RB2/GH3 and the Zepp

[ayalem]

http://arstechnica.c...real-guitar.ars (Link to an upcoming Rock Band style game which uses a "fake" guitar that switches to a real electric guitar.

So, as far as I can see it people WILL be playing areal guitar soon enough with these games... this is why I said it was a bit closed-minded. Maybe it's time to re-evaluate?

I also considered, the "it stops people playing a real instrument" statement in a bit more practical application. As in, there are plenty of people who would like to go out and buy a set of drums/guitar and start belting away on them to earn a living, however, many people a) can't afford to, have a job, c) have kids to look after.

To me music is about enjoyment and emotional response, in the creation and application/hearing of it. To say what was said is just elitist jibberish to be honest and very far off the pulse with modern music/life. Anyway, this will be my last post on the matter, thank for all the replies.

[Yupter]

Ingenious if these developers can actual put a real guitar into peoples' hands in a seamless fashion.

They will have a lot going for them if they can bundle the guitar, amp, cord, and "lessons" (tabs?) all in one inexpensive package. The inexpensive aspect may intrigue many.

It's a bit of a stretch to think the same casual gamers that bought GH/RB are going to drop more money for another music game. Their best bet may be trying to get this guitar cross-compatible with all consoles and games or an exclusive deal.

Don't leave just yet ayalem, playing the "last word" game now are we?

The fact of the matter is still about those master tapes, Jimmy doesn't want to give them up.

[Conneyfogle]

Jimmy, JPJ & Bonzo, decided to ditch the electronics and stick with the theramin for whole lotta love

[Deborah J]

Jimmy, JPJ & Bonzo, decided to ditch the electronics and stick with the theramin for whole lotta love

Conney- I am having my and I swear this was so cute that I had to laugh/smile.

[Deborah J]

Hi Debs,

Sometimes Musicians can be a little too serious and pompous, Music is supposed to be "Fun", and if "Fun" means standing in front of a TV mimicking your Idol then whats wrong with that? if you haven't got the talent to play guitar in the first place then you ain't got it, period, and nothing is gonna make you keep trying if you just cant get the hang of it.

Do you remember the 70s when Heavy Metal first came out, all those long haired weird hippie types with their cardboard cut out Gibson Victory V guitars doing every guitar solo out there at every rock club you ever visited? well if you don't i do, especially at the Bandwagon in NW London, the place was so famous it featured on the Heavy Metal Britannia Rocumentary here in the UK.

Kind Regards, Danny

PS, I can still do the STH solo on air guitar as well as i did when it first came out, and i still practice regulary.

Hi Danny!

Oh yes, I remember the 70's, but growing up in New Orleans we could go just about any given night to a variety of clubs and hear some of the best music....jazz, blues, rock..etc. Miss the days of clubs everywhere having great live bands.

How are your fingers with the cardboard cuts

[BonzoLikeDrumer]

We're not going in that direction.

I don't think there's a person on this earth that truly mistakes video game talent for instrumental talent, outside of a comical joke.

Sure, people have argued that it's somewhat of a bridge between not playing a real instrument and then having a basic understanding of how such an instrument might be played.

But nobody actually thinks that being good at GH/RB is the same thing as being good at an instrument.

Nobody does now...and no one ever will.

I truly hope your right about that.

[BonzoLikeDrumer]

Ingenious if these developers can actual put a real guitar into peoples' hands in a seamless fashion.

They will have a lot going for them if they can bundle the guitar, amp, cord, and "lessons" (tabs?) all in one inexpensive package. The inexpensive aspect may intrigue many.

It's a bit of a stretch to think the same casual gamers that bought GH/RB are going to drop more money for another music game. Their best bet may be trying to get this guitar cross-compatible with all consoles and games or an exclusive deal.

Don't leave just yet ayalem, playing the "last word" game now are we?

The fact of the matter is still about those master tapes, Jimmy doesn't want to give them up.

There are ton's of this very thing already out on the market, everything from "Esteban" to the "Fender Starter Kit" and on and on. Connecting it all with a video game may just be a ploy to steer kids away from playing the games all together, or away from the digital entertainment world in general.

Who know's for sure, the people who came up with it said all along that it was meant to get kid's interested in playing a guitar.

[BIGDAN]

Hi Danny!

Oh yes, I remember the 70's, but growing up in New Orleans we could go just about any given night to a variety of clubs and hear some of the best music....jazz, blues, rock..etc. Miss the days of clubs everywhere having great live bands.

