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Dancin'Days

4th of July

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Sunday, the Lt. Dan Band is playing on base in Grafenwoehr, Germany to Celebrate the fourth. Has anybody heard them?

Went to a beautiful lakehouse in the hill country. Canoeing, fishing, swimming. Tried something on my bucket list - Zip Lining over the cypress tress. It was awesome. Fireworks were beautiful in every direction. So were the ice cold beers and vodka. Cheers! To the USA

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Went to a beautiful lakehouse in the hill country. Canoeing, fishing, swimming. Tried something on my bucket list - Zip Lining over the cypress tress. It was awesome. Fireworks were beautiful in every direction. So were the ice cold beers and vodka. Cheers! To the USA

Sounds like a blast, glad you had a good time!

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I'm not going to respond to the response to my post..besides, Del Zeppnile

already astutely pointed out the flaws in the response to my post, so the point

is moot by now.

I'll just say it was hot this weekend, but it's always hot in July, so nothing new there.

The 4th was great...went to the Hollywood Bowl for the 50th Anniversary LA Dodger

celebration with Randy Newman and fireworks...then, later watched with friends

the Angels win their game vs. Toronto that we tivo'd, while drinking whiskey and

tequila shots.

Saturday, watched the Venus vs. Serena Women's Wimbledon Final in the morning...then

went out to play some tennis for a couple hours...then went to the beach with friends and

tweeked my back surfing.

Today is my godson's birthday...he tunrs 13, a teenager at last!...so after just watching

the great Men's Wimbledon match, am heading over to celebrate his birthday with his

family.

Hope all of your 4th of July weekend were equally fun...ciao!

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The guys play horseshoes; the kids play badminton and everyone plays bocce. :)

I spent the day on Padre Island- it looks much like your picture. Ultimate freedom, unspoiled native beach with a fishing pole or kayak- doing as I please. What could be better? B)

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People can believe and feel that the 4th of July is whatever they want it to be to them. You have no right to tell them they're wrong.

Of course I do, when they are wrong.

Just like Christmas and Easter and Thanksgiving and other holidays have meanings to people that may not be shared by others. If that's what he thinks the 4th of July is, that's what he thinks it is.

Even when he/she is wrong?

4th July should be about Independence from Britain, not 'freedom' and 'liberty' because that wasn't the case now was it?

I happen to think that the 4th of July is an important day for Americans, for what it represents to us and what it meant to the founding of this nation. You're free to think otherwise but don't tell me I'm wrong.

It's not about 'feedom' and liberty' and if you think than then you are wrong.

If you heard British people declaring the British Empire was about enlightenment and knowledge being brought to savages are you telling me that you would have no right to tell them they would be incorrect? They would be wrong for claiming that and you would have every right to tell them they should not think it.

Furthermore, you're not an American.

What's that got to do with the price of bacon? We aren't allowed to discuss history and give opinions if we aren't from the countries being discussed???

Does that mean you can't discuss the Nazi Holocaust if you aren't German or Jewish?

Ordinarily I love getting opinions from those not of this country about things happening in this country, especially our politics, but the 4th of July has particular meaning for us, a meaning you don't share.

Because some Americans meaning of it is wrong and has been skewed by the mists of historical time. That's why I don't share it.

How can you possibly know what such an important holiday to this nation means to its citizens when you are not one?

4th July is/should be about Independence from Britain and the foundation of a new country. It wasn't and shouldn't be about 'liberty' and 'freedom'. That would be neglecting the truth.

Remember, I didn't come into this thread shouting my mouth off for no reason. I saw a post referring exactly to the type of things I am talking about and that's when I stepped in.

If every post in this thread was just about "hey 4th July lets have a party" then I wouldn't care.

I don't go around acting like I understand the importance of Guy Fawkes Day, do I?

Guy Fawkes is not a part of American history. 4th July and the War of Independence is also a part of BRITISH history. Did you forget that little point? :rolleyes:

And it wouldn't bother me if you did give your views on Guy Fawkes.

After the American colonists won the War Of Independence, did the black slaves gain their freedom and liberty? Were the native Americans left alone to get on with their lives in peace? So where does all this 'freedom and liberty' come from?

Britain never ever claims the Empire was about freedom and liberty or doing the right thing.

Even as late as the 1960s hundreds of thousands of young Americans were forced by their government to have to go and fight in a war in south east Asia against an enemy that didn't even threaten the U.S.A. If they didn't they were sent to jail. I don't call that 'freedom and liberty'. When a government can tell you that they own your life and have more say over it than you do I don't call that being free. In fact I would say that was a more tyrannical practice than anything the British did during the 1770s.

