The Next President of the USA will be?

[wanna be drummer]

Where's Uncle Bill? I liked him

[Dzldoc]

Where's Uncle Bill? I liked him

I saw he was logged on last night but I didn't see any posts from him

[Pb Derigable]

After the speech in Berlin , Obama got out of the shower and was drying off when he looked in the mirror and noticed he was white from the neck up to the top of his head.

In sheer panic and fearing he was turning white and might have to give up his hopes to be president, he called his doctor and told him of his problem.

The doctor advised him to come to his office immediately. After an examination, the doctor mixed a concoction of brown liquid, gave it to Obama, and told him to drink it all.

Obama drank the concoction and replied, 'That tasted like b-u-l-l-s-h-i-t!'

The doctor replied, 'It was, you were a quart low."

That was too good of a joke

Universal health care is a socialistic ideal. Thus, it is a socialistic view he holds.. My only point

Well what about the mass unionzation of all work force Obama wants. There is a policy called "Check Card". In it, a majority of the work force would sign a petition, no secret voting, and once a majority is reached, the employer must recognized the union. That means people who didn't sign, (normally hidden by secret ballot), could be forced out and other union member be brought in. Now this program could mean a government official could walk in any factory, hand out a petition, and those oppose could go somewhere else.

Most of the regulations the union follows are government imposed. So by mass unionaztion, the government could have a better control by what is made and how much it can be sold for. Thats socialism.

Of course there was the deal with Freddie and Fannie. The liberals imposed laws that made Fannie and Freddie (and other banks) to give out sub prime loans' to people who don't deserve them' based on fairness. So when I bought my house, since i had a down payment, steady job, assets, and a payment i could afford easily, they crawled up my ass and gave me a high rate. But any minority with no job, no assets, no down payment, would've gotten a loan with no problem because those banks had to give it o them, or faced stiff penalties from the federal government.

I agree we need universal health care for children. But, 175 union men died to get Health insurance, and I won't allow some asshole give 12 million illegals, and countless crackheads, free health care. I won"t allow it.

[wanna be drummer]

I agree we need universal health care for children. But, 175 union men died to get Health insurance, and I won't allow some asshole give 12 million illegals, and countless crackheads, free health care. I won"t allow it.

Agreed, but it's not up to us

[Mary Hartman]

Socialism implies not only does the gov have better control of business's.

But also OWNS THEM.

Get it right kids.

[wanna be drummer]

Socialism implies not only does the gov have better control of business's.

But also OWNS THEM.

Get it right kids.

The government would control the means with which you are able to access health care.

Socialistic. That's all I'm saying. What don't you get?

[Mary Hartman]

The government would control the means with which you are able to access health care.

Socialistic. That's all I'm saying. What don't you get?

Socialism is a pretty broad term they way you choose to wag your tongue around it. However the definition is the same today as it was before this election. The way health care is structured in America TODAY, we are losing money at it. While it is quite successful in other countries.

So what is your solution at this point in time? I mean since we just keep going in debt over the way it's stuctured now?

[Electrophile]

The government would control the means with which you are able to access health care.

First of all, socialism as defined is not the government controlling the means of production, it's the COMMUNITY. The government is not the community.

1. a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.

Also, health care is not capital, it's not land. It's health care. It's in the same area as education and defense. The government controls the production and the distribution of our defense, right? Would you say our Defense Department is socialistic? I don't think you would.

[wanna be drummer]

Socialism is a pretty broad term they way you choose to wag your tongue around it. However the definition is the same today as it was before this election. The way health care is structured in America TODAY, we are losing money at it. While it is quite successful in other countries.

So what is your solution at this point in time? I mean since we just keep going in debt over the way it's stuctured now?

I've been advocating universal health care for children, but then you're on your own. You choose your health insurance, your policy, etc. Lessen taxes overall to allow people to afford it, but which will cause more people to insure themselves and thus, lower prices. Lower any and all tariffs on foreign drugs and medicine, to increase competition and thus lower prices, especially for senior citizens. Oh, and we need to seriously reduce all the bullshit malpractice suits that are destroying the doctoral field

And you?

[Electrophile]

I've been advocating universal health care for children, but then you're on your own.

I agree on the first part, but I think adults who are struggling to make ends meet and can't afford health care should be given help. If you're not on welfare, if you're working steady every day but still unable to afford it because your job doesn't provide it, those people should just be stuck with their cheese hanging in the wind?

Lessen taxes overall to allow people to afford it, but which will cause more people to insure themselves and thus, lower prices.

I agree taxes on health care should be lowered, but what if that's still not enough?

Lower any and all tariffs on foreign drugs and medicine, to increase competition and thus lower prices, especially for senior citizens.

Absolutely. Health care for the elderly should be a necessity, not a luxury.

Oh, and we need to seriously reduce all the bullshit malpractice suits that are destroying the doctoral field

Completely agree.

