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apantherfrommd

World War II

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*Since this site has declared war on politics, religion, etc; I start this thread on the basis of 'History' and not necessarily politics.* This is my disclaimer.* If this site declares war on history, then freedom of speech is truly dead here. ;)

World War II was a Godless war. No leaders of power claimed a religion. FDR a Freemason, Hitler an occultist at best. The Japanese worshipped their Emperor Hirohito. And we know he was not a deity. In this thread, I'd like to present history to start off.

I have not seen a thread on World War II yet. Perhaps the search function is not working for me properly. If so, I apologize.

December 7th, 1941 is "a day that will live in infamy."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lK8gYGg0dkE

 

Edited by apantherfrommd

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OK I'll jump in!  Where?  At the beginning, of course.  

The war started in 1929 when Japan invaded China.

Good Golly! 1929?! I knew we (the US) were allies with the Chinese back then. How times have changed. But I had no idea the Japanese invaded China that early. That's like 12 years years, before we (the US) got into it.

*Edited to say*

Whatever the Japanese did, I remember that even today the Chinese haven't forgot what the Japanese did to their peoples. It must have been very bad to hold a grudge this long. Thank you for that 'chef free'. Rock On

Edited by apantherfrommd
Semi-acknowledgement

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The war started in 1929 when Japan invaded China.

My distant cousin on my Mother's side was General Chennault (Flying Tigers) who was fighting the Japanese for Chiang kai-shek.

I just watched a documentary on Himmler titled 'The Decent One.'

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To be honest and correct, the actual date for the beginning of WWII, would be September 1, 1939, the day that the German Blitzkrieg invaded Poland.  It was 2 days later that the English and the French officially declared war on Germany. 

(I am somewhat of an expert on Adolf Hitler and Nazi Germany.  From an historical standpoint and not from a standpoint of a fan of Adolf Hitler and Nazi Germany). 

An expert in My own mind but still an expert nonetheless...

Edited by kingzoso

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To be honest and correct, the actual date for the beginning of WWII, would be September 1, 1939, the day that the German Blitzkrieg invaded Poland.  It was 2 days later that the English and the French officially declared war on Germany. 

(I am somewhat of an expert on Adolf Hitler and Nazi Germany.  From an historical standpoint and not from a standpoint of a fan of Adolf Hitler and Nazi Germany). 

An expert in My own mind but still an expert nonetheless...

Try this. At nearly five hours very long but an interesting watch.

https://youtu.be/iet-baOoRio?list=PLRNbzK2W6kSuGV4v58hi_VBjb_wcKTIaM

edit   Part 1 intro about 12 mins is missing.

Edited by JTM

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Actually, WW2 started the moment Germany signed the Treaty of Versailles.  There...now let's argue about it !

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My old landlord has a small, hand carved wooden pipe with Japanese writing on it that his brother brought back from Iwo Jima.

Edited by redrum

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The war in Europe did start with Hitler's invasion of Poland Sept.1 1939, however this was a World War and many other events contributed to it's "fullness". Here are a few of the pre Sept. 1, 1939 events that made it such a huge fight:

Italy invades Ethiopia, October 1935.

Spanish Civil War, 1936-1939

Japan captures Beijing, July 1937

Final score: 75 million dead, over half of them civilians including about 16 million Chinese civilians and 12 million Russian civilians.

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My old landlord has a small, hand carved wooden pipe with Japanes writing on it that his brother brought back from Iwo Jima.

Oh Wow! Where does he keep it? :lol: I'd be keeping that pipe under lock & key. That's cool!

To be honest and correct, the actual date for the beginning of WWII, would be September 1, 1939, the day that the German Blitzkrieg invaded Poland.  It was 2 days later that the English and the French officially declared war on Germany. 

(I am somewhat of an expert on Adolf Hitler and Nazi Germany.  From an historical standpoint and not from a standpoint of a fan of Adolf Hitler and Nazi Germany). 

