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ZoSoDragon

Oh CANADA!

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Hi:

There was a protest in Montreal yesterday when Charles and Camilla were visiting. They are o.k. Charles was there to inspect a regiment.

T'was a very clean and pacifist protest. We have nothing against Charles. Only against what he represent.

Against something that we, "French-Canadians", never wanted. That was force down our throats.

It's about time we get rid of this archaic thing that is the Crown. We're not in 1558 anymore.

Would be better for us all with a Republic of Canada. Even though I'm an Independandist.

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Charles,

One word for ya: conquered.

:)

I piss my French friends and relatives off with that one too, so feel free to flame me. I'm of Scottish/Irish descent and most of my family disliked the English, so when I was at the age to understand most of our family/world history I'd say: "what are we doing in Canada anyway?". No one could answer me....and still can't.

I am Canadian and proud to be Canadian.

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Charles,

One word for ya: conquered.

:)

I piss my French friends and relatives off with that one too, so feel free to flame me. I'm of Scottish/Irish descent and most of my family disliked the English, so when I was at the age to understand most of our family/world history I'd say: "what are we doing in Canada anyway?". No one could answer me....and still can't.

I am Canadian and proud to be Canadian.

I'm not sure if I understand your point of view correctly.

Are you a monarchist?

'cause my post was about that.

I don't dislike the English people, far from it. I dislike their Crown. What it has done to my people, through History. They tried to forbid our culture, our religion, our tongue, etc. Sure, that was years ago, but they never gave any excuses at all. I think some of my Scots and Irish brothers and sisters will understand what i'm saying.

I'd love to be proud of being Canadian. But it is a immense and beautiful country that is not mine.

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I'm not sure if I understand your point of view correctly.

Are you a monarchist?

'cause my post was about that.

I don't dislike the English people, far from it. I dislike their Crown. What it has done to my people, through History. They tried to forbid our culture, our religion, our tongue, etc. Sure, that was years ago, but they never gave any excuses at all. I think some of my Scots and Irish brothers and sisters will understand what i'm saying.

I'd love to be proud of being Canadian. But it is a immense and beautiful country that is not mine.

Charles, I was born in Scotland but raised here. I chose to become a Canadian citizen and therefore, I consider Canada to be my country. I'm curious as to why you don't think it's your country.

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Sit down this weekdend with a copy of Braveheart and you can see what they did to my ancestors - still makes me a proud Canadian and I will never whine or be unhappy about what has taken place in History, who did what to who, etc. Have to get clarifications Charles; what is an "Independandist" exactly, and can this term be utilized when we're refering to you being Canadian - you are a Canadian citizen correct (a three part question)?

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Ally, you show me your kilt and I'll show you mine?

:)

Your on RD :D

Still have the old man's regimental kilt. He was from the southwest of Scotland but was in the Gordon Highlanders during the war. How could that be you may ask ? Well let's just say he started out in the HLI but got himself into a bit of trouble while with them :o

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Well, I would like to see Quebec be independant one of these days just like I would love to see Canada being independant from Great- Britain. Federalism has never worked. Mainly because each provinces have its own history, its own culture, etc. Someone from Nova-Scotia doesn't think like someone from B.C. They don't share the same 'reality'.

And, technically speaking, yes, I am Canadian. Last time I check I was living in Montreal! :P

But in the bottom of my heart, Quebec is my country. I was speaking the other day with a friend of mine who's from New-Brunswick and he told me that, for him, Acady was his country.

I'm sure you're proud to be Canadian and I know there's a lot to be proud of, I respect that, but my heart, my conscience and my convictions tells me that my real country is Quebec.

Why would a Lady from another country, another Nation be my Queen? I'm French, so why a British monarch should reign over me?

In other words, I'm a republican who's fighting to see one day, the Republic of Quebec.

Simple as that.

Question of convictions.

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Have to get clarifications Charles; what is an "Independandist" exactly, and can this term be utilized when we're refering to you being Canadian - you are a Canadian citizen correct (a three part question)?

I believe that "Independantist" is a less inflammatory new term to describe separatism.

Perhaps Mr. Obscure would care to elaborate?

