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PJ Slocum

The Grammar Police

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I know you didn't ask me, but I'm bored: The "bated" part of the phrase stems from the word "abate", which means to moderate or restrain.

No direspect intended but are you an English Teacher.I know my Grammar is far from perfect.I dont even have spell check working on this forum .Even at the peak of my limited Education i was never good in English.Pot was popular in 73 as was Pink Floyd's Dark Side of the Moon and Zeppelin's Houses of the Holy anyway that felt far more important at the time.Since Daddy quit paying the bills a year later it was off to work and not off to English Class but i have always done what i wanted and still paid the bill's and gave to my Kids and Grandkids with that meger education.I hope with all of the Grammer Police's superior Education when they reach 50 they can say the same.Have no fear though

there is no correction that can be done here that my Kids and Grandkids have not already tried to implement.My Education as it is came from the road which by the way can be a good and firm Teacher.I did Graduate High School and attended over 20 Technical Schools between my Navy Career and my last 13 years of Offshore Oil Production Work and still had time to learn Guitar and a few other Instument's.My Father only went to School thru Grade Six but he supported a family of Seven until he passed away in 1987.He for all his good and his Military Service would not have passed Muster on this Forum.Try a little Tolerance for those less fortunate a lot of People barley speak English in this world . I know this because i have been around it several times.It does not make them any less intelligent than You are Me .Try Writing a letter in Japanese or Arabic or French etc. I am not getting on to you are anyone directly , however this is just my two cents and if the shoe fit's. :(

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First of all that, that screed had nothing to do with me answering Mandy's question about the phrase "bated breath". Secondly, no I'm not an English teacher. Thirdly, what the hell did you just say?

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We can't all be perfect. ;):P

It's ok Bonham - we've seen your photo ... you make up for it in other ways! ;)

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It's ok Bonham - we've seen your photo ... you make up for it in other ways! ;)

:o

Excuse me, I'm not as dumb as you might think. :P

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:o

Excuse me, I'm not as dumb as you might think. :P

I know - just winding you up! :P

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I know - just winding you up! :P

And paying me a compliment, too. :lol: Unfortunately, I can't tell if you're a blonde yet. So far you have me fooled though. :P

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Not to pick on anyone, but someone just made a post a few minutes ago and doesnt know the differance between the words one and won. Used the word one when he should have used won (as in won the game). Oh well. There is my two cents on the subject. Perhaps he will see this and learn.

I saw it too and had to restrain myself! :ph34r:

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First of all that, that screed had nothing to do with me answering Mandy's question about the phrase "bated breath". Secondly, no I'm not an English teacher. Thirdly, what the hell did you just say?

It was just to get all of you fired up and to make a point.We are all just people none better than the other.Its not meant for you directly.I should have posted it to the thread instead of directly to you.But my Education has once again failed me anyway. There is to my knowledge only one on the board with a IQ above 200 and it is not me are you.LOL

AL :D:D:D:D

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Good grammar is a mark of an educated person.

I wouldn't say so, not necessarily.

Not all the time, anyway.

My flatmate's grammar leaves a lot to be desired. She's often getting me to look over her finished assignments and check the spelling and grammar, but she did quite well in school, was taught at the same sort of schools as me, has got just as far on the degree we're doing as me. There's nothing to say she's any less educated than me, but I just have more of a natural flair for grammar and writing in general.

In fact a few of my friends are like that.

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I agree with chicken

Having worked in Universities and Research Institutions for years, some of the brightest people I know are not good with writing and by their own admision they write like 12 year olds. These people think in equations and greek letters (a bit that way myself) and think so far out of the box its frightening.

When marking student work its nice to see good grammer and presentation and marks are awarded as such, but I would always look at scientific/mathematical content first.

I am not sure in the days of spell checkers etc how much onus is placed on grammer in secondary education these days, but good grammer being the mark of an educated person, sorry dont agree.

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I noticed awhile back that a LOT of people say "less" when they should say "fewer" - including myself! I kept saying things like "less books," and I knew it sounded weird, but I couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong. Finally I remembered the word "fewer" - now I sound a lot more normal when I'm talking about quantities of things! As a matter of fact, I make fewer mistakes!

Anyway, I can't believe how often I hear people mess that up -- I've heard reporters on the national news do it, for pete's sake! I don't mind grammar mistakes that much in casual conversation (I can even overlook "ain't"), but come on now, let's make a bit of an effort for a more formal setting like the news!

