Presidential Debate

[Electrophile]

No offence but I find the "rightious anger" of those on the left rather hypocritical considering they've enguaged in character assasination almost constantly for the last 8 years. A large part of why the republicians have been so resilient is IMHO down to the lazy mutual back slapping in the democrat friendly parts of the media/society/politics etc thats allowed more legitimate criticism to be overlooked aswell(and outlets like fox news to prosper). Reminds me alot of what we saw in the UK in the late 80's/early 90's and cost Labour power in 92.

Let's play a game. Ready? Okay. You're going to start by defining "character assassination" as it relates to our extreme displeasure at a shitty President.......and then you're going to compare it to the KKK-like precision at which the Republican party is slandering Barack Obama. Can you do that?

I'll answer for you. No, you can't. Because there's a fundamental and almost blatantly obvious difference between criticizing a horrible President and what McCain/Palin are currently doing. It's not even close. Theodore Roosevelt (great President, REPUBLICAN!) said it was both unpatriotic and "morally treasonable" to feel that the President was above criticism. Are you trying to say that not only is he wrong, but that criticizing the President is the same as "character assassination"? Character assassination would be spreading rumors that you're a pedophile. Or that you've murdered someone. Or that you engage in Satanic rituals. Now try and tell me that something along those lines is what Americans have been doing with Bush.

Go on........we'll wait.

[JimmyPage1977]

Oh you mean there was something even worth assessing?

Good morning sweetie!

[bigstickbonzo]

My question to you all is, do you think these were scripted, screened, or completely random people being chosen with these questions/comments?

Most likely random idiots. The kind if you have all your teeth, they make you the mayor.

[greenman]

Let's play a game. Ready? Okay. You're going to start by defining "character assassination" as it relates to our extreme displeasure at a shitty President.......and then you're going to compare it to the KKK-like precision at which the Republican party is slandering Barack Obama. Can you do that?

I'll answer for you. No, you can't. Because there's a fundamental and almost blatantly obvious difference between criticizing a horrible President and what McCain/Palin are currently doing. It's not even close. Theodore Roosevelt (great President, REPUBLICAN!) said it was both unpatriotic and "morally treasonable" to feel that the President was above criticism. Are you trying to say that not only is he wrong, but that criticizing the President is the same as "character assassination"? Character assassination would be spreading rumors that you're a pedophile. Or that you've murdered someone. Or that you engage in Satanic rituals. Now try and tell me that something along those lines is what Americans have been doing with Bush.

Go on........we'll wait.

I'm no fan of Bush but if were looking for things "americans" have said/written about him the childish insults and wild conspiracy theories number in the billions.

[wanna be drummer]

I highly doubt that. The next president will have the chance to correct everything is wrong. He could be in office for 8 years remember.

He only has 4 years to prove he can fix everything, which is the only way he'll get reelected.

Bush is obviously the worst in history. The country is in shambles. I'm guessing it can only get better. But then again, it could barely be worse.

I can elaborate if you'd like.

I disagree. He's been bad, don't get me wrong. He's been downright awful honestly. But, we've had some real bad presidents whom I would consider to be worse then him.

[I have got a horsey]

Good morning sweetie!

Oh FUCK... I really was that drunk last night...

[Electrophile]

I'm no fan of Bush but if were looking for things "americans" have said/written about him the childish insults and wild conspiracy theories number in the billions.

I asked you a question. You accused Americans of "character assassination" which is a pretty serious charge. I asked you to back that up. I even gave you examples of what I felt character assassination was, and then asked you.....hey.....is that what we're doing here? Then I said......if what you think we're doing with Bush is character assassination, what would you call what the Republicans are currently doing to Barack Obama and his family, as they've now gone after his wife.

If you're going to make a charge, prepare to defend it.

[Medhb]

That one went over your head. Since you brought up the work place, how about those who start smoking at work, just so they can fit in with the rest of the smokers at break time. That's sheepish. Anyone that I know, who started smoking for that reason, is voting for Obama. That's my observation. If it seems odd in this day and age to you, you're not very observant.

I wish I could find a more politically correct word than sheep. Since some of you spend more time on line than I do, maybe you could find one and "bring it back to me".

Are you even old enough to vote? I don't know anyone that would take up smoking to 'fit in'.

As for finding a politically correct word for you....why you should I put words in your mouth? Presumably, you're an adult and can speak for yourself....

[greenman]

I asked you a question. You accused Americans of "character assassination" which is a pretty serious charge. I asked you to back that up. I even gave you examples of what I felt character assassination was, and then asked you.....hey.....is that what we're doing here? Then I said......if what you think we're doing with Bush is character assassination, what would you call what the Republicans are currently doing to Barack Obama and his family, as they've now gone after his wife.