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I know exactly what you mean Pat. My wife and I grew up in the city and moved to the burbs in 87. Still haven't gotten used to not being able to walk down the street to do our shopping, go out for dinner etc ! The saving grace is that both of us work in the city and neither of us have lost that sense of being part of it. The burbs have their advantages but tbh, most of those advantages are tempered by the fact that you pretty much have to drive everywhere to do things . Even going to the pub or out for dinner is a hassel. I've got one local boozer that I can realistically walk to. When we lived in the city, you could take your pick and if you had to travel a little further, you could hop on a bus and be there in no time. I'm probably making it sound all bad. It's not but as they say, you can take the person out of the city but you can't take the city out of the person. Just wish I could afford to live in it :lol:

Damn, that's the story of my life as well...word for word.

Leave it to Ally to start the suburban stampede... :D

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Well, I would like to see Quebec be independant one of these days just like I would love to see Canada being independant from Great- Britain. Federalism has never worked. Mainly because each provinces have its own history, its own culture, etc. Someone from Nova-Scotia doesn't think like someone from B.C. They don't share the same 'reality'.

And, technically speaking, yes, I am Canadian. Last time I check I was living in Montreal! :P

But in the bottom of my heart, Quebec is my country. I was speaking the other day with a friend of mine who's from New-Brunswick and he told me that, for him, Acady was his country.

I'm sure you're proud to be Canadian and I know there's a lot to be proud of, I respect that, but my heart, my conscience and my convictions tells me that my real country is Quebec.

Why would a Lady from another country, another Nation be my Queen? I'm French, so why a British monarch should reign over me?

In other words, I'm a republican who's fighting to see one day, the Republic of Quebec.

Simple as that.

Question of convictions.

Fair enough but let's do a hypothetical:

You are the new President of Quebec and some issues need to be resolved with your neighbor, Canada.

Majority Vote to separate

Currency

Aboriginals

Political border

Debt

Health Care

Taxation

Military

Education

Language Law

These are just some of many issues that would be of great interest to the rest of Canada, in terms of achieving an amicable departure.

Good luck with that.

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I believe that "Independantist" is a less inflammatory new term to describe separatism.

Perhaps Mr. Obscure would care to elaborate?

Nothing new here. This term has been around for a long long time.

Separatism is a term mostly used by english-speaking people. 'cause it's always been scarier than sovereigntist or independantist.

And I would like to answer your other post, but my english knowledge is a little bit too poor. Would be simpler if I could express myself in French. But then again, I think that don't speak it nor read it.

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Well, I would like to see Quebec be independant one of these days just like I would love to see Canada being independant from Great- Britain. Federalism has never worked. Mainly because each provinces have its own history, its own culture, etc. Someone from Nova-Scotia doesn't think like someone from B.C. They don't share the same 'reality'.

And, technically speaking, yes, I am Canadian. Last time I check I was living in Montreal! :P

But in the bottom of my heart, Quebec is my country. I was speaking the other day with a friend of mine who's from New-Brunswick and he told me that, for him, Acady was his country.

I'm sure you're proud to be Canadian and I know there's a lot to be proud of, I respect that, but my heart, my conscience and my convictions tells me that my real country is Quebec.

Why would a Lady from another country, another Nation be my Queen? I'm French, so why a British monarch should reign over me?

In other words, I'm a republican who's fighting to see one day, the Republic of Quebec.

Simple as that.

Question of convictions.

I would like to see the republic of Ontario! Just kidding. But please remember that "the grass isn't always greener..." I was born in England but i consider my self a proud Canadian. And yes my Canada definitely includes Quebec. This is the greatest country in the world. End of discussion!

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Damn, that's the story of my life as well...word for word.

Leave it to Ally to start the suburban stampede... :D

At the time we didn't think that we had much of a choice in the matter. The recession of the early to mid 80's changed everything around here . By Expo 86, the school system in Vancouver was falling apart, municipal taxes went through the roof , land and housing prices were on the rise. Interest rates, although down from the 24% they had been in the early 80's, were still hanging around 11%. Steady work was also in short supply. For any younger couple wanting to start a family and provide there kids with a reasonable quality of life, the answer seemed to be in the suburbs and for the most part, moving out did do that. Looking back now however, I wish we had been a little more patient. I think that if the generation that chose to leave had stayed,Vancouver itself would have been better off for it. As it is, the city has been left to people who have no ties to the history and ethnic traditions. I'm not saying that is all bad, far from it in fact but I do feel that something that never needed to be lost has been and it happened because so many of us left.

