The Next President of the USA will be?

[~tangerine~]

Very good explanation of your point of view. I agree with you!

I DO have a huge problem with women who use abortion as a method of birth control.

Very overdue, EDUCATION to prevent unwanted pregnancy would go a long way towards decreasing the number of "accidents" that occur leading to the decision to abort. The government should have spent a few bucks on this many years ago.

[JimmyPage1977]

Very overdue, EDUCATION to prevent unwanted pregnancy would go a long way towards decreasing the number of "accidents" that occur leading to the decision to abort. The government should have spent a few bucks on this many years ago.

Agreed. I would hope that adoption would be the primary outcome in "accidental" pregnancies.

[Dzldoc]

Very overdue, EDUCATION to prevent unwanted pregnancy would go a long way towards decreasing the number of "accidents" that occur leading to the decision to abort. The government should have spent a few bucks on this many years ago.

I'll have to remember that one next time my pants "accidentally" fall down and I "accidentally" have penetration and "accidentally" impregnate a woman

not my fault it was an "accident!"

[wanna be drummer]

I will try to answer it in more detail as soon as I have the time WBD

Controversial subject and no hard feelings.

The answer for me is it should be left up to the parents and the physician after Amniocentesis and ultrasound.

My friend who had a child with Downs decided the baby should live. The Palin's had the same choice. Downs is a very very difficult disease to deal with. The babies get infections at a sneeze and in all sincerity can fall along a spectrum from spontaneous abortion to a happy, self assured, loving productive person. Hers was impossible to get to sleep, had liver surgery, heart surgery, Eustachian tubes replaced because of constant ear infections and after almost 20 months of constant surgeries and meds, they still didn't know for sure if the child would live. Again, this isn't the case for all Downs kids.

But see, this is exactly my problem. You're focusing on what was wrong with the child, rather than seeing it as a living, breathing human being...

Pro choice. Does the child deserve to live a tortured life if thats the case?

That's up to them later on. Do we have the right to decide for them?

[wanna be drummer]

I want to apologize for nearly forgetting this conversation.

What sort of reform do you think it needs and do you honestly think that will affect costs?

I've already posted what I think, and yes it will definitely affect costs.

I don't really argue this point with you because our viewpoints on this topic are personal opinion, and I don't think they can be argued. I believe in universal health care, whereas, from your previous posts, you adopt the attitude that as America was founded on opportunity, nobody has a right to anything, and whatever they have or need they have to work for. That's fair enough, I don't argue with your opinion.

I believe we all have rights, but we as people need to learn to take care of ourselves rather than rely on others.

But I don't think you can straddle the issue by saying the answer to Electrophile's question is lower costs. The strain that the health system is going to be put under in the next 20 to 30 years time will be immense, and treament I'm afraid will favour those who can afford it, and I think you are committed, through your beliefs, to the notion that if Electrophile can't earn the 25 grand for surgery on her legs, then she's not going to have it.

What I'm saying is that medical costs need to drop sharply, and quickly. The American government has already proved itself to be quite incapable at doing anything health-related thus far, so I don't see how just throwing money at the problem would help at.

yes, and that responsibilty should be extended to ALL companies...they should be required by law to provide health insurance to ALL employees...

What right do you think you have that you can just go to a small-business owner who's got ten employees and probably isn't doing so hot right now, that he now is being forced to pay for his employees benefits?

That actually disturbs me a little bit.

[wanna be drummer]

I'm talking about ANYONE who thinks that it's okay for however many millions of people (the article i posted says) don't have coverage, which is certainly much greater today with the unemployment rate so high. I guess you blame all the people who have been and still are losing their jobs (because of the Economy under Bush that has been pulverized) on these people who were once hard working, now hard pressed to find work. How about all the employed people who don't get coverage even offered?

I think it's horrible that millions of people don't have health care. But that doesn't mean I also believe they should just get free checks, supplied by every working person in the country. That is what I have a problem with. We have the same end-goal, but we disagree on the means.

And Bush didn't do this, the problems been here a while, he just happened to be president when we finally imploded.

As i thought, "YOU" don't actually pay for your own healthcare. So you have no place to talk about "responsibility" because it's not yours, yet anyway.

I apologize for being born later than you...

And maybe it's not technically my responsibility right now, but it's ok for me to pay into Social Security (a program I'll never get) or Medicare, a program I don't get?

Yup, that's fair.