If you're going to make a charge, prepare to defend it.

Seriously if we extend it to any americans I'm sure I can find someone claiming Bush has done just about everything from killing kittens to faking the moon landings.

I'm not saying I agree with the republicans tactics and would certainly like to see Obama win but alot of the reaction just seems like people who've spent too long in the company of others who agree with there every poltical thought. Bush/Republican bashing seems to have become almost a subculture to me with lazy uniformed criticism allowing his very real faults to be dismissed along with it just like Thatcher bashing in the 80's.

[wanna be drummer]

Seriously if we extend it to any americans I'm sure I can find someone claiming Bush has done just about everything from killing kittens to faking the moon landings.

I'm not saying I agree with the republicans tactics and would certainly like to see Obama win but alot of the reaction just seems like people who've spent too long in the company of others who agree with there every poltical thought. Bush/Republican bashing seems to have become almost a subculture to me with lazy uniformed criticism allowing his very real faults to be dismissed along with it just like Thatcher bashing in the 80's.

Awesome post

[THE FIRST LEDZEP]

McCain Wins

[allthekingshorses]

^^ it's not looking so good for McCain in the polls, but yes, I know I know... Bradley Effect.

and yes... congrats on some actual posts.

[Medhb]

Not knowing anyone that would take up smoking just to 'fit in', suggests that you may be the one who is not old enough to vote.

I guess you're using the same logic you used to proclaim McCain the best candidate

[THE FIRST LEDZEP]

Tonight's debate very interesting.

McCain had is best performance.

To me Obama is a good speaker with

no track record behind him.

November 4, 2008 should tell the story.

[Electrophile]

Bob Schieffer was an excellent moderator tonight. I really thought he did better than Lehrer and Brokaw. He was far tougher and a lot more intent on making both candidates answer the questions than the previous ones had been. That alone made this debate better than the other two.

Edit: I liked this bit at the end on NBC: "McCain complained about being labeled a racist, Obama complained about people yelling for him to be killed."

No one thinks you're a racist, John. However your crowds need to be controlled.

[kirchzep27]

^ I agree, but that was also the forum of it as well.

[Pb Derigable]

No one thinks you're a racist, John. However your crowds need to be controlled.

Just like the crowds at Obama rally with the Palin is a c%$t T.shirt. and Obama has said the G.O.P. has used race as an issue and Numerous Dems have called McCain and Sarah Racist.

Please REthink.

Please REphrase.

Please don't be a REtard.

Please REmember Obama saying, "They are going to say I don;t look like the other presidents, That I have a funny name, and did I mention he is black".

In fact I believe you called some people on this board racist for bringing up the same points McCain had.

REally is that what you cam up with.

And you have spewed more elctrobullshit towards palin based on a SNL skit,(because it's obvious to anyone thats the only thing you know) that even if McCain burns a pic of Obama on Natl. TV, it would not be a bad as some of the Elctrobullshit you came up with.

[Medhb]

Yes, best debate yet in my book. Way less of the same old lines and more down to the nitty gritty. It was enjoyable though I really did want to bitch slap McCain a couple of times. I don't think he listens very well. When Obama clearly stated why something McCain said was untrue he just repeated the lie in his rebuttle. Huh? Overall I think McCain did the best he could have under the circumstances. He should have tried a little harder to control the eye rolling and disgust though, I dont' think that type of behavior will go over well if he were to be working with other countries heads of states or presidents. Not very conducive to the 'we're working together' ethic. Of course, everyone already knows by now that is just one of the things I really, really like about Obama. Much calmer and clearer head. I also think he sees past the next 4 years and I wonder if McCain really does. Somehow, I think he'll just be happy if he's still alive in 4 years.

[Medhb]

Oh Yeah...Joe the plumber won't be paying one extra dollar in taxes or health care much to McCains dismay....

[Electrophile]

Yes, best debate yet in my book. Way less of the same old lines and more down to the nitty gritty. It was enjoyable though I really did want to bitch slap McCain a couple of times. I don't think he listens very well. When Obama clearly stated why something McCain said was untrue he just repeated the lie in his rebuttle. Huh? Overall I think McCain did the best he could have under the circumstances. He should have tried a little harder to control the eye rolling and disgust though, I dont' think that type of behavior will go over well if he were to be working with other countries heads of states or presidents. Not very conducive to the 'we're working together' ethic. Of course, everyone already knows by now that is just one of the things I really, really like about Obama. Much calmer and clearer head. I also think he sees past the next 4 years and I wonder if McCain really does. Somehow, I think he'll just be happy if he's still alive in 4 years.