[Mary Hartman]

I've been advocating universal health care for children, but then you're on your own. You choose your health insurance, your policy, etc. Lessen taxes overall to allow people to afford it, but which will cause more people to insure themselves and thus, lower prices. Lower any and all tariffs on foreign drugs and medicine, to increase competition and thus lower prices, especially for senior citizens. Oh, and we need to seriously reduce all the bullshit malpractice suits that are destroying the doctoral field

And you?

Then you couldn't name it "Universal Health Care." It would be insurance for children. Canada's and the United Kingdoms "Universal Health Care" isn't structured this way. As far as competition goes, competition is all well and fine unless capitalism takes it over to where nobody can afford it, much as it is today. Buy a business and try to pay health care for your employees bud and you will see what I mean.

Has lessening taxes in the past, brought our health care system to a better place.

NO!

Will it this time?

No!

He has proposed it. It's been proposed in the past and more than likely wouldn't pass anyhow. Malpractice suits is an issue that drives prices up....but who is responsible for these treatments.

[wanna be drummer]

First of all, socialism as defined is not the government controlling the means of production, it's the COMMUNITY. The government is not the community.

What are you reading?? Karl Marx was against the community controlling the means of production. The state, he argued, needed to own it so it could redistribute wealth. The community (if by that you mean the people) owning the means of production leads to capitalism and the struggle between classes..

1. a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.

If we're going to play the dictionary.com game...Here's my answer:

1. Any of various theories or systems of social organization in which the means of producing and distributing goods is owned collectively or by a centralized government that often plans and controls the economy.

The "community" reference does not mean "not government"

Also, health care is not capital, it's not land. It's health care. It's in the same area as education and defense. The government controls the production and the distribution of our defense, right? Would you say our Defense Department is socialistic? I don't think you would.

The government doesn't own the means of production. The private companies that make weapons and sell them to the government do. As far as soldiers, there is not production of soldiers; there's a system yes, but no production of organic beings. It's not socialistic in that sense. It's important to point out, however, that the military isn't economic and is one of the fundamental reasons to have a government. In theory, the people have control of the military (although in practice, not so much). Thus, I would not consider it socialistic.

Health care is nothing like that. The government would be directly involved in the lives of the people. It would determine what medical treatment you get, what you're allowed to get, what you cannot. That is socialistic in and of itself. The government is directly in control of the system that one receives medical treatment.

[wanna be drummer]

Then you couldn't name it "Universal Health Care." It would be insurance for children.

You know what I meant

Canada's and the United Kingdoms "Universal Health Care" isn't structured this way.

Who cares? How is this relevant?

As far as competition goes, competition is all well and fine unless capitalism takes it over to where nobody can afford it, much as it is today.

Obviously you don't care for economics much. Capitalism has not trashed the health system, the government has. It doesn't work well in health care, we all know that. Capitalism tends to lower prices. See Wal-Mart

Buy a business and try to pay health care for your employees bud and you will see what I mean.

Has lessening taxes in the past, brought our health care system to a better place.

NO!

because the government finds ways to fuck it up

Will it this time?

No!

What I just advocated has never been done.

He has proposed it. It's been proposed in the past and more than likely wouldn't pass anyhow. Malpractice suits is an issue that drives prices up....but who is responsible for these treatments.

No one has put into practice everything I just said.

And where's your solution? I didn't one

[Mary Hartman]

What are you reading?? Karl Marx was against the community controlling the means of production. The state, he argued, needed to own it so it could redistribute wealth. The community (if by that you mean the people) owning the means of production leads to capitalism and the struggle between classes..

If we're going to play the dictionary.com game...Here's my answer:

1. Any of various theories or systems of social organization in which the means of producing and distributing goods is owned collectively or by a centralized government that often plans and controls the economy.

The "community" reference does not mean "not government"

The government doesn't own the means of production. The private companies that make weapons and sell them to the government do. As far as soldiers, there is not production of soldiers; there's a system yes, but no production of organic beings. It's not socialistic in that sense. It's important to point out, however, that the military isn't economic and is one of the fundamental reasons to have a government. In theory, the people have control of the military (although in practice, not so much). Thus, I would not consider it socialistic.

Health care is nothing like that. The government would be directly involved in the lives of the people. It would determine what medical treatment you get, what you're allowed to get, what you cannot. That is socialistic in and of itself. The government is directly in control of the system that one receives medical treatment.

You would still have every right to choose your own Physician last I heard. So how are they controlling who you go see? Put you in a wagon, grease your wheels and roll you to the doctor or the hospital.

No way. The way Physicians and Hospitals operate is a bit of a different subject. Universal health care doesn't make Obama a Marxist or a Socialist. It would still be democratic.

[~tangerine~]

I live in a small farming town in Ohio and there are racist posters against Obama everywhere. It's terrible.

It's also terrible that the bigotry will be passed down to the children...

