ISIS Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Why was the epic ALS missing from the set list? IMO this track is up there with Kashmir as their most accomplished piece of work. It would have been a great addition to the set in place of inferior tracks like Misty Mountain Hop, TSRTS and Ramble On. Is it just too demanding technically for Jimmy to play now? This is unlikely as he seemed to perform brilliantly on the night. Maybe the track is like the band - "sleeping now to rise again"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reids Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Maybe they're saving it for a tour (who knows)??? Let's wait and see. It is a great song (but when you have so many great songs, it's hard to choose). R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattmc1973 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 I'm guessing the song's length. It's a 10+ minute song. They did Nobody's Fault But Mine and For Your Life, so that's 2 songs represented from Presence. Trying to keep the show to 2 hours, and have songs represented from their entire career, some things had to be left out. I'd imagine if they tour, it'd be played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leddy Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Could be its a tricky song to sing ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hand_Of_Omega_91 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 I agree its an amazing song and its a shame they didnt play it but they only had 2 hours which is short compared to their sets way back when and they tried to do the songs that would please the largest amount of people. In my opinion the setlist was great and they certainly played all the biggies. Lets hope they play it on the tour that will be announced in Septmeber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidZoso Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 I was hoping it would have been played myself. I am sure if they tour it will be played as it is one of Jimmy's favs. They did play it 2 times on the Page Plant tour in 1995. At the opeing show in Pensacola and the next night in Atlanta. I have the audio tape of the first night and the video of the second one. I enjoyed seeing it with 2 guitars, live with Porl Thompson helping out but Jimmy can handle it all himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ledded1 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Lets start the rumour that it will be played as the opening song on every show they do on their world tour in October this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huw Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 It's a bugger to play - not particularly hard technically, but hard to remember the order of the sections. I mapped it out for my band & it comes out at 31 seperate sections to get in the right order. That is a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ISIS Posted January 30, 2008 Author Share Posted January 30, 2008 It's a bugger to play - not particularly hard technically, but hard to remember the order of the sections. I mapped it out for my band & it comes out at 31 seperate sections to get in the right order. That is a lot. Is it more difficult and harder to remember than say Dazed & Confused then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zep41 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Is it more difficult and harder to remember than say Dazed & Confused then? this shouldnt even be a debate. and no offense whatsoever to you for not understanding music, but it is maybe about 50 times harder for a band to execute Achilles than it is for Dazed and Confused (D&C not being tricky at all). Therefore, the reason it was not played at the o2: it is a very very complicated and hard song to execute live the CORRECT way. Its just way too all over the place and there is much too much probability for crucial error, especially when you are a band that hasnt really played much together in the past 30 years! There is not much of a chance that Zeppelin will tour, and I think its safe to say there is barely any chance that even if they do, Achilles will not be included in the set. At least not in its entirety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evster2012 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Well, they in fact did mess up D&C at the O2, and IMO Kashmir is an easier song to get lost in. Zeppelin sure did! I don't believe ALS being left out had anything to do with difficulty. I'm also shocked that TSRTS could ever be referred to as "inferior"! It was Jimmy anthemic overture at the time. An absolutely brilliant piece. Nah, I believe it was either time constraint or they simply didn't agree on it being included. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suz Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Well, they in fact did mess up D&C at the O2, and IMO Kashmir is an easier song to get lost in. Zeppelin sure did! I don't believe ALS being left out had anything to do with difficulty. I'm also shocked that TSRTS could ever be referred to as "inferior"! It was Jimmy anthemic overture at the time. An absolutely brilliant piece. Nah, I believe it was either time constraint or they simply didn't agree on it being included. I agree, TSRTS is totally inspired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zosodude13 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 I was thinking... could it have been left off becasue of its name? seriously, if they wanted to tour, ending their possibly last ever concert with Achilles LAST STAND might give the impression it was all over... it seems simple to me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstork Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Well, they in fact did mess up D&C at the O2, and IMO Kashmir is an easier song to get lost in. Zeppelin sure did! I don't believe ALS being left out had anything to do with difficulty. I'm also shocked that TSRTS could ever be referred to as "inferior"! It was Jimmy anthemic overture at the time. An absolutely brilliant piece. Nah, I believe it was either time constraint or they simply didn't agree on it being included. That choice of words shocked me too! Nothing "inferior" about TSRTS, and I thought they did it justice on 12/10. Having said that, two of the songs I really was hoping to hear, because I love them on the DVD, were the Ocean and