The Next President of the USA will be?

[Electrophile]

You mean, like the "Fraud" that is Barak Hussein Obama ? ? ?

Not even an American Born Citizen !

Yes, he is. Now go adjust your tinfoil hat, it's falling off.

[marolyn]

You didn't answer my question.

And no, it doesn't disturb me. I'm not advocating the compolete cancellation of federal health care, but I would definitely like to cut back on it...a lot I might add.

Although all of our senators and Congressman could easily afford a great privatized health care system

I'm not sure on numbers, but I'm sure many do

i wasn't avoiding your question just assumed you remembered my answer to that question since we addressed it earlier when we discussed corporate responsibility...i believe any employer falls under this realm and that healthcare is just a cost of doing business...

so if you are not advocating complete cancellation of federal healthcare, where do you draw the line? who are deemed worthy enough to be covered? and if the government should be required to provide healthcare for it's employees, why should other employers be exempt?

[wanna be drummer]

i wasn't avoiding your question just assumed you remembered my answer to that question since we addressed it earlier when we discussed corporate responsibility...i believe any employer falls under this realm and that healthcare is just a cost of doing business...

But why? Why should the responsibility fall on the business owner, as opposed to the individual workers? What makes him in charge of their health?

so if you are not advocating complete cancellation of federal healthcare, where do you draw the line? who are deemed worthy enough to be covered? and if the government should be required to provide healthcare for it's employees, why should other employers be exempt?

The really poor and homeless need a backup plan. Nothing huge, but it has to be there.

And I never said employees of the government should be covered. I just said I wasn't disturbed. I understand why they are. I don't think they should be under the government's plan, but i'm not disturbed by it.

[marolyn]

But why? Why should the responsibility fall on the business owner, as opposed to the individual workers? What makes him in charge of their health?

The really poor and homeless need a backup plan. Nothing huge, but it has to be there.

And I never said employees of the government should be covered. I just said I wasn't disturbed. I understand why they are. I don't think they should be under the government's plan, but i'm not disturbed by it.

nobody is saying they have to be in charge of a person's health... whether or not a person goes in is their decision...just that they should have the option to...the employer should just figure healthcare into the employee's pay package just like the federal government does.

i guess i'm just wondering why you can look past federal employees getting coverage while leaving all private workers high and dry? what distinguishes the federal employee from any other employee?

[wanna be drummer]

nobody is saying they have to be in charge of a person's health... whether or not a person goes in is their decision...just that they should have the option to...the employer should just figure healthcare into the employee's pay package just like the federal government does.

Why? Why can't he just pay them money, with which the employee can use to figure their own health care? Why should all the responsibility be forced on the employer? It makes no sense. He has other thigns to worry about. If he/she wants to include healthcare into their employees paychecks, then go for it. I'm all for it. But if they don't want to, then why should they have to? The people who want their company to do that can go somewhere else for a job.

i guess i'm just wondering why you can look past federal employees getting coverage while leaving all private workers high and dry? what distinguishes the federal employee from any other employee?

I don't think you get what I'm saying. I don't like how federal employees have their healthcare paid for them by the government. To me, that's wrong. But it's not shocking to me, since it's been happening for a while now.

[THE FIRST LEDZEP]

http://macsmind.com/wordpress/2008/02/27/o...disarm-america/

Obama plans to Disarm America

[Suz]

You mean, like the "Fraud" that is Barak Hussein Obama ? ? ?

Not even an American Born Citizen !

Good lord. Take some meds.

[THE FIRST LEDZEP]

Barack Obama - The first thing I think of is Osama Bin Laden

[wanna be drummer]

"The next time you have thought...just let it go"

~ Ron White

[redrum]

http://macsmind.com/wordpress/2008/02/27/o...disarm-america/

Obama plans to Disarm America

Well, he ain't been elected yet and I will give mine up.....bullets first!!

[Electrophile]

Obama is not disarming anyone. Stop with these inane conspiracy theories already, you sound like nutters.

[Electrophile]

Barack Obama's grandmother passed away today. How awful. My condolences to him and his family......what a shitty time for a death.

[euro]

Obama is not disarming anyone. Stop with these inane conspiracy theories already, you sound like nutters.

Last minute smear campaign from those that cant accept the inevitable:The American people want to turn the page, a fresh start from wreckless policies of the Bush Administration. And it is the youth of American that are leading the charge

[Suz]

Last minute smear campaign from those that cant accept the inevitable:The American people want to turn the page, a fresh start from wreckless policies of the Bush Administration. And it is the youth of American that are leading the charge

Don't forget fear. Smear/fear.

