Obama's Report Card...

[wanna be drummer]

^^ The only way to fix the health care system is to stop the insurance companies from raping people. That's the real problem, yet there hasn't even been a whisper about them. I wonder why.

That might be true, but you also have to decrease medical costs themselves, especially the costs of seeing a doctor, who's rates have been sharply increased to make up for the suits against them.

You fix these medical costs, then insurace companies will follow suit. Problem solved.

[bigstickbonzo]

That might be true, but you also have to decrease medical costs themselves, especially the costs of seeing a doctor, who's rates have been sharply increased to make up for the suits against them.

You fix these medical costs, then insurace companies will follow suit. Problem solved.

My step-father is a neurologist and has a private practice. He has to work 8 months outta the year before he starts earning for himself. That's how much the insurance rates are against him. It's ridiculous. Insurance companies have way too much power and say over the medical field.

[BUCK'EYE' DOC]

^^ The only way to fix the health care system is to stop the insurance companies from raping people. That's the real problem, yet there hasn't even been a whisper about them. I wonder why.

I agree with you bigstickbonzo.

You could pay all of your doctor's fees for your entire family for a year and not come close to paying anything near the amount that is paid for the insurance premiums for a year for your family.

In other words, your insurance premium paid to your medical insurance company (usually by your employer) is thousands of dollars more than what you would pay in fees directly to your doctor if you paid them out of pocket. Your insurance costs way more than what your medical fees would be if you paid them directly over the course of a year, provided that you are a nominally healthy person.

The point being, you don't appreciate how much money the insurance company is receiving on your behalf for your yearly coverage because you are not paying it, your employer is paying it.

I will give you a personal example:

The insurance premium for my family of four runs almost $10,000 per year! And this is for a plan with a $2000 deductible, meaning that we pay the first $2000 of any medical expense out of our pocket and the insurance will not pay anything until we have paid $2000 first.

Thank goodness my family is healthy. We have never had more than $1000 in medical expenses in one year. So that $10,000 that we pay each year does not benefit us in any way. We are paying for our own medical care. The insurance is paying nothing on our behalf.

Now if we had a major medical issue, such as Dzldoc has, then the insurance will keep us from going bankrupt paying for our medical care.

This is what INSURANCE is for. Not to pay every nickle and dime of your medical care.

That is why it is so expensive. We have been spoiled by allowing this to happen, expecting the insurance to pay everything. Insurance was meant to be a benefit for employers to attract and reward good employees. Not to pay every single cent of a person's medical expenses. But to pay for extraordinary, catastrophic expenses.

It is outrageous that the premiums are so expensive. Employers cannot bear the burden of paying this for all of their employees. People must take more personal responsibility. Pay the money to the doctor who is taking care of you, don't fund the beaurocracy of the insurance companies that are getting the lion's share of the money in the healthcare business. A doctor visit usally costs $100 or less. That is peanuts compared to what the insurance company is charging you for your insurance.

Don't blame the doctors for the cost of healthcare.

It is the insurance companies, the hospitals, the technology, the tests, the drugs, the medical equipment, etc... that cost alot more than a doctor's fee.

Then again, when you are in a life or death situation and need brain surgery, heart surgery, an organ transplant, sight-saving surgery, any specialized medical care such as this, then the doctors deserve what ever fees that they charge, in my opinion. Without them, you would be dead, disabled or blind.

Edited to add:

That is, if the best doctors refuse to work anymore under Obama's socialized heatlh care plan, then you will die, be disabled and go blind anyway because what you will have left are the sub-par hackers and it will take months to get care because there will be so few providers. But hey, you won't have to pay for it! Let the government pay for you. And yes, it is your money in the first place, that you paid in increased taxes. But hey, if you are out of a job because your employer cannot bear the increased tax burdens imposed by Obama and they go out of business, then I guess that you really aren't paying for it anyway. But hey, if everyone quits working and just relies on the government to take care of them, then who will be left working and paying the taxes to pay for everyone's healthcare? I guess that the government can just print more money to pay for it.

Sounds like a plan to me! What a great country we will have. No one will have to pay for their own healthcare and no one will be working and contributing to society. Let the government take care of you.

[cryingbluerain]

Obama is currently sitting at a 63-64% approval rating. I hate to break it to you, but for now that spells M-A-N-D-A-T-E. He's going to ram his budget right down the Republican's throat. I can hear their gagging now as Biden casts the deciding vote.

