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About Mithril46

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    Zep Head

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    Smithtown, NY

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  1. It's cool that the many fans on this thread are so enamored by the companion discs. Unfortunately, many defunct or even still rolling bands have much more comprehensive and varied box sets than Zep's. I do find some of the companion material interesting, but coming from possibly the greatest rock band ever, the releases are quite stark for me overall. Regular CD's are barely sold anymore, but box sets which have the regular release and then 3 or 4 companion discs focused mainly on the original release are very common these days. Look, Jimmy's getting older, but for these releases Jimmy should have hired some expert help, because I feel that the gold standard surrounding Zep releases has been damaged to an extent. Started with Mothership, then puzzling edits/decisions on remastered TSRTS, and so on.
  2. Well that middle section( both "departures) has always sounded to me like Zep got lost in some magical very dense forest, and Plant is the main "mystical" traveler. Totally subjective impression of the mellower part of the song. Whatever your interpretation, the song doesn't sound like anything else before or after, very creative.
  3. Interesting views, I always loved the song. Sure, the whole album is masterpiece, but I never saw FS as filler. I saw it as exotic hard rock with that dreamy, mysterious center section. I never understood why it wasn't played more live, the 71' Copenhagen version seemed to work pretty well.
  4. Great that you are attempting something like this. But, as you said, all can change depending on different parts of the song, It's not just WHAT remaster. This stuff can obviously get tremendously complicated. Although the releases are official, think about the boot remasters !!! Distortions, clipping, one instrument dominance are dialed/EQ'ed out, and despite a cleaner and more balanced result, the bite of the band can be diminished as well. To be fair, this stuff is rough going, even your interesting comparisons, which I haven't seen before.
  5. Some interesting points. As opposed to the bands you mentioned, in Zep Jimmy was really the boss of the board. Perhaps other band members had some say or suggestions, but the buck stopped with Jimmy in the studio, practically from the start to the final mix down of ITTOD. I think this helped the band immensely, because except for a few tracks on Zep l, the band really never had a dated sound. Go back to the 70's, a lot of no.1 hits even , they sound dated. Jimmy made sure the production would sound as transparent as possible. Or if he wanted a dense production, it would sound unlike anything you've ever heard. Kashmir, with all the keys and Arabic instrumentation, was not like anything heard before, certainly not "Rock".
  6. Well that is certainly part of the function of a producer. But actually depending on the artist and what the producer is "known" to do, there is tremendous variation. Jimmy was quite assertive in the studio, and even though he may have utilized Eddie Kramer or Glyn Johns on an album, you re not talking about many top 40 "commercial" artists where the record company literally insists on using a certain producer. Also, quite a few Hip/Hop and Rap producers in fact are well known for their prowess with certain pieces of music technology. All I'm saying really is that a producer can have many functions. As far as Zep goes, yes their producer or so on was certainly used to capture a certain sound or vision, but Zep had the ultimate say over the final mix, blah, blah. Nobody was going to tell Jimmy Page that a certain song on one of their albums would be a terrible mistake, unlike a dictated producer chosen by the record company, different situations.
  7. I think Page doesn't really talk about production matters for various reasons.One is that very quickly you are heading into terms and lingo obscure to most of the public. Another is according to my understanding, Page usually worked with someone else, like Eddie Kramer for example, and it might get very complicated as far as Page trying to pinpoint exactly who was doing what at what time. Then apart from Jimmy always mentioning using recording techniques like ambient miking, He has sometimes in the past said that he has some recording/ production techniques which he discovered and does not feel these "secrets" need be divulged. This stuff is interesting, some have said Page by himself could not do all the recording/mixing//producing stuff from beginning to end, this muddies the waters a bit.
  8. Well that's something, but a far cry from Beck's past. If it wasn't Beck, not sure somebody else giving eight weeks notice would be hung out to dry. I saw two of those shows, they were pretty damn good with or without Beck. Had the two bands been far less accomplished, obviously ticket sales/vibe could be heavily compromised.