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Nothing new here. This term has been around for a long long time.

Separatism is a term mostly used by english-speaking people. 'cause it's always been scarier than sovereigntist or independantist.

And I would like to answer your other post, but my english knowledge is a little bit too poor. Would be simpler if I could express myself in French. But then again, I think that don't speak it nor read it.

Well given the fact that we've had many a referendum on the issue it seems to me that the whole idea of sovereignty is something that the majority in Quebec don't seem to want.

It also seems to me that a good percentage of the sovereigntists themselves are quite happy to remain part of Canada as long as we throw enough money at them. Because of this, I can't help but question the shallowness of the movement as a whole. I also think that everyone in Canada is entitled to think what they wish about the monarchy. Not everyone is a fan but, given the fact that it is mostly symbolic, I would have to take issue with any movement using it as an excuse to seperate. Canada is a diverse country where religeous freedom and ethnic traditions are respected. Like it or not, the monarchy plays no negative roll in that. Quite frankly, I think any attempt to link it or to say

that the rest of English speaking Canada is trying squash the French traditions in Quebec

is lame and fraught with bigotry.

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Well given the fact that we've had many a referendum on the issue it seems to me that the whole idea of sovereignty is something that the majority in Quebec don't seem to want.

It also seems to me that a good percentage of the sovereigntists themselves are quite happy to remain part of Canada as long as we throw enough money at them. Because of this, I can't help but question the shallowness of the movement as a whole. I also think that everyone in Canada is entitled to think what they wish about the monarchy. Not everyone is a fan but, given the fact that it is mostly symbolic, I would have to take issue with any movement using it as an excuse to seperate. Canada is a diverse country where religeous freedom and ethnic traditions are respected. Like it or not, the monarchy plays no negative roll in that. Quite frankly, I think any attempt to link it or to say

that the rest of English speaking Canada is trying squash the French traditions in Quebec

is lame and fraught with bigotry.

APPLAUSE!!!!!

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It's about time we get rid of this archaic thing that is the Crown. We're not in 1558 anymore.

Ok then get rid of the Pope as well while we are at it. Isn't he (and religion in general) just as archaic and as medieval as the 'Crown'?

Part of the reason why this damn world is in the mess it is is because of archaic folks with archaic beliefs. The 'Crown' is the least of them. It actually does little harm.

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Sit down this weekdend with a copy of Braveheart and you can see what they did to my ancestors -

Oh for cripe's sake. Braveheart was a movie. It was a bastardisation of history. What about what the Scots did to northern England before? Northern England suffered centuries of rampaging and pillaging by those from the land now known as Scotland. Who makes films about that? Nobody.

Mel F-uckin' Gibson. Anti English, Jew hating, drunk driving religious nutcase. Next thing you know he'll be appearing in films which make English Redcoats in the American Revolutionary War act like Nazis. Oh wait........................!!

Edited by Mangani

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Hello:

I wish I could get excited about BATTLE OF THE BLADES on CBC but I have no interest in ever watching that show...

http://www.cbc.ca/

Juliet :lol:

I see your link say's BC had a couple of earthquakes last night ! We're lucky they were further north as a 6.6 could have done some serious damage to the lower mainland

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Okthen get rid of the Pope as well while we are at it. Isn't he (andreligion in general) just as archaic and as medieval as the 'Crown'?

Partof the reason why this damn world is in the mess it is is because ofarchaic folks with archaic beliefs. The 'Crown' is the least of them.It actually does little harm.

Oh for cripe's sake. Braveheart was a movie. It was a bastardisation of history. What about what the Scots did to northern England before? Northern England suffered centuries of rampaging and pillaging by those from the land now known as Scotland. Who makes films about that? Nobody.