An expert in My own mind but still an expert nonetheless...

How's it goin this weekend, King? I got one for you, King. Or anyone else. General Patton's death. Accident or planned? Rammed his car with a truck? Poisoned him while in the hospital? Did NKVD finish him off? That Patton was a tough old bird. ;)

World War II was such a pivotal sea change in world society.

A fearless General. When bombs were going on all around him, he would stay in his tank and give anybody the devil for ducking. :lol:  

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2012/11/the_mysterious_death_of_gen_george_s_patton.html

Very interesting read here.

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Oh Wow! Where does he keep it? :lol: I'd be keeping that pipe under lock & key. That's cool!

How's it goin this weekend, King? I got one for you, King. Or anyone else. General Patton's death. Accident or planned? Rammed his car with a truck? Poisoned him while in the hospital? Did NKVD finish him off? That Patton was a tough old bird. ;)

World War II was such a pivotal sea change in world society.

A fearless General. When bombs were going on all around him, he would stay in his tank and give anybody the devil for ducking. :lol:  

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2012/11/the_mysterious_death_of_gen_george_s_patton.html

Very interesting read here.

Supposedly and ex-OSS operative spilled the beans and claimed Ike "allowed" the NKVD to poison Patton while in hospital. The Russians were scared shitless of Patton & Churchill starting a war against Soviet Russia, Ike was not as he knew Patton would never, ever disobey orders. Hell, in Sept Patton had the opportunity during the Lorraine Campaign to wipe out the majority of German forces in the area, bypass Metz, and roll into Luxembourg then to Germany. However, Ike ordered Patton to stop and cut off most of his fuel instead giving priority to Monty's Operation Market Garden which was a disaster and halted the allied offensive. If Patton would have disobeyed orders he would have likely rolled into Berlin by November 44' and ended the war, but, Patton was a good soldier and a very loyal friend and would never, under any circumstance, disobey a direct order. Ike was afraid of what Patton wrote in his extensive memoirs regarding Ike's anglophile predilections, his poor strategic vision, and his tendency to prefer political alliances over American strategic gain. Ike was planning on running for President and he was very worried Patton's memoir would be published and thus cost him the election. The strange thing is Ike & Patton had been best of friends since West Point, in fact it was Patton who recommended Ike to Gen Marshall right before WWII, a recommendation which placed then junior officer Ike on a meteoric rise which would surpass his mentor Patton. Patton even assured Ike his memoirs would never be published and were personal. Despite what the public believes about Patton as a hothead and semi-controlled psychopathic tactical genius, most of his "persona" was an act. Patton was actually very intelligent and very controlled. Also, Patton was less tactical genius and more master of people management and resources. Patton's use of G2 (intelligence) was far beyond any other commander of the war on either side and, he was the first to combine arial recon with artillery to prevent the enemy for creating defensive lines during retreat. Patton also knew talent when he saw it and thus had the best tactical and strategic minds under his command (Abrams, Truscott, Keyes,Weyland).

After 70 years the truth is unlikely to come out but it is without a doubt very strange that the very healthy Patton would get in a low speed (about 5-10mph) traffic accident, sprain his vertebra, begin recovery (Patton was not paralyzed from the accident as most believe, he lost movement for a few days but before he died he was on the road to a full recovery), and then suddenly die literally six hours before he was to be released from hospital and fly home to the US. Maybe this was coincidence but that is one hell of a coincidence. BTW Patton was supposedly poisoned by a nurse who was also an NKVD agent, an agent the OSS was aware of and allowed to succeed in her mission.

Edited by IpMan

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Oh Wow! Where does he keep it? :lol: I'd be keeping that pipe under lock & key. That's cool!

