Mental Illness Thread

[sweetredwine]

... I have to fight not to become spiteful over all this. ...

Your situation is common and growing due to the acceptablility of divorce and remarriage - which is very sad, because that sort of pain (suffering the effects of broken bonds instead of enjoying the warmth of a loving, caring, positive, stable, solid family and welcoming home) is extremely difficult to rehabilitate.

This article Sowing the seeds of health: Plants and clients thrive with horticultural therapy has some great ideas:

"“Horticultural therapy is the use of plants and the natural world to improve the social, spiritual, physical and emotional well-being of individuals who participate in it.”

The theory behind horticultural therapy, in other words, how nature works on the human mind and body, is not documented by accepted scientific research standards – although many of us can attest to the powerful effects of walking along a quiet wooded path or sitting in a beautiful garden. Nevertheless, there is enough research citing the many benefits of horticultural therapy on various health conditions to show it is a viable tool for dealing with various mental health and substance use issues, including eating disorders, depression, dementia, anxiety, bipolar disorder and schizophrenia, says Christine Pollard, a masters’ level horticultural therapist in Duncan, B.C.

“When giving up addictions,” for example, “people are giving up their entire social life, most of their friends and they are left with a huge vacuum,” says Pollard. “Horticulture can help fill that void.” For clients with mental health issues, horticulture can keep their minds off their health and give them a sense of confidence as they grow along with their plants, says Pollard. “In my experience, horticultural therapy actively changes mental states.”

In a nutshell: There is evidence showing that growing plants teaches new skills, raises concentration levels and the ability to problem solve. It encourages social interaction, since often horticultural therapy occurs in groups, and improves physical strength. Psychologically, practitioners believe that growing and tending to live plant from seed gives clients a feeling of usefulness, a sense of responsibility, improved self-esteem and a sense of worth. ... clients are involved in the garden three times a week for at least an hour and a half each time. “It gives them a sense of hope, that they can change their negative lifestyles,” says Hewson. “They learn to nurture themselves, learn new habits and most important, learn to build trust.”"

... Move on, as life can give us happiness and love too. You will find it, it's there for all of us.

Looking for happiness and love in nature (interacting with and helping plants progress and thrive) is less risky than human relationships and might be a good place to start.

Edited September 27, 2011 by sweetredwine

[mastress of procrastinate]

First of all thank you all for your nice words They can really push one up! And it's goof to know I can talk somewhere - I don#t want to bother my friends with all that, they aren't my emotionals trash cans and not all of them fully understand the condition I developed out of the situation.

Your situation is common and growing due to the acceptablility of divorce and remarriage - which is very sad, because that sort of pain (suffering the effects of broken bonds instead of enjoying the warmth of a loving, caring, positive, stable, solid family and welcoming home) is extremely difficult to rehabilitate.

Well, actually I think it is good divorce and remmarriage have a growing acceptability. In some cases it is just the best for all to divorce. When two people just have gotten all out of love, only fight with each other and see no future for that marriage, both instead can be better off divorced with the chance of finding a new partner, at least the burden of a unhappy marriage is gone. My aunt's new partner for example is a father-like friend for my cousins and she is happy to have found him

But you are right, not having a stable, caring family can be really harmful since how and where we grow up sets the roads we're walking on later to a certain extent.

@Mastress of Procrastinate.....it is sad that we are sometimes dealt a bad hand when it comes to parents. It occured to me that your some of your mothers behavior is the baggage she carries having been raised by your grandmother. You can break the pattern and become a better woman than they.

THAT IS MY PLAN! When I'd become like them, they have won. I can proof to myself that I can do better and I will. I don't know whether I'll be a better mother simply because I don't know yet whether I want to be a mother at all - however I want to be better than they are. Gladfully my brother manages to get through all that on his own way and still, over all that trouble, is the kind young lad he always has been. he is nursing elderly people, and I sometimes wish to have his patience and kindness.

What I've learned from all that can be summed up by a famous Nietzsche qoute: "What does not kill me makes me stronger".

