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Rolling Stones Thread

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Are they going to record an album? It'd be much better than this useless touring.

What, another cliche filled album like A Bigger Bang? :lol: I don't think there was a single original idea to be had in any of those sixteen tracks...I've been saying for years that the Stones need to get back to their fucking roots and make a BLUES album, mix covers and originals, and go out doing what they're best at, it would be very poignant to see the band come full circle in their recording career.

Nutrocker,

I certainly didn't know Mick Taylor had criticised the article. I am wondering if he maybe thought more about it, after it had been published. For all we know, maybe the Stones management got in touch with Mick to put over their side of the story. I do know that Bill Wyman has said in the past that the money could have been spread around a bit better.

I am just glad to see Mick Taylor back on stage at a venue size that is worthy of his talents. Plus, it has been good to see him making some money out of these appearances. Here's hoping all goes well for him in the future.

All I know for sure about that article is that MT and his management said it was bullshit. No, Mick Taylor isn't rolling in the dough, and Jagger/Richards certainly screwed him over when it came to songwriting credits, but he makes out okay. I think having MT join in on this tour was at least in part to make amends and also to give in to the demands of fans who have wanted them to do something with Taylor for years now; I reckon this is why Bill Wyman sat in with them during their shows last December as well. Having said that, though, I still think they should utilize MT for more than two or three songs a night...

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The Full show was being seeded on Dime, not HC. The uploader has left the building due to uncalled for criticism about the size of the file the .ts format and his slow upload speed and inability to seed 24/7. I just wish some people would keep their mouths' shut and keep their impatience to themselves. There was over 700 downloaders waiting on this magnificent offer, now because of a bunch of morons nobody is now going to complete.

Ah...thanks for the clarification, JTM...yer right, that is pretty fucking stupid that a bunch of whingers pissed off the uploader, but it's not like it's the first time...or the last...

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Yes, Nutrocker, I agree with you. However, if MT were around for more than 2 or 3 songs, it might disjoint Ronnie Wood's nose a bit.

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However, if MT were around for more than 2 or 3 songs, it might disjoint Ronnie Wood's nose a bit.

I don't know about that, Ron Wood is a consummate team player...shit, he doesn't even seem to mind when he only appears on half the tracks on a Stones album, or only gets credited for 'inspiration' instead of 'Jagger/Richards/Wood'! To hear Keith tell it in recent interviews, he and Ronnie actually wanted MT for the duration; Keith's argument was that since so many of the Stones songs have multiple guitar tracks, the extra guitar would add that extra bit of texture to the performances. I'd be willing to bet that it was none other than Sir Michael Phillip Jagger who put the kibosh on Taylor playing the entire shows with them...they'd have to pay him that much more, right? I could see that easily- Jagger is after all the same guy who paid Ian McLagan about $20 (literally out of his own pocket) for Mac's contributions to the Some Girls LP...

Ron Wood is also the guy who invited Mick Taylor to sit in with them in Kansas City back in '81, pretty much on the spur of the moment, much to Keith's chagrin at the time :lol: By all accounts Keith enjoyed having MT sit in with them that night as much as he did when Elton John sat in during the Fort Collins 1975 show ("Get off the fuckin' stage, Elton!" you can hear Keith yell on the audience tape :lol: )

Edited by Nutrocker

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Another Led Wallet!!!! Twenty dollars!!! I know that over the years, there have comments by Bill Wyman and Ronnie about the way the money is divided. I don't know if Prince Rupert Lowenstein is still involved in the Stones finances, but he certainly did a good job for Sir Mick.

I'd be willing to bet that it was none other than Sir Michael Phillip Jagger who put the kibosh on Taylor playing the entire shows with them...they'd have to pay him that much more, right? I could see that easily- Jagger is after all the same guy who paid Ian McLagan about $20 (literally out of his own pocket) for Mac's contributions to the Some Girls LP...

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Another Led Wallet!!!! Twenty dollars!!! I know that over the years, there have comments by Bill Wyman and Ronnie about the way the money is divided. I don't know if Prince Rupert Lowenstein is still involved in the Stones finances, but he certainly did a good job for Sir Mick.

