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Mattmc1973

The Spats Thread

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The only reason it'd come out looking stupid is because you messed up the tags. Can you find the post it screwed up on? Maybe I can show you what you did wrong (concerning the post and the qhole quote thing, everyone else... :D) and show you how to set those codes right. Especially if a it's a long post you're responding to, catching a mistake can be next to impossible, and then figuring out why it looks bad can be evern harder. Retrieve that post for me and I'll see if I can't show you how to fix it.

Now, I await your response on my long post to you, involving what a gentlemen is and such. I hope you don't ignore it.

It was a post from an old thread. It came out looking bad and i haven't tried to do it again since. I typed out all these long replies to a long post from someone and after all that i screwed up and i just said screw it.

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It's our lucky day. I'm happy I have to go to work soon.

And spats dear......I've answered that question probably 5 times in the various threads you've overtaken in your tenure here and on the old board. The answer is "it depends". If the guy has his arms full of shit, yes....open the door. If he has a broken arm, and can't pull out the chair or something, yes.....pull out the chair.

Why under only those circumstances?

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It was a post from an old thread. It came out looking bad and i haven't tried to do it again since. I typed out all these long replies to a long post from someone and after all that i screwed up and i just said screw it.

Try again. Use my long post to you to try again. If you mess up I'll figure out what you did wrong and show you how to fix it. Since I'm not a mod I can't do it for you, but if you try and give me a chance, I can show you how to do it right. It's actually very, very easy once you get the hang of it, and makes your posts look a lot neater when done right. It does require a little extra work and writing on your part (no snarky responses from others, please :D), but not enough that it will be a problem.

But in doing so, please reply to my post.

Edited by Nathan

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Spats, with every word you type you look more and more like a selfish prick. It's all about YOU, isn't it? What YOU want and what YOU will do or more likely, what YOU won't do. You won't go out of your way for anything. No effort at all on your part. All you want is a "hottie" to bang YOUR way, without having any consideration for her in return. If you do something for her-even the smallest thing-you expect something in return. That's sad beyond words.

You can quit playing the "pitiful lost kid" now. If you're actually serious here, you're WAY beyond that.

May I suggest a blow-up doll? "She" won't care if you "go downtown", call her or do something nice just because you can.

Fuck me runnin'... :rolleyes:

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Spats, with every word you type you look more and more like a selfish prick. It's all about YOU, isn't it? What YOU want and what YOU will do or more likely, what YOU won't do. You won't go out of your way for anything. No effort at all on your part. All you want is a "hottie" to bang YOUR way, without having any consideration for her in return. If you do something for her-even the smallest thing-you expect something in return. That's sad beyond words.

You can quit playing the "pitiful lost kid" now. If you're actually serious here, you're WAY beyond that.

May I suggest a blow-up doll? "She" won't care if you "go downtown", call her or do something nice just because you can.

Fuck me runnin'... :rolleyes:

If a woman treats me good i will treat her good. I won't do just ANYTHING (everyone has their limits) but i will treat them good if they treat me good. But i just want to protect myself. I have been taken advantage of in the past. Where i was the good guy and got nothing in return. I just don't want to that to happen. I don't want to be doing everything and they are doing nothing. I want to be treated good too.

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When I was young

I never needed anyone

And makin love was just for fun

Those days are gone

Livin alone

I think of all the friends Ive known

But when I dial the telephone

Nobodys home

All by myself

Dont wanna be

All by myself anymore

All by myself

Dont wanna live

All by myself anymore

Hard to be sure

Some times I feel so insecure

And love so distant and obscure

Remains the cure

All by myself

Dont wanna be

All by myself anymore

All by myself

Dont wanna live

All by myself anymore

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You are so wrong it makes me cry. You are so incorrect it's painful. And you are so stubborn it's almost deadly.

Why should you do those things for a woman? How's about... BECAUSE YOU CARE!

Why aren't girls falling for you? Why are your ways working "less and less?" Because NO girl wants a guy who isn't a gentleman.

