Misty Posted May 14, 2008 Share Posted May 14, 2008 If there's intelligent design (and there is...) ---- The there's an intelligent designer ! precisely. please don't tell me i came from slime under a rock or something. i prefer to live the fairytale, if that's what some people think it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pb Derigable Posted May 14, 2008 Share Posted May 14, 2008 Really PB? I wouldn't have expected this answer from you. Does this mean you believe in state sponsored charity and morality? Yes, those who are unmoral, go to Jail. Those who work receive charity in a form of a paycheck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gainsbarre Posted May 14, 2008 Share Posted May 14, 2008 Yes, those who are unmoral, go to Jail. Those who work receive charity in a form of a paycheck. And those who can't work...? gainsbarre - great sig, by the way Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pb Derigable Posted May 14, 2008 Share Posted May 14, 2008 And those who can't work...? Thanks Those who work, will receive charity in form of a paycheck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evermore Posted May 14, 2008 Share Posted May 14, 2008 Those who work, will receive charity in form of a paycheck. You're making no sense at all. A paycheck is not charity. It's a private exchange of goods and services of equal value. Charity is unilateral generosity and helpfulness, especially toward the needy or suffering. But anyway, if anyone is short on proof, here is a site that lists Hundreds of Proofs of God’s Existence. It's a spoof on Thomas Aquinas, I think. Pretty funny considereing it comes from atheists, who are rarely funny. I would want to make a correction to #24 though. It really should read like this. #24 ARGUMENT FROM GUITAR MASTERY (1) Jimmy Page is God. (2) Therefore, God exists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarlaxle 56 Posted May 14, 2008 Share Posted May 14, 2008 ^^^ Personally, this one is my favourite ARGUMENT FROM META-SMUGNESS (1) Fuck you. (2) Therefore, God exists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suz Posted May 14, 2008 Share Posted May 14, 2008 Sometimes I wonder why anybody cares. Is it not enough to be here, now, instead of assuming there's some kind of tangible OTHER? Our hearts are beating, the water's flowing, the earth is turning and it's a dot in the sky. We're big, we're little, we're important, we're insignificant -it's all true. Deal with it. Now one o' you fancy book learnin' types can tell me what the hell I'm talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suz Posted May 14, 2008 Share Posted May 14, 2008 Personally I think it's all about trust, and that starts with self trust. I think people get that beaten out of them by their families or cultures or religions. Then they might spend the rest of their lives expecting other people, or gods, or the world outside their doors to make up the difference.... only it doesn't work that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pb Derigable Posted May 14, 2008 Share Posted May 14, 2008 You're making no sense at all. A paycheck is not charity. It's a private exchange of goods and services of equal value. Charity is unilateral generosity and helpfulness, especially toward the needy or suffering. Really, it wasn't like i was making a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted May 15, 2008 Share Posted May 15, 2008 Belief in God really does dumbfound me. Truly. I'll never be able to grasp why free-thinking, rational and intelligent being would seriously conceive that books like the Bible etc hold any truth in them. I can accept a belief in the proverbial 'something out there' but an actual theistic god? Seriously? And I can't believe that free-thinking, rational, intelligent people can possibly believe that a big ball of nothing became all that is the universe without some form of interventional spark, or that we are simply here for no reason and there's nothing for us, with no point to live I see atheism as nihilism. Nothing to live for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gainsbarre Posted May 15, 2008 Share Posted May 15, 2008 Those who work, will receive charity in form of a paycheck. So I guess those who can't work, like disabled people, it's onto the streets for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew! Posted May 15, 2008 Share Posted May 15, 2008 And I can't believe that free-thinking, rational, intelligent people can possibly believe that a big ball of nothing became all that is the universe without some form of interventional spark, or that we are simply here for no reason and there's nothing for us, with no point to live I see atheism as nihilism. Nothing to live for. Maybe the reason you think that is because you aren't an atheist. I don't expect everyone to understand athiesm. Otherwise, everyone would be athiests. It's just a difference in perspective, I don't see why people have to link someone's intelligence to their beliefs. One of the things that I find interesting is that many people assume that their concept of time is correct, and the thought of questioning