Bands That Should/Shouldnt Be In The Rock And Roll...

[Jahfin]

I'd say Run DMC is a rap duo too, but there is a lot of rock in their music, maybe even to call them rock. For a while they had guitar riffs in almost every song. It's probably their fault we got bands like Faith No More, Ugly Kid Joe, Limp Bisquit and all those rock bands who incorporated rap in their music later on.

Weren't all of their "rock" riffs lifted off of rock n' roll albums they sampled from (with the possible exception of their collaboration with Aerosmith on Walk This Way)? I have nothing against sampling as long as the original artist is credited but if someone mentions Run DMC to me the first thing I think of is rap, not rock n' roll as they were a rap group. They no doubt were influential on rock n' roll as was Grandmaster Flash (who's already been inducted) but that doesn't make their music "rock n' roll", at least to me.

[Swede]

Weren't all of their "rock" riffs lifted off of rock n' roll albums they sampled from (with the possible exception of their collaboration with Aerosmith on Walk This Way)? I have nothing against sampling as long as the original artist is credited but if someone mentions Run DMC to me the first thing I think of is rap, not rock n' roll as they were a rap group. They no doubt were influential on rock n' roll as was Grandmaster Flash (who's already been inducted) but that doesn't make their music "rock n' roll", at least to me.

Actually no, because Rick Rubin who produced them (and Beastie Boys) was a major rock fan and he brought in people who played the guitar, unless he didn't do it himself. It's mostly the beats, which is programmed. I think it wasn't until the late 80's rappers begun to sample stuff off of records. Their second record is even titled King Of Rock.

BTW Jahfin, it's great to see you post frequently again.

[Jahfin]

Actually no, because Rick Rubin who produced them (and Beastie Boys) was a major rock fan and he brought in people who played the guitar, unless he didn't do it himself. It's mostly the beats, which is programmed. I think it wasn't until the late 80's rappers begun to sample stuff off of records.

Thanks for clarifying. I remember an MTV Unplugged where a variety of rap artists performed but actual instruments had to be used. No turntables or sampling were allowed.

Their second record is even titled King Of Rock.

I'm not sure if it's what you're implying but I really don't think just using the word "Rock" in their album titles (or songs) makes them "rock n' roll". I consider them to be rap artists first and foremost. Influential on rock n' roll? Yes. An actual "rock n' roll" artist? Most definitely not.

[Black Dawg]

I'd say Run DMC is a rap duo too, but there is a lot of rock in their music, maybe even to call them rock. For a while they had guitar riffs in almost every song. It's probably their fault we got bands like Faith No More, Ugly Kid Joe, Limp Bisquit and all those rock bands who incorporated rap in their music later on.

I would Say They are a Trio That don't belong in The Rock and Roll Hall of fame for covering other artist's work.

[Jahfin]

I would Say They are a Trio That don't belong in The Rock and Roll Hall of fame for covering other artist's work.

I agree that Run DMC don't belong in the Rock n' Roll Hall of Fame but it's because they're a rap group. Despite the sampling, they in fact do compose a great majority of their own material:

http://allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&s...pfpxqlgld6e~T31

If doing other people's songs was a prerequisite for not belonging in the Rock n' Roll Hall of Fame then Elvis Presley would be among the first to go.

[Swede]

I'm not sure if it's what you're implying but I really don't think just using the word "Rock" in their album titles (or songs) makes them "rock n' roll". I consider them to be rap artists first and foremost. Influential on rock n' roll? Yes. An actual "rock n' roll" artist? Most definitely not.

Not that it matter much, but I dare say they didn't sample any instruments at all the first three albums. At least not any guitar parts. Drums were programmed though. I do look at them as a rap group, but they were very influenced by rock. Not only does the title King Of Rock show that, you sure can hear it on their early albums. I'm ok with them in the r'n'r hall of fame. Not Madonna.

Edited January 15, 2009 by Swede

[ninelives]

I don't have a problem with Run DMC in the RRHOF. I've always viewed their use of the word "rock and roll" more of an umbrella term for popular music as opposed to straight rock. Maybe it wasn't the best choice of terms given the varied artist inductions. Madonna though I can't say I totally support, not because of her not being rock, but more I think she was culturally influential (whether you liked it or not) rather than musically so.

[zosodude13]

I'm digging this up since I decided to be smart and use the search feature before I made a whole new thread.

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Alright, bare with me...

1. I believe some of the artists that are not in now, and seem like obvious choices (Deep Purple, Heart, Alice Cooper...) stay on the outside because the hall does not want to acknowledge that they made a mistake by not putting them in earlier. Imagine Deep Purple being inducted in 2010 and the average rock fan saying 'But I thought they were already in? The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is SO FUCKING STUPID!!!' It would be bad publicity for them... which leads me to point #2.

2. The hall has a bad habit of deciding what acts to put in based on what will increase sales. There was a controversy in 2007 when The Dave Clack Five received more votes then Grand Master Flash. Jann Wenner, allegedly, decided that the RNRHOF couldn't go another year without inducting a rap group and voided some of the votes for Dave Clark Five for being "late". Naturally, this would be in hopes of bringing in fans of rap to buy tickets for the RNRHOF. The same argument could be said as to why Johnny Cash, Miles Davis and Madonna are in, even though the first 2 did have a notable impact on rock music.

3. The RNRHOF hates progressive rock. Sure Pink Floyd is in, but they are a band that is beyond any subgenre of rock due to their popularity. But bands like King Crimson, Yes, Genesis and the Moody Blues are all worthy of being in when compared to some names that are already in. Some people say prog is not rock so it should not go in. Any prog rock band is 100x more rock then say... I don't know, maybe Madonna?

As for who should be in (in no particular order) and why

Link Wray- the bridge between the early rock guitarists and the guitar gods of the 60's. Basically invented the power chord and was among the first to use distortion

MC5/The Stooges- both were highly influential in punk, taking the garage rock sound and adding anger too it. I would love for both to go in, but if one does get in, the other won't

Alice Cooper- made rock theatrical, much like David Bowie, and still made amazing music. Rob Zombie and Marlyn Manson owe their careers/copied Alice.

Deep Purple- part of the trio of Led Zeppelin and Black Sabbath that shaped and heavily influenced heavy metal.

Heart- a rock group led by two women, especially during the 70's? That's pretty damn influential if you ask me

The Sonics -like Swede said, they were punk rock 15 years before there was punk

Dick Dale- the King of the Surf guitar. His style and sound was unheard of back then and is still being used to this day.

King Crimson- They were the first prog rock band and deserve to represent the genre in the hall. Their lack of success should not be questioned because of their huge influence. The is a precedent of that kind of band being inducted: the Velvet Underground (with zero mainstream success and undeniable influence)

Genesis- This solves a lot of problems if they are inducted. It would likely mean that Peter Gabriel and Phil Collins would not have to be inducted as solo artists, and a legit prog band (70's) who did have mainstream success (80's) would go in.