stonefreelee
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I've already said it was cool that Paul had some good things to say about Jimmy and Zep, so that's that. But on the subject and Kiss' artistic merit, it's important to remember that Gene Simmons himself is quite upfront about the fact that he doesn't care about the music, he wants to make as much money as possible, and brand as much merch for his fans to buy as possible. That's where their "questionable artistic integrity comes in". Here are some quotes from Simmons, and this is just from ONE INTERVIEW:
And now in the '90s and the 2000 era, we've got over 2,500 licenses: There's a KISS Broadway play on the way with Rob Roth, who directed Beauty and the Beast, a KISS cartoon show with the people who do Transformers and Beast Wars. In other words, there are KISS comic books in the works. Superman meets KISS. That's going to be the kickoff of the new Superman, uh, rather, the new KISS comic books series. So we're going everywhere. I can be on the cover of Playboy magazine, and I can sell comic books and bubble gum to younger fans. And it's all good. And instead of being in a rock and roll band -- who the hell wants to do that? I don't -- I want to be in a rock and roll brand. I want to be Disney without the overhead. And I'm on the way.
when asked about his makeup pattern on his face: A banker's pattern. When you look at it, it says, "Boy that guy's got a lot of money."
I will contend, and you try to disprove it, that the most important thing as we know it on this planet, in this plane, is, in fact, money. But getting to the money part, money is the single most important thing on the planet, including the notion that uh, love gives you everything. That's a lot of hogwash.
I believe in my heart that anyone who gets up there and says what they're doing is art is on crack, and is delusional, and that in point of fact, what they really ... their modus operandi initially -- perhaps it changed when they started to question their sexuality, but clearly, initially -- it was to get laid and make lots of money. And anybody who tells you otherwise is lying to you.
And my favorite obnoxious, money-grubbing, completely devoid of any artistic integrity quote: No one -- and that includes the Beatles and Elvis -- can touch our (KISS') merchandising and licensing. Nobody. Outside of the music world, it's only Disney and Lucas. But in the music world, they can't shine our shoes.
I was gonna read the entire thread but you, sir, you have stolen the thunder right out from under me, albeit 4 months ago!
A friend I went to grade school and high school with a huge Kiss fan. From freshman year on, he and I constantly battled over who was the better band. Constantly. I'd see him in the halls in school and yell, "Kiss sucks!". I'd slip notes in his wall-locker which would say the same thing...I've never, ever liked them because their "music" always boiled (dummed it down, as someone else said) things down to the lowest common denominator
...they were/are a caricature of themselves from day one, album one. Kiss came to St.Louis, (omg, i just went to a frickin' Kiss web site!) Oct. 2nd, 1979 and my friend bought two tickets...I dont know why (probably trying to convert me!) but he asked me to go and I said yes. Musta had nothing better to do that night. That would put me in the first semester of my sophmore year, so probably correct...Anywho, the show was quite the spectacle: fire, blood, explosions, etc. What was to be expected, I suppose. I'm glad he got to see his favorite band...
I must assure y'all though, I wasn't converted...good show, sucky, cartoon band...
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Great band.
Hard to pick their best song - Main In the Box, Them Bones, or Rooster.
The other day, I found a very cool clip of AIC on the Letterman Show.
Beside "Would" my fave is probably "Sickman"
sickman, sickman...
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In the late seventies I used to collect all things Zep-or should I say "...all Zep things that a 15 year-old bus-boy could afford!" I used to have the usual: boots, belt-buckles (used to have an all-brass LZ that I wore non-stop, no doubt with short-shorts and white socks up to my knees! Hey, it was the seventies...) pins, posters, etc.
