The Next President of the USA will be?

[Suz]

I support Obama, but I don't think Clinton or McCain would be bad presidents. McCain has the most experience, and at least he knows what our soldiers are going through. I've never voted for a Republican, but there have been some I haven't minded and he's one of them.

[Pb Derigable]

hermit> What do you disagree with? A. Rezko is a slimeball B. Obama has benefited from their relationship.

As much as i don't like Obama thoughts on anything. I do have to tell you guys coming from Chicago, obama is the least corrupt person from this state, with that said, if he came from any other city besides Chicago, he would've been hanged for treason. still even though he is the cleanest turd from the pile of crap called Chicago politics, he still was a willing participant. You don't get anywhere here without getting down on your knees.

[Hermit]

.

Its official: John McCain is even more full of shit than George W Bush.

----------

One Year Later, Market Where McCain Strolled ‘Freely’ Is Controlled By Sadr, Too Unsafe For Americans To Visit

On April 1, 2007, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) strolled through the open-air Shorja market in Baghdad in an effort to prove that Americans are “not getting the full picture” of what’s going on in Iraq. In a press conference after his Baghdad tour, McCain told a reporter that his visit to the market was proof that people could “walk freely” in parts of Baghdad.

What McCain failed to mention was that he was accompanied by “100 American soldiers, with three Blackhawk helicopters, and two Apache gunships overhead.” He also appeared to be wearing a bulletproof vest during his visit.

Since that trip, McCain has claimed that the situation in Iraq has improved even more. A few months ago, McCain claimed that “we’ve succeeded militarily” in Iraq. Things, of course, are going so well, that he wants to keep U.S. troops there for at least 100 years.

McCain is now back in Iraq for a “surprise visit with Iraqi and American diplomatic and military leaders.” He is joined by fellow Iraq war defenders Sens. Joe Lieberman (I-CT) and Lindsey Graham (R-SC). But it’s unlikely they will be visiting the Shorja market again. Today, CNN reported that they tried to visit the Shorja market, but it was too unsafe and they were unable to go: "We got close to that marketplace today, Jim, but our own security advisers here in Iraq did not want us to go there. They didn’t believe it was safe for an American to be in that area. We were in a thriving marketplace nearby".

*source*

-------

[Uncle Bill]

I disagree with neither.

What do you disagree with? A. Obama did nothing improper and/or illegal B. Obama is not responsible for every action of every person he's ever had dealings with C. the vetting done by the Chicago Tribune editors and staff on this issue was thorough and convincing.

b= agreed, but whom he chooses to associate with speaks to his character/ judgment and even his supporters questioned that.

"It surprised me that late in the game he [Obama] continued to take contributions from somebody who was under a rather dark cloud in the state," said Cynthia Canary of the Illinois Campaign for Political Reform, a group that has worked closely with Obama and supported his legislative efforts.

c= disagree (it may be good enough for you,that's fine, personally I'm far from convinced but I'm pretty skeptical)

a= that remains to be seen imo

On a related topic I see that BHO threw the pastor of his church under the bus over the weekend.

Do you think:

A. He showed poor judgment by not standing behind his long time spiritual leader?

B. He showed poor judgment sticking with him too long?

Zosodude> great cartoon

[Hermit]

On a related topic I see that BHO threw the pastor of his church under the bus over the weekend.

Do you think:

A. He showed poor judgment by not standing behind his long time spiritual leader?

B. He showed poor judgment sticking with him too long?

He didn't throw him under the bus, he merely threw him off the (campaign) bus.

Should Barack have booted Reverend Wright off the campaign bus sooner? Probably. But I think overall he showed well-reasoned, well-tempered judgment in his handling of the recently erupted bru-ha-ha over Wright's comments, and I think his response to the situation was politically appropriate. I think he did the right thing by unequivocally disavowing the reverend's controversial statements while also making it clear that he maintains his overall love and respect for the man whom he credits with "bringing me to Jesus". I think he showed wisdom in pointing out that Reverend Wright, on account of his being from the generation of African Americans who lived through the darkest (no pun intended) days of the civil rights movement, carries with him a fair amount of anger; and I think he showed political savvy in pointing out that he himself is not of that same generation and as such does not have that same degree of anger. I also think he showed his Christian values and compassion in his choosing to condemn the reverend's comments while not outright condemning the man.

Do you think:

A. Obama is personally responsible for everything the minister of his church says?

B. Obama should henceforth sever ALL ties with his pastor of almost 30 years on

....account of that minister having expressed controversial political points of view?

or.. uhh..

C. He should've responded by saying "I wanna say one thing to the American people,

....and I want you to listen to me: I did not have spiritual relations with that man."

btw..

"BHO"?

..what does the "H" stand for again?

[Uncle Bill]

A. No ,but pretending he didn't know what the man is/ was saying is unbelievable to me, and I've heard BO (better? I thought BHO sounded more respectful) say that himself.

