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kipper

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    What Are You Doing Today?

    in Ramble On

    Posted

    On 5/31/2020 at 5:15 AM, LedZeppfan1977 said:

    No it wont be a physical.  Just talk about ongoing bullshit and meds.  He wound up calling my cell phone and using some software like facetime.

    I need to make an online appointment then with my hot Thai female doctor. I'll strip naked in front of the computer screen and ask her to inspect my "junk"..

    Could be fun!

    The Rest in Peace Thread

    in Ramble On

    Posted

    4 minutes ago, SteveAJones said:

    Mr. Floyd was lawfully restrained for cause. He was high as a kite and apparently unwilling or unable to get in the vehicle.

    The interaction between the police officer and the community, not to mention the video recording, is what will send at least one of the officers to prison. Chauvin will almost certainly be found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt of failing to render assistance to Mr. Floyd once Mr. Floyd was handcuffed. Most police officers are well aware if not trained as standard operating procedure that once a suspect is cuffed you should, as a minimum, place them on their side or to get them up from the ground as soon as possible, either sitting or standing, since lying on one's stomach can cause breathing problems, especially for large people. Chauvin cannot possibly use as a defense that he was unaware of Floyd's distress. The rookie officer asked Chauvin directly if they should put him on his side. Chauvin refused, saying something to the effect of Floyd was having an episode of delirium. Additionally, as you noted there were several onlookers shouting at Chauvin and he acknowledged their appeals by reaching for his can of mace (as I recall).

    We may never know why Chauvin behaved the way he did, but I would agree, based on the evidence presented thus far, that Mr. Floyd's failure to get in the vehicle was perceived by Chauvin as contempt of cop and this led to Chauvin abusing his authority. It It  seems Chauvin's motivation was to publicly humiliate Floyd to the point of unconsciousness and then the four of them would lift him up and throw him into the back seat. We must remember Chauvin has 18 complaints on his record, which is inordinately high.

    A good point was raised this week, that although each individual complaint may not have warranted punishment, there should have been a point where they were reviewed in aggregate. We could quibble over how many offenses it would take to trigger that review, but for the sake of example every five complaints a personnel file should go to a review board.

    Good post Steve, I think people here who are always on your back should accept your post as indication that you are reasonable enough to conclude that whatever Chauvin's motivation was for how he dealt with Floyd that it seemed clearly beyond the scale of being concerned for Floyd's well being--- especially after twice being warned by a fellow officer.

    Proving motive however is not a necessary element of the crime of murder. All that is required is proving beyond a reasonable doubt that the homicide resulted from an illegal (unjustified act) and that the perpetrator did so with malice aforethought. I believe, and I know you and I disagree, that the elapsed time of the knee on the neck WITH warnings from the other cop and others---was enough time to contemplate the act and therefore imply intent/malice.

    If the officer's motive was to administer "an attitude adjustment" on Floyd for some disrespect or some other negative view by the cop, that doesn't help the officer's case and may only feed the prosecution's means to find the malice in the act.  There was previously reported that both Floyd and Chavin worked as security guards at a local club, but not sure if they ever crossed paths before the day this incident occurred.  My personal theory is that this officer didn't just get up that day and suddenly do the knee on the neck thing; I am sure it was just part of his SOP when dealing with some suspects, especially large strong ones.  Cops don't make a habit of losing fights, and most cops I have seen consider ANY resistance by a suspect ---even if it is going dead weight, or slightly dragging their feet as a pretext to do an "attitude adjustment" and reinforce who is command, and who is in control, and who will not be disrespected.  So if Chauvin was in the habit of doing that (which I believe he was and answers in my mind why the other officers didn't seem to alarmed by it), but then on this one day, with this one suspect it went where it did.....   well, I guess Chauvin maybe should have retired or found some other kind of work BEFORE this one day.  I would bet anything that his thing Chauvin was doing he has done alot in the past.

    BTW, I called a friend of mine who is a retired Los Angels County Sheriff deputy who had worked in some of the toughest ghetto areas of Los Angeles County; worked the jails, been in hundreds of knock down drag out fights with thugs and all kinds of rough and tumble stuff. Certainly not a shrieking daisy, and definitely not a guy who was averse to using necessary force to win a battle even if it left a suspect bloody. And he told me that what he saw in the video was inexcusable. He said this was  NOT Rodney King getting hit because King kept fighting back. He said once the guy was on the ground in cuffs and under control--- the battle is OVER and there is no reason for what the officer did other than the officer was retaliating for some reason because he could.