What is a gentleman, spats? The gentleman is the man who holds open a door and let's the lady in first. The gentleman is the man who opens her car door for her and takes her hand as she gets out of the car. The gentleman is the man who pulls her chair out for her so she can sit down. If one of you made dinner, the gentleman is the man who let's the woman sit first and have her food and drink first, unless she insists on serving you (my last girlfriend did that sometimes... both of us cook, and many of our dates were at eachother's house... whenever she cooked for me, she insisted on serving me, letting me sit first, etc... In return, I did exactly the same, and a lot of times more, when I cooked for her... this was, of course, when our parents were out of town, which, at the time, was often... enough). The gentleman is the man who gives her gifts, such as flowers and jewelery and such (belive me, the easiest hint to decipher from a woman is what kinds of gifts she likes to get... she'll tell you by pointing out the items at stores and saying things like "I love that" or "I've always wanted one of those" or "I've always wanted to try that" which almost always means "will you get it for me?"). Basically, the gentleman is the man who does every single thing you seem to be against.

I don't know why you are so focused on the short-term. You seem quite selfish, and no, it's not reasonable to think what you think, so don't even try and ask that question. What do you get by acting the above? Well, the obvious one is sex, but you also get happiness.

Now does all this mean you have to do this on EVERY date? Well, be courteous, kind, and chivalrous on every date, yes. But cater to her every date? Make every date about her? HELL NO! The best part about making the first date about her is the guarantee that one of the dates coming up is gonna be all about you. It may not be the second, or the third, or the fourth date... but if you just have some patience, you'll start finding that she's asking you out on dates, and more of them slowly become about you. Yes, there's a give-and-take. You want her to be a lady towards you, then you need to act the gentleman. For every one date that's about you, there needs to be two dates about her. And the first date is always, always, always about her. Period. End of subject.

And while doing all that, the only reason you wouldn't be having fun on the first date is because you aren't attracted to her. If you're attracted to her... if you like her... then while the first date is all about her, you'll still have fun. You'll enjoy talking to her, getting to know her, laughing with her... you WILL have fun if there's a real attraction there. But if the first date isn't about her, then there simply won't be any more dates.

Why does the first date have to be about her? Because, in reality, it's all about you... about testing you. On that first date, she's is trying to figure out who YOU are. Are you a kind person? Are you a mean person? Would you protect her if someone tried to hurt her? Would YOU hurt her? Would you buy her gifts? Would you ignore her? Are you romantic? Are you just looking for "a hot piece of ass?" On the entire date, the girl, in her head, is answering all these questions and more about you. You're goal is to give the RIGHT answers:

Are you a kind person?

Yes

Are you a mean person?

No

Would you protect her if someone tried to hurt her?

Yes

Would YOU hurt her?

No

Would you buy her gifts?

Yes

Would you ignore her?

No

Are you romantic?

Yes

Are you just looking for "a hot piece of ass?"

No

These are the answers you want her to have. So you HAVE to make the date all about her in order to form a good first impression. Is it wrong for girls to ask these questions? To test you like that? No! If no girls did this, the rate of girls getting beat by men they liked would be high. Girls protect themselves this way. You have to make sure the girl knows you aren't abusive or just looking to get your hand down her pants. That's what she's trying to avoid by testing you.

But what about you? Shouldn't you have to form a good first impression about her? Well... you've asked her out... doesn't that mean she's already made a good first impression on you?

I don't care how much you want to deny it, Spats, but us men are simple creatures. We don't need to answer all these questions. We can try to, like you are, but it only serves to make us confused, just like you are, wondering why we can't seem to get a date. When we first see her, we see that she's attractive. Most guys will talk her up before asking her out, so we'll get to know a bit about her then (even I'll talk up a prospect, and you have no idea just how introverted I am... ever heard of the uncomfortable silence?... I'm the reigning champion at it :'( ). We'll get to know who she is. THEN we decide if we're gonna ask her out. When we do, it's our turn to make a good impression. So the first date is all about her.

Not those exact same things, no, but they should be just as ladylike and chivalrous. However, they aren't going to be if we men aren't, and we should not expect them to. "Treat others as you wish to be treated." If you really want her to treat you like that, then you need to treat HER like that. It's a two-way street. Give-and-take. Only when you give are you allowed to take.

Okay, here's a question I'm sure has been asked and answered. I ask with all due respect, and whatever your answer I'm not trying to make an example out of it. I would simply like to determine something. I hope you will answer, though. I will say this... anyone else who wishes to make a derogatory comment based on his answer, please don't. Thank you.

spats... how old are you?