There used to be a head shop a mile or two from my house. They used to sell music stuff as well as, er, 'head' stuff. They used to sell these things that were kinda like posters only they were made of wood. It was lile someone took a piece of plywood and then painted a pic on top of it...mine was "the boys", of course. It was from a concert pic, looks to me like '75. Believe it or not, I still have it! It's in my basement and is still in good condition. It probably cost me 10-15 bucks at the time. It was always the 'centerpiece' (
) of my collection! Well, besides my copy of Japan '70 vinyl (which oddly, i still have) with the most crystal clear version of "Friends" - the rest of the album is barely audible! They are the remnants of my "collection". The music, official or not, is what does it for me these days... -
What a sotry...
sorry so long winded! someone burnt me some real classics, history-wise, anyway. I have live in Amsterdam '68 - with Ray singing all the vocals 'cause Jim was in the local hospital! I also have their 2nd from last concert ever, Dallas '70. This is where they previewed "L.A Woman" and "Love Her Madly"...maybe even "the changeling". I cant remember 'cause I think i've listened to this one once! It sounds like the taper was in the upper level, nosebleed section or something. You can hear the music and vocals but it sounds like they are playing a block away! And it sounds like Jim is, um, tipsy. (GASP!)
Oh well. I have quite a few '68 shows and beyond most are horrible sound quality.
I hear the "perception" recordings have been really cleaned up. Dont have that yet...I have probably bought every doors (lz and Jimi) album/cassete/cd at least 15 tjimes over in the last 30 years!
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Well, I couldn't find any one, so this is first (I think).
Wellcome to:
What is your favourite CD and song?
Me: Roadhouse Blues - Song
CD: Morrison Hotel
I know The Doors since 2006, when the brother of the girlfriend of my brother (I cant remeber the word in english for all that), said to me: Listen Break on Through.
Go Jim
Where do I start? I started to learn about the doors in the fall of 1980, right after Bonzo passed. In fact, Jerry Hopkins and Danny Sugerman release their book that year and I received it for Christmas 1980. Having just turned 17 in August of that year, I was totally devastated by the news of John's passing. In addition to some serious substance abuse issues I had at that time, I was being overwhelmed with panic attack/anxiety attacks/flashbacks---I did't know what they were and during Christmas of '80, my dad and step-mom had me admitted to an "adolesecent" center for troubled youths...While I was in their for 2-3 weeks, I devoured "NO One Here Gets Out Alive", the doors first real biography. I was hooked...my life, my attitude changed overnight. And not necesarily for the better. Hell, if Jim Morrison did 250 hits of pure LSD in one year, why couldn't I? Well, he was the Lizard King and I wasn't.
I became a doors fan with a vengeance after that winter. I have followed them in great detail over the years, never surpassing my love for LZ, but right up there with them. The reason for that? Well, the bands were light years apart as far as the type of music they created. I always have my "exalted three" Jimi, lz, and the doors...never in competition with each other simply because they were so disimmlar...love them all....
But back to the original question. Favorite disc/album? Probably would have to go with their 1967 debut, if not just for "Light My Fire", which was really groundbreaking at the time. Musically, this song is incredible, with the jazzy solo's and the such...all culminating in the most unbelievable freaking sound-gasm I had heard (up to that point)...not many other have come close to this orgiastic explosion of 'music, sweet music'....(to quote Jimi).
Fave Doors songs: too many to list, though I definately like the more "obscure" songs, not "the hits", as it were. For example, I'd much rather hear "My Eyes Have Seen You" than a more recognizable one such as, "Love me two time".
I'll try to keep this brief: You're lost little girl, Twentieth Century Fox, Crystal Ship, Love Street, End of the night, Moonlight Drive, Strange Days (really love this one!), wintertime love, summer's almost gone, spanish caravan, yes the river knows, tell all the people, shaman's blues, ezy ride (sp?), do it, wild child, wishfull sinful, soft parade, waiting for the sun, you make me real, Peace Frog/Blue Sunday, indian summer, the changeling (awesome!), been down so long, the cars hiss by my window, l.a. woman, l' america (sp?), hyacynth house (the "demo" version on the '97 box set is freaking awesome!), whoops, forgot "Queen of the Highway". And yes, the "jazz" version on the same box set (imho) is better than version on the Morrison Hotel lp. Yeah, I almost forgot the JL Hooker cover (as mentioned above) of "Crawling Kingsnake". And of 'course, "Riders..." This was all from memory, so I may have missed a few. I loved his "crooner songs", all though they were certainly never marketed as such. He had an assload of charisma, though he was obviously a very flawed individual. I learned a lot from them and their music.