Edited by Mangani

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But at least the Brits had representation in Parliment. Whenever you have a system were there is taxation without due representation, then of course there will eventually become a point where colonist are going to feel put upon. Americans had no interest in paying for Britian's European war. It was not our concern.

Yet, the American Colonists were happy for the British taxpayer back home to stump up the costs for the French and Indian war and the Colonist's safety against the French threat. The Colonists were very concerned about the French threat in the 1750s.

In due course, taxation WITH representation would likely have occurred. Abolition of slavery didn't happen overnight. Women gaining the right to vote didn't happen overnight. Etc etc etc. It takes time for the status quo to change. There was actually a lot of support in Britain for the Colonist's concerns and viewpoints. However we do know that there was also a significant number of American Colonials who saw the 'taxation without representation question' as a convenient excuse to break away from Britain and they used this as a rallying cry.

Do you really think Britian would have acted in any other manner concerning the French competition for land and influence in North America despite the wishes of the colonists? Britian did not go to war agains the French in North America for any other reason than it was in Britian's interest to do so.

And at that moment in the time, the Colonists and the Colonies were seen as British and an extension of Britain. Don't forget, this was the first major far overseas territory Britain had.

Are we to assume that Britian fought the Japanese in India for sake of the people of India alone?

Not alone of course not. The equation is slightly different though because the population of India was not largely made up of folks of British heritage. The Colonies were. 2 million folks or so of largely British heritage.

Which in other words meant the British crown and those companies sanctioned by the crown, would make less money if the Americans won their independece. Please don't tell me that you actually believe that Britain's sole interest in North America was to provide a high standard of living and protection from the French. Of course money had something to do with it. Afterall, we are not communists.

Nope, I don't believe that, I never said that and British history doesn't claim that. The fact is though, the Colonials were HAPPY to have British muscle and power behind them when it looked like their then (1750s) freedoms and life choices could be threatened by French presence on the North American continent.

It seems though that as soon as the French threat to the Colonials way of life was nullified then extinguished, the Colonials started to get other ideas. Would the Colonists still have rebelled against the British if the French were still a threat to them in the 1770s?

If Britain's presense in America was all about protecting colonist and high standards of living,

Which I never claimed it was and which British history doesn't claim it was.

why didn't Britain end slavery in America before 1776?

The fight to end it was still going on in Britain at that time and it took a good few more decades. The fact is, Britain ended slavery before America did and Britain was the major player in the abolition of the slave trade.

Besides, Britain only outlawed the overseas trading of slaves in 1807. However Britain continued to allow slavery in her colonies up until 1833... and in some isolated areas for years beyond that.

Britain still ended it before America did. British ships were the ships on the high seas hunting down slave traders. America had to fight a bloody civil war to completely end slavery.

I have and have never had any problems with Americans celebrating 4th July in the right context. When it is exaggerated and when some claim it signifies freedom and liberty and that without the Revolution they would still be living under so called 'tyranny' etc etc or that America would not be the 'free' country it is today then I get a bit irked because that does not jibe with historical fact.

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I mean both Australia and the USA sought independence within 150 years of the beginning of colonisation, but I guess the basic difference is that British migration to the USA was based on people wanting to get away from Britain, whereas British migration to Australia, in the beginning, was generally forced.

So it, i think, resulted in two different mindsets in both countries, with the USA wanting a forced break with Britain and Australia wanting independence but happy to retain close ties with Britain.

I would debate that slightly. Yes in the beginning, early immigrants such as those on the Mayflower wanted a land totally away and separate from Britain. However, Britain quickly established the Colonies and everyone knew they were British. Most of the immigrants to the American Colonies up until the 1770s (convicts apart)went there precisely because they were British Colonies, they enjoyed the fact that the language was mainly English and the lifestyle, culture, customs and traditions were largely British.

If they didn't want to go to a British Colony then they would have gone elsewhere....to the French colonies in Canada or the Spanish/Portuguese colonies in South America or any of the Caribbean islands etc etc.

Those that didn't want anything to do with Britain would not have chosen to have gone to the American colonies in the 1700s.

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I would debate that slightly. Yes in the beginning, early immigrants such as those on the Mayflower wanted a land totally away and separate from Britain. However, Britain quickly established the Colonies and everyone knew they were British. Most of the immigrants to the American Colonies up until the 1770s (convicts apart)went there precisely because they were British Colonies, they enjoyed the fact that the language was mainly English and the lifestyle, culture, customs and traditions were largely British.

If they didn't want to go to a British Colony then they would have gone elsewhere....to the French colonies in Canada or the Spanish/Portuguese colonies in South America or any of the Caribbean islands etc etc.