[sweetredwine]

Well, actually I think it is good divorce and remmarriage have a growing acceptability. In some cases it is just the best for all to divorce. When two people just have gotten all out of love, only fight with each other and see no future for that marriage, both instead can be better off divorced with the chance of finding a new partner, at least the burden of a unhappy marriage is gone.

So it seems ... but other "invisible" burdens are placed squarely on the shoulders of the innocent - grandparents that no longer get to see their grandchildren (while the grandchildren are often placed in unloving day care centers far away or in the care of irresponsible and/or abusive boyfriends/girlfriends/stepparents), emotional and financial investments of other family members' (often the parents, grandparents, brothers and sisters of the spouses) time, energy and money that disappear along with the couple (pre-marital agreements can never undo all the damage), family ties brutally broken - and even long-term relationships with ex-nieces and ex-nephews, along with all the ex-brotherinlaws, ex-sisterinlaws, ex-motherinlaws, ex-fatherinlaws, etc. quickly disposed of.

So, the idea that the "burden of a unhappy marriage is gone" is a pleasing illusion that functions well in a consumeristic throw-away society that is enticed by the allure of "personal" romantic relationships and the thrill of "the chance of finding a new partner". Relationships - marital, friendships, family members, you-name-it - become empty, "all out of love" because the people involved aren't filling them up as quickly as they are consuming and depleting them, and then the fights begin ...

A better future is possible only when people perceive marriage as a truly sacred institution and make a commitment only when they are mature enough to envision that relationship from all angles including those exterior to themselves. When the couple is well prepared and the support and guidance of elders and a caring community are available (Can Amish get divorced?) divorce is not necessary, and all relationships - inside and outside of families - can thrive.

Edited September 27, 2011 by sweetredwine

[mastress of procrastinate]

So it seems ... but other "invisible" burdens are placed squarely on the shoulders of the innocent - grandparents that no longer get to see their grandchildren (while the grandchildren are often placed in unloving day care centers far away or in the care of irresponsible and/or abusive boyfriends/girlfriends/stepparents), emotional and financial investments of other family members' (often the parents, grandparents, brothers and sisters of the spouses) time, energy and money that disappear along with the couple (pre-marital agreements can never undo all the damage), family ties brutally broken - and even long-term relationships with ex-nieces and ex-nephews, along with all the ex-brotherinlaws, ex-sisterinlaws, ex-motherinlaws, ex-fatherinlaws, etc. quickly disposed of.

So, the idea that the "burden of a unhappy marriage is gone" is a pleasing illusion that functions well in a consumeristic throw-away society that is enticed by the allure of "personal" romantic relationships and the thrill of "the chance of finding a new partner". Relationships - marital, friendships, family members, you-name-it - become empty, "all out of love" because the people involved aren't filling them up as quickly as they are consuming and depleting them, and then the fights begin ...

A better future is possible only when people perceive marriage as a truly sacred institution and make a commitment only when they are mature enough to envision that relationship from all angles including those exterior to themselves. When the couple is well prepared and the support and guidance of elders and a caring community are available (Can Amish get divorced?) divorce is not necessary, and all relationships - inside and outside of families - can thrive.

Actually, I highly disagree. Sometimes a divorce simply is the BETTER solution for all. Divorce does not mean that my grandparents all of a sudden are ex-grandparents. I have regular and frequent contact to my father and his half of the family. I don't know how many people you know which went through a divorce, but those I know are better off now. My father was in therapy over years and was diagnosticised a burn-out also because the marriage to my mother wasn't everything but nice. I don't want to go into detail, but a grown-up confident man developed severe psychological problems after 15 years of being with my mother. Also, there are marriages in which domestic violense is involved (both men and women can be the victims) or other kinds of abusive relationships. It is only a good development being divorced doesn't mean a stigma anymore. Just 40 years ago many women would have stayed in marriage which meant domestic violenece and abuse simply because their economical situation was worse, they were dependant on their husband and had to fear being labelled and looked upon for being a divorced women.

Also, feelings can chance. It can be that a couple that was truely in love 30 years ago now no longer is feeling for each other. People who stay in unhappy marriages just for the sake of being married are only lying to themselves. And just don't come with counselling lessons and couple therapy - I know by mw own experience that sometimes divorce is the best solution. My own grandmother divorced form heir husband because he was violent against her and their two children.