In the early eighties, my good friend (whom I met in the adolescent "center") became mega-doors fans (whatever that is!
). He began to acquire a bunch of doors boots on lp---almost all of which I recorded by putting my cassete recorder in front of the speakers as the album played! This is how I recorded many lp's in the late 70's and early eighties (pre-82, anyway)! Some were really crappy sound, but one, probably my fave (boot) is the two sets from Stockholm, Sweden Sept. 20th (?) 1968. Sound near pristine, albeit in mono. You get to hear a version of "Love Street" live...in fact, at the beginning of the song, Jim has to give them a loud "shush" so they can hear it....also during one of the sets they preface "Alabamba Song" with the (early, I think) sixties song by bobby darin, "Mack the Knife" unbelievably good! I also have purchased all (but one) the live shows they have released on "Bright Midnight Records", which I think is a frickin' AWESOME endeavor! LZ take heed: I can only imagine all the reels and reels of shows that Jimmy probablly has in his possesion...throw us a bone James Patrick!
Finally I'll finish with a few items: The one they released pre-x-mas, I believe was "live in Boston 1970". DO NOT BUY THIS SHOW. JIM MORRISON WAS DRUNK ON HIS ASS FOR BOTH SETS THEY PERFORMED THAT NIGHT. AND IT SHOWS!! Three remaining doors tryed to make it through the show, and they did. I had even more respect for them after hearing these shows. It gave me much perspective on what they had to endure...Dont buy it unless you want to keep it with the tempe, arizona lz performance....as some of the worst concerts by some of the best artists ever...
Finally, "An American Prayer" is simply stunning, imho. They have a (relatively) new version of it with a few bonus tracks which are very poigiant (sp?), such as, "Bird of Prey" and a couple others...
Finally (really, I swear this time!), I and my "teen rehab buddy" and his wife got tickets to see Ray Manzerak and poet Michael McClure perform at a StLouis area basement bar sometime early nineties. All three of us, uh, "riding the snake", so to speak! And this in the basement bar of a University City establishment that probaly held no more than a hundred people-max. Ray played electric piano while MM recited some of his poems -all night. I remebered he did one as a tribute to Jim called, "In memorium". They were both less than 10-12 feet away from me and my friends -the whole time!
If you recall, Michael McClure was one the poets Jim looked up to before he was ever even in the doors...
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How about "Crawling King Snake" - that has an old fashioned blues feel to it?
Johnny Lee Hooker wrote this song, the doors covered it.
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I just found a song that was one of her first recordings:
Hopefully someone will here will enjoy it.
once again, Janis' first know audio can be heard (on the box set) or youtube. I just found it. Just search 'Janis Joplin What good can drinkin' do' and you'll get to hear the audio, at least. This was recorded in 1962, years before she really took off!
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I'm the source, aside from whatever follows thru further collaboration. The thread title
and first post establishes this precept quite clearly.
Yeah, that's how I understood it, as well. This thread is titled...
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When I was a kid in the early/mid 70s, there were books (the size of coloring books) that the pages in them did the same exact thing- turn colors when water was applied. I used a small paintbrush to do this. After I got ITTOD I used the same brush (which I had saved for some reason) to color the inner sleeve.
oh for the days of "click-clacks" and the day-glo things you could put on your bicycle spokes (with said bike sporting a 'banana seat!)
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It's not uncommon in film/video production for the production house/laboratory to keep the masters in their vault. In this case, providing a clean, controlled and safe environment for storage of the tapes was probably part of the contract.
It doesn't mean that the band/record company don't have ownership of all rights associated with the recordings, just that the production house is taking care of the physical tapes.
yeah, that makes sense, actually.
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I was surprised to learn their location as well. The band (Jimmy) or their label may have taken possession of them in the intervening years but as I understand it that's where they were. One of the reasons Nocturne kept them is for the occasional promo clips they would be commissioned to provide, normally for news reports and telecasts. In this way, some pro-shot footage clips have been released (New Orleans 3/11/95, Detroit 4/1/95, East Rutherford 4/7/95, Irvine Meadows 10/3/95, Hartford 10/21/95).