One of my all time favorite Jagger stories centers around his negotiations with promoter Bill Graham for the 1989 North American tour. I'm paraphrasing parts of it:

Canadien Promoter Michael Cohl and San Francisco-based Bill Graham presented the group with two very different approaches. Cohl offered to act as a national promoter, risking a huge million-dollar guarantee (later revealed to be 65 to 70 million dollars) for the opportunity to make big money. In contrast, Graham wanted to serve as a salaried "tour director," the position he held during the Stones' 1981-82 tour, which allowed him to book the tour without cutting the local promoters who dominate each city out of the action.

Early in 1989 both Cohl and Graham sent written offers to the Stones' brain trust – their London financial adviser, Prince Rupert Loewenstein; their American attorney, John Branca; and their American business manager, Joseph Rascoff. In mid-February the Stones' business advisers joined Jagger and Richards in Barbados, where the two chief Stones were working up material for the album.

Both Graham and Cohl made their way to Barbados to meet with the group in person over Presidents Day weekend. Graham spent two fruitless days attempting to convince the Stones and their advisers that what had worked the last time would work again. "Bill Graham was told that the difference between his offer and Cohl's was 'tens of millions,' " said a source familiar with the Barbados meetings. "Over and over he was told, 'No matter what you offer, you can't match Cohl.' "

Graham made one last desperation pitch to Jagger, who reviewed the figures and then disclosed to Graham he was just two million dollars shy of Cohl's offer. Graham took this as a sign of encouragement and asked Mick for a continuation of the negotiations given the working relationship they'd forged over the past three decades. Mick thought for a moment and then flatly declined. Frustrated beyond belief, Graham then asked Mick point blank why he couldn't have the Steel Wheels tour. "Well, two million dollars," Mick replied.

Ultimately, a contract between Cohl and the Stones was signed in Barbados in mid-March 1989. As a consolation, Graham was offered a high-paying position as "creative consultant," which would have put him in charge of such concerns as public relations and stage set designs. Graham turned it down, later admitting in his autobiography to lose that tour simply devastated him.

Edited by SteveAJones

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SAJ,

Thanks for that - fascinating stuff. The name John Branca is very familiar - he is one of America's top lawyers, having first of all majored in music. I believe the poor soul is now having to sort out the mess that is the Wacko Jacko estate!

Regarding Prince Rupert, I found this article from the Guardian in 2007 which makes reference to the Barbados deal:-

"...

The Rolling Stones have reportedly suffered what could be their most damaging personnel loss yet, in the shape of a septuagenarian merchant banker with a royal title.

The music industry newsletter Record of the Day this morning reported that Prince Rupert zu Loewenstein, who has handled the group's financial affairs for nearly 40 years, has quit. A statement released by the band's UK PR firm said: "Prince Loewenstein is no longer taking care of the Rolling Stones day-to-day business but is currently retained on some aspects of their career."

Loewenstein, who was born in 1933, was hired by the Stones to sort out their financial affairs in the wake of their split from manager Allen Klein in 1971. He reconfigured the Stones into being more of a business than a band, advising them to make decisions about recording, rehearsing and performing on the basis of the tax advantages that might accrue from their location.

In a 2002 article in the US business magazine Fortune, Keith Richards summed up Loewenstein's contribution to the Stones: "He is a great financial mind for the market. He plays that like I play guitar. He does things like a little oil well. And currency - you know, Swiss francs in the morning, switch to marks in the afternoon, move to the yen, and by the end of the day, how many dollars? That's his financial genius, his wisdom. Little pieces of paper. As long as there's a smile on Rupert's face, I'm cool."

Loewenstein transformed the Stones, restructuring them as a blue-chip company, with four partners at the head of the pyramid and a variety of companies beneath to handle the various parts of the business. His greatest triumph, arguably, was matching them with a Canadian promoter called Michael Cohl in 1989. Cohl proposed to the Stones the touring model that they adopted for the Steel Wheels tour, which duly became the most lucrative rock tour in history, grossing $260m worldwide, and which has been the template for all their subsequent world tours. Those tours have made the Stones the most profitable rock act in the world.

Loewenstein, a descendant of Bavarian royalty, entered finance by buying a merchant bank in 1962. When Mick Jagger phoned and asked for help in sorting out the mess that was the Stones' finances, Loewenstein had never heard of them. Nevertheless, he told the Independent on Sunday in 1992, he prefers working with clients who are "new money". "It's much more interesting than old money," he said. "People with old money are nearly always having to be adjusted downwards; those with new money are much more realistic.""

