SteveAJones Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 ..I am also reviewing some attendees recollections posted herein..will update likewise... For now...I suppose if Iron's concerts can be looked into that would be helpful I suppose...I have sent email so far... I have the Las Vegas orginal email/contact Staff for reference.... Something tells me this will come down to discovery of a a long-lost photograph or some legal documentation (a contract, tax, city, county, police or union records, etc) as opposed to wholly unsubstantiated recollections. We'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanetPage Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 Something tells me this will come down to discovery of a a long-lost photograph or some legal documentation (a contract, tax, city, county, police or union records, etc) as opposed to wholly unsubstantiated recollections. We'll see. ...this was my purpose/alternative to contact UNLV Special Collections/Historic Documents.....If they possibly have any venue records....... ..I have looked into the Doors, they opened Nov. 1, 1969 at Ice Palace... It is mentioned by one of the groups members in the fanviews that "we opened for Alice Cooper" the same night we did for Doors...I looked into this, Alice Cooper does not appear to be in Convention Centre/Vega same night as Doors...(sorry, I don't have the date now)... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAJones Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 ...this was my purpose/alternative to contact UNLV Special Collections/Historic Documents.....If they possibly have any venue records....... ..I have looked into the Doors, they opened Nov. 1, 1969 at Ice Palace... It is mentioned by one of the groups members in the fanviews that "we opened for Alice Cooper" the same night we did for Doors...I looked into this, Alice Cooper does not appear to be in Convention Centre/Vega same night as Doors...(sorry, I don't have the date now)... Grateful Dead played the Ice Palace circa Mar '69. No question it was a well-known venue for rock music. Just need to confirm when/if Led Zeppelin performed there. Hey, I just realized your a female. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikezep61 Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 (edited) Ho Lee Shit! We are on the brink of a confirmation once again. Just got to get the ball across the goal line now. Steve, that last yard is usually the toughest! Postscript to story: The marriage lasted just 13 days and was annulled on July 9, 1970. Interestingly enough, Patti Duke had a baby boy named Sean who was born in February 1971. Though long-rumored to be the son of actor John Astin (Addams Family fame), DNA results proved Mike Tell was actually Sean Astin's biological father. Sean Astin is also an actor and was the lead character in the movie "Rudy" and also acted in "Lord of the Rings," as well as many other roles. Edited September 4, 2009 by mikezep61 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAJones Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 Steve, that last yard is usually the toughest! See, that's just fascinating. I can see gross inaccuracy or embellishment 40 years after the fact..."yeah, man we opened for Zep in Vegas"..."hey man, so did we..." but waaay back in 1970? Hey, the guy was booking big acts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanetPage Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 See, that's just fascinating. I can see gross inaccuracy or embellishment 40 years after the fact..."yeah, man we opened for Zep in Vegas"..."hey man, so did we..." but waaay back in 1970? Hey, the guy was booking big acts. Actor Sean Astin, right, is the son of Michael Tell, the editor and publisher of The Las Vegas Israelite. COURTESY PHOTO For local newspaper publisher Michael Tell, this goes beyond any father's wildest fantasy. http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2004/Feb-29-Sun-2004/photos/astin.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2004/Feb-29-Sun-2004/news/23327549.html&usg=__kW6Ygup1XkJ13uPYdbDn0H6Wq38=&h=400&w=297&sz=26&hl=en&start=1&um=1&tbnid=cayjhhrKAzrK2M:&tbnh=124&tbnw=92&prev=/images%3Fq%3DSean%2BAstin%2BMichael%2BTell%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26channel%3Ds%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1 oh..just a little more... Tucson Daily Citizen Saturday April 4, 1970 reports the following from newspaperarchives.com search.. ...Hotel Thunderbird Led Zeppelin rock group booked for April 19, 1970 concert at con-vention centre..... (I will acquire membership) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikezep61 Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 The Las Cruces, New Mexico and Tucson papers had a weekly syndicated feature called the "Las Vegas Scene" which listed where all the "stars" were playing in Las Vegas. It lists a LOT of venues (Caesar's Palace, Dunes, Flamingo, Sands, Sahara, International, Thunderbird, Stardust, and many, many others). It also lists a lot of artists, but mainly typical Las Vegas "show" types. I have checked 1969 and have not seen any reference to the Zep gig. I'll keep digging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanetPage Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 The Las Cruces, New Mexico and Tucson papers had a weekly syndicated feature called the "Las Vegas Scene" which listed where all the "stars" were playing in Las Vegas. It lists a LOT of venues (Caesar's Palace, Dunes, Flamingo, Sands, Sahara, International, Thunderbird, Stardust, and many, many others). It also lists a lot of artists, but mainly typical Las Vegas "show" types. I have checked 1969 and have not seen any reference to the Zep gig. I'll keep digging. ...yes, likewise, UNLV is very cooperative so far, I will see to it if Las Vegas Court House might have any legally binding contracts available to public of major venues... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAJones Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 ...yes, likewise, UNLV is very cooperative so far, I will see to it if Las Vegas Court House might have any legally binding contracts available to public of major venues... A search of police arrest records or desk sergeant logbooks could provide interesting..."31 Jul 69...two patrols dispatched to Ice Palace to direct traffic following rock music concert..." I'm either getting rather imaginitive or overly desperate to solve this mystery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAJones Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 The Las Cruces, New Mexico and Tucson papers had a weekly syndicated feature called the "Las Vegas Scene" which listed where all the "stars" were playing in Las Vegas. It lists a LOT of venues (Caesar's Palace, Dunes, Flamingo, Sands, Sahara, International, Thunderbird, Stardust, and many, many others). It also lists a lot of artists, but mainly typical Las Vegas "show" types. I have checked 1969 and have not seen any reference to the Zep gig. I'll keep digging. It's a good lead but as Chain said, Tell apparently booked concerts on the fly with little to no advance promotion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanetPage Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 (edited) A search of police arrest records or desk sergeant logbooks could provide interesting..."31 Jul 69...two patrols dispatched to Ice Palace to direct traffic following rock music concert..." I'm either getting rather imaginitive or overly desperate to solve this mystery. ..July 31, 1969 was the only date within the time frame when Page was in transitional relationship between Catherine James and P. Debarres...(He left the first, hasn't met the latter). I have written to James as well, and she so far has not confirmed anything (to save her time, I told her to write back ONLY if she knows any thing about Vegas...she was with Page, as you know...) Miss P., well her account is most knowledgeable...(FYI - James/Debarres were both present in the Venue on July 31, 1969 - James being employee at The Ex...) so far, I have not proved as to where the Band is arriving from...IMO they are arriving, P.M., from somewhere... I would think the Police Dept. Archives would be very helpful, in addition to search we already have in progress... Edited September 4, 2009 by PlanetPage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAJones Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 ..July 31, 1969 was the only date within the time frame when Page was in transitional relationship between Catherine James and P. Debarres...(He left the first, hasn't met the latter). I have written to James as well, and she so far has not confirmed anything (to save her time, I told her to write back ONLY if she knows any thing about Vegas...she was with Page, as you know...) Miss P., well her account is most knowledgeable...(FYI - James/Debarres were both present in the Venue on July 31, 1969 - James being employee at The Ex...) so far, I have not proved as to where the Band is arriving from...IMO they are arriving, P.M., from somewhere... I would think the Police Dept. Archives would be very helpful, in addition to search we already have in progress... Not to whip a dead horse, but I'm thinking 7/31 or 8/11. I just don't trust Pam's recollections when it comes to specific dates. Her books are entertaining but have inaccuracies more casual fans don't notice nor care about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanetPage Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 (edited) 8/11. I just don't trust Pam's recollections when it comes to specific dates. Her books are entertaining but have inaccuracies more casual fans don't notice nor care about. ..If I follow a pattern, Page always calls her after the shows, ie. when he went to Texas (He states, I will call you tomorrow, etc. (I will post that entry more consistently)...I do agree with you that it is a available date, but she does state on his day off they listened to the Test Press (this has to be August 11) other date being Palamino Brother Show date with Page...(BTW, I should look into that concert date...) Anyhow, she has accounted for most of her time with Page...and this date does not appear in her view in any way...I am sure the very least she would have received a phone call, although I think, Page would have offered a ticket, as he always does to the ladies... The inaccuracy that I find is she writes next day...the event sometime is of day before... Edited September 4, 2009 by PlanetPage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAJones Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 ..If I follow a pattern, Page always calls her after the shows, ie. when he went to Texas (He states, I will call you tomorrow, etc. (I will post that entry more consistently)...I do agree with you that it is a available date, but she does state on his day off they listened to the Test Press (this has to be August 11) other date being Palamino Brother Show date with Page...