Some years back, not precisely sure when (99-2005) I saw an add in RS magazine (in the back) where you could purchase "rare" videos by mainstream acts...this is where i purchased a video of Knebworth-all 3 and a half hours! It was the worst copy of a copy of a copy of a copy I have ever seen. The point is, this 'outfit' subsequently sent me a mailer with lists of other "acts" etc...and included in the list was Page/Plant...this is why I have wondered about this. Is it safe to assume that some Nocturne employee'
s weren't the most honorable? I just dont see anyone sneaking in a camcorder in those days and not be noticed. And the shows listed were quite numerous...
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There were six covers, each depicting the same bar scene from different point of view.
He wanted to know why a particular cover was selected for the cd release. The answer seems obvious - because only one can be chosen - but perhaps there is more to it. I've
heard some crazy theories before about why there are six covers, six angles, six...
The water-color inner sleeves sprung from the incomparable imagination of Hipgnosis. It
is a bar scene and drinks are often spilled on bars so why not the inner sleeve? If there's more to this someone else can feel free to chime in.
The brown paper bag was possibly a band idea. The music was not fashionable (In Through The Out Door...get it) so it was thought why not put it out in a brown paper bag. Robert has related the joke that in this way people who came to it while flipping through their record collections could exclaim: "Oh, no that's not really there. It's just a brown paper bag!". However, the bag does conceal which of the six covers (each was
labelled on the spine either A B C D E F) the record-buyer had just purchased so it did
serve a purpose beyond party humor.
Cool, thanks again...did not know about the lettering on the spines though. I never even thought about the "cd cover" for said album! Last time I purchased that was with all the studio albums that came in the box...thanks!
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Yes. Nocturne would have been obligated by contract to provide that service. Bear in mind, as I understand it, the mastertapes in the Nocturne vault only contain whatever was shown on the screens. This is to say the video engineer at the board "selected" the camera feed he wanted displayed at any given time and that final "mix" as shown on the screens is what was recorded on the mastertape. The individual cameras themselves were not equipped with a record capability.
Right on, Steve. Thanks for your promt, info filled reply. It seems odd (to me, anyway) that Nocturne would have the tapes in their vaults. Would the images contained therein not be property of the band? Also, (and I probably already know the answer) is it possible that any of this footage will see the light of day?
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Hey Steve,
It's been a while, but I'm just wondering if there has been any progress of the "ITTOD Cover Mystery"? its jsut been a while without any updates... thanks in advance!
Just wondering, can you explain what the "mystery" is? I do remember it had seven (i believe) different covers. Does anyone remember this: I heard on the local radio station (probably that day, 20 Aug '79) that if you took a damp sponge to the inside sleeve (you know, the ashtray, drink on table, etc) it would then change from black/white to color. Strange but true. I did it to mine, and sure enough---there it was: color. Was there any reason for this besides just something extra to do?
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That's a sweeping generalization which may not hold up under closer scrutiny. I believe
Nocturne Video's tour production support may have been limited to the North American
dates only. I can get clarification on that. I do know I attended many European dates
which were not documented by a full camera crew and screens were not present, for
example St. Austell 7/12/95. However, they may have employed the use of a single cam
mounted on the soundboard, as I'd seen John Paul Jones do on his 1999 European tour.
In clarification, every show that Nocturne participated in probably has a full audio/video recording?
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Unfortunately, there aren't any accurate official records of the early tour itinerary. For obvious reasons, the band members don't remember every city/date they played nearly forty years ago. Periodically, evidence of a "new" date surfaces - In this case, it's the first time evidence of this show has come to light.
Quote: Wouldn't this have already been known by the zep powers that be? How have the site creators came up with "timeline"? Did they not have imput from the band members themselves? Is this really a new revelation?
thank you for your reply, I really had no idea...I guess I thought these things were recorded for posterity's sake...