Well, considering that his budget puts more debt on the books in the first 5 years than all of the debt put on the books by every president between George Washington and George W. Bush, I can hear our children and grandchildren gagging too.

[wanna be drummer]

My step-father is a neurologist and has a private practice. He has to work 8 months outta the year before he starts earning for himself. That's how much the insurance rates are against him. It's ridiculous. Insurance companies have way too much power and say over the medical field.

Right, can't argue there. Malpractice insurance especially a total bitch.

Just to reiterate: If you can help keep costs down for doctors, that will be passed on to the insurance-field, and thus onto us. Huzzah!

[Pb Derigable]

As far as energy, Obama ain't stupid. He's smart enough to play the populist card because paying $4.50 a gallon is still fresh on every American's mind. "A plan" is far better than "no plan"......and what was this country's energy policy during the last 8 years ? Feel free to give me a Republican spiel on that particular point....I'm all ears.

I believe the G.O.P. plan called for Offshore drilling, ANWAR drilling and lots and lots of privately funded nukes and refineries.

The problem with that plan is the government has no power regulate that once it goes online

Im also glad we have a president who is more concern about what people think of him, than trying to fix the economy. Bush had a very bad image about protecting us and yet we never got attack. Obama on the other hand, has a strong image, but quite possibly cause this Bush Problem to form into a BUSH/OBAMA problem. and come 2012. a NOBAMA problem.

But i do believe Obama approval rating won't slip bad, but his ideas are falling and that will hurt the dems. Can't pass a bill when you're prez and the other party has control and don't like you. Check out Bushs last two years. Congress did nothing.

[DBJ]

In regards to the economic meltdown.

I think if people want to pass judgment, they should look at what the concerned parties had to say before the shit hit the fan.

I think people owe it to themselves to hear what was really going on with their own ears instead of being told what happened after the fact.

Listen now to the actual politicians and find out the truth to who's to blame

page 1

Pay no attention to the pundits or new anchors. Listen to the politicians.

If you want to know the roots of this economic crisis and why banks made bad loans listen here (especially for 2:20 to 3:10)

listen

This is from 1998 and involves a lawsuit that groups like acorn won against the Federal Government.

[Bong-Man]

What happened to all that input about the stock market on this thread ?

[cryingbluerain]

What happened to all that input about the stock market on this thread ?

Yeah, ever since BO started talking about the "fundamentally sound aspects of our economy" the market has been heading higher. Guess he was mistaken when said that John McCain "just doesn't get it" for saying that the fundamentals of our economy are strong..

[Bong-Man]

Yeah, ever since BO started talking about the "fundamentally sound aspects of our economy" the market has been heading higher. Guess he was mistaken when said that John McCain "just doesn't get it" for saying that the fundamentals of our economy are strong..

Wasn't that last July ? I believe the stock market had record losses that month. Isn't that the same criteria you guys used to judge Obama on March 9th of this year a few pages back ? I guess timing is everything in life.....and in the market.

Remember....when the 'Messiah' speaks....people listen !

[cryingbluerain]

Wasn't that last July ? I believe the stock market had record losses that month. Isn't that the same criteria you guys used to judge Obama on March 9th of this year a few pages back ? I guess timing is everything in life.....and in the market.

Remember....when the 'Messiah' speaks....people listen !

When McCain said that, unemployment was around 6% and the credit crunch had yet to reach the point that prompted Bush to propose a bailout. Now with unemployment over 8%, the $700 billion-plus Bush bailout has been followed by the $787 billion Obama stimulus package, and some Dems already are arguing for another stimulus package because the first Obama stimulus bill didn't do the trick. But now everything's fine and dandy because he says so?

[Bong-Man]

When McCain said that, unemployment was around 6% and the credit crunch had yet to reach the point that prompted Bush to propose a bailout. Now with unemployment over 8%, the $700 billion-plus Bush bailout has been followed by the $787 billion Obama stimulus package, and some Dems already are arguing for another stimulus package because the first Obama stimulus bill didn't do the trick. But now everything's fine and dandy because he says so?

I guess that would depend on if you bought when he told you to.

[cryingbluerain]

I guess that would depend on if you bought when he told you to.

I cost average slowly over time.

[wanna be drummer]

wow this place has gotten boring as of late no?