I see lots of women who are constantly hooking up with guys who are not "gentlemen". Hell when i was younger i used to get passed over for guys like that. I believe in treating a woman nice but i am not being her errand boy. I will treat them like i want to be treated. And nobody is doing all of that stuff for me. I have never been out on date where the woman is doing everything for me. I doubt you will see that on many dates anywhere where the girl is doing everything. So i don't think the guy should be doing everything. It should be more evened out. Making sure she sits first? Come on.

I have had quite a few girlfriends so i know how the whole hinting for gifts routine works. And i don't respond to it. Because it's silly and just game playing. And materialistic. I will buy her a gift if i want to buy her a gift but i don't want a woman who is gonna be hinting for gifts when we are out at a mall. I am not made of money.

I think i am focused on the short term because i am not looking to get married and settle down to have a family. I just want to meet and hook up with a great, pretty, cool woman. And have fun. I am not looking for a life time commitment.

If i am already out on a date with a girl, she has been the one who asked and she already knows enough about me to know the answers to those questions pretty much. I don't go on dates with women that i haven't spent time with. Those blind date attempts are long over. I am not spending a whole dated auditioning for her. I want to make she is the girl for me to. I have questions about her as well. So i don't agree with the first date is to impress the hell out of her and cross my fingers for a second date.

I will treat them good if they treat me good. I think most people have that attitude.

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May I suggest a blow-up doll? "She" won't care if you "go downtown", call her or do something nice just because you can.

That's been suggested *before*.. a number of times, actually. Spats always replies the same way: "I've done that before and it didn't work out for me so I'm not doing that ever again. I don't wanna risk being rejected again. If you knew how rejected I felt, you'd understand."

You see, RA,.. there was this one time when spats' buddies set him up on a date.. with a doll. They made all the arrangements for him for and everything. They even inflated her for him so he wouldn't have to.. you know.. go down on her. When spats came into his living room for the date, there she was.. waiting for him on the sofa.. looking good and.. by golly, reading to go! Spats sat down next to her on the sofa, and..

lars_and_the_real_girl.jpg

..he waited. He waitied for her to start the conversation or make the first move. After an hour it gotta kinda awkward for spats. He started feeling insecure, and he started thinking she was "playing games" with him. Afterall, he figured, if she liked him and she wanted him she should have been the one to make the first move, right? Eventually he stood up and, without even looking at her, nervously said "Oh my gosh, you know what? I think I'm in the wrong place. I don't actually live here. I gotta go." And just like that, he left. And wouldn't you know, his buddies had to come get the doll and take her away before spts would go home again. He's been carrying the emotional scars of that "rejection" ever since. slapface.gif

:P

^_^

Edited by Hermit

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If a woman treats me good i will treat her good. I won't do just ANYTHING (everyone has their limits) but i will treat them good if they treat me good. But i just want to protect myself. I have been taken advantage of in the past. Where i was the good guy and got nothing in return. I just don't want to that to happen. I don't want to be doing everything and they are doing nothing. I want to be treated good too.

This is why you'll never have anyone. Like I said earlier, your issues with women become more apparent all the time. Your distrust, resentment, and apprehension are oozing out. Not sexy qualities to have, and women can smell it a mile away. Get counseling.

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That's been suggested *before*.. a number of times, actually. Spats always replies the same way: "I've done that before and it didn't work out for me so I'm not doing that ever again. I don't wanna risk being rejected again. If you knew how rejected I felt, you'd understand."

You see, RA,.. there was this one time when spats' buddies set him up on a date.. with a doll. They made all the arrangements for him for and everything. They even inflated her for him she he wouldn't have to.. you know.. go down on her. When spats came into his living room for the date, there she was.. waiting for him on the sofa.. looking good and.. by golly, reading to go! Spats sat down next to her on the sofa, and..

lars_and_the_real_girl.jpg

..he waited. He waitied for her to start the conversation or make the first move. After an hour it gotta kinda awkward for spats. He started feeling insecure, and he started thinking she was "playing games" with him. Afterall, he figured, if she liked him and she wanted him she should have been the one to make the first move, right? Eventually he stood up and, without even looking at her, nervously said "Oh my gosh, you know what? I think I'm in the wrong place. I don't actually live here. I gotta go." And just like that, he left. And wouldn't you know, his buddies had to come get the doll and take her away before spts would go home again. He's been carrying the emotional scars of that "rejection" ever since. slapface.gif

:P

^_^

Did you see that movie? That was one of the worst movies of the year.