When you know how it feels for the millions of people who worry about this and "can't afford" healthcare, then you can act like it's their fault.

Chances are, I won't have that problem.

For now, it's the fault of our country for not providing all it's citizens with healthcare.

Of course, it's not the people's fault that our country's been on the downturn for decades, it's the government's fault..

Not just in an emergency (as 1977 says) but when people are sick and need a doctor. If healthcare isn't afforded to people with chronic illness, the costs skyrocket when they finally get their "emergency" medical care. Maybe the system needs overhauling, but that doesn't change the need to provide everyone with a good healthcare plan.

People have been providing themselves with good healthcare for a while. It's only recently that the system fell apart.

IMO, quality of care should never be effected. If you have well trained professionals working in healthcare, you should have quality care provided. Dedicated people will do their best, that shouldn't and i doubt will change. Technology will continue to improve, doctors will continue to specialize in their field of interest, and people will continue to get cutting edge, research based medical treatment. If a doctor or nurse isn't giving good care, it's becaue they don't care.

As for Obama's plan, i don't think you understand, and i'm not going to explain it to you (as i interpret it). McCain's plan is NO PLAN. That is worse. While Obama spends time telling the American public what he wants to do for his country, McCain comes up with another "bash Obama" strategy. LOSER! Palin's plan would be LESS THAN ZERO.

I am fully aware of Obama's plan, I've been getting it shoved down my throat since the race began (thank you Hermit, wherever you may roam). And I never said McCain's plan was good, so how is that relevant?

So while it's nice that you would help a friend in need, what about the millions of other human beings who don't have help?

What about the hundreds of millions that already help themselves?

You will see when you are on your own how reality is. It's easy when you still live at home. I miss it sometimes, myself.

Will I now? I sincerely doubt that because see, my parents pay for our plan (6 people altogether) and they are quite content with it (no we're not rich by any strecth of the imagination). Why do you think their are still millions of people who don't want universal health care? You honestly think I'll just change my thoughts to yours ocne I graduate? Why won't I see it like my parents do?

Not to you tangerine, but to everyone in general:

Look, I've simply lost a lot of sympathy for America. We're getting dumber and dumber and no one cares so long as Britney's new haircut is on the front page of every News outlet out there. It's ridiculous. I mean we're talking about a country that votes more often for American Idol then the President, a country where 1 out of every 5 of its citizens can't even locate America on the map. We're continulously spiralling down to a society that expects everything and wants zero responsibility for everything. It's the decay of our culture IMO.

[bigstickbonzo]

Look, I've simply lost a lot of sympathy for America. We're getting dumber and dumber and no one cares so long as Britney's new haircut is on the front page of every News outlet out there. It's ridiculous. I mean we're talking about a country that votes more often for American Idol then the President, a country where 1 out of every 5 of its citizens can't even locate America on the map. We're continulously spiralling down to a society that expects everything and wants zero responsibility for everything. It's the decay of our culture IMO.

The Bizarro American Dream.

[Mary Hartman]

I want to apologize for nearly forgetting this conversation.

I've already posted what I think, and yes it will definitely affect costs.

I believe we all have rights, but we as people need to learn to take care of ourselves rather than rely on others.

What I'm saying is that medical costs need to drop sharply, and quickly. The American government has already proved itself to be quite incapable at doing anything health-related thus far, so I don't see how just throwing money at the problem would help at.

What right do you think you have that you can just go to a small-business owner who's got ten employees and probably isn't doing so hot right now, that he now is being forced to pay for his employees benefits?

That actually disturbs me a little bit.

“It is the mark of an educated mind to rest satisfied with the degree of precision which the nature of the subject admits and not to seek exactness where only an approximation is possible.”

Aristotle

[Pb Derigable]

I'll have to remember that one next time my pants "accidentally" fall down and I "accidentally" have penetration and "accidentally" impregnate a woman

not my fault it was an "accident!"

I thought birth control was "accidentally" squirting her in the face.

[~tangerine~]

I'll have to remember that one next time my pants "accidentally" fall down and I "accidentally" have penetration and "accidentally" impregnate a woman

not my fault it was an "accident!"

Here's where education comes in. If you would keep one of those rubber thingy's in your pocket, you could put it on real quick and prevent that accident...

[wanna be drummer]

“It is the mark of an educated mind to rest satisfied with the degree of precision which the nature of the subject admits and not to seek exactness where only an approximation is possible.”