Marriage is just another kind of relationship, and a relationship that doesn't meany any good to both parties anymore should be ended, as simple as that. People who think there'd be no need for divorces are living in a sheer utopia.

Just because my parents are no longer married, my bonds to him and his half of the family didn't vanish. I find your post highly offensive. My father is a much happier man with his new wife which is a wonderful women and her two sons are like older borthers for me and my brother. I am glad to got to know this people. Actually, after the divorce my relationship to my father just grew tighter. He always was my stable point in all that chaos, the one that would help me and give me the feeling to be loved.

Marriage is no gurantee to stay together happily for a lifetime. No matter how mature one is, no matter how long people have been together already before the got married, no one never knows whether they will for always feel the same way for their partner as they do right now. I just can't predict whether I'll love someone a lifetime. But, I wish everyone a happy marriage and to be happy with their partner a lifetime.

[reswati]

@ Mistress:

Sei froh das du da weg bist, dein Stiefvater ist ein besoffenes herrschsüchtiges Obersturmbahnferkel und scheinbar hat deine Mutter kein Rückgrat um was dran zu machen.

(Ein kleiner Arsch ist schnell geleckt, falls er sein eigenes Hinterteil so wunderbar geformt findet)

Deine Oma hat es noch nicht begriffen das ihre "Disziplinierungs und Koerperstrafen Logik" etwas aus dem dritten Reich ist.

Edited September 27, 2011 by reswati

[mastress of procrastinate]

@ Mistress:

Sei froh das du da weg bist, dein Stiefvater ist ein besoffenes herrschsüchtiges Obersturmbahnferkel und scheinbar hat deine Mutter kein Rückgrat um was dran zu machen.

(Ein kleiner Arsch ist schnell geleckt, falls er sein eigenes Hinterteil so wunderbar geformt findet)

Deine Oma hat es noch nicht begriffen das ihre "Disziplinierungs und Koerperstrafen Logik" etwas aus dem dritten Reich ist.

Meine Oma hat das 3. reich nicht mir erlebt, sie ist kurz nach dem Krieg geboren. Und *noch* muss ich dableiben, der Umzug is erst in ein paar Tagen. Aber an dem Tag an dem ich da raus bin feiere ich ein riesiges Freudenfest. (leider kann ich kein Niederländisch :s )

[Anjin-san]

Hi all,

English please! but you could teach me German!

KB

[mastress of procrastinate]

Hi all,

English please! but you could teach me German!

KB

haha, what would you like to know?

[reswati]

Hi all,

English please! but you could teach me German!

KB

Lol, my message contained a Reductio at Hitlerum and some nasty words which I found that not everybody needed to be able to read. Nobody's fault but mine....reading the story told by Mastress just triggered something inside me.

Since you wanted to learn a good German word, here's one you won't find in any other language:

Arschgeiger

(Literally: anal violin player.........means something like an enormous asshole)

[mastress of procrastinate]

Lol, my message contained a Reductio at Hitlerum and some nasty words which I found that not everybody needed to be able to read. Nobody's fault but mine....reading the story told by Mastress just triggered something inside me.

Since you wanted to learn a good German word, here's one you won't find in any other language:

Arschgeiger

(Literally: anal violin player.........means something like an enormous asshole)

Reswati, you German is really good, just thought I'd mention. Du kriegst eine 1+....haha, I just realised I could put a german joke at the end of all comments and only reswati would undertstand (among the people currently active on this thread) >: D

[Anjin-san]

Hi all,

haha, what would you like to know?

Technical German railway words,.....

KB

[sweetredwine]

Marriage is just another kind of relationship, and a relationship that doesn't meany any good to both parties anymore should be ended, as simple as that.

Sorry, I disagree. Marriage isn't "just another kind of relationship" - it is sacred and involves a sacred promise to our Creator.

Just because my parents are no longer married, my bonds to him and his half of the family didn't vanish. I find your post highly offensive.

Sorry, I meant no harm, but the purpose of divorce is to break family ties - which usually distances relationships, but (as in your case) not necessarily all of them.