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Did you see that movie? That was one of the worst movies of the year.

Most awesomely clueless, obtuse, and naive response ever.

:lol:

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its hilarious that your response to that post is only related to the picture....

Awww did you skim the post, like you would with a really long, boring book and just looking at the pics :P

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This is why you'll never have anyone. Like I said earlier, your issues with women become more apparent all the time. Your distrust, resentment, and apprehension are oozing out. Not sexy qualities to have, and women can smell it a mile away. Get counseling.

I have some distrust. That's true. Because of past experiences. There is apprehension. Because i don't i don't want to get burned or rejected. I don't know about the resentment part though. i don't know what you mean by that.

If i have the stench of all that the girl from News Years couldn't smell it. I don't buy that women have a good intstinct about that stuff or they wouldn't make bad choices with men.

Edited by spats

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Most awesomely clueless, obtuse, and naive response ever.

:lol:

yeah, even you couldnt have preicted that response, Matt.

And your prediction accuracy has been ferking amazing! :D

the spats is too much, isn't he?

He never, ever fails to disappoint.

:beer:

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I see lots of women who are constantly hooking up with guys who are not "gentlemen". Hell when i was younger i used to get passed over for guys like that. I believe in treating a woman nice but i am not being her errand boy. I will treat them like i want to be treated. And nobody is doing all of that stuff for me. I have never been out on date where the woman is doing everything for me. I doubt you will see that on many dates anywhere where the girl is doing everything. So i don't think the guy should be doing everything. It should be more evened out. Making sure she sits first? Come on.

No. You come on.

So you only go out with women you know, now? That changes dynamics completely. If you two already know each other then the first date is quite a bit easier. Then the first date can, in fact, be a movie. But you still have to be a gentleman.

As far as girls who go for guys who aren't like that... actually, they are. But many guys won't show that in front of other guys. In front of the girl, however... he's a perfect gentleman. Not to say that's true for all guys, but then those guys who aren't gentlemen tend to go through girls very quickly, and I mean very quickly.

I have had quite a few girlfriends so i know how the whole hinting for gifts routine works. And i don't respond to it. Because it's silly and just game playing. And materialistic. I will buy her a gift if i want to buy her a gift but i don't want a woman who is gonna be hinting for gifts when we are out at a mall. I am not made of money.

The hinting does not necessarily mean she wants it right then and there. A lot of times this hinting will get strong when an important date is coming up... your dating anniversary, her birthday, Christmas, Valentine's Day... oh, she'd be excited if you bought for her on a whim, but waiting for one of those days is fine, too. She'll be just as happy. And women do know that if you buy them a gift but it isn't a special day, chances are it's flowers. So they usually wait until one of those special dates are coming up before they start to hint at what they want.

But your idea of it being silly is quite annoying, actually. Believe it or not, I actually agree with you. I have often wished women were as simple as men. In fact, there's a brilliant joke that articulates perfectly a man's frustration in trying to understand women:

---------------------------------

A man was riding his Harley was riding along a California beach when suddenly the sky clouded above his head and, in a booming voice, the Lord said, 'Because you have tried to be faithful to me in all ways, I will grant you one wish.

The biker pulled over and said, 'Build a bridge to Hawaii so I can ride over anytime I want.' The Lord said, 'Your request is materialistic, think of the enormous challenges for that kind of undertaking; the supports required reaching the bottom of the Pacific and the concrete and steel it would take! It will nearly exhaust several natural resources. I can do it, but it is hard for me to justify your desire for worldly things. Take a little more time and think of something that could possibly help mankind.'

The biker thought about it for a long time. Finally, he said, 'Lord, I wish that I and all men could understand women; I want to know how she feels inside, what she's thinking when she gives me the silent treatment, why she cries, what she means when she says nothing's wrong, and how I can make a Woman truly happy.'

The Lord replied, 'You want two lanes or four on that bridge?

---------------------------------

So you see, you aren't the only one who feels that way.

However. The fact is, it's a test. All women do it, unless they are either too young to understand it or old enough to have learned. And instead of ignoring it and/or rebelling against it, you need to learn to just accept it.

I think i am focused on the short term because i am not looking to get married and settle down to have a family. I just want to meet and hook up with a great, pretty, cool woman. And have fun. I am not looking for a life time commitment.