it never even crosses their minds. For example, that classic quote, "In the beginning, there was nothing." Maybe there wasn't a beginning. Maybe everything has always existed, there is no way to prove either side. If time is eternal, it doesn't seem too far-fetched that "all that is the universe" could be eternal as well. To me, anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bouncing~ship Posted May 15, 2008 Share Posted May 15, 2008 of course he/she does...Look at what the Vatican has just released http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/3066... now to the BBC... http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7399661.stm and now to an anniversary of 91 years...The anniversary of Fatima http://catholicism.about.com/b/2008/05/13/...y-of-fatima.htm (Pretty crazy on how the pope got shot...It is said that from the bullet the was lodged into his stomach, he placed it on the crown of Fatima.) If it's ok with the Vatican then it's ok with us...We don't want them to come killing now because we don't believe them. If you don't believe this...Honk on Bo-Bo. Free for a Debate. shall i say..."Case closed"? (My advice...Take your time with this post and have an open mind ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted May 15, 2008 Share Posted May 15, 2008 Maybe the reason you think that is because you aren't an atheist. I don't expect everyone to understand athiesm. Otherwise, everyone would be athiests. It's just a difference in perspective, I don't see why people have to link someone's intelligence to their beliefs.I was just responding in a sort of pissed off mood. I really don't mind if someone is atheist. It's theior choice. It's a logical choice and one of reasoning. I simply disagree..I didn't mean to make it sound so one-sided, my bad One of the things that I find interesting is that many people assume that their concept of time is correct, and the thought of questioning it never even crosses their minds. For example, that classic quote, "In the beginning, there was nothing." Maybe there wasn't a beginning. Maybe everything has always existed, there is no way to prove either side. If time is eternal, it doesn't seem too far-fetched that "all that is the universe" could be eternal as well. To me, anyways. Makes sense. But that would differ from the Big Bang, which I think would take the road of "First there was nothing, then dense gas, then the universe exploded into existence" I honestly don't know how things came to be. I don't think anyone ever will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alwizard03 Posted May 15, 2008 Share Posted May 15, 2008 I try to avoid these threads but I will make this one statement and I will leave you to your own Beliefs. I believe there is a God and He has set us some rules to live by and that those who try to do so will have something better to look forward to.Those that dont well They say Hell is really hot. Read the commandments and make a attempt to live by them and maybe your life will be better.You might even get front row tickets to a Zeppelin concert who knows.IF this is all there is whats the point? I know it gets hard to believe in anything when you turn on the news and out of a thirty minute show there is maybe one story thats not doom and gloom.That is the Media not the World ending there are tens of thousands of babies made daily so people are doing something besides killing themselves.Lots of weddings.A few laughs a few hugs love your parents love your kids and your husbands and wives. Be a friend to someone.Believe in something or someone and your life will be far better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gainsbarre Posted May 16, 2008 Share Posted May 16, 2008 I try to avoid these threads but I will make this one statement and I will leave you to your own Beliefs. I believe there is a God and He has set us some rules to live by and that those who try to do so will have something better to look forward to.Those that dont well They say Hell is really hot. Ah yes, the old Christian notion that you have to fear people into making the correct choice..."If you don't blah blah blah then you'll go to hell..." Christianity then isn't built on understanding, but fear... Being Christian, not because of your enlightenment through an understanding of your actions, but just through plain old fear of going to hell... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mangani Posted May 16, 2008 Share Posted May 16, 2008 And I can't believe that free-thinking, rational, intelligent people can possibly believe that a big ball of nothing became all that is the universe without some form of interventional spark, So how did the 'interventional spark' come about then? Where did God come from? It's the same bloody argument.LOL. or that we are simply here for no reason and there's nothing for us, with no point to live LIFE itself is the point. I see atheism as nihilism. Nothing to live for. I'm living for the here and now. I exist for what is occurring at this very moment. I don't live to die so that I can experience something that likely doesn't even exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ledsabbath