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Off topic, but Stones related:

I have two projects in the making, I wonder if there's interest for any of them.

1) Texas 7/18/1978 splitscreen (Let it Rock until Beast of Burden)

2) Hyde Park 7/5/1969 (all footage available; like Zep MSG 1973 for those who've seen it)

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Yes, Nutrocker, I agree with you. However, if MT were around for more than 2 or 3 songs, it might disjoint Ronnie Wood's nose a bit.

Yes, Nutrocker, I agree with you. However, if MT were around for more than 2 or 3 songs, it might disjoint Ronnie Wood's nose a bit.

They could have done what Iron Maiden did when Adrian Smith returned , play with three guitarists , It seems to work for them live and in the studio

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Another Led Wallet!!!! Twenty dollars!!! I know that over the years, there have comments by Bill Wyman and Ronnie about the way the money is divided. I don't know if Prince Rupert Lowenstein is still involved in the Stones finances, but he certainly did a good job for Sir Mick.

If you ever read Bill's book (Stone Alone) he is constantly ranting about the Stones' finances (and, by extension, his own)...I believe he actually turned down sitting in on the rest of the 50 And Counting Tour because -you guessed it- Sir Mick didn't want to pay Wyman what he wanted. Woody's finances have been up and down over the years- he's pissed a lot away on drugs, bad investments and at times has had to rely on his second career as an artist to pay the bills (Ronnie told some innaresting money stories in his book), and considering he joined the band in '75 he wasn't made an official member of the Stones until 1994 (thus giving him a bigger piece of the pie beyond being a salaried sideman ala Chuck Leavell)...and even then Ronnie's 'promotion' only happened because Charlie Watts insisted on it.

Prince Rupert basically saved the Stones' finances after Allen Klein fucked them over in the sixties...RL was the driving force behind setting up Rolling Stones Records as well as suggesting their tax exile in France, which begat Exile On Main Street. I'm surprised he packed it in actually (truth be told, I thought he was dead) but Prince Rupert had to be getting on in age.

One of my all time favorite Jagger stories centers around his negotiations with promoter Bill Graham for the 1989 North American tour. I'm paraphrasing parts of it:

Yeah, Mick sorta screwed over Bill Graham in '89, but ya can't say Jagger doesn't have good business acumen...Michael Cohl has made them a fuckin' fortune doing their tours since then.

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Brilliant! They really are in a league of their own when it comes to presentation and design for a live music spectacle. I don't think they can possibly equal let alone top the Glastonbury experience but for those attending at Hyde Park they certainly seem to be trying.

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True. Their sets over the years have been magnificent - and very expensive too. A lot of thought and creativity on the part of their team.

The UK press is speculating madly about whether they will do the exact set as at Hyde Park in '69. I am wondering if Mick will go the whole hog, and come out in a white smock, and quote an except from "Adonais". :D

Brilliant! They really are in a league of their own when it comes to presentation and design for a live music spectacle. I don't think they can possibly equal let alone top the Glastonbury experience but for those attending at Hyde Park they certainly seem to be trying.

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True. Their sets over the years have been magnificent - and very expensive too. A lot of thought and creativity on the part of their team.

I still think the "Lotus Stage" from the 1975 tour is one of the coolest stages ever. Some of the modern day Stones stages are just over the top...as Keith would say, "Fuck it, let's just go onstage with a couple of lights..." :lol:

The UK press is speculating madly about whether they will do the exact set as at Hyde Park in '69. I am wondering if Mick will go the whole hog, and come out in a white smock, and quote an except from "Adonais". :D

:lol: I kinda doubt it...after all to totally recreate the '69 stage/vibe they'd need the bad pictures of Brian Jones put up on the sides of the stage, and I don't see that happening.

My guess is they'll play the standard 50 And Counting set, maybe with an extra goodie or two thrown in for good measure.

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A full show Glasto SBD is now up at HC..... 384kbps lossy though, but It will do.....CYHMK w/MT in SBD stereo yay hey.....

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It's a shame they don't let Taylor play the entire show....Keef is shot as a guitarist, his contributions are minimal compared to the past.

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A full show Glasto SBD is now up at HC..... 384kbps lossy though, but It will do.....CYHMK w/MT in SBD stereo yay hey.....

HC ?

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Joined today ,accessed the rolling stones recording download , thanks

hungercity

Edited by weslgarlic

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The complete show DVD is now up, also at HC.

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