And I ask again... how old are you?

If i am already out on a date with a girl, she has been the one who asked and she already knows enough about me to know the answers to those questions pretty much. I don't go on dates with women that i haven't spent time with. Those blind date attempts are long over. I am not spending a whole dated auditioning for her. I want to make she is the girl for me to. I have questions about her as well. So i don't agree with the first date is to impress the hell out of her and cross my fingers for a second date.

1. Since you already know them, then you're right, there's no need to "audition" for them, as they already know you. But you STILL need to be a gentleman.

2. As usual, you are wrong.

I will treat them good if they treat me good. I think most people have that attitude.

But they will only treat you good if you treat them good. You have to go first. Period.

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---------------------------------

A man was riding his Harley was riding along a California beach when suddenly the sky clouded above his head and, in a booming voice, the Lord said, 'Because you have tried to be faithful to me in all ways, I will grant you one wish.

The biker pulled over and said, 'Build a bridge to Hawaii so I can ride over anytime I want.' The Lord said, 'Your request is materialistic, think of the enormous challenges for that kind of undertaking; the supports required reaching the bottom of the Pacific and the concrete and steel it would take! It will nearly exhaust several natural resources. I can do it, but it is hard for me to justify your desire for worldly things. Take a little more time and think of something that could possibly help mankind.'

The biker thought about it for a long time. Finally, he said, 'Lord, I wish that I and all men could understand women; I want to know how she feels inside, what she's thinking when she gives me the silent treatment, why she cries, what she means when she says nothing's wrong, and how I can make a Woman truly happy.'

The Lord replied, 'You want two lanes or four on that bridge?

---------------------------------

:lol:

cheers Nathan! :beer:

fwiw, I appreciate your patience, compassion

and tenacity in your dealings with the spats.

:hippy:

[do him a huge favor though, eh? Along with your excellent advise

and insights, also reinforce the notion that he needs counseling. ;) ]

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No. You come on.

So you only go out with women you know, now? That changes dynamics completely. If you two already know each other then the first date is quite a bit easier. Then the first date can, in fact, be a movie. But you still have to be a gentleman.

As far as girls who go for guys who aren't like that... actually, they are. But many guys won't show that in front of other guys. In front of the girl, however... he's a perfect gentleman. Not to say that's true for all guys, but then those guys who aren't gentlemen tend to go through girls very quickly, and I mean very quickly.

The hinting does not necessarily mean she wants it right then and there. A lot of times this hinting will get strong when an important date is coming up... your dating anniversary, her birthday, Christmas, Valentine's Day... oh, she'd be excited if you bought for her on a whim, but waiting for one of those days is fine, too. She'll be just as happy. And women do know that if you buy them a gift but it isn't a special day, chances are it's flowers. So they usually wait until one of those special dates are coming up before they start to hint at what they want.

But your idea of it being silly is quite annoying, actually. Believe it or not, I actually agree with you. I have often wished women were as simple as men. In fact, there's a brilliant joke that articulates perfectly a man's frustration in trying to understand women:

---------------------------------

A man was riding his Harley was riding along a California beach when suddenly the sky clouded above his head and, in a booming voice, the Lord said, 'Because you have tried to be faithful to me in all ways, I will grant you one wish.

The biker pulled over and said, 'Build a bridge to Hawaii so I can ride over anytime I want.' The Lord said, 'Your request is materialistic, think of the enormous challenges for that kind of undertaking; the supports required reaching the bottom of the Pacific and the concrete and steel it would take! It will nearly exhaust several natural resources. I can do it, but it is hard for me to justify your desire for worldly things. Take a little more time and think of something that could possibly help mankind.'

The biker thought about it for a long time. Finally, he said, 'Lord, I wish that I and all men could understand women; I want to know how she feels inside, what she's thinking when she gives me the silent treatment, why she cries, what she means when she says nothing's wrong, and how I can make a Woman truly happy.'

The Lord replied, 'You want two lanes or four on that bridge?

---------------------------------

So you see, you aren't the only one who feels that way.

However. The fact is, it's a test. All women do it, unless they are either too young to understand it or old enough to have learned. And instead of ignoring it and/or rebelling against it, you need to learn to just accept it.

And I ask again... how old are you?