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YET ANOTHER 1969 LED ZEPPELIN CONCERT CONFIRMED
ICE PALACE in LAS VEGAS August 11, 1969
The Initial Confirmation I received in response to my inquiry via private correspondence:
(addresses omitted)
Hiya Steve;
PINKINY CANANDY didn't open for Led Zeppelin - we were second on the bill. A local band opened the show, then Pinkiny Canandy (Michael Chain) and then Zeppelin. PINKINY CANANDY: Michael Chain lead singer/songwriter guitarist (original lead singer of the KNACK) drums - Doug Altman (played with Ricky Nelson, Jackson Brown, Linda Rondstat, Danny O'Keefe) bass -Mike Rice (formerly with Merry Go Round) lead guitar - Gary Kato (formerly with Merry Go Round). Any other questions you have I'll be happy to answer. I remember that concert well.
Michael Chain
www.michaelchain.com
Original Thread:
Wouldn't this have already been known by the zep powers that be? How have the site creators came up with "timeline"? Did they not have imput from the band members themselves? Is this really a new revelation?
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Questions pertaining to soundboard Page/Plant tour videos came up in a Ramble On thread. The inquiry was does each of the Page/Plant concerts which were filmed for the overhead screens exist in their archive and did each camera have a recorder inside? This answer via private email with consent to post from Terry Stephenson:
P/P tour video presentation was done by a company out of San Francisco called Nocturne Video. They had about 5 camera men I think that each had a camera with a video cable that fed back to the video live-switch mixer. These cameras did NOT have tapes recording in the cameras, they acted as CAMERAS, not CAMCORDERS.
Each of these video signals was fed to the live-switch mixer where the director, Paul Becher, was directing his crew and choosing which camera feed to switch to at that time. The resulting image was shown on the big video screen, and at the same time this live-switch video mix was also being recorded on a Betacam deck, archiving the final product for P/P to have. The soundboard audio feed was also being fed into this record deck as well.
Every single P/P show was archived on tape from the live-video/audio mix, recorded to Betacam video tape. Every one of these tapes was sent back to the Nochturne Video office in SF and stored in their vault. On occasion P/P called for certain tapes to be pulled out for news promo releases, etc...this is how the pro-shot Irvine '95, Hartford '95, etc. got out.
The O2 concert was done differently; they had over 20 cameras going. There were 2 separate crews; one crew was dedicated to the live-switch mix shown on the video screen for the fans to see (as described above), and we've seen the result of this live mix with the sample clip of Black Dog that they released for the news.
The second video crew was shooting for the purpose of making/editing a DVD release later. Each of these cameras was recording HD digital tape, what is called "an iso tape" or isolated tape source that a video editor can study and pick shots from in post production.
In the case of EC '75 I think the 3 or 4 camera crew was doing both a live feed to the video screen and recording tape in the cameras at the same time. I remember reading that much of those tapes were not usable after all these years. Jimmy had the tapes restored through a process called "baking."
So, in summation, the audio and video for every P/P show was recorded?
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now I want to move to Finland...
My friend and I painting trees, so sillyThis is me
looking very proud
I did this
And my friend did this
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He supposedly pulled his dick out at a show, I think that's what someone asking but I don't think the previous post makes that clear. I don't know for sure but I don't think it's ever actually be known whether he did or not. Even in the Doors movie they kinda skirted around it and never made it clear. Maybe because no one really knows for sure.
Yeah, it was the Miami concert where this was supposed to have happened. At the trial around a year-and-a-half later, no photographic evidence was presented that Jim exposed himself. Some testified that he exposed himself, most testified that they hadn't seen anything of the sort. If anyone is interested, the original book on the doors, "No one here gets out alive" is a great document, actually an informative, funny read. It details the Miami trial fairly well. Apparently the trial itself was a farce, a miscarriage of justice. The judge was up for re-election at that point and didn't want the public to think he was soft on "the long-hairs".
I believe Jim was found guilty of indecent exposure and a few of the other charges. To give you an idea of how back-assward the "trial" was, Jim was found not-guilty of public drunkeness! When the prosecutor asked him if he exposed himself, Jim replied, "I dont remember, I was too drunk". The defendant admits to public drunkeness while on the witness stand, under oath and is still found not guilty!
Jim went free on bond while the verdict was under appeal. Sadly he died in Paris in early July of 1971 before "justice" was served.
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While at college in Florida, he was arrested for stealing a police helmet out of a cop car or off of a police motorcycle.
