Led Zeppelin song lessons?

[leveebroke]

I know nearly every Zeppelin song has a YouTube tutorial on how to play it on guitar, but sometimes those tutorials lack some depth. Once of my goals in the near future is to sign up for some online guitar lessons to try and get off this plateau I'm on, and I was wondering if anyone here has gone down that route and if any of the services have any decent LZ content? 

[reids]

https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/30287-hooked-marty-schwartz-on-led-zeppelins-over-the-hills-and-far-away-marty-music?utm_source=Premier+Guitar&utm_campaign=9248e9235f-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2020_04_28_01_58&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_93db14e670-9248e9235f-66532873&goal=0_93db14e670-9248e9235f-66532873&mc_cid=9248e9235f&mc_eid=001229829a

OTHAFA

R😎🎸👍

[Annamilia]

On 4/29/2020 at 12:36 AM, reids said:

https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/30287-hooked-marty-schwartz-on-led-zeppelins-over-the-hills-and-far-away-marty-music?utm_source=Premier+Guitar&utm_campaign=9248e9235f-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2020_04_28_01_58&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_93db14e670-9248e9235f-66532873&goal=0_93db14e670-9248e9235f-66532873&mc_cid=9248e9235f&mc_eid=001229829a

OTHAFA

R😎🎸👍

Good one! I love his tutorials! 

[reids]

13 minutes ago, Annamilia said:

Good one! I love his tutorials! 

Thx. Yes, indeed. 
😎🎸👍🎶

[woz70]

On 4/28/2020 at 11:36 PM, reids said:

https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/30287-hooked-marty-schwartz-on-led-zeppelins-over-the-hills-and-far-away-marty-music?utm_source=Premier+Guitar&utm_campaign=9248e9235f-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2020_04_28_01_58&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_93db14e670-9248e9235f-66532873&goal=0_93db14e670-9248e9235f-66532873&mc_cid=9248e9235f&mc_eid=001229829a

OTHAFA

R😎🎸👍

Aaargh!  Incorrect timing on intro (he keeps adding a beat!!!), incorrect chords in the verse.  It's like he listened to the song once about 15 years ago and this is how he remembered it.
If you're going to do tutorials on a song, the least you can do is check you're playing it right first 🤬

[reids]

12 hours ago, woz70 said:

Aaargh!  Incorrect timing on intro (he keeps adding a beat!!!), incorrect chords in the verse.  It's like he listened to the song once about 15 years ago and this is how he remembered it.
If you're going to do tutorials on a song, the least you can do is check you're playing it right first 🤬

Yep. Maybe you can start a YouTube tutorial to help Marty stay on point.

R😎

[woz70]

9 hours ago, reids said:

Yep. Maybe you can start a YouTube tutorial to help Marty stay on point.

R😎

If you're going to teach somebody something first learn it right, then teach it right. Sarcastic comments like that don't make a wrong thing right. 

I haven't got the time, the video gear or the inclination to compete with the ocean of videos out there. There are a few video tutorials out there that get it right, but they're, sadly, in the minority.  It annoys me that a big trusted site like Premiere Guitars, using a big trusted name like Marty Schwartz teach things wrong - especially for such an iconic song. And then people who are obviously guitarists, like you, always give snarky comments when it's pointed out. 

Or did you not notice that he's playing it wrong? 

I just tell my students to use their ears. Play along with the song you want to learn and work it out for yourself first. If you get stuck watch a few videos pre-armed with the knowledge that the huge majority will show you something that's wrong, but with the hope that they've got the bit you're stuck on right! 

There are some excellent general tutorial videos out there for learners - Justinguitar is excellent. Paul Davids is also very good, but sadly you really have to trawl through the dross to find them.  

Edited February 28, 2021 by woz70

[woz70]

This guy gets it right :

 

 

[reids]

9 hours ago, woz70 said:

If you're going to teach somebody something first learn it right, then teach it right. Sarcastic comments like that don't make a wrong thing right. 

I haven't got the time, the video gear or the inclination to compete with the ocean of videos out there. There are a few video tutorials out there that get it right, but they're, sadly, in the minority.  It annoys me that a big trusted site like Premiere Guitars, using a big trusted name like Marty Schwartz teach things wrong - especially for such an iconic song. And then people who are obviously guitarists, like you, always give snarky comments when it's pointed out. 

Or did you not notice that he's playing it wrong? 

I just tell my students to use their ears. Play along with the song you want to learn and work it out for yourself first. If you get stuck watch a few videos pre-armed with the knowledge that the huge majority will show you something that's wrong, but with the hope that they've got the bit you're stuck on right! 