I thought McCain came out strong in the first 30 minutes, but then it fell apart. Obama basically bitchslapped him on Ayres/ACORN and brought up McCain/Palin rallies and the "kill him" comment and all that stuff. I didn't think he would honestly, seeing as Obama has run a basically even-keeled campaign. However, considering this is the last debate and the last time the both of them will have an audience of this size in which to speak to, something needed to be said about it because it's fucking despicable. What's worse is that McCain defended it. I couldn't believe it, even my dad was like "what the hell did he just say?".

Obama was a little boring, but in order for McCain to change the narrative of this election and desperately turn things around, he basically needed to pull an Ali on Sonny Liston and he didn't come close. So now he's got 20 days to somehow flip about 10 states.....hell, he's currently 2 points down in Arkansas right now. Frickin' Arkansas.

[kirchzep27]

^Thats the key point imo, the next four years are not going to be about solar and wind power/some sort of energy independance. The next four years are going to be about going on from here. I mean, how can one sit and listen when the world banking system is froze up?

Is this not the weirdest thing in the world?

[Medhb]

I thought McCain came out strong in the first 30 minutes, but then it fell apart. Obama basically bitchslapped him on Ayres/ACORN and brought up McCain/Palin rallies and the "kill him" comment and all that stuff. I didn't think he would honestly, seeing as Obama has run a basically even-keeled campaign. However, considering this is the last debate and the last time the both of them will have an audience of this size in which to speak to, something needed to be said about it because it's fucking despicable. What's worse is that McCain defended it. I couldn't believe it, even my dad was like "what the hell did he just say?".

Obama was a little boring, but in order for McCain to change the narrative of this election and desperately turn things around, he basically needed to pull an Ali on Sonny Liston and he didn't come close. So now he's got 20 days to somehow flip about 10 states.....hell, he's currently 2 points down in Arkansas right now. Frickin' Arkansas.

That WAS hysterical! Basically, in a nutshell "Well if Obama would have agreed to the townhall discussions I wanted we wouldn't have had to resort to negative campaigning" <grimace> Who does a better grimace than McCain?! He's actually kinda scary.

Oh, priceless the look on his face when he asked Obama how much it would cost Joe the plumber to not have insurance for his employees and Obama said "0" Someone in McCains campaign IS getting bitchslapped tonight

[Electrophile]

McCain spent more time attacking Obama and his policy issues and less time actually outlining what he'd do, and how it differed. I had hoped to see that from him. I thought considering the position he's in, he'd realize how steep this hill is he has to climb and do something to at least reassure his base and the right-leaning Independents that he hasn't lost complete grasp of his sanity. Following the Ayres/ACORN/Lewis section, he completely lost it. Obama was obviously prepared to discuss it, realizing that it's the only card McCain had left to play.

[Electrophile]

BTW, someone clue John McCain in on the fact that Sarah Palin's son has Downs Syndrome, not autism. There is a very clear difference between the two.

[Patrycja]

I thought McCain came out strong in the first 30 minutes, but then it fell apart. Obama basically bitchslapped him on Ayres/ACORN and brought up McCain/Palin rallies and the "kill him" comment and all that stuff. I didn't think he would honestly, seeing as Obama has run a basically even-keeled campaign. However, considering this is the last debate and the last time the both of them will have an audience of this size in which to speak to, something needed to be said about it because it's fucking despicable. What's worse is that McCain defended it. I couldn't believe it, even my dad was like "what the hell did he just say?".

Obama was a little boring, but in order for McCain to change the narrative of this election and desperately turn things around, he basically needed to pull an Ali on Sonny Liston and he didn't come close. So now he's got 20 days to somehow flip about 10 states.....hell, he's currently 2 points down in Arkansas right now. Frickin' Arkansas.

Now there's an analogy. Gold.

The main thing about this debate is that despite his fairly even-keeled presence (some would say flat?), BO was essentially the cool calm hub around which McCain kept getting erratic and angry. BO didn't really need to do anything, except for not bite on any of McCain's aggressive jabs. He tired himself out after a strong start and exposed his weaknesses. The harder McCain tried, the farther he removed himself from his self-professed position of a steady, reliable, experienced-to-handle-the-pressure leader, especially in contrast to BO's measured demeanour. What a knockout. A thing of beauty.

On a side note, the moderator did an excellent job - very good questions, very good policing of the minutes, and opportunities for rebuttal. He had a calm control without getting in the way.

On another side note, CNN had McCain's campaign adviser on after the debate and he blatantly twisted and lied about BO's position on Roe vs. Wade and taxation. Unbelievably defensive and reactive so soon after the debate.