Edited by Footsteps of Dawn

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I ain't got no...

People say that here all the time and I can't stand it.

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As an Englishman on all family sides going back to at least 1850 I just want to say.

It does not matter that much how English is pronounced or spelled it is a living language and a worldwide one.

My local dialect uses Anglo-Saxon words such as bae, bin etc and it varies from town to town and background.

There is no such thing as standard English IMO. An Aussie might say 'g'day', a Yank 'hi there' and a Brit 'hello there' but all mean the same thing.

Besides which, where does ' whole lotta love' appear in the standard English dictionary? It does not, but it sounds better than 'a whole lot of love' surely?

What counts is what the words mean more than how they are pronounced, IMO.

Rant over

Nige

:D

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Here in New Orleans they have a grammar unlike anywhere in the world.

oil-erl,boil-berl,foil-ferl Mayonaise-Mynazz, Where y'at- How are you what have you been up to, Yeah you right- multi use word for approval/agreement,

By ya momanem's-Over at your mother's house.

I could go on about the lingo it's addictive. :lol:

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As an Englishman on all family sides going back to at least 1850 I just want to say.

It does not matter that much how English is pronounced or spelled it is a living language and a worldwide one.

My local dialect uses Anglo-Saxon words such as bae, bin etc and it varies from town to town and background.

There is no such thing as standard English IMO. An Aussie might say 'g'day', a Yank 'hi there' and a Brit 'hello there' but all mean the same thing.

Besides which, where does ' whole lotta love' appear in the standard English dictionary? It does not, but it sounds better than 'a whole lot of love' surely?

What counts is what the words mean more than how they are pronounced, IMO.

Rant over

Nige

:D

I'll agree with that - English is definitely a living language, so changes and variations should be expected. However, you also said that English is a worldwide language. Given that, I think it's important to have some sort of standard rules so people from, say, Louisiana can understand someone from the Black Country in England if they happened to meet. I don't think that should mean that those whose dialect more closely resembles the standard rules should feel some sort of superiority over those whose dialect differs more, but I think it's important to maintain a common set of rules that everybody around the world can use when they need to.

Take Arabic, for example. They teach a form of Literary Arabic called Modern Standard Arabic in schools, and use it in newspapers and other official publications, but nobody speaks it in everyday situations. Every region has its own spoken dialect, but they keep Modern Standard Arabic around so everyone across the Middle East can understand each other. I think that's why having a standard English grammar is so important - because it is a global language, and it will have variations, so we need some way of communicating despite that.

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Take Arabic, for example. They teach a form of Literary Arabic called Modern Standard Arabic in schools, and use it in newspapers and other official publications, but nobody speaks it in everyday situations. Every region has its own spoken dialect, but they keep Modern Standard Arabic around so everyone across the Middle East can understand each other. I think that's why having a standard English grammar is so important - because it is a global language, and it will have variations, so we need some way of communicating despite that.

Arabic is a good example of a language which has a long and diverse history, but as you say still retains a form all who speak it understand.

But it will never be the World's language due to British and then U.S. culture and science being so dominant. Even the French use English terms now e.g. 'le weekend' and they are not known for their love of the English or Americans.

As for English I agree forms of standard English does exist, but not one style, due to English spreading across the world.

I sometimes have problems understanding my friends from the West Indies when they use patois and Americans from the deep south on t.v. But I also know if I was to say to someone not familiar with Black Country 'woz yow doin? Tae right, yow bae gonna ger it right yowl bost it' they would not understand.

Standard English for this is 'What are you doing? That is not right, you will not get it right you will break it'.

So on the Net and when talking to people who do not use my dialect, I use standard English as written in the newspapers.

Long live the differences (and long live Rock). They make it far more fun to use all types of English.

Rant over again

Nige

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dude, if my English teacher heard somebody say "ain't," he'd smite you. hahahaha

He is really funny too. he acts stupid and plays stupid to get students to pay attention. He is a grammar Nazi if you will, but a cool grammar Nazi.

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dude, if my English teacher heard somebody say "ain't," he'd smite you. hahahaha

He is really funny too. he acts stupid and plays stupid to get students to pay attention. He is a grammar Nazi if you will, but a cool grammar Nazi.

And if hes a Republican (sorry I hate Bush) I would just laugh at him before decking him and packing him off to France. A really good teacher does not need to act stupid he or she just gains respect naturally by being a good teacher.