Also, feelings can change. It can be that a couple that was truely in love 30 years ago now no longer is feeling for each other. ... no one never knows whether they will for always feel the same way for their partner as they do right now.

Of course feelings change - they're supposed to change as we grow and experience what "for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health" really means

I just can't predict whether I'll love someone a lifetime.

So ... don't take the vow "I will love you and honor you all the days of my life, until death do us part."

But, I wish everyone a happy marriage and to be happy with their partner a lifetime.

Me too.

Edited September 27, 2011 by sweetredwine

[mastress of procrastinate]

Hi all,

Technical German railway words,.....

KB

well, you could type into google tranlsate whatever you'd like to know (for example, train--> Zug) and there is this little speaker icon that even makes a computer vice say that waord I can hardly type how to actually pronounce words

Let's all praise google translate!

Lasset uns den Google Übersetzer lobpreisen!

[sweetredwine]

In the news again:

Two Tibetan monks self-immolate to protest policies

"BEIJING — Two Tibetan monks set themselves on fire Monday in a protest over China’s tight rein over Buddhist practices, a rights group said as the Chinese government reiterated it will choose the next Dalai Lama.

The London-based Free Tibet campaign said Lobsang Kalsang and Lobsang Konchok, both believed to be 18 or 19 years old, self-immolated Monday at the Kirti Monastery in Sichuan province’s Aba prefecture. ... Lobsang Kelsang is the brother of Rigzin Phuntsog, a 21-year-old Kirti monk who died March 16 after setting himself on fire, said Free Tibet. Phuntsog’s death was seen as a protest against China’s heavy-handed controls on Tibetan Buddhism and provoked a standoff between security forces and monks.

Aba has been the scene of numerous protests over the past several years against the Chinese government. ..."

_________

What are your thoughts, is self-immolation a mental illness problem or indicative of a deeper truth in human beings/human society and in our world?

Edited September 27, 2011 by sweetredwine

[sweetredwine]

In the news again:

Two Tibetan monks self-immolate to protest policies

"BEIJING — Two Tibetan monks set themselves on fire Monday in a protest over China’s tight rein over Buddhist practices, a rights group said as the Chinese government reiterated it will choose the next Dalai Lama.

The London-based Free Tibet campaign said Lobsang Kalsang and Lobsang Konchok, both believed to be 18 or 19 years old, self-immolated Monday at the Kirti Monastery in Sichuan province’s Aba prefecture. ... Lobsang Kelsang is the brother of Rigzin Phuntsog, a 21-year-old Kirti monk who died March 16 after setting himself on fire, said Free Tibet. Phuntsog’s death was seen as a protest against China’s heavy-handed controls on Tibetan Buddhism and provoked a standoff between security forces and monks.

Aba has been the scene of numerous protests over the past several years against the Chinese government. ..."

_________

What are your thoughts, is self-immolation a mental illness problem or indicative of a deeper truth in human beings/human society and in our world?

Here's another recent article:

Self-immolation spreads across Mideast inspiring protest

"... At least 13 cases of people setting fire to themselves in protest have been recorded in the Middle East since Bouazizi, an unemployed university graduate, doused himself with petrol and set himself alight in the city of Sidi Bouzid on December 17. He was protesting official harassment of his street-side produce business, but his act quickly came to symbolize government abuse and the absence of economic opportunity. Tunisia suicide protester Mohammed Bouazizi dies

RELATED:

Self immolation and individual freedom

3 Egyptians light themselves on fire in protest - 1 dies

In Egypt, at least six cases of self-immolation have been reported, including a man arrested last Thursday while trying to set himself on fire outside the Egyptian parliament in downtown Cairo. Over the weekend, a Moroccan man set himself on fire in Casablanca as did a Mauritanian man who set himself on fire and died in hospital on Saturday. In Algeria, four men have reportedly set themselves on fire. Even in Saudi Arabia, whose people are insulated from poverty and inflation by oil wealth, a man in his 60s set himself on fire in the town of Samitah. He died in hospital on Sunday. ..."

What are your ideas - what's going on with these people ?

Edited September 28, 2011 by sweetredwine

[sweetredwine]

No thoughts whatsoever on the subject of self-immolation?