  9. Ah, some correction.....Beck absolutely to somewhere in the mid 70's was prone to very erratic behavior, Yes missing gigs, quitting in the middle of a gig, even leaving a tour. And that 84' Stewart tour, the plan was for Jeff to play with Stewart for a half hr. tops, Beck was not the "band" guitarist for the full show. Now you must do your contractual obligations. But, Beck got frustrated onstage, saying they were.just getting started, and then, suddenly, cut off. I'm not sure that Jimmy wouldn't do the same thing if he had a half hour slot with Robert and his band. Although it's somewhat different because Jeff and Rod together weren't really superstars even early on, whereas Robert would never have such an arrangement since his own material would seriously pale in comparison. Anyway, for a long time now Beck has had no troubles being a responsible pro musician. I've seen him 4 or 5 times, the only problem is he is either totally amazing or just not sparking.
  10. Don't you realize everything to do with Zep is of cosmic significance?? I remember some threads here and elsewhere where somehow the subject of Page's height was discussed, and some of the posts made me collapse with uncontrollable laughter. Not going there. So Plant used his thumbnail, and Page did actually use his grown out pinky, but that was after Zep and I don't recall Jimmy doing much fingerstyle stuff. With Roy Harper Jimmy was throwing in fills and little chord bits, no need for short or long nails. I've got a good one......why don't we chart Page's weight changes yearly from 68' to Sep.80' ?? Ha Ha.
  11. I understand Robert in one way but overall he's been making similar statements about Zep's material for a long time. He's attacking one of the greatest "rock" songs of all time. Sorry, but nothing in his solo career even approaches "Stairway". Not sure if Lynryd Skynrd feels the same about "Freebird", or Paul McCartney feels the same about "Yesterday".
  12. Where is there any guarantee any such book will come out ? Page would have to be dictating the contents of the book now, and is there some legal document which would shield the material coming out only after death ? Most people feel uneasy setting up wills and after death financial arrangements let alone "getting the truth out" so others left alive will understand them better. Also at Page's age people can be struck down right away, although Page despite looking old seems to be much more animated and spry than others his age. I wouldn't be surprised that after Page's death someone finds 40? 50? pages of Page very loosely going over his life, and there you are with a tell-all, truthful book. He has promised so much in his past, why all the gates would open when he's gone ? But endgame, not sure if this fits, but I feel that even among younger kids/ teenagers, many consider Zep to be mythical and legendary, and many are in awe of the whole live thing, with Page's dragon suits and so on. Remember when Roy Harper first saw Zep, he thought the band was literally out of this world, something entirely different. Zep won't totally fade away.
  13. Well, in the 70's you sometimes had these one-off rock magazines with a Zep feature for maybe 10-20 pages, usually half black and white pictures, half color. Anyway sometimes there would be something interesting the band had to say, but even back then the writer(s) would usually just talk about the band, very rarely any substantial interviewing.
  14. Even to call a Zep "Endgame" , Plant and Jones seem to have a completely blasé attitude towards a 50th anniversary or various audio or video for the 50th. I would bet that Jones and Plant haven't even listened or cared much by what Jimmy has released in the last ten years or more. Does anyone really believe that Robert showed up in the studio when Jimmy was doing the companions thing, telling Jimmy, Oh, could you make the voice louder on that section ?? Plant and Jones probably don't even know or care what was on the companions or whatever.
  15. All this is very interesting. But I must press one area concerning the Beatles. They changed music and musicians enormously ? What bands and what songs( Yes, Oasis, Badfinger, some others) ? Beyond the early "PoP" period, the Beatles created many brilliant songs which may have inspired some musicians, but basically their output beyond a certain point is in many cases can't be duplicated properly without almost all members aboard. You could play just the guitar part from some of the Beatles' less popular songs, and not recognize the song. Whereas in Zep at least 60%-70% or more of their songs you could recognize straight away from the guitar or drums, even the bass part alone. Obviously some Zep songs are much harder than others, but the point is that Zep were the "Kings of the Riff"(of course "Kings of many musical elements"). So learning some of Zep's riffs they often sounded strong even without other other instruments. With certain Beatles songs, isolating parts of songs without the vocal harmonies or bass line, you may or may not recognize it. MAIN point: certainly the playing of riffs predates Zep, but Zep made the most colossal riffs imaginable, and hence dozens or hundreds of bands to this day search to find the ultimate riff.
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