B. That's what he appears to be doing.

C. Saying he didn't know what the guy was saying from the pulpit is a similar evasion imo.

Do you agree with Pastor Wright's statements? (feel free to spell out which statement/s you mean)

A.All

B. Some

C.None

[Hermit]

A. No ,but pretending he didn't know what the man is/ was saying is unbelievable to me, and I've heard BO (better? I thought BHO sounded more respectful) say that himself.

I'm skeptical too, but I chalk it up to politics. Ultimately it aint no big deal.. other than as

something for his political opponents to fabricate a 'guilt by association' controversy over.

B. That's what he appears to be doing.

I think you're quite mistaken about that. He has removed Wright from any direct involvment in his campaign, but he has not severed all ties; he's maintaining his relationship with the man as his pastor, spiritual advisor, and family friend.

C. Saying he didn't know what the guy was saying from the pulpit is a similar evasion imo.

Evasion.. like someone who opposes Obama not coming right out and admitting that his referring to Obama as "BHO" was a politically motivated subtle reference to Obama's controversial middle name, and instead claiming it was done because he "thought it sounded more respectful" than referring to him as "BO" (another not-so-subtle slam, perhaps?)?

Evasion and skepticism are happening all over the place, huh?

fwiw.. I dont think the middle name "Hussein" is something BHO should run from. My joking about it in the previous post was merely my way of letting you know I knew what you were doing.

Do you agree with Pastor Wright's statements? (feel free to spell out which statement/s you mean)

A.All

B. Some

C.None

Of the video clips I've seen,.. it seems to me there's a kernal of truth in everything he's said. I think he was over-the-top in how he expressed himself, and I think he did so in a manner that many would see as being politically incorrect. I think it's the political incorrectness of it that is causing a political perception problem for BHO right now and his political opponents are trying to exploit it for political purposes. I think BHO is handling the political perception problem created by his pastor's political incorrectness in a politically savvy... and politically correct.. manner.. and I think ultimately the political gains his political opponents hope to achieve from the controversy will be nullified.

Do you think:

A. we're going to keep playing this A-B game ad nauseum?

B. there's a end in sight?

I do appreciate the points you've been making.. and the discussion, UB.

cheers, man.

[Uncle Bill]

hermit> lets stay on topic and keep the attempted mind reading to yourself eh? I'm just an undecided voter collecting info. Fact is, I don't know anyone in real life who supports BO to question about this, I'm interested in what you have to say. I haven't ruled out anyone but HRC at this point.

For background, this is my 10th pres election and I've never liked any candidate either party has put up in that time, including this time. It's always the lesser of two evils or voting against someone I particularly dislike.

I couldn't care less if the H stood for Hitler is irrelevant to me, he didn't pick it. I was afraid if I kept typing Obama it was only a matter of time til I slipped and typed an S instead of a B and we all know how you would have reacted then

The A-B thing had it's desired result, no more cut and paste of other peoples opinions, I wanted to hear yours

"I do appreciate the points you've been making.. and the discussion, UB.

cheers, man." beer.gif

Agreed!

[Hermit]

fair enough, bro.

I'm glad to hear that BHO's middle name is not an issue for

you, and I apologize for jumping to conclusions about that.

I hear ya about the lesser of two evils thing when it comes to electing presidents. That's how it's always felt to me too. However, having watched BHO over the past few years, and particularly throughout this campaign, I don't see him as being the lesser of two (or three) evils; I think he's far and away the best of the three remaining candidates and at this time and I'm convinced that he would be an excellent POTUS. He has my full, and enthusiastic, support. And I say that with complete awareness that he is not a perfect person nor a perfect politician, and as such I expect there to be blemishes in his personal history, and I expect there to be bumps in the road and mistakes to be made; afterall, he is human. Mistakes and political maneuverings notwithstanding, I think there is something special about him, and I think he's the person coming along at just the right time.

Thanks again for the discussion.

[Bonham]

Evasion.. like someone who opposes Obama not coming right out and admitting that his referring to Obama as "BHO" was a politically motivated subtle reference to Obama's controversial middle name, and instead claiming it was done because he "thought it sounded more respectful" than referring to him as "BO" (another not-so-subtle slam, perhaps?)?

Why do Americans have to make everything in to initials all the time?

[zosodude13]

enjoy

[JimmyPage1977]

fair enough, bro.

I'm glad to hear that BHO's middle name is not an issue for

you, and I apologize for jumping to conclusions about that.

I hear ya about the lesser of two evils thing when it comes to electing presidents. That's how it's always felt to me too. However, having watched BHO over the past few years, and particularly throughout this campaign, I don't see him as being the lesser of two (or three) evils; I think he's far and away the best of the three remaining candidates and at this time and I'm convinced that he would be an excellent POTUS. He has my full, and enthusiastic, support. And I say that with complete awareness that he is not a perfect person nor a perfect politician, and as such I expect there to be blemishes in his personal history, and I expect there to be bumps in the road and mistakes to be made; afterall, he is human. Mistakes and political maneuverings notwithstanding, I think there is something special about him, and I think he's the person coming along at just the right time.