Aristotle

Happiness depends upon ourselves.

~Aristotle

[Electrophile]

I think the accident more lies in the fact that while the sex was intentional, the pregnancy wasn't. My sister was an accident. My mother wasn't intending on having more than 1 child, but that didn't last long. So I ended up with a baby sister and my mom was back to bottle feedings at 2 am and mountains of dirty diapers. She wouldn't take it back for anything in the world, but even when you're trying NOT to get pregnant, you still can anyway.

[~tangerine~]

I think it's horrible that millions of people don't have health care. But that doesn't mean I also believe they should just get free checks, supplied by every working person in the country. That is what I have a problem with. We have the same end-goal, but we disagree on the means.

And Bush didn't do this, the problems been here a while, he just happened to be president when we finally imploded.

I apologize for being born later than you...

And maybe it's not technically my responsibility right now, but it's ok for me to pay into Social Security (a program I'll never get) or Medicare, a program I don't get?

Yup, that's fair.

Chances are, I won't have that problem.

Of course, it's not the people's fault that our country's been on the downturn for decades, it's the government's fault..

People have been providing themselves with good healthcare for a while. It's only recently that the system fell apart.

I am fully aware of Obama's plan, I've been getting it shoved down my throat since the race began (thank you Hermit, wherever you may roam). And I never said McCain's plan was good, so how is that relevant?

What about the hundreds of millions that already help themselves?

Will I now? I sincerely doubt that because see, my parents pay for our plan (6 people altogether) and they are quite content with it (no we're not rich by any strecth of the imagination). Why do you think their are still millions of people who don't want universal health care? You honestly think I'll just change my thoughts to yours ocne I graduate? Why won't I see it like my parents do?

Not to you tangerine, but to everyone in general:

Look, I've simply lost a lot of sympathy for America. We're getting dumber and dumber and no one cares so long as Britney's new haircut is on the front page of every News outlet out there. It's ridiculous. I mean we're talking about a country that votes more often for American Idol then the President, a country where 1 out of every 5 of its citizens can't even locate America on the map. We're continulously spiralling down to a society that expects everything and wants zero responsibility for everything. It's the decay of our culture IMO.

I believe i heard the number was 43 million Americans don't have healthcare insurance. Wow, that's a lot of checks the rest of us need to write . As for Bush, he did nothing but start a War in his eight long, destructive years as President (and line more pockets of millionaires, oops i almost forgot about that).

My point about responsibility, that you missed, is not about when you were born. You talk about how others should be responsible for getting their own healthcare, but you don't currently have that "problem" to deal with. You don't know what it's like for many people who are struggling because you are not. You are very judgemental however.

Like you, i pay into Social Security and all the other programs my taxes go to, and have gone to since i started working at age 14. I don't intend to see any of it back, either. Believe me, i have paid way more than you.

What is relevant about Obama vs. McCain is what i said. Obama has "plans" for healthcare and all the other issues our country faces. McCain spends his time bashing Obama and looking for bad men Obama knows to fear monger to the people in hopes of winning the election. Nobody will have a plan that pleases everybody. Nobody will have a plan that even comes close to perfection because we are a very broken society right now. The most i hope for and expect if Obama is elected, is a good start. If McCain is elected, i expect a deeper descend into our grave. This is MY OPINION of the difference between these two men.

Bottom line, everybody deserves medical care. If they can't afford it for whatever reasons, they should still be able to get it. I work in the healthcare field and i can't imagine looking at even the worst patient i have ever seen and saying to myself that they don't deserve the "right" to medical care. And while it's great to make sure all children are covered, what about the parents of those children who need their health, too?

Having healthcare insurance is not the same as giving everyone a right to own a car, television, cell phone, or whatever material objects we enjoy.

Your feelings about Americans being dumb, i wholeheartidly agree. Look who so many elected twice in the past two elections to lead our country. A Dumbass. and for the record, i don't watch American Idol and if i did, i wouldn't spend a penny to place a "vote". But i agree, there is alot of crap out there for people to obsess over. Another issue our government should have focused on addressing all these past years, Education.

[wanna be drummer]

I believe i heard the number was 43 million Americans don't have healthcare insurance. Wow, that's a lot of checks the rest of us need to write . As for Bush, he did nothing but start a War in his eight long, destructive years as President (and line more pockets of millionaires, oops i almost forgot about that).

I've always said health care for all children, so take of about 10 million and you're down to 33 million people. Easier to work with.