Here's an article that gives Details on ten acts of self-immolation for various motives

One of these acts which received little publicity was

"Hartmut Gründler was a German teacher from Tübingen, engaged in environmental protection. He opposed German energy policy and the construction of nuclear power plants. He protested against means to store radioactive nuclear waste. He handed out pamphlets in an attempt to educate the public about environmental matters that concerned him. He staged hunger strikes and all manner of non-violent protest trying to affect German policy. He even tried to open a dialogue with Federal Chancellor Helmut Schmidt.

On November 16, 1977, (at the age of 47) Gründler burned himself in Hamburg during the SPD Party Congress, out of protest against “the continued governmental misinformation” in the energy policy, particularly concerning the permanent disposal of nuclear waste.

Two days before he self-immolated, he made a flyer with the heading “Please pass on… Self-immolation of a Life Protector – appeal against atomic lie…”, and, speaking of himself in the third person, he wrote, among other things, the following: “Gründler calls his action an act not of despair, but of resistance and resolution. To the inherent necessity of greed of profit, of confidence tricks, of taking people unawares here, and the inherent necessity of inertia and cowardice there, he wants to oppose the inherent necessity of conscience.”"

______

According to Hartmut Gründler from Wikipedia, "Reactions and impact:

The media hardly reported on the background."

Why? He spoke the truth, and quite a few lives might have been saved if someone had listened - or had been allowed to listen --

[ledzepfvr]

I think it is a sad waste of a life. While they are resolved in their faith to make a strong point of pain and oppression, living and fighting the fight seems a better path to me.

[sweetredwine]

I think it is a sad waste of a life. While they are resolved in their faith to make a strong point of pain and oppression, living and fighting the fight seems a better path to me.

Sounds like you might agree with Thomas Merton (Father Louis, a Roman Catholic monk who died in 1968) - upon hearing of 22-year-old Catholic Worker Roger LaPorte's self-immolation Merton wrote "What is happening? Is everybody nuts?" in his journal and sent a telegram to the Catholic Peace Fellowship withdraw his membership from that organization. After being reassured that the event was an aberration, that LaPorte was not a very stable person psychologically, and nothing that LaPorte had done derived from any spoken or unspoken policy of the Catholic Peace Fellowship movement Merton withdrew his resignation.

Instead, Buddhist monk Thich Nhat Hanh wrote a letter to Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. with another point-of-view:

"The self-burning of Vietnamese Buddhist monks in 1963 is somehow difficult for the Western Christian conscience to understand. The press spoke then of suicide, but in the essence, it is not. It is not even a protest. What the monks said in the letters they left before burning themselves aimed only at alarming, at moving the hearts of the oppressors, and at calling the attention of the world to the suffering endured then by the Vietnamese."

The practice of "sati" (female self immolation) was approved by Hindu religions for hundreds of years, up until the 19th century.

And according to this article "Suicide, in any form, is strictly prohibited in Islam. And there is a great reward for Muslims who bear tyrant rulers with patience and trust in God Almighty. However, burgeoning inflation and hopelessness due to lack of education or job opportunities in many parts of the region, are adding fuel to the flames of an increasingly combustible situation. ... Bouazizi is being touted as a martyr and his deeds an effective means to an end. What is most surprising is that all of the self-immolations have occurred in predominantly Muslim lands and many were by Muslims. ... Bouazizi’s deed lives on in the hearts and minds of people willing to sacrifice their very lives for the sake of change."

So, seems like Christianity is somewhat unusual by promoting Christian martyrdom while severely prohibiting Christian suicide and self-immolation (by physical fire).

Edited October 1, 2011 by sweetredwine

[scottf]

i've had anxiety, panic disorder,and depression for several year's now,also had a heart attack this year on mother's day , but they say my heart's fine now, i understand your condition in that i pulled away from the thing's i enjoyed too, for some reason it hasn't affected my abilty to get up in front of people and sing or play music , i did quit playing in band's for a long time, i dont play bar's anymore but i still get together and play with friends alot. there are however alot of thing's i still dont do anymore, ive found that the best support is from family and friends, you'd be surprised how many people out there have similar condition's. hang in there, i've found that discussing your condition with other's help's alot, i take med's but they dont completely control it, i'll be seeing a mental healthcare specialist next week for the first time who will have the answer i'm sure. don't get discouraged

[sweetredwine]

The panic attacks of this 15 year old girl will probably last a lifetime

Teen patient at psych ward was brutally sodomized, kept in same unit with attacker for weeks Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2011/04/25/2011-04-25_rage_over_psych_ward_sex_attack_on_teen.html#ixzz1Zc5aW7yy

"The boy was arrested March 11 and charged with a criminal sex act.

