the chase
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Posts posted by the chase
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Just now, CherrySunburstWorshiper said:
That's cool. I was just sayin..
I do believe Carmine only because I've heard Jimmy say the same thing and: why would he lie? I mean, if he were gonna lie he would say "oh, John told me he listened to me every day." not, He told me he heard me do something I can't do and don't remember and probably only did it the one time...
That makes no sense to me.
Sorry I was just trying to lighten things up around here.. Carmine loved Bonham and even dedicated a solo album to him.
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You know who else cites Carmine Appice as an infuence on John Bonham? Carmine Appice. 😎
Just having fun. He’s great.. true though
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2 minutes ago, gibsonfan159 said:
Oh, I got the rest of it. It's just the same old rhetoric that keeps deterring (and misunderstanding) from my point.
Nobody understands your point.. give me a break. I get it. I just don’t agree with it. Mediocre technically? That’s ridiculous.
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Just now, gibsonfan159 said:
And there's more to it than just triplets and groove. Nobody seems to get that. I'm not even talking about flash. I'm just saying Bonham was pretty mediocre technically. It's fascinating how no one can accept that.
That’s all you got out of my post? Really? I said all I’m going to say.
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19 minutes ago, gibsonfan159 said:
My point was that if you take away the amazing tuning, monstrous triplets, and addictive grooves, there were drummers (rock drummers) who were just far more skilled when it comes to incorporating the entire kit and varying their accents and phrases. Of course this goes out the door when one says "Bonham only played what was needed". Sure, that makes Charlie Watts better than Bonham. I'll omit Baker considering he came strictly from jazz. Barrie Barlow for one was much more adept to structure. Artimus Pyle accented the beat like nobody's business. Moon is debatable. Do we even have to compare Bonham to Palmer? It would be comparing grooves and muscle to finesse and expertise. This is only touching the surface.
My point is that Bonham's drumming was basic, but extremely impressive. Much like Tony Iommi's guitar playing. It's really in response to anyone who brags about Bonzo's technicality. He just wasn't that technical. Now go ahead and make a statement about groove.
But why would you take anything away? His sound, power, projection, tone, timing, feel, yes groove and especially his restraint are all part of the package.. not just the triplets... He was a great technician too. Never said he he was the drummer with the greatest technical ability. But he was certainly not a player that other drummers would roll their eyes at. And if they did, they’re stupid. There’s more to it than just flash.
Much of his stuff is alot harder to play correctly than it sounds.. I’ve watched incredible drummers struggle with getting his parts right.. Simon Phillips for one butchered the shit out of Stairway To Heaven live more than once.. and he’s an unbelievable drummer.. one of my all time favorites. Some walk in and think it’s going to be easy because they’ve heard it 10,000 times and then they go to play it and it’s just not there.. just ask a great drummer like Phil Collins...
I’d put Bonham’s footwork next to anyone you mentioned. I heard Mike Portnoy play Achilles Last Stand.. another excellent drummer with incredible technique .. The hands were pretty much right there.. the bass drum work was light..
Barrimore Barlowe is incredible no doubt.John Bonham himself once called him the best drummer to come out of England. But I don’t think he would have been rolling his eyes at Bonham either.. far from it.. Nor would anyone else you mentioned. the eternally bitter Ginger Baker has.. but he doesn’t have much good to say unless it’s Jazz players..
done.
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On 2/5/2019 at 11:47 AM, gibsonfan159 said:
Go watch a few proper jazz and swing drummers and you'll realize Bonzo did little more than steal their beats and add muscle to them to sound more impressive in the rock world. But on a technical proficiency level, he was a few notches below. I can't make you understand truly sophisticated drumming techniques, but this is true. The "Fool In The Rain" beat is nothing more than a Purdie shuffle played in a pop context. (What's that? Bonham "borrowed" riffs too?)
Now with that said, you need to understand my original comment. In no way shape or form am I discrediting what Bonzo did and achieved. I'm just saying that I get tired of the fanboys talking about his "complexity" when I know by mind and heart he was only complex to rock fandom. Outside of that, he wouldn't stand a chance. And yes, he dominated the rock world with amazing grooves, syncopation, and heavy handed technique. But I will always stand by my opinion that despite all that, he was stiff as a board.
Uh. yeah you did.... maybe not in your original comment.. but it’s right there.. “proper jazz and swing drummers”... pretty obvious what you were referring too all the way through. Hey if that’s your opinion ... great.. Jon Hiseman was awesome . If you prefer him.. whatever.
Who were the “real drummers”? You know ... the ones who would have been “rolling their eyes”? You weren’t referring to Jazz guys? Who then?
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19 minutes ago, Paganini said:
Sorry ..but no one will ever convince me Hot Dog and All My Love are anything other then at best very poor tracks that should have been dropped from ITTOD and replaced with Either/or Darlene, Ozone Baby or Wearing & Tearing.
I won’t try to change your opinion. This is mine..
Hot Dog.. possibly... I prefer Darlene .. but I’ll always trust Jimmy’s decisions as a producer..