Those that didn't want anything to do with Britain would not have chosen to have gone to the American colonies in the 1700s.

I agree with you Mangani. Ten grandfathers ago (1600's) my grandfather left Warwickshire for the U.S. My grandfather told me family history that only family members would be privy to before the day of the Internet. I thought he had a vivid imagination (or was slightly mad) before I did the research. B)

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Hi all,

Yes,nothing pissed off the British here across the pond.No,....we just one day woke up,started a war and had our own country,....ok,.....

KB

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"Today's the fourth of July

Another June has gone by

And when they light up our town I just think

What a waste of gunpowder and sky"

~ Aimee Mann "4th of July"

Happy 4th of July! Enjoy your Independence Day my fellow Americans.

I miss watching the 4th of July concert by the Boston Pops with Arthur Fiedler that used to be on PBS every year when I was a kid.

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"Today's the fourth of July

Another June has gone by

And when they light up our town I just think

What a waste of gunpowder and sky"

~ Aimee Mann "4th of July"

Happy 4th of July! Enjoy your Independence Day my fellow Americans.

I miss watching the 4th of July concert by the Boston Pops with Arthur Fiedler that used to be on PBS every year when I was a kid.

Happy Independence Day!

The only Arthur in town today is the storm. The Pops concert and fireworks were rescheduled to last night....a wise move. We are getting so much rain we're getting flash flood alerts on cell phones and such.

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Happy Independence Day my fellow Americans! Hope all your festivities are as fun as possible - sorry jb126 that Arthur has ruined the plans for most from the mid-Atlantic to New England. Stay safe!

:)

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Happy Independence Day my fellow Americans! Hope all your festivities are as fun as possible - sorry jb126 that Arthur has ruined the plans for most from the mid-Atlantic to New England. Stay safe!

:)

Same to you Walter. I am making these beef ribs that are cut exactly like baby back pork ribs. I do them on the grill to start and then put them in a crock pot with barbecue sauce. Cook for hours. I cut them individually before I grill them. the acid of the sauce and the long cooking soften them up. I doubt they will be as good as the pork ribs but going to try. I wish I had a good cut of Venison.

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Happy 4th everyone!

You should all be watching "1776" on TCM right now!! Especially if you're stuck inside with bad weather (confession: It's lovely here. I'm watching anyway :) )

http://popwatch.ew.com/2014/07/04/watch-1776-4th-of-july/

+ 1,000,000! :thumbsup:

1776 is one of my favourite musicals...the book by Peter Stone and songs by Sherman Edwards are fantastic. Right from the opening song, "Sit Down, John", you're hooked.

These aren't musty, stuffy powdered-wigged museum pieces as the Founding Fathers were often presented in school and history books. These are living, breathing men with lusts and desires, passions and weaknesses...they eat, drink, and shit.

No, it is not 100% historically accurate...some people and events are changed for dramatic effect. But the main gist of the musical...the debate over whether the Colonies should declare their independence from King George...is riveting.

William Daniels as John Adams (with a little Sam Adams thrown in), a pre-"White Shadow" Ken Howard as Thomas Jefferson, Howard De Silva as Ben Franklin, are all superb.

Highly watchable and I recommend it unreservedly. Just saw it again last night with the director Peter Hunt in person.

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Too bad about Hurricane Arthur. Hope it doesn't hit the New England/Northeast area too hard.

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We're an American band - Grand Funk Railroad

American made - George Thorogood Edited by luvlz2

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One more soldier - Eddie Money

I'm American - Queensryche

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Some more American artists

Lawyers, guns and money - Warren Zevon

- They want it all - David Crosby - Graham Nash

Sweet home Alabama - Lynyrd Skynrd Edited by luvlz2

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I have and have never had any problems with Americans celebrating 4th July in the right context. When it is exaggerated and when some claim it signifies freedom and liberty and that without the Revolution they would still be living under so called 'tyranny' etc etc or that America would not be the 'free' country it is today then I get a bit irked because that does not jibe with historical fact.

WTF??? Just curious, but what do the British do on the 4th of July? Have a parade for some rich crotchety old woman or something?

I found these comments to be really offensive. We can celebrate our independence from tyrants any way we want to.

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I think "1776" is good, too. Also, there are at least two separate (and good) narrative, documentary mini-series about the "Revolution" which regularly air on television. (On the History Channel and PBS, I believe.) Of course, there are also any number of excellent books about the Revolution and the Founding Fathers.

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@3:53

This is the uncut version of tweekers on woodstock 94' it has the cover of Jimi Hendrixs' national anthem with the sounds of bombs exploding done by Les Claypool on BASS!?!?!?!

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