There are some excellent general tutorial videos out there for learners - Justinguitar is excellent. Paul Davids is also very good, but sadly you really have to trawl through the dross to find them.  

I wasn’t being sarcastic; just direct to find the solution to the problem and suggested that you Seriously address It with him if it’s enough for you to comment on it here.  I definitely noticed it, as I posted it just to see if others noticed it. I’ve been playing and teaching for years as well as played with Grammy winners, number one hit songwriters in multiple categories, etc.  Also take into consideration: There’s also a grey area of a copyright issue where some “teachers” on YouTube will purposely not play note for note to avoid being shut down or having their posts deleted / removed or have strikes against their accounts like Rick Beato (also here in Atlanta) has done (note for note) just for educational purposes. It’s ridiculous.
I stay away from doing videos to avoid the drama and prefer to teach students one on one or group lessons directly. Videos will only get you so far as most use them as a crutch in learning then peak out due to laziness and not learn for themselves (I wore out vinyl, vcr tapes, etc growing up learning solos, riffs, arrangements, etc). There’s no real short cut to learning to how play other than (working hard) taking the time and discipline to review it yourself and then getting a mentor / teacher who has already done the work to reinforce proper habits, technique and apply your own personal fingerprint (tone) into the music. 

R😎

Edited February 28, 2021 by reids

[reids]

9 hours ago, woz70 said:

This guy gets it right :

 

 

Jimmy Sakurai gets it right, too. 
 

R😎

[woz70]

52 minutes ago, reids said:

I wasn’t being sarcastic; just direct to find the solution to the problem and suggested that you Seriously address It with him if it’s enough for you to comment on it here.  I definitely noticed it, as I posted it just to see if others noticed it. I’ve been playing and teaching for years as well as played with Grammy winners, number one hit songwriters in multiple categories, etc.  Also take into consideration: There’s also a grey area of a copyright issue where some “teachers” on YouTube will purposely not play note for note to avoid being shut down or having their posts deleted / removed or have strikes against their accounts like Rick Beato (also here in Atlanta) has done (note for note) just for educational purposes. It’s ridiculous.
I stay away from doing videos to avoid the drama and prefer to teach students one on one or group lessons directly. Videos will only get you so far as most use them as a crutch in learning then peak out due to laziness and not learn for themselves (I wore out vinyl, vcr tapes, etc growing up learning solos, riffs, arrangements, etc). There’s no real short cut to learning to how play other than (working hard) taking the time and discipline to review it yourself and then getting a mentor / teacher who has already done the work to reinforce proper habits, technique and apply your own personal fingerprint (tone) into the music. 

R😎

Dude. 

My apologies. There are soooo many complete tits on this forum that it's hard to sort the wheat from the chaff sometimes. 

Looking at the comments on Marty's videos tells me that enough people have noticed that he is mostly er.. 'less than accurate' that my voice will get lost in that ocean too... 

If you're not going to play note for note for fear of copyright infractions you need to state that clearly at the beginning of the video. Students, as you well know, are often lazy and are always looking for the shortcut. Explaining that the only way to get good is the hard way never goes down well. 

Explaining that online tablature is wrong 99% of the time also goes down badly. Explaining that listening is a better tool than videos and books is another hard one. If I'd had the ability to play the records I learned from at 1/2 speed but with the correct pitch when I was learning.... I could have saved money on buying new tape machines to replace the ones I broke. 

The reason I commented here is because, as a teacher I know it's best to learn things right the first time. Mistakes are easily embedded into muscle memory and are time consuming and boring to fix. 

Stay well, and let's hope we can play in the outside world once again very soon. 

[reids]

1 hour ago, woz70 said:

Dude. 

My apologies. There are soooo many complete tits on this forum that it's hard to sort the wheat from the chaff sometimes. 

Looking at the comments on Marty's videos tells me that enough people have noticed that he is mostly er.. 'less than accurate' that my voice will get lost in that ocean too... 

If you're not going to play note for note for fear of copyright infractions you need to state that clearly at the beginning of the video. Students, as you well know, are often lazy and are always looking for the shortcut. Explaining that the only way to get good is the hard way never goes down well. 

Explaining that online tablature is wrong 99% of the time also goes down badly. Explaining that listening is a better tool than videos and books is another hard one. If I'd had the ability to play the records I learned from at 1/2 speed but with the correct pitch when I was learning.... I could have saved money on buying new tape machines to replace the ones I broke. 

The reason I commented here is because, as a teacher I know it's best to learn things right the first time. Mistakes are easily embedded into muscle memory and are time consuming and boring to fix. 

Stay well, and let's hope we can play in the outside world once again very soon. 

No problem. I understand. Agreed. 
Take it easy. 
 