Wearing and Tearing would have been way out of place.... moreso than even Hot Dog. Ozone Baby was a side opener. In The Evening and Carouselambra were much much better for that...I’m not quite sure Darlene would have fit after FITR... or as a side closer... maybe maybe not..
As far as All My Love... no way. Way too important a song to Robert Plant. Besides being a beautiful tribute to his son and family, it was and still is a very popular radio cut.
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1 hour ago, Paganini said:
Your first instinct to hate Hot Dog was correct, it’s a joke song that used to cause me immense embarrassment as a Zep fan back in ‘79 amongst my other rock loving mates. All My Love is just plain awful -so bad in fact Jimmy didn’t even put his name to it .....so bad that my wife -who can’t stand Zep -actually likes it!
You think Jimmy Page didn’t put his name to All My Love because he thought it was a bad song? I’ve never heard that before. As far as I know, he didn’t help write it. If he could have taken a credit, he would have. He took a credit for LA Drone.
All My Love was Robert’s (1st) tribute to Karac. There are feelings in the song that are very deep. Page wouldn’t have had the nerve to imply that it was so bad that he wouldn’t take a credit. I’ve heard him say it wasn’t the direction he (or Bonham) wanted the band to go in. But I also feel he respected and understood what Robert was going through enough to want to include it on the album.
Same thing happened to me as Christopher Lees with Hot Dog. I saw the Knebworth video and gained a new appreciation for it. Still not one of my favorites, but it is kind of fun to play on the drums.
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26 minutes ago, gibsonfan159 said:
I'll be the first to admit that sounded overly harsh, but it was poor wording on my part.
And again, no one on here is even attempting to understand my point. It's all "How dare you!" comments.
No i get it. It’s apples and oranges though. Jazz to Rock. In a lot of ways, John Bonham was strongly influenced by the Jazz greats. The way he tuned his kit, the way his drums were mic’d in the studio, and some elements of his drum solos were heavily inspired by Jazz players. But he also had Funk Blues and Soul in his style. John Bonham led with his feet.. He had incredible feet. Most Jazz players or the Ginger Baker type Jazz Rock players lead with their hands. The feet for the most part just kind of go with it. Not all but most lead with their hands. They are very different approaches to playing and I wouldn’t say one is better than the other.
Besides John Bonham was only 32 when he died. Some...most of the main performances people point to of his were layed down when he was really just a kid... a young man. He was 20 when he played the Bass Drum pattern on Good Times Bad Times.
To knock him for not having had the technique of a phenomenal player like a 60 year old Vinnie Colauita is kind of a cheap shot.
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On 2/6/2019 at 11:24 PM, tyler19 said:
Bonham brought all the technicality to the music that was required. We will never know if there was more to him than he was able to put to use in Led Zeppelin. An expert uses the technique required to get the job done, Bonham did that in spades. Within his genre he is the most revered drummer there is, and only Keith Moon was more original within the genre. Charlie Watts does nothing flashy and I have no idea about his technique but his feel for the Stones is immaculate.
Nice. I wish I saw this before my post. Spot on.
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On 1/30/2019 at 6:46 AM, Mook said:
'Real drummers'?
Jesus wept.
Amen. Typical opinion of certain Jazz snobs.
There’s good and bad in all genres.. John Bonham was among the very best in his.. I watched a drumming phenom like Dennis Chambers go on about the greatness of John Bonham after a jaw dropping drum clinic. I was pleasantly surprised he didn’t jump on the pretentious wagon by dumping on the “rock guy”. It was obvious he was an admirer.
Bonham’s rare combination of immense power, technique and restraint are what made him so great.
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On 12/25/2018 at 2:58 AM, Strider said:
The final week. All 16 games are on Sunday. Choose wisely. Happy Christmas to all the NFL pool players!
Week 17 Schedule
Sunday, Dec. 30 TIME(ET)
Miami
Green Bay
New England
New Orleans
Houston
Dallas
Atlanta
Pittsburgh
Philadelphia
Minnesota
Kansas City
Baltimore
Denver
L.A. Rams
Seattle
Tennessee -
21 hours ago, LedZeppfan1977 said:
Well i will go first. Just to get it over.
Buffalo
Green Bay
New England
New Orleans
Houston
Dallas
Tampa
Pittsburgh (an effort here in vain to try and save the coach's head from the block-won't work)
Philadelphia
Minnesota
Oakland
Cleveland (an upset possible in this and above game)
LA Chargers
Los Angeles Rams
Seattle
Indy
Rick. I should just copy your picks....😎😁
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5 hours ago, kipper said:
I vote to give Strider a mulligan for not posting his picks. It's a friendly no money game anyway. I say go ahead and take a credit for the picks you would have posted.
I’m ok with that.
What a difference a year makes. I did so much better last year. Seems like a lot of the League has leveled off this year.