Posted May 16, 2008 Share Posted May 16, 2008 I try to avoid these threads but I will make this one statement and I will leave you to your own Beliefs. I believe there is a God and He has set us some rules to live by and that those who try to do so will have something better to look forward to.Those that dont well They say Hell is really hot. Read the commandments and make a attempt to live by them and maybe your life will be better.You might even get front row tickets to a Zeppelin concert who knows.IF this is all there is whats the point? I know it gets hard to believe in anything when you turn on the news and out of a thirty minute show there is maybe one story thats not doom and gloom.That is the Media not the World ending there are tens of thousands of babies made daily so people are doing something besides killing themselves.Lots of weddings.A few laughs a few hugs love your parents love your kids and your husbands and wives. Be a friend to someone.Believe in something or someone and your life will be far better. Ah yes, the old Christian notion that you have to fear people into making the correct choice..."If you don't blah blah blah then you'll go to hell..." Christianity then isn't built on understanding, but fear... Being Christian, not because of your enlightenment through an understanding of your actions, but just through plain old fear of going to hell... This one is a tough one for me, and to be honest, I can see both sides of the argument. I've been raised in a fundamentalist Christian environment all my life, that actually become more fundamentalist as time went on. And to be fair to alwizard03, he did also say that believing in God gives you the hope of Heaven, and a better life here and now. But also, as someone who hasn't stepped foot in a church for years now, I can see the point of Gainsbarre. All I can say is that to me, there are two types of Christians. Those motivated by the love of God, and those motivated by the fear of Hell. And both can be pushy, obnoxious, loveless, etc. I'll admit freely I'm in a no mans land when it comes to my belief in Christianity. I've had so many bad experiences, so my perspective is clouded. But Gainsbarre, I totally understand why you're put off. It just doesn't sound right when someone says "believe in what I say or burn in Hell". Like some sort of threat. I understand that the message of Jesus contains both the promise of Heaven and the warning of Hell. Maybe because we don't see enough love and compassion indicative of Heaven is why we take offense at the prospect of Hell. I don't know anymore. So I understand you well Gainsbarre. And to you alwizard03, let me also tell you this. You come here and put this post up on God, which is all well and good. I looked at your profile, and you like of course Zeppelin, plus my favourite band, Sabbath and other bands like The Who. Just remember. The vast majority of conservative fundamentalist Christians would say that you are not a proper Christian because you listen to this type of music. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but I have to tell you that. I should know. Been there, done that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alwizard03 Posted May 16, 2008 Share Posted May 16, 2008 This one is a tough one for me, and to be honest, I can see both sides of the argument. I've been raised in a fundamentalist Christian environment all my life, that actually become more fundamentalist as time went on. And to be fair to alwizard03, he did also say that believing in God gives you the hope of Heaven, and a better life here and now. But also, as someone who hasn't stepped foot in a church for years now, I can see the point of Gainsbarre. All I can say is that to me, there are two types of Christians. Those motivated by the love of God, and those motivated by the fear of Hell. And both can be pushy, obnoxious, loveless, etc. I'll admit freely I'm in a no mans land when it comes to my belief in Christianity. I've had so many bad experiences, so my perspective is clouded. But Gainsbarre, I totally understand why you're put off. It just doesn't sound right when someone says "believe in what I say or burn in Hell". Like some sort of threat. I understand that the message of Jesus contains both the promise of Heaven and the warning of Hell. Maybe because we don't see enough love and compassion indicative of Heaven is why we take offense at the prospect of Hell. I don't know anymore. So I understand you well Gainsbarre. And to you alwizard03, let me also tell you this. You come here and put this post up on God, which is all well and good. I looked at your profile, and you like of course Zeppelin, plus my favourite band, Sabbath and other bands like The Who. Just remember. The vast majority of conservative fundamentalist Christians would say that you are not a proper Christian because you listen to this type of music. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but I have to tell you that. I should know. Been there, done that. Yes I aware of that and of course it does not say in the bible if I listen to heathen Music I will go to Hell just that I have to believe in God and Jesus none of us can live up to the standards Jesus set all we can do is try .I once gave away all of my music and then I realized it was a little crazy and went out and bought it again .I now have 2700 cds and no I am not giving them away again.I like you dont go to Church like I should mainly because in my experiance it has became a buisness which I dont believe is what it was intended to be .I still believe in God and I still believe in Jesus.I hate to tell you this but it does not matter what religon you believe in they all have a penalty clause for not believing it is not just a christian thing.They would not like my hair either.My Great Grandmother used to read Me a Bible quote about it being a shame for a Man to have long hair but as i told her it may be a shame but every picture I have ever saw of Jesus He had long Hair and it is not a sin so I will live with the shame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ledsabbath Posted May 16, 2008 Share Posted May 16, 2008 Yes I aware of that and of course it does not say in the bible if I listen to heathen Music I will go to Hell just that I have to believe in God and Jesus none of us can live up to the standards Jesus set all we can do is try .I once gave away all of my music and then I realized it was a little crazy and went out and bought it again .I now have 2700 cds and no I am not giving them away again.I like you dont go to Church like I should mainly because in my experiance it has became a buisness which I dont believe is what it was intended to be .I still believe in God and I still believe in Jesus.I hate to tell you this but it does not matter what religon you believe in they all have a penalty clause for not believing it is not just a christian thing.They would not like my hair either.My Great Grandmother used to read Me a Bible quote about it being a shame for a Man to have long hair but as i told her it may be a shame but every picture I have ever saw of Jesus He had long Hair and it is not a sin so I will live with the shame. Hey, good answer. I am nearly 3 times your age, and have become bitter and hardened with religion and especially Christianity. I honestly hope that doesn't happen to you like it has to me. You seem to be a genuine person, so I wish you well in your journey of faith. And remember: Zeppelin and Sabbath rule!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alwizard03 Posted May 16, 2008 Share Posted May 16, 2008 Hey, good answer. I am nearly 3 times your age, and have become bitter and hardened with religion and especially Christianity. I honestly hope that doesn't happen to you like it has to me. You seem to be a genuine person, so I wish you well in your journey of faith. And remember: Zeppelin and Sabbath rule!! I wish You were three times my age but I turn 50 in a couple of months so I doubt that could be possible.That would make you 150 years old and if your posted age is correct of 42 I would have to be 14 .If that were true I would be home Mom would be paying the bills.I would have just started getting high which I dont do anymore and I would be having way more sex than I do now. Take care not giving you a hard time but i think you confused me with someone younger than me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ledsabbath Posted May 16, 2008 Share Posted May 16, 2008 Take care not giving you a hard time but i think you confused me with someone younger than me. Ummm..........yeah! How the Hell did I get that wrong? I think I looked up a few profiles and confused you with some dude who was 15. Gosh, you're an older fart than me. Hehe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alwizard03 Posted May 16, 2008 Share Posted May 16, 2008 Ummm..........yeah! How the Hell did I get that wrong? I think I looked up a few profiles and confused you with some dude who was 15. Gosh, you're an older fart than me. Hehe. Its all good take care. AL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bouncing~ship Posted May 17, 2008 Share Posted May 17, 2008 of course he/she does...Look at what the Vatican has just released http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/3066... now to the BBC... http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7399661.stm and now to an anniversary of 91 years...The anniversary of Fatima http://catholicism.about.com/b/2008/05/13/...y-of-fatima.htm (Pretty crazy on how the pope got shot...It is said that from the bullet the was lodged into his stomach, he placed it on the crown of Fatima.) If it's ok with the Vatican then it's ok with us...We don't want them to come killing now because we don't believe them. If you don't believe this...Honk on Bo-Bo. Free for a Debate. shall i say..."Case closed"? (My advice...Take your time with this post and have an open mind ) this is some crazy shit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted May 18, 2008 Share Posted May 18, 2008 LIFE itself is the point. If theres no god or cosmic being or what have you, I'd argue that life is a mistake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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