[Bong-Man]

I cost average slowly over time.

Me too....and I think it's going to end up killing us. Thank God I held on to the annuity when everyone told me not to.

[jimmie ray]

wow this place has gotten boring as of late no?

I'm just learning about all this politics and economy stuff. Anyone want to explain why a deficit matters? I mean, regardless of whether it's 10 dollars or 10 kadrillion dollars, how does it change the way this country operates? Who do we owe this money to, and what can they do if we don't pay it? Seriously???

[Reggie1971]

I'm just learning about all this politics and economy stuff. Anyone want to explain why a deficit matters? I mean, regardless of whether it's 10 dollars or 10 kadrillion dollars, how does it change the way this country operates? Who do we owe this money to, and what can they do if we don't pay it? Seriously???

Well if we default on the debt we owe other nations they can simply stop lending us money. Then in order to pay our bills we would have to print a whole lot more money, thereby causing superinflation. This leads to people's savings being ravaged, the poor and lower middle class not being able to pay for rent, gas, food, and so forth and dogs and cats living together.

It would not be a pretty sight.

[jimmie ray]

Well if we default on the debt we owe other nations they can simply stop lending us money. Then in order to pay our bills we would have to print a whole lot more money, thereby causing superinflation. This leads to people's savings being ravaged, the poor and lower middle class not being able to pay for rent, gas, food, and so forth and dogs and cats living together.

It would not be a pretty sight.

Thanks for engaging in what may seem a ridiculous subject to some. Are there particular countries that are lending the U.S. money? Don't they see they are going to wait a long time to be paid back, if ever? How does printing a bunch of extra money hurt us, once it's given outside this country? What about all the money that we give other countries that we are not in debt to, but supposedly want to help or pay off to not pursue certain actions?

You offered an undesireable scenario put in a future tense, yet it seems to be a present situation?

[bigstickbonzo]

Thanks for engaging in what may seem a ridiculous subject to some. Are there particular countries that are lending the U.S. money? Don't they see they are going to wait a long time to be paid back, if ever? How does printing a bunch of extra money hurt us, once it's given outside this country? What about all the money that we give other countries that we are not in debt to, but supposedly want to help or pay off to not pursue certain actions?

You offered an undesireable scenario put in a future tense, yet it seems to be a present situation?

China has bought nearly 70% of our bad assets, ie, we're on the hook with them for more than we currently have. I read yesterday they (China) want to push for a "common global currency" to eliminate the weak dollar and start fresh. That will surely get the Christian elite in an uproar.

Printing an excessive amount of money with no bottom end only further depleats the value of the dollar. If the dollar is weak, printing excessive amounts and pumping the system full of it won't necessarily solve anything. More likely, it will only prevent any turnaround and add to our deficit. In theory though, if the banks begin giving loans out to people who deserve them, it really doesn't matter how much money we print because the system will eventually correct itself. The big question is what will happen if the banks continue to fail, no lending and we still print a shit load of money. No one really knows because its never happened before and nothing like what Obama is proposing has been attempted before. It all comes down to bullshit. This whole mess resides on the shoulders of speculators in the Stock Market and banks shuffling around money for personal finances and self-trusts than anything else.

[jimmie ray]

China has bought nearly 70% of our bad assets, ie, we're on the hook with them for more than we currently have. I read yesterday they (China) want to push for a "common global currency" to eliminate the weak dollar and start fresh. That will surely get the Christian elite in an uproar.

Printing an excessive amount of money with no bottom end only further depleats the value of the dollar. If the dollar is weak, printing excessive amounts and pumping the system full of it won't necessarily solve anything. More likely, it will only prevent any turnaround and add to our deficit. In theory though, if the banks begin giving loans out to people who deserve them, it really doesn't matter how much money we print because the system will eventually correct itself. The big question is what will happen if the banks continue to fail, no lending and we still print a shit load of money. No one really knows because its never happened before and nothing like what Obama is proposing has been attempted before. It all comes down to bullshit. This whole mess resides on the shoulders of speculators in the Stock Market and banks shuffling around money for personal finances and self-trusts than anything else.

I think someone posted something about "China owning us" a while back, here. I knew we relied on imported goods from them, but not this. We're dead AND red, it seems???

