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The Vaccine for Covid is coming fast


LedZeppfan1977

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15 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

For the most part it's because people like you insist the solution to every problem is more Big Government.

Now that's a cop-out and you know it. Not getting into with you Steve, must respect the rules.

COVID, evolving toward sentience? Enquiring minds want to know.

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5 hours ago, JohnOsbourne said:

Probably bullshit bluster, but if it comes to war, Australia will have plenty of precedent for locking down dissent:

Australia Says It's 'Inconceivable' That It Won't Join the US to Defend Taiwan - News From Antiwar.com

So says the exspurt, (exspurt - a has been or never was crossed with a drip under pressure) on Australia who has never been here or anywhere else outside of the US (or so it would seem).

Check your history. Australia and the USA have been allies for nearly a century and have been involved in many conflicts together including WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan, and Iraq.

Our, and New Zealand's commitment has always been greater than any other countries per capita.

Dissent? We too have freedom of speech, it's not just limited to America.

Have a nice day.

.

Edited by Reggie29
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4 hours ago, JohnOsbourne said:

Probably bullshit bluster, but if it comes to war, Australia will have plenty of precedent for locking down dissent:

Australia Says It's 'Inconceivable' That It Won't Join the US to Defend Taiwan - News From Antiwar.com

The view you have of Australia is completely baffling to me. Not your views on Covid, lockdowns and over reach, I get your views on those subjects, but I can't for the life of me figure out how you seem to believe we are akin to a authoritarian China/Russia style dictatorship. I get you think that applies in terms of our Gov's response to the pandemic, but jeez luise, you at time seem to really think we are 100% the opposite of what we are.

I think it is similar to me watching police brutality videos on youtube one after another and thinking the United States is primarily a completely failed police state.

I truly hope one day you get to visit here John, and if you ever do, I'd offer a catch up for a beer and some Zep talk for sure. I'd absolutely delight in having a laugh with you about the view you hold (held?) vs. the reality.

Please don't worry too much about us mate, we'll be fine.

As for the upcoming conflict (not certain, but more likely than not I'm afraid), we will no doubt have those that protest. Understandable given the horrors of war. I can't see the Government interfering in peaceful protests any more than they do for any protest about anything. And like Reggie says, we will stand shoulder to shoulder with you as always should things kick off.

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9 hours ago, Reggie29 said:

So says the exspurt, (exspurt - a has been or never was crossed with a drip under pressure) on Australia who has never been here or anywhere else outside of the US (or so it would seem).

Check your history. Australia and the USA have been allies for nearly a century and have been involved in many conflicts together including WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan, and Iraq.

Our, and New Zealand's commitment has always been greater than any other countries per capita.

Dissent? We too have freedom of speech, it's not just limited to America.

Have a nice day.

.

So, you're proud of supporting the various stupid, pointless wars that the Americans have waged?  Interesting.  What Australian national interest has been served by any of these?  What Australian (or American, for that matter) national interest depends on who controls Taiwan (or Ukraine, or Syria, etc.)?  Or are you just mindlessly cheer-leading about being America's bitch?  

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1 hour ago, JohnOsbourne said:

So, you're proud of supporting the various stupid, pointless wars that the Americans have waged?  Interesting.  What Australian national interest has been served by any of these?  What Australian (or American, for that matter) national interest depends on who controls Taiwan (or Ukraine, or Syria, etc.)?  Or are you just mindlessly cheer-leading about being America's bitch?  

Well, you started strong with your first two sentences but after that went right off the rails. Come on John, no need to insult. I believe most thinking people agree with your first sentence. Now regarding WWII Australia really had no choice as the Japanese wanted to invade Australia during WWII and attacked her 111 times during the war. 

Poor Aussies just wanted to eat Vegemite and ballroom dance when Tojo arrived to spoil the party. Its not like they could have just sent a few thousand Drop Bears and some Inland Taipans' to take out the Japanese 😉 

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7 hours ago, JohnOsbourne said:

So, you're proud of supporting the various stupid, pointless wars that the Americans have waged?  Interesting.  What Australian national interest has been served by any of these?  What Australian (or American, for that matter) national interest depends on who controls Taiwan?

