near the end of the track when the news first hit the CNN news ticker; Seems prophetic. 

Not surprised by the verdict.

 

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Glad this ruled in Zep's favor as it should! Well done by the boys and their legal team! :thumbsup:  I can only imagine what implications this would have on the music industry, if the jury had ruled in favor of Taurus!  It would certainly do something to creativity with songwriters worrying about getting sued!

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