And yes, Bush has sucked

My point about responsibility, that you missed, is not about when you were born. You talk about how others should be responsible for getting their own healthcare, but you don't currently have that "problem" to deal with. You don't know what it's like for many people who are struggling because you are not. You are very judgemental however.

I fully understood it. But I'm not going to just throw away my opinion because of my age. You're right, I've never had that responsibility. I've also never gone to war. Should I still be able to have an opinion on the war?

Like you, i pay into Social Security and all the other programs my taxes go to, and have gone to since i started working at age 14. I don't intend to see any of it back, either. Believe me, i have paid way more than you.

I know you have. I'm just upset at how my forcibly taken money is being spent.

What is relevant about Obama vs. McCain is what i said. Obama has "plans" for healthcare and all the other issues our country faces. McCain spends his time bashing Obama and looking for bad men Obama knows to fear monger to the people in hopes of winning the election. Nobody will have a plan that pleases everybody. Nobody will have a plan that even comes close to perfection because we are a very broken society right now. The most i hope for and expect if Obama is elected, is a good start. If McCain is elected, i expect a deeper descend into our grave. This is MY OPINION of the difference between these two men.

And that is your right. I would never try and take that from you.

Bottom line, everybody deserves medical care.

Sure, but no one should ever expect others to pay for them.

If they can't afford it for whatever reasons, they should still be able to get it. I work in the healthcare field and i can't imagine looking at even the worst patient i have ever seen and saying to myself that they don't deserve the "right" to medical care. And while it's great to make sure all children are covered, what about the parents of those children who need their health, too?

Those parents have the means with which to help themselves.

Having healthcare insurance is not the same as giving everyone a right to own a car, television, cell phone, or whatever material objects we enjoy.

According to whom?

Your feelings about Americans being dumb, i wholeheartidly agree. Look who so many elected twice in the past two elections to lead our country. A Dumbass. and for the record, i don't watch American Idol and if i did, i wouldn't spend a penny to place a "vote". But i agree, there is alot of crap out there for people to obsess over. Another issue our government should have focused on addressing all these past years, Education.

Our education system is terrible

God I'm cynical

[marolyn]

What right do you think you have that you can just go to a small-business owner who's got ten employees and probably isn't doing so hot right now, that he now is being forced to pay for his employees benefits?

That actually disturbs me a little bit.

does it disturb you that our senators get healthcare as a benefit? because our government isn't doing so hot financially either...

do you advocate cancelling all healthcare benefits for all state, local, and federal employees?

[Mary Hartman]

DENVER, CO. --

First word on Barack Obama's historic nomination acceptance speech from a bevy of celebrities in attendance was decidedly partisan: "It was excellent," Black Eyed Peas singer Fergie said. "It was amazing."

"Incredible," said Jessica Alba simply, before joining Fergie, Rosario Dawson, Wilmer Valderrama and Kerry Washington at a private exit from Invesco Field. Alba was at the speech with husband Cash Warren.

Other celebrities in attendance included George Lucas with girlfriend Mellody Hardon and his daughter, Forest Whitaker with wife Keisha and Star Jones, and Daniel Dae Kim of "Lost," who posed for pictures with the Hawaii delegation.

Next for Obama and his celebrity backers?

"What I hope happens is the country doesn't forget the jubilation and excitement that's been generated here," Kim said. "And I hope it turns into something that changes the world."

will.i.am performed his speech-song "Yes We Can" with John Legend during the run-up to Obama's speech. Susan Sarandon and Anne Hathaway sang along in the stands as Sheryl Crow performed "Change is Gonna Come," and crooner Michael McDonald prompted many a flag wave with his rendition of "America the Beautiful."

Oprah Winfrey left Denver with the candidate she wanted, but reportedly without her eyelashes.

The talk-show host said she was moved to tears by Obama's speech. And those must've been some serious tears.

"I cried my eyelashes off," she said in the bowels of Invesco Field, moments after Obama accepted the nomination for president before an estimated 84,000 people.

"I think it's the most powerful thing I have ever experienced," she added, calling Obama's words "transcendent." On the 45th anniversary of Martin Luther King Jr.'s "I have a Dream Speech," Winfrey compared Obama's words to those of the civil-rights leader, Franklin Delano Roosevelt and Abraham Lincoln.

"He's not an African-American candidate," she said. "He's a candidate for Americans."