I'll have to ask the son Keith where it is. The wife is still living and she just turned 92. I help her out and take her to her doctor and eye doctor appointments. She really enjoys my company. I rented a small house from them for 15 years. She suffered a stroke about 10 years ago and now has a hard time saying what she wants, but she still has a good memory. Her Father was named Thorp and he was an Army colonel in the Philippines when the Japs invaded. He was very close to MacArthur and led a guerrilla group for a couple years before he was captured and eventually executed.

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The seeds for the Pacific Theatre were sown as early as 1905 with the Japan-Russian War and the response of Teddy Roosevelt. After acting as peacemaker Roosevelt commended the Japanese for their success and encouraged them on a path toward imperialism. Roosevelt later regretted his actions and predicted the US & Japan would be at war within 20 years...Roosevelt made this statement in 1910 so he was off by a decade.

Tha Japanese were sick and tired of being isolated which resulted in Anglo-American influence in their country at gunpoint during the mid-19th century. They were not stupid and quickly adapted to the situation, they just did it a bit to eagerly and matter of factly. The Japanese are also, like the Germans at the time, believers in national exceptionalism which resulted in a very bad outcome and a reason why I detest the notion of American exceptionalism of any sort. As son as a people believe they are superior to everyone else, look out.

In regard to the European conflict, alternate history analysts believe WWII would have happened with or without Hitler. If Hitler would not have come to power, the weak Weimar Republic would likely have collapsed by the mid-30's to be replaced by a military dictatorship. The only difference is under a military dictatorship Germany would likely not have attacked western Europe would would have seen Soviet Russia as their main target. 

Bottom line, WWII was almost inevitable given the political and social climate of the time.

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The seeds for the Pacific Theatre were sown as early as 1905 with the Japan-Russian War and the response of Teddy Roosevelt. After acting as peacemaker Roosevelt commended the Japanese for their success and encouraged them on a path toward imperialism. Roosevelt later regretted his actions and predicted the US & Japan would be at war within 20 years...Roosevelt made this statement in 1910 so he was off by a decade.

Tha Japanese were sick and tired of being isolated which resulted in Anglo-American influence in their country at gunpoint during the mid-19th century. They were not stupid and quickly adapted to the situation, they just did it a bit to eagerly and matter of factly. The Japanese are also, like the Germans at the time, believers in national exceptionalism which resulted in a very bad outcome and a reason why I detest the notion of American exceptionalism of any sort. As son as a people believe they are superior to everyone else, look out.

In regard to the European conflict, alternate history analysts believe WWII would have happened with or without Hitler. If Hitler would not have come to power, the weak Weimar Republic would likely have collapsed by the mid-30's to be replaced by a military dictatorship. The only difference is under a military dictatorship Germany would likely not have attacked western Europe would would have seen Soviet Russia as their main target. 

Bottom line, WWII was almost inevitable given the political and social climate of the time.

I wonder if the Holocaust would have occurred without Hitler?  Antisemitism has a long and ugly history in Europe.  Most European countries subjected Jews to all manner of discriminatory laws and enforced segregation until the 18th century.  European Jewry made great strides during the 19th century but, the knee-jerk bigotry against them never really went away.  Their economic and social advances also caused envy and resentment among their Gentile fellow citizens.  They were damned if they did and damned if they didn't. 

Most fascist political parties in Europe between the world wars were rabidly antisemitic.  Jews would not have fared well in this political atmosphere even without Hitler.  But would the large scale death camps have occurred without him? Germany's government under Hitler was willing to sacrifice some of their ability to wage war in order to exterminate the Jews.  They diverted manpower and resources to build the death camps, round up Jews, transport them to said camps and murder millions of them.  That was manpower, transportation and other resources they could have used against the Soviet and American military forces.  

 I don't want to veer off topic but, there are lessons here that Europeans today should heed. A minority group can do all the right things: adopt the local language and social mores, contribute to the country's economic and cultural life, but it won't matter if the majority refuses to accept them as full and equal citizens.  Most European Jews did their part, but the Gentiles they lived among refused to do their part; own their antisemitism and work to overcome it.  