    The Rest in Peace Thread

    in Ramble On

    Posted

    13 minutes ago, PeaceFrogYum said:

    I have lived in poor neighborhoods, middle class neighborhoods, and affluent neighborhoods and I can attest that crime in poor white neighborhoods is just as bad as those in poor black neighborhoods, no difference.

     

    So then in Appalachia you are saying that the crime there is just as high as in East Chicago?

    6-62592_funny-meme-faces-png-thinking-me

     

     

     

     

    RIP George Floyd

    Make me laugh!

    in Ramble On

    Posted

    On 6/2/2020 at 10:31 AM, paul carruthers said:

     

    That is funny, and I 100% agree!  I've been calling Chicago pizza a "casserole" for decades. There is usually lots of great foods in Chicago, from soul food, to German, to Polish, and even most Italian foods are great in Chicago. Noting like an Italian Beef sandwich from Chicago--- and don't even get me started on how Chicago hot dogs are the king!

    Put Chicago Pizza???

    Oof marone!!!!

     

    51d7sDamavL._AC_.jpg

     

     

     

     

    The Rest in Peace Thread

    in Ramble On

    Posted · Edited by kipper

    2 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

    I was just about to educate PukeFrogYum. With regard to Floyd's death, what I really want to emphasize is the Hennepin County Medical Examiner's autopsy concluded Floyd died from a heart attack. Additionally, based upon the illegal drugs in his system the case can be made he was high as a kite. Personally, I think the prosecutor's office is making a mistake by charging Chauvin with Murder in the 2nd Degree. I think I could get him an acquittal on that charge. They should have stayed with Murder in the 1st Degree, in which case I would seek to plea bargain down to Manslaughter.  

    You make some good point Steves about what originally drew the attention to the police to Floyd. I have always said that when people go out looking for trouble, trouble will unusually find them.

    In terms of murder (unlawful homicide with malice aforethought) or manslaughter (unlawful homicide without malice aforethought) I think the problem for the officer is the amount of time which elapsed from his initial use of force against Floyd (who was in fact handcuffed eventually)--- which  ended up being about 8-9 minutes---  and with at least 3 or 4 minutes of which Floyd was no longer moving or breathing..........  ALL while bystanders were warning the officer that the man was not breathing.....AND AFTER the man himself has said more than once that he couldn't breath.

    So I suppose an interesting legal dilemma as it would apply to the definition of murder.  At what point given a certain amount of time to either reflect on your action(s) and use of lethal force--- and then NOT de-escalate from that deadly force when you have an option to do so. Can the prosecution then argue that the illegal homicide went from manslaughter to murder?

    To me an example would be a suspect in a stolen car observed by the police who then accelerated to a high speed to get away but loses control and has an accident and someone is killed. Clearly an illegal homicide (vehicular), clearly a manslaughter.  But lets say instead the suspect drove at high speeds trying to evade the police for 15-20 minutes, weaving in out of oncoming traffic, sometimes running red lights, goes up on sidewalks-- speeding through school zones--- and THEN he kills somebody.  Wouldn't the time in which his wanton and callous behavior-- all of which any reasonable person would HAVE TO KNOW would likely end in a death, wouldn't that satisfy a  charge of premeditated murder in the 2nd degree?

    Do you believe the officer had a duty to de-escalate at some point in the encounter, especially since Floyd was handcuffed, and especially since he appeared to be having difficultly breathing? I think that is at the heart of the current murder charge against the officer.

     

    The Rest in Peace Thread

    in Ramble On

    Posted

    On 5/29/2020 at 2:54 PM, Walter said:

    RIP George Floyd 

    I agree Walter.

    Whatever he was suspected of did not warrant the way he was dealt with.  All Americans are entitled to due process. Harvey Weinstein raped women and yet was never treated as badly as Floyd was treated over being suspected of passing a forged note.

    If there are cops unwilling to accept that we didn't hire them to act as judge and jury, then they ought to find a different line of work. Those cops only make the job harder for good cops--- and look at what the result of their bad acts cause.

    I am equally outraged at how George Floyd was treated as I am with the rioters who are destroying businesses and attacking police and fire fighters.

     

     

    What's the weather like where you are?

    in Ramble On

    Posted

    1 hour ago, Strider said:

    Beautiful. The most boring job in the world is weatherman for a Southern California tv station.

    los-angeles-jacarandas-in-bloom.jpg.5f4144cefc1b6a908f4b447302408f2e.jpg

     

    Ain't  that truth Strider. But it still doesn't stop them from making a big production out of "the weather" on the local news.  Dallas Raines always cracks me up with his OVER THE TOP weather reports and all of his prancing about while he shoes the weather map--- usually showing nothing.

    I always laugh when they send a reporter out to cover rain drop and a few puddles of water like it is some level 5 hurricane.

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