[JimmyPage1977]

No one is talking about the stock market right now because it is not a symptom of the current problem...in the short term. If we go further into debt and China and Great Britain stop financing our debt... the stock market will hit lows that you've never seen before. The stock market is up for the moment because the Democrats are willing to give big business untold amounts of money to stabilize them. The chance of short term success is a no-brainer.

As far as a mandate for Obama..... that's fine, but he is breaking campaign promises at a record pace. I guess that "The Messiah" can lie and it doesn't matter to his fanatical followers.

It's always amusing to me that opponents of my views never debate the common sense logic in my posts, but rather divert to simplistic generalizations of the current situation.

I never mentioned Obama's approval rating and with the fact that there are lemmings that will follow him over the cliff, I don't see the relevance.

I agree that health care reform is necessary... I just don't think that it's a key component to solving our economic issues.

I agree that switching to alternative fuel sources is necessary... I just don't feel that it is a key component to solving our financial woes in the short term.

I think that Bush and the Republican Congress did a terrible job dealing with our economy, but I also heard the Democrats (Barney Frank, in particular) crying for and getting exceptions for approval of home loans for people that really couldn't afford them. The Republicans big mistake was abandoning conservative fiscal values.

I don't see us spending our way out of a mess that was created by overspending and greed.

Hey....I want the economy to get healed up. It should be JOB #1.

I want all Americans to have access to health care. I want us to do away with our dependence on foreign oil and fossil-based fuels. The thing is that they are not issues that will get us back into a great economy. Obama needs to focus on the things that got us here and deal with those things.

You can't fix overspending by inducing record overspending. You can't fix the separated politics of our legislative branch by shoving one sides politics down the others throats. Remember, Obama was going to use BI-PARTISAN methods to fix our nation's woes.

He is not doing the things that a great leader would do....he is not even doing the things that he PROMISED to do.

F-

[marolyn]

I think someone posted something about "China owning us" a while back, here. I knew we relied on imported goods from them, but not this. We're dead AND red, it seems???

when we buy all that chinese junk, they have to spend those dollars on something...so they end up "buying up america" or loaning those dollars back to us...

the chinese are not happy about the prospect of runaway inflation because we are in effect paying them back "less" than what we borrowed because those dollars we pay back are worth less...

[DBJ]

"In a new program, the Fed said it will buy up to $300 billion of long-term bonds, a move that should boost Treasury prices and drive down their rates. That would ripple through and lower rates on other kinds of debt. The last time the Fed set out to influence long-term interest rates was during the 1960s."

This new policy is very alarming. What it means is that the U.S. has run out of people( mainly countries like China) who are willing to buy our debt, so we are buying our own debt which translates into us printing more money.

This will directly result in higher inflation.

Basically we are where we were in the late 70's perhaps a little worse off.

Had we not thrown $3 trillion dollars down the drain over the last 6 months, we would be in the same place we where in 1991.

Had the Federal Government not forced banks into making unsound loans, there would be no problems relatively speaking at all.

[jimmie ray]

No one is talking about the stock market right now because it is not a symptom of the current problem...in the short term. If we go further into debt and China and Great Britain stop financing our debt... the stock market will hit lows that you've never seen before. The stock market is up for the moment because the Democrats are willing to give big business untold amounts of money to stabilize them. The chance of short term success is a no-brainer.

There certainly seems to be some media / voter bias that is trying to mask the point you make. I do wonder what countries we are in debt to think of this long term plan, and who is getting funds and rewards currently?

[Bong-Man]

**Bump**

I'm pissed that Obama tapped into the strategic oil reserve. What is it that Democrats don't understand about the word 'strategic' ? The oil reserve should never be used to manipulate short-term oil prices. Heck they were doing a good job heading down by themselves. The only thing accomplished was making everyone paranoid about anything and everything. People were actually speculating that we were about to send troops into Libya. Dumb dumb dumb.

18,000 new jobs last month, when every teenager and College student in America is looking for one..... .....and 90% of those probably pay minimum wage. Every city, school, police dept., fire dept., around me is laying off or taking pay and benefit cuts.....a recovery is supposed to come from this ?

When is a Republican going to admit that taxes are the lowest they've been since 1946 ? Since this is the worst economy in 80 years, what's so bad about making 'rich'people pay 39 % ? Hell, they don't end up ever paying that anyway !

Better grab your nuts Mr. President....you're gonna need 'em.