Gainsbarre Posted July 7, 2008 Share Posted July 7, 2008 It has taken me years... But I'm still not any closer to figuring out whether Velvet Underground were crap or not... The album I'm most familiar with, like everybody else, is VU & Nico, now I've always rather liked Nico, and one of my dreams in life was to produce an album for her because I had a great album title: Beef Nico. But sadly she's dead, so I'm not going to be able to do that. I listen to the VU and I know every indie musician from Brooklyn to Bury St Edmunds raves about them and they get lauded as the greatest musical influence since, I don't know, Fanny Brice? But I wonder, did they just influence and encourage people who are fairly crap at playing instruments, singing and writing songs? I mean I do confess there is a certain charm about VU, the titles and lyrics were always interesting, but was it all just load of bullshit? Were they just a bunch of talentless, shitty poseurs, incapable of singing/strumming/keeping time who's only claim to fame was Andy Warhol? Or is the praise justified? I don't know, you tell me... All I know is that I couldn't sit through a John Cale solo set without falling asleep twice... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kashmir330 Posted July 7, 2008 Share Posted July 7, 2008 No. The Velvet Underground is not some shitty or crap band. They happen to be one of my favorite bands but they do take some time to get into them. I don't think they wanted Warhol around much longer after Velvet Underground and Nico because White Light/White Heat was done without Nico and Warhol wanted Nico to sing more songs which wasn't much to the bands liking. If you don't like The Velvet Underground and Nico album I would suggest getting or hearing Loaded (if you haven't already) because it's probably the most easy to listen to Velvet Underground album. I love all of their albums but they do certainly take some time to get into. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hot dog Posted July 7, 2008 Share Posted July 7, 2008 I love them too - one of the true originals ploughing their own course outside of the usual influences. I saw them too - on their 1993 European tour in London. Despite this being Reed's dreaded 'mullet' period they were great and nice to see them all on stage together - rather an unexpected reunion too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Posted July 7, 2008 Share Posted July 7, 2008 Velvet Underground are definitely NOT CRAP! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JethroTull Posted July 8, 2008 Share Posted July 8, 2008 Your question inspired me to youtube Lou Reed. One of my biggest concert disappointments was Lou Reed in 1976. A sax player instead of a guitarist. At the time, I was an opinionated 21 year old. Needless to say, I thought this clip was okay...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kakdaddy Posted July 8, 2008 Share Posted July 8, 2008 The Velvets are fantastic but are overrated like most great bands who werent generally accepted at the time of their existance by the lack of radio, tv, magazines coverage, thus leading to very few record buyers knowing who they were at the time. I'm listening to one of those bands right now, the Flying Burrito Brothers who the Eagles owe their entire career to, but that's another story. If you want to listen to less abrasive VU stuff besides "Loaded" I recommend their self titled third album & their posthumous album"VU" that came out in the 80's. Both have the most beautiful songs that they ever recorded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted July 8, 2008 Share Posted July 8, 2008 I love Velvet Underground. Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmie ray Posted July 8, 2008 Share Posted July 8, 2008 The Velvets are fantastic but are overrated As a New York resident, I would say all the famous acts from this area are tremendously over-rated. Pat Benatar, Billy Joel, Debbie Gibson, Twisted Sister, New York Dolls, etc - none of these would have made a dent anywhere else. Blue Oyster Cult (Soft White Underbelly) and The Good Rats (local fun guys) would be the only exceptions, to me. Andy Warhol had 14 minutes and 59 seconds too much exposure, too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted July 8, 2008 Share Posted July 8, 2008 As a New York resident, I would say all the famous acts from this area are tremendously over-rated. Pat Benatar, Billy Joel, Debbie Gibson, Twisted Sister, New York Dolls, etc - none of these would have made a dent anywhere else. Blue Oyster Cult (Soft White Underbelly) and The Good Rats (local fun guys) would be the only exceptions, to me. Andy Warhol had 14 minutes and 59 seconds too much exposure, too... I don't think Velvet Underground is overrated. Think of the huge impact they've had. Everyone, from David Bowie, Iggy Pop and the whole NY punk scene to todays indie pop/rock bands like Strokes are influenced of VU's four records. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmie ray Posted July 8, 2008 Share Posted July 8, 2008 I took Gainsbarre's inquiry as a measure of musicianship versus gimmickery. I happen to live near Gimmick City Central. No question of influence about the subject - but it does nothing for my ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gainsbarre Posted July 9, 2008 Author Share Posted July 9, 2008 I don't think Velvet Underground is overrated. Think of the huge impact they've had. Everyone, from David Bowie, Iggy Pop and the whole NY punk scene to todays indie pop/rock bands like Strokes are influenced of VU's four records. Yeah, I love David Bowie, I've never listened to Iggy even though I've seen him live twice, and when The Strokes brought out their second album, I thouht it was laughable shit... I took Gainsbarre's inquiry as a measure of musicianship versus gimmickery. I happen to live near Gimmick City Central. No question of influence about the subject - but it does nothing for my ears. Yeah, I mean VU obviously did influence people, but you wonder whether it was founded in music or just style/presentation. There's nothing wrong with the VU apart from some of their songs being absolutely dreadful, but you know, not all of them of course, I guess I just don't understand why they are so lauded... It's like The Ramones, I don't get The Ramones and why they are olympian Gods. I guess what I'm trying to say is punk has never meant anything to me and probably never will. But that's me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumpeller Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 I love them too - one of the true originals ploughing their own course outside of the usual influences. I saw them too - on their 1993 European tour in London. Despite this being Reed's dreaded 'mullet' period they were great and nice to see them all on stage together - rather an unexpected reunion too! A top band in my opinion. I saw them a couple of times druing their 1993 European tour too. They only played for about a month. My first show was on June 5th at a small venue called The Forum in London. Really amazing to see them play at all, let alone in a small place like this. The band really enjoyed themselves at this one, as did the audience. However ..... Near the end of the tour I saw them again at the Glastonbury Festival on June 25th. Reed and Cale were apparently falling out big time by then. It really showed in the performance. Such a shame and such a contrast to the fantastic Forum gig. Mind you, the last bands on the pyramid stage at Glastonbury that night were: The Velvet Underground ..... followed by: Robert Plant ..... followed by: The Black Crowes That's got to be a few hours well spent (and not forgetting Rolf Harris earlier in the day!!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmie ray Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 Yeah, I mean VU obviously did influence people, but you wonder whether it was founded in music or just style/presentation. It's like The Ramones, I don't get The Ramones and why they are olympian Gods. I guess what I'm trying to say is punk has never meant anything to me and probably never will. But that's me. And me. I only listen to music, not look at it. I never went to live shows until I was about 20 years old. I avoided watching MTV, or whatever. I don't do the U-tube thing. And Zep could have worn tweed suits, for all I care. I saw the Ramones - they jumped around and sneered a lot (I could swear "alot" is the right grammer, but I don't need my English corrected by some wise ass again) - but musically, it was abysmal. I don't want to hurt others' feelings, but this is the subject that was brought up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JethroTull Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 It's like The Ramones, I don't get The Ramones and why they are olympian Gods. I'm a big douche bag. You are on here talking about the VU and I start talking about Lou Reed in 1976. WTF is wrong with me. Loser. Anyway, enough about me.....I remember back around 76/77/78 going to CBGB's and watching various warm-up acts and thinking "are these guys serious, is this the act?". After 4-5 songs it became obvious, it WAS the act. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JethroTull Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 And me. I only listen to music, not look at it. I never went to live shows until I was about 20 years old. I avoided watching MTV, or whatever. I don't do the U-tube thing. And Zep could have worn tweed suits, for all I care. I saw the Ramones - they jumped around and sneered a lot (I could swear "alot" is the right grammer, but I don't need my English corrected by some wise ass again) - but musically, it was abysmal. I don't want to hurt others' feelings, but this is the subject that was brought up. I admit, it really is a bit effed up!! I NEVER saw the Ramones. On record, I thought they took some simple musical ideas with some interesting lyrics and made it something special. If you listen to some of the rockers from the 50's, songs during the mid 60s' and even some early Beatles, the beauty is in the simplicity of what is going down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatbo Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 I'm a big douche bag. You are on here talking about the VU and I start talking about Lou Reed in 1976. WTF is wrong with me. Loser. Anyway, enough about me.....I remember back around 76/77/78 going to CBGB's and watching various warm-up acts and thinking "are these guys serious, is this the act?". After 4-5 songs it became obvious, it WAS the act. you can blame danny fields, a&r at electra records initially. what you saw as the ramones, danny tried to do first with iggy pop and the stooges. he even tried to do the jackets and hair thing with them (including everyone changing thier last name to 'stooge')but iggy told him to get stuffed. iggy wasn't suprised when later in new york fields introduced him to the ramones and iggy thought 'well, danny got his boy band'. a great book about alot of this is "please kill me" by legs mcneil... go here and preview about 30 pages of it if you like: please kill me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatbo Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 great tunes! interesting live. nico=boring. lou reed as a junked up new york smart-ass was a good listen, always a time bomb. that said, they've never had a chance to become my favorite band. not enough dynamics, too much lou... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 I've never seen Lou Reed or VU live, not even on DVD or VHS, so I guess I can say I love them a 100% for their music and nothing else. BUT, if I watch any band in consert, it will be even better if there is something to look at and not only a great performance of the songs. I mean, I rather watch Mick Jagger than Liam Gallagher, if you know what I mean. Rock'n'roll is about attitude as well as music. I don't mind bands having gimmicks, but they have to deliver musically as well, otherwise it will be of no interest. Ramones is a good laugh, nothing serious.. I mean, their song Now I Wanna Sniff Some Glue says it all. They made the 60's "Do The Monkey" songs their own and brought it to the disillusioned late 70's punk scene, f'n brilliant IMHO. Back to VU: I like the monotonous song structure and the sonic guitars of Sterling Morrison, but I understand it's not for everybody. I think the unreleased verve album, that was about to be their fourth album but was later released in the 80's as VU, is more accessible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 beatbo, Please Kill Me is an excellent book! Very entertaining! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarlaxle 56 Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 I think they were brilliant, nuff' said. I don't know just where I'm going But I'm gonna try for the kingdom, if I can 'Cause it makes me feel like I'm a man When I put a spike into my vein And I'll tell ya, things aren't quite the same When I'm rushing on my run And I feel just like Jesus' son And I guess that I just don't know And I guess that I just don't know I have made the big decision I'm gonna try to nullify my life 'Cause when the blood begins to flow When it shoots up the dropper's neck When I'm closing in on death And you can't help me now, you guys And all you sweet girls with all your sweet talk You can all go take a walk And I guess that I just don't know And I guess that I just don't know I wish that I was born a thousand years ago I wish that I'd sail the darkened seas On a great big clipper ship Going from this land here to that In a sailor's suit and cap Away from the big city Where a man can not be free Of all of the evils of this town And of himself, and those around Oh, and I guess that I just don't know Oh, and I guess that I just don't know Heroin, be the death of me Heroin, it's my wife and it's my life Because a mainer to my vein Leads to a center in my head And then I'm better off and dead Because when the smack begins to flow I really don't care anymore About all the Jim-Jim's in this town And all the politicians makin' crazy sounds And everybody puttin' everybody else down And all the dead bodies piled up in mounds 'Cause when the smack begins to flow Then I really don't care anymore Ah, when the heroin is in my blood And that blood is in my head Then thank God that I'm as good as dead Then thank your God that I'm not aware And thank God that I just don't care And I guess I just don't know And I guess I just don't know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfman Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 They were way better then ABBA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gainsbarre Posted July 10, 2008 Author Share Posted July 10, 2008 They were way better then ABBA! In your opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kakdaddy Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 When I said in an early post that I think that VU is overrated, it certainly wasnt about their music. They are overrated due to "serious rock journalists". It's almost "serious rock journalism 101" to write some overwinded, romanticized, account of the band. Who gives a shit if VU hung out with Andy Warhol & wannabe's from the Factory? I dont, & I didn't when Mick Jagger did too. Rock journalists are always touting the same seminal bands who didnt make it big from the past year after year after year, unfortunately VU is at the top of the heap with Big Star, the Replacements, Tom Waits, Gram Parsons, the Stooges, Can, etc not far behind. VU could be very abrasive with songs like "Black Angels Death Song" & "Sister Ray", that was their John Cage & Ornette Coleman influence. But then they did the most beautiful songs ever like "Sunday Morning" & "Stephanie Says". This band had a great range then & now. So praise for their music is deserved, it speaks for itself, just dont listen to some asshole waxing romantically about Max's in the 60's or CB's in the 70's. It's rubbish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zosodude13 Posted July 13, 2008 Share Posted July 13, 2008 I am quite fond of them. White Light/White Heat is my favorite album. They were a much better band with Cale in the line-up, IMO. That was the band at their peak, and while WL/WH was a sloppy noise experiment, it still was beyond anything they did with Andy Warhol (excluding Heroin). If anything, they suffer from reverse psychology as in they are so underrated and underappriciated, they seem to be overrated... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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