How are your fingers with the cardboard cuts

Hi Debs,

Thanks for your concern about me poor fingers, I'm in need of large donations of elastoplast at the moment, i seem to be getting through yards of these plasters weekly, what with my world tour and the double live album I'm putting together at the moment, and the endless practicing that goes with it, still that's Showbiz for ya.

Me Misses says this,

Forget about any musical snobbery for a moment, and look at it this way, at least it is bringing family and friends together to "Jam" in the living room, as well as redressing the balance that the computer and the Internet took away from families that used to play boardgames together and the like, it is bringing "Families" back together again and that can only have a beneficial effect on society. This also goes for the Wii as well.

Kind Regards, Danny

[VirusSnake]

Hello, new here

what do you guys think of this?

http://www.gametrailers.com/video/exclusive-debut-power-gig/63187

[guitarmy]

Hello, new here

what do you guys think of this?

http://www.gametrailers.com/video/exclusive-debut-power-gig/63187

I think it's awesome if it's real and I want to know more about it and any limitations.

[BonzoLikeDrumer]

Hello, new here

what do you guys think of this?

http://www.gametrailers.com/video/exclusive-debut-power-gig/63187

Hmmm.... To tell you the truth, I couldn't tell what it was all about. Looked like a bunch of people jumping around in micro-second video clip's.

What is it?

[VirusSnake]

guitar hero like game using a real guitar.... the gameplay will be again simplyfied of course but there could be even begginer to novice lessons in the software as well...

heres the unedited video

[ledwelo]

something that james hetfield says made me completely have a different look on this subject. he said making the music is all about the fans and how it gets through to them. sure some people wanna make music for themsleves but just about everyone knows here, led zeppelin has always been about the money. they were probably one of the first bands to take the whole concept and make it an actuall buisness. not wanting the music to be spread around to a younger generation would be just plain selfish and ignorant. id rather see some kid listening to zep because of a videogame then have him listen to lil wayne or w.e. assholes are around today. its all how it gets through to ppl that should matter, not how you play or listen to it. in the end the music is being made for the fans anyways, minus well get as many of them as possible.

on a side note, id only want this done if it was done like the beatles. i never played it but it looked fantastic. you play famous gigs and the songs they played. play in the studio and learn all kinds of info about the band, and not just aimless bull "ultimate impossible expert harder then a real guitar" setting.

[Yupter]

Jimmy doesn't want anyone touching his masters with their dirty fingers

Would be too impractical if implemented anyway.

[ptensioned]

As a newcomer here (though not to Zeppelin), I understand this particular dead horse has been well beaten, but I feel the need to get a few kicks in of my own...

I was once one of those people who dismissed GH/RB, sniffily wondering why people didn't just put the time into learning to play an instrument. Having actually sat down and played Rock Band 2 enough to get passably good (one or two songs is *not* enough to learn the nuances of the game), I have completely changed my mind.

First off, I would argue that it's unfair to lump all the folks who play these games into one category (kids who treat it as a game only, with high scores as their main motivation - I'm looking at you, South Park). A huge number of adults play them as a social thing. It's to sit down with a few friends, a few drinks, and have fun playing together. This is something that's very difficult to do with real instruments unless everyone is a musician (I know many of my friends aren't). It's a way to experience the music together in a way that's more fun than just putting the records on.

Second, the idea that people will eventually abandon playing real instruments altogether because of these games is nonsense. Those who are motivated to create will create, regardless of the entertainment options available to them. In fact, I would argue the opposite is true: music games often inspire people to go out and pick up a real instrument. A good friend's brother is a bassist in a band and teaches bass and guitar to pay the bills. When I asked him about these games, I was expecting a dismissive answer. Instead, he said his teaching was busier than ever due to people from all walks of life wanting to learn the real thing after some time with the plastic versions. I know it's only anecdotal, but I think it's still interesting.

Third, these games provide a fun way for 'casual' music fans to learn to appreciate the intricacies of things like song structure, playing styles, and technical skill of various musicians. I'm not talking about those of us who put on the cans and analyze Bonham's triplets, or what effects have been applied to Plant's vocals. I'm talking about the other 99% of the population for whom music is something to be enjoyed but not dissected. Further, this increases appreciation of so-called 'classic rock', as the technical skill levels of those bands are often light years ahead of most modern bands.