As for being a 'cool grammar nazi' to be honest I would rather you had used another term as I studied the nazis for 3 years on my degree as well as having family murdered by the SS in a massacre in France in 1940. The only 'cool' nazi is a dead one. :angry:

Cheers though mate

Nige

:D

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I wouldn't say so, not necessarily.

Not all the time, anyway.

My flatmate's grammar leaves a lot to be desired. She's often getting me to look over her finished assignments and check the spelling and grammar, but she did quite well in school, was taught at the same sort of schools as me, has got just as far on the degree we're doing as me. There's nothing to say she's any less educated than me, but I just have more of a natural flair for grammar and writing in general.

In fact a few of my friends are like that.

I agree with chicken

Having worked in Universities and Research Institutions for years, some of the brightest people I know are not good with writing and by their own admision they write like 12 year olds. These people think in equations and greek letters (a bit that way myself) and think so far out of the box its frightening.

When marking student work its nice to see good grammer and presentation and marks are awarded as such, but I would always look at scientific/mathematical content first.

I am not sure in the days of spell checkers etc how much onus is placed on grammer in secondary education these days, but good grammer being the mark of an educated person, sorry dont agree.

What I'm saying is that if a person writes a letter, paper...anything, and they have a major grammatical error, their credibility as an educated person is sometimes questioned. I'm not saying that I NEVER break any of the rules--hell--I'm the last person to start harping on people for run-on sentences, comma splices, etc. What I'm saying is that if you don't know how to do simple things like tell the difference between when to use an apostrophe and when NOT to use one, you may have a few people blow you off here and there when you're communicating in written form.

And Chicken, I'm not saying that because someone makes these mistakes they're not educated. I'm saying that if they are unaware that they have an issue with making such mistakes or they don't care, that's when the problem comes into play. It sounds like L. knows that she needs someone to look over her work, and who doesn't? I surely wish I was smart enough to have someone look over a lot of my work before I turn it in...

Now all of this aside, this IS an internet forum, and while I try to be as grammatically correct as possible, I also I feel that it is extremely important to express yourself clearly, for there are a few grammar things that aren't going to be too important.

As an English teacher, I have to agree that marking papers down if their content is great but they have one or two little grammar mistakes is not exactly a good idea. I have made a rule with myself that if I am going to mark my students down for grammatical errors, it will only be on things I KNOW I have specifically taught them. I turn in papers all the time and when I get them back, I notice a mistake; and I'm embarrassed that I didn't catch it. I also grade for content first. I only mark the papers down when there are so many errors that the papers become incomprehensible.

But come on, use you're apostrophes correctly! Use the correct word if you can help it! (I got caught using the wrong work recently, so I'm not innocent of these crimes.)

Oh an another thing--when you've finished a sentence, please hit the space bar twice before you start the next sentence! It makes it sooo hard to read if there is no break!

:D

Edited by manderlyh

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I wouldn't say so, not necessarily.

Not all the time, anyway.

My flatmate's grammar leaves a lot to be desired. She's often getting me to look over her finished assignments and check the spelling and grammar, but she did quite well in school, was taught at the same sort of schools as me, has got just as far on the degree we're doing as me. There's nothing to say she's any less educated than me, but I just have more of a natural flair for grammar and writing in general.

In fact a few of my friends are like that.

We all have a natural flair in some way.

My father had a flair for working with engines.

My mom for dealing with me and my sister feuding all the time.

Myself I hold a History/Politics Honours Degree.

Jimmy Page has a talent (understatement or what?) for playing the guitar.

My point is while some maybe good with grammar and spelling others are good with carpentry or teaching, each to their own. The main thing is never to think you are better than others because you have an academic qualification. After all who would you want to help you if you broke down in your car a Mechanic or a Professor of Ancient Greek?

Rant over

Nige

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your

you`re

Yep, that makes me grind my teeth when I see it incorrectly used. I have seen a lot of this in evidence recently on this forum, and worryingly, the main protagonists seem to be native English speakers from the UK!

Edited because I originally used the word "culprits" and thought I might get shot down in flames for implying that bad grammar was some sort of serious crime ... :blink:

Edited by Lilith

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"Compared to". It's supposed to be "Compared with".

I have never, ever heard that one before.

I have honestly never heard anyone say "compared with."

Where do you live? Perhaps it is a dialect difference?

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