And Merry Christmas all
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On 12/18/2018 at 2:00 AM, Strider said:
Saturday, Dec. 22 TIME(ET)
Tennessee
Lost ChargersSunday, Dec. 23
Minnesota
Dallas
Cincinnati
Indianapolis
Miami
New England
Green Bay
Philadelphia
Atlanta
L.A. Rams
Chicago
Pittsburgh
Kansas CityMonday, Dec. 24
OaklandThose last four games on Sunday are HUGE-HUGE-HUGE-HUGE.
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On 12/11/2018 at 4:46 AM, Strider said:
Week 15 Schedule
Thursday, Dec. 13 TIME(ET)
Kansas CitySaturday, Dec. 15
Houston
DenverSunday, Dec. 16
Atlanta
Buffalo
Chicago
Oakland
Dallas
Minnesota
Tennessee
Jacksonville
Baltimore
Seattle
New England
PhiladelphiaMonday, Dec. 17
Carolina -
On 12/8/2018 at 1:22 PM, blindwillie127 said:
Steven Tyler has been relying on "outside writers" for the past 30 years.
I know. It's a shame because there are more than capable writers in Aerosmith.. Besides Steven and Joe.. Brad, Tom and Joey are all under utilized.
If he needs help with Lyrics, that's a different thing.
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On 12/4/2018 at 1:06 AM, Strider said:
Week 14 Schedule
Thursday, Dec. 6 TIME(ET)
Tennessee LateSunday, Dec. 9
Buffalo
Carolina
Atlanta
Kansas City
New England
New Orleans
Washington
Houston
Lost Chargers
Denver
DallasPittsburgh
Arizona
ChicagoMonday, Dec. 10
Seattle -
1 hour ago, 76229 said:
I wonder if Tyler suggesting bringing in Marti Frederiksen brought back Mickie Most / Little Games style flashbacks for Page?! "outside songwriter? bugger off!"
I would guess Desmond Child. If true, dumb move on Steven's part. no offense to Desmond Child either.
You have Jimmy and John Paul Jones there .... and you want to bring in outside writers?
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On 11/27/2018 at 1:06 AM, Strider said:
Week 13 Schedule
THURSDAY NOV. 29 TIME (ET)
Dallas
SUNDAY DEC. 2
Atlanta
Cincinnati
Detroit
On 11/27/2018 at 1:06 AM, Strider said:Green Bay
Houston
Jacksonville
Miami
Chicago
Tampa Bay
Kansas City
Tennessee
New England
Seattle
Pittsburgh
MONDAY DEC. 3
Philadelphia
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On 11/27/2018 at 8:48 AM, 76229 said:
I would've happily switched out Misty Mountain Hop for In The Evening, and Trampled for Achilles. According to Mick Wall Plant vetoed anything "too heavy metal", which meant no Immigrant Song and no ALS.
... and that is my overall issue... Robert's way or the highway.. That's why we got Paul Martinez and Phil Collins at Live Aid ... That's why we got no JPJ on the Unledded, and WIC.. collaborations.. I get it to a degree. Robert had been through quite a lot and has had a very successful solo career. He is used to being the boss..
But if anyone is going to run the band.. I'd much prefer it be Jimmy.
Too heavy! Bollocks.. we're talking Led Zeppelin. Not Fleetwood Mac.
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Ozzy usually complains about Tony Iommi when they’re not playing together. He did from 1979-97 and again in 2007-2010. So why should now be any different...
Ozzy’s all bent out of shape now, because Tony asked (or told) him to stop yelling “Let’s See You going CRAZY!!!” and “LOUDER” and “I Can’t fucking hear you!!!” non stop during his guitar solos... who knows? 2-3 years ago..
That’s part of being in a band.. I am sure Tony and Geezer had to grin and bear a lot of things ... like not playing a ton of classic Black Sabbath songs because Ozzy can no longer sing them..
Ozzy prefers being his own boss now, which is understandable. But when you’re in a major band, like Black Sabbath, some compromises with your bandmates is part of the deal. It’s not all about the one guy doing frog leaps.
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18 hours ago, Strider said:
Week 12 Schedule
Thursday, Nov. 22 TIME(ET)
Chicago
Dallas
New OrleansSunday, Nov. 25
Jacksonville
CincinnatiIndianapolis
New England
Philadelphia
Tampa Bay
Carolina
Oakland
Lost Chargers
Denver
Green BayMonday, Nov. 26
TennesseeHappy Thanksgiving all!
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3 hours ago, SteveAJones said:
I think we can all agree if Millard wrote Listen To This, Eddie on a cassette copy of a recording that entered circulation circa 1978 he sure as hell would not have been referring to Eddie Van Halen.
There is a Wikipedia page on “Listen To This Eddie”. This points to both Eddie’s (Kramer and VH) as the possible Eddie. It states that the “broken hand” quote came from a Guitar World interview with Eddie Van Halen from 1981. So if there’s any way to prove Listen To This Eddie goes back further than 1981.. it most likely wouldn’t be EVH..
Does anyone have any controversial opinions about Zep?
in Led Zeppelin Newbies
Posted
Thanks. I liked your Daddy’s quote.