Mel F-uckin' Gibson. Anti English, Jew hating, drunk driving religious nutcase. Next thing you know he'll be appearing in films which make English Redcoats in the American Revolutionary War act like Nazis. Oh wait........................!!

Hi Mangani, and all,

The more i read your posts the more i like them.:thumbsup:

The one thing that the small minded, biggoted, god-botherers on this forum dont like or want to hear is a witty, well educated know it all like yourself (or me) giving them a lesson in history. They would rather believe all the intentionaly misguided crap that their family, friends, and thier society in general spews out to justify their petty war on what keeps them in their place and what made the English speaking world so great.

I have no time for the whinging minnows who keep going on about how hard done by their ancestors were treated by the English, as you said they all did it themselves, raping, pillaging, slavery, land grabbing, centuries before the English turned the tables on them, just like Corporal Jones said in Dads Army, "they dont like it up em do they Mr Mainwaring?"

Now before you get all shirty with me let me say this, without the Scotch, the Irish Paddies, the Welchers, and all, we wouldnt be called "Great Britain" would we, we need each other. However much we detest what we did to each other in the past we can only stay "Great" if we put aside our differences and get along, because together we can rule the world again, but if we let the separatists have their way we will all be consigned to history as a bit part player in world politics, and as England is the centre of the the modern worlds civilisation we must not let that happen must we.

It wasnt the Queen of England who opened the floodgates of immigrants to this country of ours, nor did she give away jobs to eastern european migrants over her own subjects, nor destroy our coal or manufacturing industry, nor sell of our utilities to foreign companies, nor sell our gold reserve, that was the political traitors that we elected, rich, unscrupulous, profit hungry, TRAITORS. If we were to bring back the death penalty i hope these so called politicans are quaking in their boots for thats a job i would willingly do free overtime to get.

The French have always been our Old Enemy, the Germany envy our Greatness and beating them in 1918-1945-1966, the Spanish cant forgive us for the Armada and nicking their Gold that they nicked from the Incas and Aztecs, the Scotch, Irish and Welchers have always forgot that they started this centuries old conflict with the English and have always joined our enemies out of spite, still we can forgive them all, because to be Great is to be benevolent to all, however much you hate us we will not recipricate your hatred but rather feel sorry for your misunderstanding and intolerance of our mission to bring peace and wisdom to your barbaric lands.

Regards, Danny

PS, it was bad enough having the Scotch, Irish and Welchers keep on about seperatism, now the Frogs want to chime in, still i supose we only have ourselves to blame for not wipeing them all out when we had the chance, you would think they would be happy that we didnt behave or treat them like the French, Germans, Russians, Spanish, Chineese, Romans, Mongols, or Americans would, wouldnt you? Just goes to show how benevolent we really are in England doesnt it? :thumbsup::notworthy::lol:

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Hi Mangani, and all,

The more i read your posts the more i like them.:thumbsup:

I thank ye, my friend. :)

The one thing that the small minded, biggoted, god-botherers on this forum dont like or want to hear is a witty, well educated know it all like yourself (or me) giving them a lesson in history. They would rather believe all the intentionaly misguided crap that their family, friends, and thier society in general spews out to justify their petty war on what keeps them in their place and what made the English speaking world so great.

I couldn't agree more. I was trying not to be too harsh on the other poster but the minute I hear "I saw it in a film what so and so did" it gets my goat. And though an entertaining film I guess, Braveheart isn't exactly reknowned for sticking to the facts. Even many Scots who like their history don't care for it much.

I have no time for the whinging minnows who keep going on about how hard done by their ancestors were treated by the English, as you said they all did it themselves, raping, pillaging, slavery, land grabbing, centuries before the English turned the tables on them, just like Corporal Jones said in Dads Army, "they dont like it up em do they Mr Mainwaring?"

Hehe, bit of cold steel for the fuzzy wuzzys (joke).

Seriously, it would seem that all the crap the English (or those in the land that is now England) have had to take over the centuries is ignored. The Romans, the Vikings, The Normans etc etc all tried to rampage and pillage their way across England long before the English hid poor Paddy's potatoes. It's as if the Celts like to have the monopoly on being hard done by and have convinced themselves it's a fact. If you yourself haven't been hard done by then it's irrelevant what happened to your ancestors. If not, then how about I start feeling aggrieved about the Danes and Swedes because of what the Vikings did to my ancestors?