1. Since you already know them, then you're right, there's no need to "audition" for them, as they already know you. But you STILL need to be a gentleman.

2. As usual, you are wrong.

But they will only treat you good if you treat them good. You have to go first. Period.

Not girls that i have known for a long time but girls i have met and hung out with somewhat. Hooking up with girls at clubs where it's hard to get to know them hasn't worked in a while. In those cases they would want those questions answered. But i would want questions answered to. Men are not as simple as you think. You are not giving your own gender enough credit. Guys are not cavemen.

Dude, i am out on the dating scene and i see these guys with women all the time. Women go for guys who are not gentlemen all the time. It's not all girls but there are plenty that don't. There are women that love guys who are hard to get and don't bow down to them.

I don't have to go first with a cool girl that goes after what she wants. I have dated them. They are not the majority but they are out there.

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"I'm not made of money"

love you. :lol:

*Hermit....ahahaha!! :P

:D Hope you had a good day.

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spats, muh-boy

you're not gonna ignor this post are ya? :( -->

You often speak of your "ex's"..

I cant help but wonder:

What was the longest relationship you've been in..

..how old were you at the time.. and why did it end?

and..

how have your beliefs, attitudes, and behaviors regarding

relationships grown, developed, and evolved since then?

I'm hoping for a thoughtful response that indicates a minimal degree of

self-reflection and self-awareness of your part. Don't let me down, spats.

munchies.gif

Edited by Hermit

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Not girls that i have known for a long time but girls i have met and hung out with somewhat. Hooking up with girls at clubs where it's hard to get to know them hasn't worked in a while. In those cases they would want those questions answered. But i would want questions answered to. Men are not as simple as you think. You are not giving your own gender enough credit. Guys are not cavemen.

Dude, i am out on the dating scene and i see these guys with women all the time. Women go for guys who are not gentlemen all the time. It's not all girls but there are plenty that don't. There are women that love guys who are hard to get and don't bow down to them.

I don't have to go first with a cool girl that goes after what she wants. I have dated them. They are not the majority but they are out there.

You have a point. Sometimes the kind of guy a woman says she wants really is different than the kind of guy she actually may decide to have sex with. But it is not healthy or constructive.

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In my experience, people who have a hard time trusting others don't really trust themselves. There's a difference between looking out for yourself and trusting yourself, and it can be hard to determine.

But if you trust yourself, you're not afraid to take risks, because you know you'll handle what comes up. If you're just trying not to get fucked over, you probably WILL get fucked over. Because if that's all you know, you'll almost inevitably end up with it. Even if it's the last thing you wanted.

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Damn straight, we got it good!

Come on spats, opening up a door or pulling a chair back aren't even necessary. You don't have to do them. 95 out of 100 times, a girl won't even notice. But I'll tell ya this much, they're certainly positives if you catch my drift (there's a draft in my house...weird).

My point is, little things are like extra credit, they don't have to be done, but theyc an help you a lot

I agree that they are not needed. I guess they are positives if you are looking for extra credit. I just think they are silly and wouldn't want a woman who expected it. If i want to do it, fine. But i am not gonna do it because it's the right thing to do or because the guy should do that.

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Sorry, I need to add a p.s.

p.s. That's why I agree with the others who suggested counseling. Otherwise the same thing will keep happening over and over.

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Not girls that i have known for a long time but girls i have met and hung out with somewhat. Hooking up with girls at clubs where it's hard to get to know them hasn't worked in a while. In those cases they would want those questions answered. But i would want questions answered to. Men are not as simple as you think. You are not giving your own gender enough credit. Guys are not cavemen.

I think Bill Engvall said it best.

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"Men are basic. Just basic. There's not a whole lot a' frills. That's why, ladies, when you ask a fella a question, a lot of time the answer you get is 'ionoh' [i don't know]. Basic."

...

"You see ladies, men have three basic needs in life. That's it. Three. Eating, sleeping, sex. That's it. That's our whole day. And I can do all three of those in my truck. By myself. In traffic."

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Here, watch the video. And DON'T respond until after you do:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gACeaAQIdDQ

I don't have to go first with a cool girl that goes after what she wants. I have dated them. They are not the majority but they are out there.

They are also maturing. Think about that.

And again... how old are you? There is a legitimate reason for my asking and I promise you will not be belittled for it. Right, everyone else?

Edited by Nathan

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