Taiwan is a free society of 24 million people that puts the lie to the Chinese Communist Party’s ultimate claim of legitimacy. Throughout its seventy years of rule, the Party has justified its totalitarianism on the basis that any other form of government would lead to chaos and corruption—features that marked much of China’s history and which some historians blame for why greatness and global power have eluded the world’s most populous nation.

Taiwan is a living rebuke of this fiction. It shows that an ethnically Chinese-majority country can achieve stability and prosperity through democracy and the rule of law. Since Taiwan evolved into a full democracy in 1996, it has had three peaceful changes of power between political parties and its per capita income has grown to more than $50,000—now ranked twenty-eighth in the world. Furthermore, Taipei has achieved this despite persistent threats and intimidation from Beijing.

Unfortunately, the US does not have a mutual defense treaty with Taiwan and the Communist Chinese own President Biden so if and when the Communist Chinese decide to take Taiwan I seriously doubt the US will do a damn thing about it.

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59 minutes ago, SteveAJones said:

Taiwan is a free society of 24 million people that puts the lie to the Chinese Communist Party’s ultimate claim of legitimacy. Throughout its seventy years of rule, the Party has justified its totalitarianism on the basis that any other form of government would lead to chaos and corruption—features that marked much of China’s history and which some historians blame for why greatness and global power have eluded the world’s most populous nation.

Taiwan is a living rebuke of this fiction. It shows that an ethnically Chinese-majority country can achieve stability and prosperity through democracy and the rule of law. Since Taiwan evolved into a full democracy in 1996, it has had three peaceful changes of power between political parties and its per capita income has grown to more than $50,000—now ranked twenty-eighth in the world. Furthermore, Taipei has achieved this despite persistent threats and intimidation from Beijing.

Unfortunately, the US does not have a mutual defense treaty with Taiwan and the Communist Chinese own President Biden so if and when the Communist Chinese decide to take Taiwan I seriously doubt the US will do a damn thing about it.

The issue isn't whether Chinese or any other ethnic/national group can achieve stable democracy.  The issue is, how does it concern the US if they do or not?  It's a good thing the US doesn't have a mutual defense pact with Taiwan.

And if I recall, don't Taiwan (where the Nationalist government evacuated to after the civil war) and the CCP both claim to be the rightful rulers of China?  How is this any business of the US?  It sounds like an internal Chinese matter, we have enough of our own problems to solve.  Ironically, the US wouldn't have to worry about any of this if they hadn't betrayed the Nationalists during WW2.  Another triumph of the "good war".

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42 minutes ago, JohnOsbourne said:

The issue isn't whether Chinese or any other ethnic/national group can achieve stable democracy.  The issue is, how does it concern the US if they do or not?  It's a good thing the US doesn't have a mutual defense pact with Taiwan.

And if I recall, don't Taiwan (where the Nationalist government evacuated to after the civil war) and the CCP both claim to be the rightful rulers of China?  How is this any business of the US?  It sounds like an internal Chinese matter, we have enough of our own problems to solve.  Ironically, the US wouldn't have to worry about any of this if they hadn't betrayed the Nationalists during WW2.  Another triumph of the "good war".

Unsure if I have the time and inclination to explain the history of the world to you. Suffice to say a world without stable democratic nations is not the world I want.

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17 minutes ago, SteveAJones said:

Unsure if I have the time and inclination to explain the history of the world to you. Suffice to say a world without stable democratic nations is not the world I want.

There's nothing sanctified about democracy, it's a form of government, and can be as bad as any other form if the rulers themselves are rotten or if the society over which it presides is corrupted.  Prime examples being the US and Western Europe.  The destructive lock-downs, vaccine mandates, and mass surveillance are all products of democratic governments.  As bad as the CCP unquestionably is, I'm pretty sure they don't hate their own people, like the Western governments do.  When the US government shows more concern for the stability of our southern border, I'll take more seriously its concerns over Taiwan's or Ukraine's borders.  