 

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 I don't want to veer off topic but, there are lessons here that Europeans today should heed. A minority group can do all the right things: adopt the local language and social mores, contribute to the country's economic and cultural life, but it won't matter if the majority refuses to accept them as full and equal citizens.  Most European Jews did their part, but the Gentiles they lived among refused to do their part; own their antisemitism and work to overcome it.  

 

Don't want to veer off topic but does anyway? :P Sure you do Duck!! :) And you did.

Yes, yes, yes. Minority groups can do the right things, or the wrong things. Such is life and plenty of lessons to be learned.

By comparison, European Jews in the early 20th century were more amenable to assimilation to the countries that they were living in. They were participating in both the cultural and intellectual life on Germany for already at the time, a century and a half.

German Jews were not attempting to carry out attacks on civilians on several continents. They were not randomly massacring European citizens in stadiums, magazine offices, and concert halls.

The sad thing is a country can overcompensate out of guilt of it's past or too soft a heart leading to it's own demise.

Best to you, Duck. And don't click here. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ

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I wonder if the Holocaust would have occurred without Hitler?  Antisemitism has a long and ugly history in Europe.  Most European countries subjected Jews to all manner of discriminatory laws and enforced segregation until the 18th century.  European Jewry made great strides during the 19th century but, the knee-jerk bigotry against them never really went away.  Their economic and social advances also caused envy and resentment among their Gentile fellow citizens.  They were damned if they did and damned if they didn't. 

Most fascist political parties in Europe between the world wars were rabidly antisemitic.  Jews would not have fared well in this political atmosphere even without Hitler.  But would the large scale death camps have occurred without him? Germany's government under Hitler was willing to sacrifice some of their ability to wage war in order to exterminate the Jews.  They diverted manpower and resources to build the death camps, round up Jews, transport them to said camps and murder millions of them.  That was manpower, transportation and other resources they could have used against the Soviet and American military forces.  

 I don't want to veer off topic but, there are lessons here that Europeans today should heed. A minority group can do all the right things: adopt the local language and social mores, contribute to the country's economic and cultural life, but it won't matter if the majority refuses to accept them as full and equal citizens.  Most European Jews did their part, but the Gentiles they lived among refused to do their part; own their antisemitism and work to overcome it.  

 

Good question Disco. In the US Hitler and his policies were very popular among industrialist and politicians, in fact Chaplin was deemed a communist for making The Great Dictator in 1940 and would have been blackballed from Hollywood if it were not for the war. The Eugenics movement actually started in the US and by the 1930's was very popular, in fact many states had laws on the books which required convicted criminals to be sterilized as well as the "mentally deficient." If there was no Hitler and no Holocaust, Eugenics would most likely have progressed in the US and at the very least the likely outcome would have been a nationwide law requiring all convicted criminals, mentally unstable, and mentally ill to be sterilized. Hitler, the Nazi's, and the Holocaust kinda woke everyone up to the notion of eugenics leading to a very dark place plus, no one wanted anything which even remotely harkened to Hitler so the movement in the US died very quickly post-WWII.

Edited by IpMan

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*Since this site has declared war on politics, religion, etc; I start this thread on the basis of 'History' and not necessarily politics.* This is my disclaimer.* If this site declares war on history, then freedom of speech is truly dead here. ;)

World War II was a Godless war. No leaders of power claimed a religion. FDR a Freemason, Hitler an occultist at best. The Japanese worshipped their Emperor Hirohito. And we know he was not a deity. In this thread, I'd like to present history to start off.

I have not seen a thread on World War II yet. Perhaps the search function is not working for me properly. If so, I apologize.

December 7th, 1941 is "a day that will live in infamy."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lK8gYGg0dkE

 

Andy my friend, how is it going. Great thread and hopefully if we keep it civil it won't be "Banned in the USA."