Now before you get all shirty with me let me say this, without the Scotch, the Irish Paddies, the Welchers, and all, we wouldnt be called "Great Britain" would we, we need each other. However much we detest what we did to each other in the past we can only stay "Great" if we put aside our differences and get along, because together we can rule the world again, but if we let the separatists have their way we will all be consigned to history as a bit part player in world politics, and as England is the centre of the the modern worlds civilisation we must not let that happen must we.

I agree totally. I am part Welsh, a smaller part Irish and have had many good times in Scotland on holiday. I have nothing against any of the other nations which make up Great Britain/United Kingdom. I don't even have any kind of grudge whatsoever towards the Germans. In fact Mrs Mangani is one (a German).

It wasnt the Queen of England who opened the floodgates of immigrants to this country of ours, nor did she give away jobs to eastern european migrants over her own subjects, nor destroy our coal or manufacturing industry, nor sell of our utilities to foreign companies, nor sell our gold reserve, that was the political traitors that we elected, rich, unscrupulous, profit hungry, TRAITORS.

Here here. 100% correct. It wasn't the 'Crown' who did all that. That would be the fault and responsibility of lying and cheating POLITICIANS. In my opinion the world needs more monarchs and less scumbag politicians who lie and cheat their way into getting their votes by default. :D

The French have always been our Old Enemy, the Germany envy our Greatness and beating them in 1918-1945-1966, the Spanish cant forgive us for the Armada and nicking their Gold that they nicked from the Incas and Aztecs, the Scotch, Irish and Welchers have always forgot that they started this centuries old conflict with the English and have always joined our enemies out of spite,

:D

Arses kicked but conveniently forget why they got their arses kicked.

still we can forgive them all, because to be Great is to be benevolent to all, however much you hate us we will not recipricate your hatred but rather feel sorry for your misunderstanding and intolerance of our mission to bring peace and wisdom to your barbaric lands.

Deep fried Mars Bars, it's horrendous I tell you!!!!!!!!

Ok, back to the Canada talk and why the 'Crown' isn't anymore archaic than the idea of organised religions.

Edited by Mangani

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Hi Big Dan , Mangani :wave:

I happen to agree with what both of you are saying but in fairness to Ronniedawg, I think that he was basically saying the same thing with his referrence to Braveheart. It's all in the past and everyone has history that is less than flattering but to continuely use that ancient history to fuel hatred is just stupid and counter productive. At somepoint, any viable society needs to move forward. Ulster would be a good case in point but so would many other countries around the world. Canada nor Quebec itself need or want sectarianism. Canada is a diverse society that is made up of people who have chosen to move forward and leave those old hatreds behind. Outside of the separatists, nobody is interested in fuelling those old way's. Political reform is a seperate issue. That is something that needs to happen but it doesn't need to be done by the sword. At least, not in Canada

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Hi Big Dan , Mangani :wave:

I happen to agree with what both of you are saying but in fairness to Ronniedawg, I think that he was basically saying the same thing with his referrence to Braveheart.

Yeah you're right. I tried to not be too harsh to him after as he didn't seem to be saying anything bad. It was just the 'I saw it in a movie' thing.

It's all in the past and everyone has history that is less than flattering but to continuely use that ancient history to fuel hatred is just stupid and counter productive.

Quite right. I don't think there is any country in the world without any skeletons in the closet, although I'm not so sure about Switzerland. :D

Canada nor Quebec itself need or want sectarianism. Canada is a diverse society that is made up of people who have chosen to move forward and leave those old hatreds behind. Outside of the separatists, nobody is interested in fuelling those old way's.

Good to hear that. Those in the minority tend to shout and scream the loudest unfortunately so you can get a wrong perspective when you listen to them.

Political reform is a seperate issue. That is something that needs to happen but it doesn't need to be done by the sword. At least, not in Canada

I say scrap politicians and let rock stars run the planet. :D

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Yeah, instead of elections we could just have a good old Battle Of The Bands

:guitar_mood::drumz::standup_bass::accordian:

:elvis2:

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