Thanks again for the discussion.

We agree! WOW!!!

[Pb Derigable]

Is Hillary official off the Rodham crap. I mean she is not going to be Pres. Rodham Clinton if she wins Right.

[bigstickbonzo]

At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if she revealed the 'mark of the beast.'

[Dzldoc]

At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if she revealed the 'mark of the beast.'

I believe that's reserved for someone that eveyone likes and is charismatic so it is written.

[Pb Derigable]

I believe that's reserved for someone that eveyone likes and is charismatic so it is written.

Sounds like Obama.

[bigstickbonzo]

Here we go...

[Hermit]

We agree! WOW!!!

Halelujah!

[its been a long time since we rock and rolled last agreed.. on a political issue!]

cheers!

You see, naysayers..

Barack Obama really can bring people together!

[Bonham]

At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if she revealed the 'mark of the beast.'

Already done.

Have you not seen this flag, pictured here to the left? Virtually no one else has, either, as this is a very special flag with a most unusual type of star.

She's quick.

[Uncle Bill]

Can someone point to where BO (or anyone else) stated clearly before the Iraq War started that the WMD's would not be found. I have a hard time wading through all the political gooble de gook. Thanks,UB

[Uncle Bill]

Predictions about Obama's speech:

No matter what he says, it will be,

A. plenty good enough for his supporters, all that needs to be said etc

B. not nearly good enough for his detractors, it proves he's racist etc

C. the rest of us scratching our heads wondering what to believe.

*edited so it actually made sense*

[Pb Derigable]

Can someone point to where BO (or anyone else) stated clearly before the Iraq War started that the WMD's would not be found. I have a hard time wading through all the political gooble de gook. Thanks,UB

Hussein did.

[Hermit]

Can someone point to where BO (or anyone else) stated clearly before the Iraq War started that the WMD's would not be found. I have a hard time wading through all the political gooble de gook. Thanks,UB

I don't think anyone said with any certainty "WMD wont be found", but there were sure lots of questions about it, and there was plenty of evidence that suggested the Bush admin claims of WMD being found in Iraq was a "slam dunk" was not true. Joe Wilson debunked the "yellowcake" claim; Richard Clark, a former CIA terror specialist, questioned the entire Bush case for war; intell that undermined the Bush rush to war was buried rather than presented; and the UN Inspectors that were on the ground in Iraq before the invasion were saying that they were not finding any WMD or any evidence of WMD programs.

Face it: the Bush admin WMD claim was a ruse. It was a politically

convenient basis upon which to fabricate a case for invading Iraq.

Regardless of WMD, the fact of the matter remains: Obama opposed the war... for all the right reasons.. and the other candidates supported the war. Obama has proven to have been right, and the others wrong. The position Obama took in 2002, before the war in Iraq began, is spot-on with what is now commonly accepted as being the reasons why the invasion of Iraq was misguided and ill-advised. Obama rightly noted, among other things, that Saddam was no threat to America.

You can raise all the questions you want about WMD,.. but the fact remains the same:

Barack Obama was right.

Barack Obama's pre-war position about Iraq:

"I am not opposed to all wars. I’m opposed to dumb wars," he said. "What I am opposed to is the cynical attempt by Richard Perle and Paul Wolfowitz and other arm-chair, weekend warriors in this Administration to shove their own ideological agendas down our throats, irrespective of the costs in lives lost and in hardships borne."

"He’s a bad guy," Obama said, referring to Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein. "The world, and the Iraqi people, would be better off without him. But I also know that Saddam poses no imminent and direct threat to the United States, or to his neighbors, that the Iraqi economy is in shambles, that the Iraqi military a fraction of its former strength, and that in concert with the international community he can be contained until, in the way of all petty dictators, he falls away into the dustbin of history."

"I know that even a successful war against Iraq will require a U.S. occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences," Obama continued. "I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the Middle East, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of al-Qaeda."

*source*

Pretty clear (and correct), aint it?

It's particularly amazing that those who followed Bush lock-step into war did so despite the fact that the reasons Obama outlined in opposition to the invasion are essentially the same reasons that Dick Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld outlined in explaining why the Bush I admin didn't push into Iraq after liberating Kuwait in the Gulf War.

[wanna be drummer]

Hussein did.

Hussein had been bragging about his WMD for a while.

In fact, he's one of the main reason the world thought he had nukes, the way he talked about them

[Pb Derigable]

Hussein had been bragging about his WMD for a while.

In fact, he's one of the main reason the world thought he had nukes, the way he talked about them

Atleast you knew who i was taliking about. Since there are no WMD's (which i still find hard to belive) he knew he didn't have them. but then again they still find MiGs out there in the sand.