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14 hours ago, JohnOsbourne said:

So, you're proud of supporting the various stupid, pointless wars that the Americans have waged?  Interesting.  What Australian national interest has been served by any of these?  What Australian (or American, for that matter) national interest depends on who controls Taiwan (or Ukraine, or Syria, etc.)?  Or are you just mindlessly cheer-leading about being America's bitch?  

The only interest Australia and America have with Taiwan is trade.

Of course I don't support any wars, however, when a country attacks or invades another then it's only natural they defend their homeland.

As Bob pointed out we had no choice but to take action against Japan just like America did. Remember Pearl Harbour?

Both allies stopped the advance in New Guinea.

Personally, I think Taiwan, The Ukraine and Syria is China's, Russia's and Syria's concern but considering Americas past history of defending democracy and freedom in general, I doubt they would sit back and do nothing.

They are difficult situations that hopefully diplomatic solutions are possible. Time will tell.

We're nobody's bitch.

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5 hours ago, JohnOsbourne said:

There's nothing sanctified about democracy, it's a form of government, and can be as bad as any other form if the rulers themselves are rotten or if the society over which it presides is corrupted.  Prime examples being the US and Western Europe.  The destructive lock-downs, vaccine mandates, and mass surveillance are all products of democratic governments.  As bad as the CCP unquestionably is, I'm pretty sure they don't hate their own people, like the Western governments do.  

Yeah, were definitely done here.

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The inclination of Australia to stand with the US - even in very questionable "first strike" conflicts (or even false flag ones like Vietnam) should be viewed PURELY as national interest. Failure to realise that is simply ignorance of the geo-political reality of Australia in the 20th century. We trade and are open to Asia, we - like other nations incorrectly thought engagement with China would bring the benefit of a more liberal China. We share the US, Canada, and Europe/Britain's view of western free market liberal government as not only superior, but worth defending against the authoritarian alternative. Western liberal democracies are far from perfect, but holds the right of the citizen above the power of governance by mechanism of free and fair elections. The people decide governance, not the powerful.

WORTH DEFENDING. Worth standing together for.

12 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

Taiwan is a free society of 24 million people that puts the lie to the Chinese Communist Party’s ultimate claim of legitimacy. Throughout its seventy years of rule, the Party has justified its totalitarianism on the basis that any other form of government would lead to chaos and corruption—features that marked much of China’s history and which some historians blame for why greatness and global power have eluded the world’s most populous nation.

Taiwan is a living rebuke of this fiction. It shows that an ethnically Chinese-majority country can achieve stability and prosperity through democracy and the rule of law. Since Taiwan evolved into a full democracy in 1996, it has had three peaceful changes of power between political parties and its per capita income has grown to more than $50,000—now ranked twenty-eighth in the world. Furthermore, Taipei has achieved this despite persistent threats and intimidation from Beijing.

Unfortunately, the US does not have a mutual defense treaty with Taiwan and the Communist Chinese own President Biden so if and when the Communist Chinese decide to take Taiwan I seriously doubt the US will do a damn thing about it.

Well said.

Edited by rm2551
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16 hours ago, JohnOsbourne said:

There's nothing sanctified about democracy, it's a form of government, and can be as bad as any other form if the rulers themselves are rotten or if the society over which it presides is corrupted.  Prime examples being the US and Western Europe.  The destructive lock-downs, vaccine mandates, and mass surveillance are all products of democratic governments.  As bad as the CCP unquestionably is, I'm pretty sure they don't hate their own people, like the Western governments do.  When the US government shows more concern for the stability of our southern border, I'll take more seriously its concerns over Taiwan's or Ukraine's borders.  

I hear what you are saying however it really does come down exclusively to trade. You may think Taiwan is insignificant but we live in a global economy akin to a Jenga Tower, pull one piece and the whole thing could collapse. 