Winfrey threw her support behind Obama early — even before the Democratic primaries got under way last year. She's stayed active since, hosting rallies and fundraisers that even Obama has acknowledged have given him a boost.

Before singing the national anthem to a slowly filling stadium, Jennifer Hudson appeared lost in thought, wearing a casual gray

dress and listening to iPod earphones as her handlers asked for directions to the podium. While waiting, she typed on a Sidekick.

"Fired up!" said an excited Spike Lee on the field. "Bigger than the Super Bowl!"

The only major party planned for Thursday night was an elite event sponsored by Vanity Fair and Google.

Among the celebrities spotted in and around the convention on Wednesday was Steven Spielberg, who directed a short film on veterans that shown at the convention. Jennifer Lopez spoke at a reception honoring children's rights activist Marian Wright Edelman. Ben Affleck read excerpts from a Howard Zinn book and made an appearance at the city's food bank for America's Second Harvest.

Affleck was joined by his wife, Jennifer Garner, at the book reading at the Starz Green Room across the street from the Pepsi Center. Also participating: Dawson, Washington, Taye Diggs, Hill Harper and Josh Brolin.

Also on Wednesday:

-- The Black Eyed Peas performed a concert at the Fillmore Auditorium for the Creative Coalition. Fergie praised Hillary Rodham Clinton's Tuesday-night speech, saying Clinton "really spoke to me as a woman. And I think she spoke to a lot of people in that way."

-- Politicians including former Virginia Gov. Mark Warner attended a ONE Campaign party featuring a Kanye West performance. Also in attendance: Whitaker, Kal Penn, Jamie Foxx and director Davis Guggenheim.

-- Muhammad Ali sat in the convention audience.

-- Fran Drescher, Ashley Judd and Joy Bryant joined Lopez at the reception honoring Edelman.

-- Hathaway and others gathered at a morning reception honoring Annette Bening for her work narrating the documentary "14 Women," about women in the U.S. Senate.

-- Big Boi of Outkast was at the airport on his way out of town after hosting a Radio One show where he interviewed John Legend, among others.

On that cutest babes note, good morning!

[Mary Hartman]

I believe i heard the number was 43 million Americans don't have healthcare insurance. Wow, that's a lot of checks the rest of us need to write . As for Bush, he did nothing but start a War in his eight long, destructive years as President (and line more pockets of millionaires, oops i almost forgot about that).

My point about responsibility, that you missed, is not about when you were born. You talk about how others should be responsible for getting their own healthcare, but you don't currently have that "problem" to deal with. You don't know what it's like for many people who are struggling because you are not. You are very judgemental however.

Like you, i pay into Social Security and all the other programs my taxes go to, and have gone to since i started working at age 14. I don't intend to see any of it back, either. Believe me, i have paid way more than you.

What is relevant about Obama vs. McCain is what i said. Obama has "plans" for healthcare and all the other issues our country faces. McCain spends his time bashing Obama and looking for bad men Obama knows to fear monger to the people in hopes of winning the election. Nobody will have a plan that pleases everybody. Nobody will have a plan that even comes close to perfection because we are a very broken society right now. The most i hope for and expect if Obama is elected, is a good start. If McCain is elected, i expect a deeper descend into our grave. This is MY OPINION of the difference between these two men.

Bottom line, everybody deserves medical care. If they can't afford it for whatever reasons, they should still be able to get it. I work in the healthcare field and i can't imagine looking at even the worst patient i have ever seen and saying to myself that they don't deserve the "right" to medical care. And while it's great to make sure all children are covered, what about the parents of those children who need their health, too?

Having healthcare insurance is not the same as giving everyone a right to own a car, television, cell phone, or whatever material objects we enjoy.

Your feelings about Americans being dumb, i wholeheartidly agree. Look who so many elected twice in the past two elections to lead our country. A Dumbass. and for the record, i don't watch American Idol and if i did, i wouldn't spend a penny to place a "vote". But i agree, there is alot of crap out there for people to obsess over. Another issue our government should have focused on addressing all these past years, Education.

You cant reason with him.

Why bother?

[I have got a horsey]

Look, I've simply lost a lot of sympathy for America. We're getting dumber and dumber and no one cares so long as Britney's new haircut is on the front page of every News outlet out there. It's ridiculous. I mean we're talking about a country that votes more often for American Idol then the President, a country where 1 out of every 5 of its citizens can't even locate America on the map. We're continulously spiralling down to a society that expects everything and wants zero responsibility for everything. It's the decay of our culture IMO.