Still, for the next two weeks, the boy remained in the same ward with the girl, adding to her pain.

Hearing her daughter whimper every day left Watson feeling shattered.

"It took all the strength that I had to hold my composure," said Watson, who has filed a notice of claim and plans to sue the city for $20 million. "I didn't want her to see me break down and cry.""

______

... So WHY doesn't she just take her daughter back home?

"Watson said she doesn't want to remove her daughter from the facility because it will delay her placement in a state hospital for long-term treatment.

Watson said her daughter, who loves to dance and play basketball, is still reeling.

"Her smile used to brighten up a room," said Watson, inside the office of her lawyer, Martha Gold. "Now, I have to ask her to smile for me, and when she smiles, I can still see the pain, the hurt, the anger, the sadness.""

No surprise there ...

[sweetredwine]

The panic attacks of this 15 year old girl will probably last a lifetime

Teen patient at psych ward was brutally sodomized, kept in same unit with attacker for weeks Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2011/04/25/2011-04-25_rage_over_psych_ward_sex_attack_on_teen.html#ixzz1Zc5aW7yy

"The boy was arrested March 11 and charged with a criminal sex act.

Still, for the next two weeks, the boy remained in the same ward with the girl, adding to her pain.

Hearing her daughter whimper every day left Watson feeling shattered.

"It took all the strength that I had to hold my composure," said Watson, who has filed a notice of claim and plans to sue the city for $20 million. "I didn't want her to see me break down and cry.""

______

... So WHY doesn't she just take her daughter back home?

"Watson said she doesn't want to remove her daughter from the facility because it will delay her placement in a state hospital for long-term treatment.

Watson said her daughter, who loves to dance and play basketball, is still reeling.

"Her smile used to brighten up a room," said Watson, inside the office of her lawyer, Martha Gold. "Now, I have to ask her to smile for me, and when she smiles, I can still see the pain, the hurt, the anger, the sadness.""

No surprise there ...

If this had happened before the sodomy laws were repealed (June 26, 2003, when the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that all sodomy laws were unconstitutional in its historic Lawrence v. Texas decision, which also had an impact on the burgeoning same-sex marriage debate) this teen probably would not have been left alone with her attacker ...

... but with the way things are currently this type of an assault is no longer in the same type of "criminal" category as it once was - nowadays it is only considered "sexual misconduct" - which means that the boy faces less than a year in a juvenile detention center ... which means he'll probably only serve a few months, if that much.

Which also explains why they risked keeping him in the same ward with her for two weeks after the incident: his crime was no "big deal" to anybody.

And good luck with plans to sue the city - nowadays the boy's lawyer could argue that he was just trying to "love" her, to display a valid form of affection!

In fact, nowadays one could argue that the girl is at fault for complaining as if she were "violated" and exaggerating the pain, the hurt, the anger, the sadness - is she truly justified in feeling such strong emotions or is she mentally ill? ... but as this confusing trend continues, what is happening to the mental/emotional health of our children - modern society - and the world?

Edited October 2, 2011 by sweetredwine

[sweetredwine]

In the news again:

Two Tibetan monks self-immolate to protest policies

"BEIJING — Two Tibetan monks set themselves on fire Monday in a protest over China’s tight rein over Buddhist practices, a rights group said as the Chinese government reiterated it will choose the next Dalai Lama.

The London-based Free Tibet campaign said Lobsang Kalsang and Lobsang Konchok, both believed to be 18 or 19 years old, self-immolated Monday at the Kirti Monastery in Sichuan province’s Aba prefecture. ... Lobsang Kelsang is the brother of Rigzin Phuntsog, a 21-year-old Kirti monk who died March 16 after setting himself on fire, said Free Tibet. ...