ALS. But everything else sounded so great (on youtube anyway!) that I didn't even miss them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suz Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 I was thinking... could it have been left off becasue of its name? seriously, if they wanted to tour, ending their possibly last ever concert with Achilles LAST STAND might give the impression it was all over... it seems simple to me... Oh, I never thought of that. Huh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ISIS Posted January 30, 2008 Author Share Posted January 30, 2008 Well, they in fact did mess up D&C at the O2, and IMO Kashmir is an easier song to get lost in. Zeppelin sure did! I don't believe ALS being left out had anything to do with difficulty. I'm also shocked that TSRTS could ever be referred to as "inferior"! It was Jimmy anthemic overture at the time. An absolutely brilliant piece. Nah, I believe it was either time constraint or they simply didn't agree on it being included. INHO, TSRST is "inferior" to ALS! Just a subjective viewpoint I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slagfarmer Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Perhaps it had something to do with Jimmy's recently broken finger? Just a thought Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zep41 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Well, they in fact did mess up D&C at the O2, and IMO Kashmir is an easier song to get lost in. Zeppelin sure did! I don't believe ALS being left out had anything to do with difficulty. I'm also shocked that TSRTS could ever be referred to as "inferior"! It was Jimmy anthemic overture at the time. An absolutely brilliant piece. Nah, I believe it was either time constraint or they simply didn't agree on it being included. exactly my point. They knew that not everything was going to be absolutely perfect (not that I really care that much about the mess up in dazed but it did kill the high point transition of the song at the time) and given that, why even waste time with Achilles when there's a number of other tracks that they know they have a better chance of nailing. So your right, maybe the sole reason Achilles wasnt played was not because its really hard, but it seems there were a bit easier tracks that they felt needed to be played and felt they had a much better chance of nailing live. Then again, For Your Life is not an easy track fro a band to play by any means. NOR is In My Time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zep41 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 I was thinking... could it have been left off becasue of its name? seriously, if they wanted to tour, ending their possibly last ever concert with Achilles LAST STAND might give the impression it was all over... it seems simple to me... I think you are thinking too hard. However --- what I do find interesting is that Achilles was left off the setlist of their last show ever in Berlin 1980. And they played it for every other show on that tour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Z(oso) Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Well, they in fact did mess up D&C at the O2, and IMO Kashmir is an easier song to get lost in. Zeppelin sure did! I don't believe ALS being left out had anything to do with difficulty. I'm also shocked that TSRTS could ever be referred to as "inferior"! It was Jimmy anthemic overture at the time. An absolutely brilliant piece. Nah, I believe it was either time constraint or they simply didn't agree on it being included. Agree with all your points, Evster. In a 2 hour show where you've already got Dazed, Stairway, Kashmir & No Quarter, there really isn't room for another epic like ALS. As for TSRTS, I believe it was to be alternated with ALS on the '95 P&P tour, but the reaction to TSRTS was so much stronger that they dropped ALS after those 2 times. And TSRTS is in NO WAY an inferior peice! IMO, anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninelives Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 My feeling is time constraints. As Robert said there were so many songs to choose from that it was difficult to narrow it down to fit a two hour slot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mos6507 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 D&C (at least the long 30+ minute version) has a lot more segments but it's a much looser number. The transitions can be kind of slid into and out of without the band having to be in perfect sync all the time, since it's all just one big experimental jam where the lengths of each segment are determined at the spur of the moment. As such, the goofup in D&C at the O2 kind of went with the territory of that song. ALS's song structure (as with Kashmir, or Nobody's Fault) is all laid out ahead of time and has to be executed very strictly from start to finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evster2012 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Agree with all your points, Evster. In a 2 hour show where you've already got Dazed, Stairway, Kashmir & No Quarter, there really isn't room for another epic like ALS. As for TSRTS, I believe it was to be alternated with ALS on the '95 P&P tour, but the reaction to TSRTS was so much stronger that they dropped ALS after those 2 times. And TSRTS is in NO WAY an inferior peice! IMO, anyway... Good to see you Steve! Love the avi! Wonder how many people think it's a pic of Jimmy they've never seen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leddy Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 So nobody thinks that they thought that certain songs were to hard to do now ??? I mean the vocals on that song are tough ( I would imagine), but seeing some tribute bands trying to do the vocals on the latter half of that song, they either skip it or fail at it !! Before I get slaughtered for even contemplating that Plant might think no I ain't doing that now as my voice cannot take that anymore, think about it, Gillan dropped Child in Time years ago for the same reason !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evster2012 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 Gillan dropped Child in Time years ago for the same reason !! I think there's a difference of a full octave between Child in Time's screams and ALS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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