In November of 1967, the doors were scheduled to play in New Haven, CT. Backstage, before the show, Morrison was allegedly "talking" with a female fan in a toilet stall. The police officer asked Jim and the girl to vacate the area. The girl fled, Morrison decided to stay and confront the cop. The cop then maced Jim in the face. Jim ran out of the stall screaming, "I've been maced!"
Judging from the attention that Jim was receiving, the cop no doubt realized he screwed up! The cops did, however, let the show go on. During a passage in "Back Door Man", Jim began talking, describing what took place backstage just before the show started...slowly, all the cops in the building began to turn around and stare at Jim as he began to berate "the little blue man in the little blue suit..." suddenly the house lights came on and the ancient police chief walked onstage to inform Jim he was under arrest...Jim supposedly stuck the mic in the cop's face and said, "Say your thing, man..." Then he was surrounded on both sides by cops and arrested. Jim was beaten, kicked, spit on...all by the "law enforcement" officers of the day. Fortunately, a reporter for "TIME" magazine was arrested with Jim and his cameramen supposedly had their equipment confiscated and cameras emptied of their film...I think Jim Morrison was the first rock 'n roll star to be arrested on stage, during the performance...I could be wrong, but pretty sure...
Of course, there was the infamous "Miami Concert" in Dade County, FL. March 1st, 1969. Jim missed a few flights enroute to Miami and drank all the way there! The promoters supposedly screwed the doors by paying them a flat rate based on the current seating setup. As soon as the doors' reps signed the contract, the promoters had approximately 1500 seats removed and began charging general admission...jamming more people in the facility than what the band was getting paid for. When Jim got there he was shit-faced...he was most probably incensed by the promoters' greed and his anger is palpable in his "performance"! "You're all a bunch of fucking idiots!!!" He screamed at one point, no doubt referencing the situation with the promoters...The concert finally ground to a halt after Jim supposedly tried to remove his leather pants...three days later the doors were charged with trying to incite a riot, public drunkeness, profanity, lewd and lacivious behavior and exposure... this caused almost every city to cancel appearances by the band...they lost an entire tour (1969) over that one...this also was the begining of their "decline"....he was also arrested at least two times after these incidents...
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It was the 60s, so sometimes the cops over-reacted. Sometimes it was legit.
Does anyone know if Jim Morrison really did do what he was arrested for?
Which time?
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I looked it up on the internet and didn't find that he had been arrested. I could be wrong though.
He was arrested in Sweden early on, probably '67 or early '68. I've read many, many books on Jimi, so this is just from memory. I think it was in Gothenburg(?) Sweden. Jimi was drunk off his ass and for whatever reason began trashing his hotel room, etc. I imagine not much of this went on in Sweden. The authorities were called and he was arrested. I've seen pictures of him w/handcuffs, you cant tell that very well though, 'cause he is wearing a big, white fur around his neck and it partially covers his front area...he is flanked by two Swedish police officers, though.
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I'm sure some of you will hate my guts for saying this....but, I just never liked her. It's okay driving in the car listening to one of her hits. That's about it. Am I going to sit at home alone analysing the meaning of her music/lyrics. Probably not. There is a whole group of artists from the sixties I find repulsive, Joplin, Hendrix, Jefferson Airplane, Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young. There, I just made some more friends. All these hippie, dippie, American, drug taking, getting arrested acts. Maybe it's because, my main thing during my formative years was British rock. Then around 75/76 I got into punk and I really hated them all.
Yeah JT, we know that british lads would never consider doing such things (i.e. drugs)...we know the mop-toppies would never think about dropping acid or smoking weed...or the stones...what are you out of your frickin' mind????
...they were/are a caricature of themselves from day one, album one. 
) of my collection! Well, besides my copy of Japan '70 vinyl (which oddly, i still have) with the most crystal clear version of "Friends" - the rest of the album is barely audible! They are the remnants of my "collection". The music, official or not, is what does it for me these days...
It was the 60s, so sometimes the cops over-reacted. Sometimes it was legit.
Post A Picture Of Yourself!
in Meet & Greet
Posted · Edited by stonefreelee
Me and my sister in Greensboro this past weekend.