[wanna be drummer]

The youth are generally unintelligent I've found

[redrum]

And it is the youth of America that are leading the charge.

We are doomed!

And gun control is a losing issue for the left. Always has been, always will be.

[euro]

We are doomed!

And gun control is a losing issue for the left. Always has been, always will be.

This election is not about gun control

[wanna be drummer]

When the revolution comes it will

[euro]

When the revolution comes it will

What type of revolution you envisioning?

[Suz]

But see, this is exactly my problem. You're focusing on what was wrong with the child, rather than seeing it as a living, breathing human being...

That's up to them later on. Do we have the right to decide for them?

Yes we do. when it's in our bodies the point is that no one has the right to decide for US. No one else can make that decision, and if it were the other way around and men could get pregnant there would be no argument about this. You can cry for the unborn children all you want, and I understand why. But the moment a woman looses the right to make choices involving her own body is is the moment she's not a full citizen. Consider it the lesser of two evils if that's how you look at it. It is a private matter, and do you ever wonder why other western countries aren't bitching about this? (Not to mention briging up people's religions in politics and all this stuff we inexplicably sink to). It is PRIVATE. Go mentor a kid. Or you could try to find all the women who have had abortions- would you head to the clinic and take down license plate numbers and call them murderers to their faces? Please.

[redrum]

This election is not about gun control

Believe me, it's about gun control.

[SunChild]

Yeah, that's a good comparison

Sorry for the long delay, I was travelling with a wonky lap top that crashed so much I just stopped using it... but, this is a good discussion.

Yes, it IS a good comparison... because we're talking about threats to your health and even your life. Kind of like a wild fire. Or an intruder with a gun.

What, you've never heard of communicable diseases, epidemics, pandemics? There's been quite a resurgence of tuberculosis in recent years, for example, mainly among the poor. You know, those same poor who don't seek health care because they can't afford it? Yup, they get contagious diseases, too.

They're completely different. Firefighters protect everyone from fires, not just the people who's home or business or what have you is on fire. They are essential in keeping the peace. Policeman provide one of the fundamental reasons for even having government in the first place: They protect us from those that would infringe upon on our rights. Health care is not a right, but a responsibility.

Why do you think that? We all suffer "the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune, the thousand natural shocks that flesh is heir to." We're flesh and blood, absolutely guaranteed to be injured or take sick. It's far more likely than fire or crime -you're going to become ill some day, friend, and wouldn't it be nice if that didn't bankrupt your whole family?

Oh, and police business can be privatized just like anything else. Ever hear of bodyguards? What about bounty hunters? Yeah, they aren't all owned by the government

No one says you can't go see a private doctor or buy private health insurance. I'm just saying people shouldn't HAVE to.

In that regard, Obama's plan is quite brilliant.

We need a system that prevents shitholes do things like take a $400,000 spa trip after being awarded federal money (stupid move again government) to protect their company.

Gotta agree with you on that one!

The Bush Admin rammed that through Congress faster than the so called Patriot (sic) Act, probably just for that reason; after all, they only have a few months left to spread wealth from the poor and middle class to the ultra wealthy.

What?

Maybe you'll answer me, what is your solution

Easy enough. Socialized medicine (*oooh, I said the "S" word*!) Single payer health care. Government paid health services. Call it want you want, it's the system where medical care is provided by doctors and other trained health care providers, and the bills are paid via taxes. It would be cheaper than our current system since it removes the barbaric profit margins of the insurance companies, and done right, people would seek care earlier, and go in for wellness checks to maintain health, resulting in less serious illnesses and less expensive treatments.

There are many successful models to choose from since most countries, even poor ones, have that system.

Your answer?

[SunChild]

Hooray for you! That's what i always say to the "boys" who think they should have a right to decide what the opposite sex does with their body. It's not like the boys took responsibility in preventing the issue. It's not like a large majority of them will be supportive after the fact (and that goes for adult men as well).

Thanks!

[THE FIRST LEDZEP]

If Barack Obama, Joe Biden, Harry Reid, and Nancy Pelosi control the government, can you imagine the liberal laws that will be created?

Higher taxes, mandated national health care, amnesty for illegal immigrants, leaving Iraq before the job is finished, continued dependency on foreign oil, abortions on demand ... the list will go on and on.

[kirchzep27]

^you must have a really good job.