R😎🎸👍🎶

[Annamilia]

@woz70 @reids

Obviously, I am a total newbie at playing the guitar and also not as big of a Led Zeppelin expert as you guys so watching the above posted tutorial at first I did not think about the intro being wrong.

I can see how that must be annoying for your trained ears but I wondered if playing songs exactly like the original is what guitar teachers are expecting of their students. More specifically, I wondered what your teaching approach is:

Build up the basics first, learn the theory, the chords, practice progressions and transitions before you even start learning how to play songs? 

Or do you teach by letting the students practice the songs they like in a sort of "learning by doing" approach and add some theory along the way?

Would appreciate your thoughts on this because I feel like I have seen both approaches and am not sure which way to go in order to minimize frustration when learning to play. ☺️

[woz70]

3 hours ago, Annamilia said:

@woz70 @reids

Obviously, I am a total newbie at playing the guitar and also not as big of a Led Zeppelin expert as you guys so watching the above posted tutorial at first I did not think about the intro being wrong.

I can see how that must be annoying for your trained ears but I wondered if playing songs exactly like the original is what guitar teachers are expecting of their students. More specifically, I wondered what your teaching approach is:

Build up the basics first, learn the theory, the chords, practice progressions and transitions before you even start learning how to play songs? 

Or do you teach by letting the students practice the songs they like in a sort of "learning by doing" approach and add some theory along the way?

Would appreciate your thoughts on this because I feel like I have seen both approaches and am not sure which way to go in order to minimize frustration when learning to play. ☺️

Firstly - the intro to OTHAFA is very idiosyncratic (as is much of Page’s playing) and not at all easy from a rhythm point of view.  I wouldn’t recommend trying this tune to anyone who: doesn’t know all their ‘open position’ chords; isn’t able to smoothly move between those chords; isn’t comfortable moving from chords to single notes and vice versa; isn’t comfortable with different strumming patterns and alternate picking; isn’t comfortable with hammer-ons and pull-offs... the list goes on.  Simply put, it’s hard. 

As for the rest... it all depends on the student and their interests and abilities, as to what happens when, and how things get taught.  You do need to learn your open chords,  distinguish between major and minor, and be able change easily between one chord and another.  Learning some scales can also be useful because they help you to be able to move your fingers independently.

‘Learning by doing’ is the only way to learn any musical instrument.  It’s like learning to drive - you can read about it, talk to people about it, watch people doing it.... but until you actually sit there and do it, and learn over time and with repetition what you have to do with you eyes, your ears, your arms and your legs, you don’t really have a clue what ‘driving’ actually involves.

Learning ‘theory’ can be useful (and it depends on what you mean by ‘theory’) but isn’t strictly necessary (to use the car analogy again, you don’t need to know how a four stroke engine works in order to drive a car).  Using tablature or standard notation can be useful but isn’t strictly necessary - I learned to play the guitar ‘by ear’ and didn’t discover tablature until I was in my 20’s - It all depends what you want from the guitar and your playing.

The best advice I can give you is this:

Take it slowly. Be patient with yourself. At the beginning learning the guitar is uncomfortable on the fingers, and co-ordinating both hands can be challenging. Frustration is going to happen, but doing things slowly and over-and-over again is the only way get through it.

Repetition is your best friend - your aim is to build muscle memory, and repeating actions methodically and slowly (at first) is the best way to do this.  Anyone who tells you there are hacks or shortcuts is lying to you. Lots of practise is the only way to improve.

Get a good teacher who listens and adapts to your way of learning, and can stop you from doing things that aren’t helpful or will give you long-term injuries.  (Some things can seem ridiculously difficult until it’s pointed out that if you put this finger here instead of that finger..... and that’s why teachers can be useful!)

Most importantly listen to lots of music. Listening is the most powerful tool available to any musician.  I’ve heard guitarists with amazing, mind-blowing technique who are utterly incapable of playing in a band because they learn their part, put their head down and all they hear is what they’re playing,  not what the other musicians in  the band are doing and how to make all the parts fit together.

If you’re an absolute beginner and want to look at some excellent tutorial videos check out justinguitar.com.  I’m not affiliated with him in any way, but I met him back in the late 90’s when he was playing in a Stones tribute band and he’s a great player and a fantastic teacher.

Good luck!

Edited March 2, 2021 by woz70

[The Pagemeister]

 

[The Pagemeister]

 

[Plant77]

On 7/16/2022 at 10:15 AM, The Pagemeister said:

 

Watching these lessons is really a reminder of what an absolute genius Jimmy is. The tunings, strum patterns, and the overall complexity of his music. We are all truly blessed to have the ability to listen to his and their music. Incredible.