One last note, China can not and will not invade Taiwan, plain and simple. The US is the only nation on this planet which could engage in a large scale amphibious invasion and is the only country to have done so successfully in the past. The Chinese has primarily what is called a littoral Navy for coastal defense only. It's only deep water assets are its subs and two really shitty, diesel powered, extremely antiquated carriers. They simply do not have the necessary assets to invade anyone not directly on their land border. They could blow it off the map but no way they could successfully invade Taiwan. Now even if they did have the assets (which they do not) the entire invasion force would be destroyed long before it was even in sight of Taiwan. Again, amphibious operations rely on one thing above all else, the element of surprise. No way an amphibious invasion force would not be spotted long before it left port. Totally impossible. Just one American carrier group could literally destroy the entire Chinese surface navy and any attacking air forces with little effort.

It's just sabre rattling, nothing more.

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The three big cats delighted visitors to the Nebraska zoo for years - pouncing on pumpkins during Halloween, preening for pictures and lounging on rocks in their enclosure.

The Lincoln Children's Zoo has described the snow leopards as silly, bubbly and handsome. They were one of the zoo's main attractions, delivering a dose of mountain majesty to the Great Plains.

But on Friday, the zoo announced that the leopards - Everest, Makalu and Ranney - had died of complications from covid-19, about one month after the animals had tested positive for the coronavirus. While scientists are still studying the effects of the virus on animals, members of several species have been infected and died in zoos around the world. Snow leopards are considered vulnerable to extinction, with just a few thousand estimated to be living in the wild.

The Lincoln cats "were beloved by our entire community inside and outside of the zoo," the zoo said in a statement. "This loss is truly heartbreaking, and we are all grieving together."

Two Sumatran tigers, Axl and Kumar, were also infected, but the zoo said Friday that they "have made a seemingly full recovery from their illness."

The zoo will remain open to the public. The park said it has strict coronavirus protocols in place for animal areas, including mask use for staffers working inside. An investigation did not determine the cause of the outbreak, it said.

It is possible for humans to infect cats with the coronavirus and for cats to pass it on to other cats, according to the Cornell Feline Health Center. However, the Cornell center said, there is not yet evidence that cats can infect people. The Food and Drug Administration classifies the risk for animal-to-people spread as low.

 

Wait a minute.....I thought this whole Covid virus thingee was caused BY THE TRANSFER OF THE VIRUS IN A WET MARKET IN WUHAN TO HUMANS!!! 

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4 hours ago, Stryder1978 said:
Wait a minute.....I thought this whole Covid virus thingee was caused BY THE TRANSFER OF THE VIRUS IN A WET MARKET IN WUHAN TO HUMANS!!! 

Nope. As I stated very early on (and was branded as a tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorist for doing so) the origin of this virus is an inadvertent leak that occurred during gain of function research inside a Wuhan lab funded in part by that son of a bitch Dr. Anthony Fauci.

2021 09 02.jpg

Edited by SteveAJones
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6 hours ago, BobDobbs said:

I hear what you are saying however it really does come down exclusively to trade. You may think Taiwan is insignificant but we live in a global economy akin to a Jenga Tower, pull one piece and the whole thing could collapse. 

One last note, China can not and will not invade Taiwan, plain and simple. The US is the only nation on this planet which could engage in a large scale amphibious invasion and is the only country to have done so successfully in the past. The Chinese has primarily what is called a littoral Navy for coastal defense only. It's only deep water assets are its subs and two really shitty, diesel powered, extremely antiquated carriers. They simply do not have the necessary assets to invade anyone not directly on their land border. They could blow it off the map but no way they could successfully invade Taiwan. Now even if they did have the assets (which they do not) the entire invasion force would be destroyed long before it was even in sight of Taiwan. Again, amphibious operations rely on one thing above all else, the element of surprise. No way an amphibious invasion force would not be spotted long before it left port. Totally impossible. Just one American carrier group could literally destroy the entire Chinese surface navy and any attacking air forces with little effort.

It's just sabre rattling, nothing more.

It's not a question of it being insignificant, it's a question of whether it is worth American lives to defend.  I say definitely not.  America seems to have survived just fine with worse governments than the CCP exerting their sphere of influence, there's no reason it can't do so again.  But you are right:  this is all just bluster, but it would be better if the Western politicians just shut their mouths about it.  

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