(BTW, I should look into that concert date...) Anyhow, she has accounted for most of her time with Page...and this date does not appear in her view in any way...I am sure the very least she would have received a phone call, although I think, Page would have offered a ticket, as he always does to the ladies... The inaccuracy that I find is she writes next day...the event sometime is of day before... You know, it's a shame she didn't keep copies of her phone bills as they probably are not archived. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanetPage Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 (edited) You know, it's a shame she didn't keep copies of her phone bills as they probably are not archived. ..No she didn't...I think she updated the last of diaries at the back of her original book in 2005...She did say she had telegrams from Page ..on that note, I wonder about the Vegas Telephone Co/Police search...transcripts of telephones/incident reports on those dates, if any from Ice Palace, as you suggest earlier Police search... Edited September 4, 2009 by PlanetPage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikezep61 Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 It's a good lead but as Chain said, Tell apparently booked concerts on the fly with little to no advance promotion. Geez, not exactly a recipe for success, is it? After all, he was called a concert promoter! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotplant Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 Jeez...why can't one of our four or five members who are a phone call away from the Master, or the Golden one, simply call them and ask?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAJones Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 Jeez...why can't one of our four or five members who are a phone call away from the Master, or the Golden one, simply call them and ask?? This has already been answered in the thread. In short, apparently none of them remember. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotplant Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 This has already been answered in the thread. In short, apparently none of them remember. Oh man that makes me feel so much better. If THEY can't even remember whether they played Vegas or not, my memories aren't that shabby after all. Sorry Steve, I missed that part, my bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanetPage Posted September 12, 2009 Share Posted September 12, 2009 (edited) Nice work as always, Mike. The photos certainly help to visualize what it must have been like, if in fact Led Zeppelin did perform there. ... It has been extremely difficult to locate any party who may be familiar with the Original Ice Place...The Record Search Vegas-Police Service...I am in this process now...but this will take time, as documentation must be notarized for a formal process...anyway...just thought I let every know where things stand so far... ....here is a e-mail that I received from UNLV....after contacting every museum, State Library, classic vintage Vegas sites...etc..etc...hopeless so it appears to have some insight into the Original Venue....I have sent both of these contacts e-mail/and phone call...I will update as I receive information... UNLV: Unfortunately we do not have any images of the Ice Palace. You may try and contact the Las Vegas News Bureau. Try Brian Alvarez there at 702-892-0711 or email him at balvarez@lvcva. com. Or you may try and contact UNLV's history professor Jay Coughtry at 702-895-3926. He has recently done research on the Ice Palace. University of Nevada, Las Vegas Special Collection Edited September 12, 2009 by PlanetPage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAJones Posted September 12, 2009 Share Posted September 12, 2009 ... It has been extremely difficult to locate any party who may be familiar with the Original Ice Place...The Record Search Vegas-Police Service...I am in this process now...but this will take time, as documentation must be notarized for a formal process...anyway...just thought I let every know where things stand so far... ....here is a e-mail that I received from UNLV....after contacting every museum, State Library, classic vintage Vegas sites...etc..etc...hopeless so it appears to have some insight into the Original Venue....I have sent both of these contacts e-mail/and phone call...I will update as I receive information... UNLV: Unfortunately we do not have any images of the Ice Palace. You may try and contact the Las Vegas News Bureau. Try Brian Alvarez there at 702-892-0711 or email him at balvarez@lvcva. com. Or you may try and contact UNLV's history professor Jay Coughtry at 702-895-3926. He has recently done research on the Ice Palace. University of Nevada, Las Vegas Special Collection I commend your persistence. It's the only