... and again:

China hit by new Tibet monk self-immolation

"The 17-year-old from Sichuan province's Kirti monastery, the scene of repeated protests, shouted slogans against the Chinese government as he tried to self-immolate, the US-based International Campaign for Tibet (ICT) said.

Citing Tibetans in exile with contacts in Aba town, where the incident occurred Monday, the activist group said the monk was immediately surrounded by security personnel who extinguished the flames, beat him and took him away. ...

Barry Sautman, an associate professor at the Hong Kong University of Science and Technology who studies ethnic politics, said self-immolations in Tibetan regions had been a "rare" occurrence until recently.

"I don't think that we knew of any examples until recently, at least no examples that occurred inside Tibet," he said, referring to wider Tibetan areas.

"There was one example of a Tibetan exile who immolated himself some years back. At the time, the Dalai Lama condemned the self-immolation and said it contravened the Buddhist idea of the sanctity of life.

"So it's rather unusual for Buddhist monks in Tibet who are presumably devoted to the Dalai Lama to take this path."

Many Tibetans in China are angry about what they view as increasing domination by the country's majority Han ethnic group.

China, however, says that Tibetan living standards have improved with billions in Chinese investment."

_____

The Chinese probably think that the Tibetans should be happy because their living standards have improved "materially" - so what's their problem, and why all the uproar ?

Your thoughts?

[greenman]

If this had happened before the sodomy laws were repealed (June 26, 2003, when the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that all sodomy laws were unconstitutional in its historic Lawrence v. Texas decision, which also had an impact on the burgeoning same-sex marriage debate) this teen probably would not have been left alone with her attacker ...

... but with the way things are currently this type of an assault is no longer in the same type of "criminal" category as it once was - nowadays it is only considered "sexual misconduct" - which means that the boy faces less than a year in a juvenile detention center ... which means he'll probably only serve a few months, if that much.

Which also explains why they risked keeping him in the same ward with her for two weeks after the incident: his crime was no "big deal" to anybody.

And good luck with plans to sue the city - nowadays the boy's lawyer could argue that he was just trying to "love" her, to display a valid form of affection!

In fact, nowadays one could argue that the girl is at fault for complaining as if she were "violated" and exaggerating the pain, the hurt, the anger, the sadness - is she truly justified in feeling such strong emotions or is she mentally ill? ... but as this confusing trend continues, what is happening to the mental/emotional health of our children - modern society - and the world?

I'm sorry but thats nonsense, Sodomy laws deal with consential sex and would have no baring on this situation. The boy was afterall under investigation for sexual assault and the failing was allowing him to stay in the same ward as the girl in that situation.

Personally I get the feeling that your preaching relgious(veiled homophobic?) hokem in a thread where its totally unwelcome.

[sweetredwine]

... and again:

China hit by new Tibet monk self-immolation

"The 17-year-old from Sichuan province's Kirti monastery, the scene of repeated protests, shouted slogans against the Chinese government as he tried to self-immolate, the US-based International Campaign for Tibet (ICT) said.

Citing Tibetans in exile with contacts in Aba town, where the incident occurred Monday, the activist group said the monk was immediately surrounded by security personnel who extinguished the flames, beat him and took him away. ...

Barry Sautman, an associate professor at the Hong Kong University of Science and Technology who studies ethnic politics, said self-immolations in Tibetan regions had been a "rare" occurrence until recently.

"I don't think that we knew of any examples until recently, at least no examples that occurred inside Tibet," he said, referring to wider Tibetan areas.

"There was one example of a Tibetan exile who immolated himself some years back. At the time, the Dalai Lama condemned the self-immolation and said it contravened the Buddhist idea of the sanctity of life.

"So it's rather unusual for Buddhist monks in Tibet who are presumably devoted to the Dalai Lama to take this path."

Many Tibetans in China are angry about what they view as increasing domination by the country's majority Han ethnic group.

China, however, says that Tibetan living standards have improved with billions in Chinese investment."

_____

The Chinese probably think that the Tibetans should be happy because their living standards have improved "materially" - so what's their problem, and why all the uproar ?