FDR, though a Freemason was also a devout Christian (Episcopalian) and was very vocal about his faith in general. Hitler was baptized a Catholic but essentially believed all religion, including and especially mysticism, was bullshit. Hitler wanted to convert the German people to either a form of Shintoism or Islam as he believed these were strong, masculine religions which had the best chance of controlling the population, however this was part of a long-term goal which obviously never happened. The Japanese did worship Hirohito, however it was mostly symbolic and Japan's main religion was Shintoism. Stalin studied to become a priest in the Russian Orthodox Church and kept his belief until he died but suppressed it for the masses as he did not want any competition for power. So, Hitler was the only true Atheist in the group. 

I have been watching a series called Finding Hitler which theorizes Hitler fled the bunker on April 22nd or 23rd and lived, however from there its anyones guess. I personally believe, from the evidence, Hitler did indeed escape and did not commit suicide as claimed, after all no remains of Hitler or Braun have ever been found and verified. I do not believe he lived very long though and did not escape Europe. I believe he fled to Spain via aircraft, landed safely, and was promptly arrested, executed, and cremated under Franco's orders out of fear of what the Allies would do to Spain should it be discovered they aided Hitler in any way.

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Andy my friend, how is it going. Great thread and hopefully if we keep it civil it won't be "Banned in the USA."

FDR, though a Freemason was also a devout Christian (Episcopalian) and was very vocal about his faith in general. Hitler was baptized a Catholic but essentially believed all religion, including and especially mysticism, was bullshit. Hitler wanted to convert the German people to either a form of Shintoism or Islam as he believed these were strong, masculine religions which had the best chance of controlling the population, however this was part of a long-term goal which obviously never happened. The Japanese did worship Hirohito, however it was mostly symbolic and Japan's main religion was Shintoism. Stalin studied to become a priest in the Russian Orthodox Church and kept his belief until he died but suppressed it for the masses as he did not want any competition for power. So, Hitler was the only true Atheist in the group. 

I have been watching a series called Finding Hitler which theorizes Hitler fled the bunker on April 22nd or 23rd and lived, however from there its anyones guess. I personally believe, from the evidence, Hitler did indeed escape and did not commit suicide as claimed, after all no remains of Hitler or Braun have ever been found and verified. I do not believe he lived very long though and did not escape Europe. I believe he fled to Spain via aircraft, landed safely, and was promptly arrested, executed, and cremated under Franco's orders out of fear of what the Allies would do to Spain should it be discovered they aided Hitler in any way.

Must disagree with some of the statements, Adolfchen was obsessed with his own belief, a crossover between Neo-paganism and the Roman display of power (Why need a god if you can be one yourself).

Citation by Adolfchen ....

"We shall continue to make disturbances in the Far East and in Arabia. Let us think as men and let us see in these peoples at best lacquered half-apes who are anxious to experience the lash".

Numbers of Shintoist temples built by the Nazi's....zero

Number of mosques built by the Nazi's...one (really ugly shed).

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Since I have a bad feeling about why this thread actually exists I shall now leave it, this might end up into another political and reli-bullshit  discussion......do your own research on historically accurate sites, don't feed the trolls nudge nudge wink wink.

Shalom.

Edited by reswati

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Since I have a bad feeling about why this thread actually exists I shall now leave it, this might end up into another political and reli-bullshit  discussion......do your own research on historically accurate sites, don't feed the trolls nudge nudge wink wink.

Shalom.

Hiya Res, how ya doing? No worries, it is all good and peace is my mantra. Just wanted to say, Hitler never had those Shinto or Muslim worship houses built because that was a long-term goal to be possibly sought after WWII. Hitler was indeed very Romanesque in general and possibly saw himself almost akin to an Augustus or Constantine, who knows. In the end it is all conjecture.

Peace my friend.

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Possibly the best way to get into his weird mind is to read his book (which I did in highschool......I burned it after reading).

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