way this can be resolved for certain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanetPage Posted September 12, 2009 Share Posted September 12, 2009 (edited) It's the only way this can be resolved for certain. ...I will add this e-mail...Dick Lepre Producer of Dead/Santana at Ice Palace in 1969 ... I produced those 2 shows at the Las Vegas Ice Palace: The Grateful Dead/Santana and the Creedence both mentioned in the article I sent. I know nothing about any other shows there. I am not saying they did not happen. I am only saying I know nothing of them. The best source is the guy who wrote that article. I would guess that he knows all the details. http://www.psychedelicart.com/concertposters/concertpostergallery/grateful-dead-santana/ On June 13th, 2007 gmt said: http://www.dead.net/show/march-29-1969 The Ice Palace was an old ice skating rink in a shopping center located on the south side of East Charleston (possibly East Sahara - it's been a long time & I haven't lived in Vegas since 1971) between Maryland Parkway & Eastern. If I recall correctly, there were some other big shows there in 1969, including Led Zeppelin. Edited September 13, 2009 by PlanetPage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanetPage Posted September 18, 2009 Share Posted September 18, 2009 It's a good lead but as Chain said, Tell apparently booked concerts on the fly with little to no advance promotion. ...at the same time, it's not much different, when it comes to Press/Media attention of CONFIRMED EVENTS...here is what Producer of Dead/Santana shows, Mr. Dick Lepre, recalled re: Ice Palace on March 29,1969 Dead/Santana........ This was 40 years ago and I am just going form memory but… The contracts we had were with the performers and with the Ice Palace. The Ice Palace handled security. I do no recall there being any police presence. The only media coverage was radio. Radio DJs gave us advertising and were allowed to act as MCs. I did no liaison with print. I do remember that the A&R people who handled the Grateful Dead were very sour on Las Vegas because no one had done well there in the years before. It is those folks who normally would have encouraged press coverage. Dick Lepre ...anyway, the search continues with respect to any permits (a legal permit must be obtained for event) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAJones Posted September 19, 2009 Share Posted September 19, 2009 ... no liaison with print... If only they knew how much we would care to confirm the events of that time forty years later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanetPage Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 This from http://www.dead.net/show/march-29-1969 Ice Palace On June 13th, 2007 gmt said: The Ice Palace was an old ice skating rink in a shopping center located on the south side of East Charleston (possibly East Sahara - it's been a long time & I haven't lived in Vegas since 1971) between Maryland Parkway & Eastern. If I recall correctly, there were some other big shows there in 1969, including Led Zeppelin. Ice Palace On July 20th, 2007 worldbetween said: We saw lots of shows at the ice palace, didn't see the dead show, too bad. I didn't really know who they were back then. The ice palace was in the Comercial Shopping Center on E Sahara and Maryland Pkwy. Went skating there, too. Cool place for the desert. ....... e-mail received... RE: [uncle Jack's Very Vintage Vegas Comment: "Commercial Center Business Association Attempts To Set The Record Straight" From: Jack LeVine (Jack@UncleJack.com) Sent: September 20, 2009 12:34:52 AM Attachments: 1 attachment LAS_VEGAS...pdf (9.7 KB) I was all typed out with the note below when Lynn Zook of classic las vegas emailed me that she had already heard from you on this project. Bummer, I thought I had something new for them. Looks like I’m last in line. Still think we should put it out on our blogs to see what anyone else has. Just to keep this email thread intact and coherent, Lynn Zook said this: Jack, I was contacted about this about two weeks ago. Pam went to the concert at the Ice Palace but sadly did not take any pictures. Another friend still has his concert ticket from the cancelled Zep concert at the Convention Center that never happened. I believe Paco has not found any pics at the News Bureau and I asked Dennis about it but I think he might be busy with the Zick mailer and stuff and hasn't had a chance to look .... Attached is the tax record showing the building was built in 1967. I've passed your message on (in a separate email) to the 3 best cultural historians in Las Vegas, and am CC’ing them on this. Lets see what they know or have in their archives. I'd be happy to help by putting it out on my blog to see what else we can shake loose from the readers. Is there a deadline for the project, or are you just filling in gaps everywhere that they exist. Glad to help. Jack We have lots of fun promoting the classic homes and historic neighborhoods of Las Vegas. We call it "Very Vintage Vegas" www.VeryVintageVegas.com And, selling real estate funds our passion for preserving Vintage Vegas. Your referrals are always appreciated. Jack LeVine Keller Williams Realty-Las Vegas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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