Your thoughts?

... and yet again

China police shoot Tibetans, nun burns to death

"BEIJING (Reuters) - A Tibetan nun in China burned herself to death on Monday a day after police shot and wounded two Tibetan demonstrators, a group advocating Tibetan self-determination said, the latest protests against Chinese rule of the Himalayan region.

The self-immolation and the protests would appear to signal that anger is growing in Aba prefecture, a mainly ethnic Tibetan part of the southwestern province of Sichuan that has been the center of defiance of Chinese control.

Rights groups say the unrest could lead to a crackdown in Aba, which erupted in violence in March 2008 when Buddhist monks and other Tibetans loyal to the exiled Dalai Lama, their exiled religious leader, confronted police and troops.

The condition and whereabouts of the two protesters who were shot and wounded, Dawa and Druklo, were not known, the London-based Free Tibet group said.

The Foreign Ministry said it had not heard of the shootings by the police.

"Some organizations with political motives have been spreading rumors and it's not the first time that (they have used) this practice of misleading the public," the office of the ministry's spokesman said in a statement.

"We hope everyone treats such information with caution."

On Monday, a 20-year-old nun, Tenzin Wangmo, set fire to herself outside a nunnery in the same region, the ninth self-immolation this year in Tibetan parts of China, Free Tibet said.

The nun had called for religious freedom in Tibet and for the return of the Dalai Lama as she set herself alight, the Free Tibet group said.

Her death comes seven months after a Tibetan Buddhist monk, Phuntsog, 21, from the restive Kirti monastery, burned himself to death. As a result, security forces detained about 300 monks for a month.

Foreign Ministry spokesman Liu Weimin last week criticized the Dalai Lama for not only failing to denounce the self-immolations but for playing them up and even asking people to "follow the example.

He did not mention the Dalai Lama on Tuesday but said: "We believe that promoting and encouraging harm to life is immoral."

Nine ethnic Tibetans, eight of them from Aba prefecture, have burned themselves since March to protest against religious controls by the Chinese government, which labels the Dalai Lama a violent separatist.

The Nobel Peace Prize-winning Dalai Lama denies the accusation and says he wants autonomy and not independence for Tibet.

The state news agency Xinhua said, citing officials from Aba's religious affairs bureau, said exiles were being the self-immolation attempts.

"(They) showed signs of having been instigated by a clique jockeying for power in the overseas Tibetan community under the Dalai Lama," the news agency said.

Xinhua report quoted bureau head Song Tendargye as saying that the Tibetan community in Aba was "disgusted" that a former "living Buddha" of the Kirti monastery in Aba had led prayer services for those who had attempted self-immolation.

Free Tibet Director Stephanie Brigden said in a statement late on Monday her group had "grave concerns that greater force may be deployed if protests spread."

China has ruled Tibet with an iron fist since Communist troops marched in 1950.

But it rejects the criticism of rights groups and exiled Tibetans, saying its rule has bought much needed development to a poor and backward region."

Edited October 18, 2011 by sweetredwine

[sweetredwine]

Barry Sautman, an associate professor at the Hong Kong University of Science and Technology who studies ethnic politics, said self-immolations in Tibetan regions had been a "rare" occurrence until recently.

"I don't think that we knew of any examples until recently, at least no examples that occurred inside Tibet," he said, referring to wider Tibetan areas.

... the ninth self-immolation this year in Tibetan parts of China, Free Tibet said.

The nun had called for religious freedom in Tibet and for the return of the Dalai Lama as she set herself alight, the Free Tibet group said.

China has ruled Tibet with an iron fist since Communist troops marched in 1950.

But it rejects the criticism of rights groups and exiled Tibetans, saying its rule has bought much needed development to a poor and backward region."

During that same timeframe the "Bank of China said Wednesday its net profits totaled 96.30 billion yuan (15.17 billion U.S. dollars) in the first three quarters of this year, showing a 21.52 percent year-on-year rise" http://news.xinhuane...c_131214239.htm

Is this just a coincidence, or are the Tibetans just increasingly mentally ill ?

Edited October 26, 2011 by sweetredwine