I look to The Beatles: Rock band as an example of how to do a great band justice (though I'm not so sold on Green Day as a 'great band'). With the involvement of Dhani Harrison and Giles Martin, the artistic legacy was kept intact. They were able to maintain the security of the masters by using low quality 'placeholders' to create the song structures outside of Abbey Road, and inserting the proper mixes at the very end. The main game is essentially a 'greatest hits' collection (something Zeppelin has done once or twice), with full albums available for download. If you want to get picky about people listening to entire albums (something I wish more people did, though you can blame mp3 players for that, not music games), then it's easy to only make the music available for purchase as such. It's also great fan service, with the game being a (slightly sanitized) capsule of the band's history and artistic evolution. For me, my love and appreciation of the Beatles music has been greatly enhanced by this game. I believe the same would be true of a Led Zeppelin equivalent.

In the end, all of this is academic of course. The decision lies with the band, and they've made their feelings clear. The music is their property and they're free to do with it as they wish. I just hate reading all the knee-jerk dismissals of these games without understanding how most people experience them and the music they contain.

[guitarmy]

As a newcomer here (though not to Zeppelin), I understand this particular dead horse has been well beaten, but I feel the need to get a few kicks in of my own...

I was once one of those people who dismissed GH/RB, sniffily wondering why people didn't just put the time into learning to play an instrument. Having actually sat down and played Rock Band 2 enough to get passably good (one or two songs is *not* enough to learn the nuances of the game), I have completely changed my mind.

First off, I would argue that it's unfair to lump all the folks who play these games into one category (kids who treat it as a game only, with high scores as their main motivation - I'm looking at you, South Park). A huge number of adults play them as a social thing. It's to sit down with a few friends, a few drinks, and have fun playing together. This is something that's very difficult to do with real instruments unless everyone is a musician (I know many of my friends aren't). It's a way to experience the music together in a way that's more fun than just putting the records on.

Second, the idea that people will eventually abandon playing real instruments altogether because of these games is nonsense. Those who are motivated to create will create, regardless of the entertainment options available to them. In fact, I would argue the opposite is true: music games often inspire people to go out and pick up a real instrument. A good friend's brother is a bassist in a band and teaches bass and guitar to pay the bills. When I asked him about these games, I was expecting a dismissive answer. Instead, he said his teaching was busier than ever due to people from all walks of life wanting to learn the real thing after some time with the plastic versions. I know it's only anecdotal, but I think it's still interesting.

Third, these games provide a fun way for 'casual' music fans to learn to appreciate the intricacies of things like song structure, playing styles, and technical skill of various musicians. I'm not talking about those of us who put on the cans and analyze Bonham's triplets, or what effects have been applied to Plant's vocals. I'm talking about the other 99% of the population for whom music is something to be enjoyed but not dissected. Further, this increases appreciation of so-called 'classic rock', as the technical skill levels of those bands are often light years ahead of most modern bands.

I look to The Beatles: Rock band as an example of how to do a great band justice (though I'm not so sold on Green Day as a 'great band'). With the involvement of Dhani Harrison and Giles Martin, the artistic legacy was kept intact. They were able to maintain the security of the masters by using low quality 'placeholders' to create the song structures outside of Abbey Road, and inserting the proper mixes at the very end. The main game is essentially a 'greatest hits' collection (something Zeppelin has done once or twice), with full albums available for download. If you want to get picky about people listening to entire albums (something I wish more people did, though you can blame mp3 players for that, not music games), then it's easy to only make the music available for purchase as such. It's also great fan service, with the game being a (slightly sanitized) capsule of the band's history and artistic evolution. For me, my love and appreciation of the Beatles music has been greatly enhanced by this game. I believe the same would be true of a Led Zeppelin equivalent.

In the end, all of this is academic of course. The decision lies with the band, and they've made their feelings clear. The music is their property and they're free to do with it as they wish. I just hate reading all the knee-jerk dismissals of these games without understanding how most people experience them and the music they contain.

That's quite possibly the most well-organized and thoughtful assessment of the GH/RB issue in a single post. Great Job!

I also dislike the hysterics associated with writing off this game. Not everyone is meant to play instruments either-but most people enjoy music.

We don't tell people who can't play music that they can't listen to it, right? So they should be able to have some fun with their favorite music.

[Yupter]

I'd sure have fun with it no doubt, but these games are just another way of releasing a band's singles. As Zeppelin history would show us, the band was never really big on releasing singles and despite this fact they still had tons of success. For what reason do they have to change now?

Led Zeppelin is not going to fade away into oblivion just because they don't jump on the video game bandwagon. They hardly need the exposure.

The way I see it, if people are looking for music other than what's on the top 40's chart, they'll find it.

Also, a Led Zeppelin game is very impractical <<< I'm still standing by my Impractical Thread.