[wanna be drummer]

You would still have every right to choose your own Physician last I heard. So how are the controlling who you go see? Put you in a wagon, grease your wheels and roll you to the doctor or the hospital.

No way. The way Physicians and Hospitals operate is a bit of a different subject. Universal Health care doesn't make Obama a Marxist or a Socialist. It would still be democratic.

I never said you couldn't choose your own physician, quit putting words in my mouth. I said the government would be in control of how you go about your health care and what treatments you receive.

Still waiting on that solution you have planned

[~tangerine~]

I hope after we get Bin Laden, they string your ass up next.

That is GOOD!

[Mary Hartman]

I never said you couldn't choose your own physician, quit putting words in my mouth. I said the government would be in control of how you go about your health care and what treatments you receive.

Still waiting on that solution you have planned

I know exactly what you said. Can't squirm out of it eh? Quote your entire post instead of selective picking.

Universal Health Care would mean Universal or it would have to be called something else.

Universal (adjective) of, pertaining to, or characteristic of all or the whole: universal experience.

...

[wanna be drummer]

I know exactly what you said. Can't squirm out of it eh? Quote your entire post instead of selective picking.

Squirm out of it? Can you read?

I said this:

It would determine what medical treatment you get, what you're allowed to get, what you cannot.'

I never said you wouldn't be able to visit the doctor of your choice. Get your facts right

Universal Health Care would mean Universal or it would have to be called something else.

Universal (adjective) of, pertaining to, or characteristic of all or the whole: universal experience.

Oh my God, I screwed up an adjective, my apologies

Because everyone didn't know what I meant right?

Are you gonna post your ideas on how to fix health care or should I just consider your posts null and void like FIRST LED ZEP from now on?

[~tangerine~]

Of course there was the deal with Freddie and Fannie. The liberals imposed laws that made Fannie and Freddie (and other banks) to give out sub prime loans' to people who don't deserve them' based on fairness. So when I bought my house, since i had a down payment, steady job, assets, and a payment i could afford easily, they crawled up my ass and gave me a high rate. But any minority with no job, no assets, no down payment, would've gotten a loan with no problem because those banks had to give it o them, or faced stiff penalties from the federal government.

I believe Reagan (although wannabe says it started way before him) started the deregulation policies that we have finally been hit by. Besides the point i want to make... when i got my first mortgage (on my own, with a small down payment and good credit and a good job in place) i paid the competitive interest rate (back in 97). When i purchased my second home in 2004, by myself, very little down, still good credit and the same good job, i also paid the competitive rate (6.125) which was actually lower than some with worse credit ratings. I'm not sure how you got a "high" rate.

[Mary Hartman]

Squirm out of it? Can you read?

I said this:

I never said you wouldn't be able to visit the doctor of your choice. Get your facts right

Oh my God, I screwed up an adjective, my apologies

Because everyone didn't know what I meant right?

Are you gonna post your ideas on how to fix health care or should I just consider your posts null and void like FIRST LED ZEP from now on?

I don't care what you do. As long as you voted I don't care. You will have to ask everyone else what they think of your posts.

IMO you take broad strokes with a tiny brush.

Your forgiven. Keep you after class, where's my wet noodle?

I do know Canada's health care system operates though and The United Kingdoms. As far as getting these twits in Washington to change anything. Well get the tractors and dynamite. I hate when they (gov) bring things up and haven't any clue on how to implement it or ever intend on implementation.

[wanna be drummer]

At least I paint period. Where's that plan of yours?

Ya know what, it's obvious you don't have one. But don't worry, this country needs more absent-minded voters like yourself who don't actual know anything about the people they're voting for. A simple "Golly gee, I guess I don't know what to do!" would've sufficed but you've made more of a fool out yourself than i ever could.

Cheers to you, another wasted life mary. Youre living proof of the decay of America

[Mary Hartman]

At least I paint period. Where's that plan of yours?

Never claimed I had one. However I would adopt one similar to Canada's. The one we have now is truly fucked. And it does bother me to think of hard working Americans not being able to get health care. Especially kids.

One slip and surgery? There goes your house, business and all your savings. I have a friend this happened to.

As far as those who are here from other countries sucking the American teat without proper papers? Ship their ass back. They are citizens of their country, it's their responsibility to care of them until the are a citizen.

[wanna be drummer]

So you criticize me and then say you don't have a plan? Intelligent.

Do you even know Canada's system, because I'm quite positive you don't.

[Mary Hartman]

At least I paint period. Where's that plan of yours?

Ya know what, it's obvious you don't have one. But don't worry, this country needs more absent-minded voters like yourself who don't actual know anything about the people they're voting for. A simple "Golly gee, I guess I don't know what to do!" would've sufficed but you've made more of a fool out yourself than i ever could.

Cheers to you, another wasted life mary. Youre living proof of the decay of America

Seeya. And who did you vote for?