A big part of the problem is we place fewer and fewer expectations on society than we used to, and if Pb is going to praise the virtues of American capitalism, then just to be a pain in the ass I'd like to blame the whole dumbing down thing on American capitalism too.

In the drive for more and more youth dollars, all media, products etc have been dumbed down to make them more appealing and accessibile to consumers. Anything that is considered overly intelligent or high-brow or whatever does not sell, according to various companies, because if people don't easily understand it, it alienates them from the product, and they, apparently, would rather spend their money on something they do understand.

People in the past were expected to lift themselves up to the social level. A well-to-do society person in the past was expected to be intelligent and cultured. If you wanted to better yourself or your situation in life, you had to acquire those attributes. You had to be able to understand what was being said in The Times. But in the 20th century the drive for profits and capitalism and consumer culture broke down those social expectations, also the breaking down of the class system had a role to play. Things changed from where being purely wealthy was a vulgarity without social graces, to how the situation is now, which is as long as you're rich you can be whatever you want and you'll be admired. You don't have to be smart or cultured, you basically have to be young sexy and rich and with a flamboyant or attention grabbing lifestyle.

Society sees this as the bar, or the level of role models and only aspires that high.

Once upon a time a person would go to University simply to be educated, it was considered important for a young man who wanted to advantaged in social situations to have an education.

But that's changed, nowdays you go to Uni simply to earn more money or to get a better job. I studied Humanities at University and nearly everyone asked me "why the hell are you doing that for?"

It's so ironic. More people today have had more years of schooling and post-secondary education than 100 years ago, and yet society as a whole is becoming less intelligent.

[THE FIRST LEDZEP]

[The Rover]

Yeah, because registration fraud is so much worse than election fraud

You mean, like the "Fraud" that is Barak Hussein Obama ? ? ?

Not even an American Born Citizen !

[Patrycja]

You mean, like the "Fraud" that is Barak Hussein Obama ? ? ?

Not even an American Born Citizen !

*sigh* back to that again, are we? So I guess proof to the contrary simply isn't accepted, only conjecture that supports this load of bs?

[wanna be drummer]

does it disturb you that our senators get healthcare as a benefit? because our government isn't doing so hot financially either...

do you advocate cancelling all healthcare benefits for all state, local, and federal employees?

You didn't answer my question.

And no, it doesn't disturb me. I'm not advocating the compolete cancellation of federal health care, but I would definitely like to cut back on it...a lot I might add.

Although all of our senators and Congressman could easily afford a great privatized health care system

I'm not sure on numbers, but I'm sure many do

You cant reason with him.

Why bother?

Ok, ya know what Mary? Put me on ignore. And the next time you get banned and come back, put me on ignore ok?

We're having a discussion, it's not out of control. We're both just talking and having fun. Neither of us is expecting to convert the other all right?

You're welcome.

A big part of the problem is we place fewer and fewer expectations on society than we used to, and if Pb is going to praise the virtues of American capitalism, then just to be a pain in the ass I'd like to blame the whole dumbing down thing on American capitalism too.

Oh, no doubt this materialistic society is dumbing us down. I agree whole-heartedly. That being said, I think people need to rise above that. It's ok to drive for a goal of acheivement. You want that new Mustang? Go for it, be my guest. But you have to accept the consequences of your actions. You better be able to pay for it. Buy what you want, when you want, but accept the consequences. Simple as that baby

It's so ironic. More people today have had more years of schooling and post-secondary education than 100 years ago, and yet society as a whole is becoming less intelligent.

Ever see Idiocracy?

[Knebby]

You cant reason with him.

Why bother?

I may not agree with all his viewpoints, but I find his discussion of them very reasonable and very mature.

I also think - correct me if I'm wrong - that discussion is the whole point of a forum like this.

[wanna be drummer]

I may not agree with all his viewpoints, but I find his discussion of them very reasonable and very mature.

I also think - correct me if I'm wrong - that discussion is the whole point of a forum like this.

Thank you Kneb. I haven't gotten out of line so why does it matter if she argues with me or not? We're having aperfectly acceptable discussion no?

[Knebby]

Thank you Kneb. I haven't gotten out of line so why does it matter if she argues with me or not? We're having aperfectly acceptable discussion no?

I certainly thought so. No name-calling, nothing offensive.