Okay, so from 1972 to 1975, Jimmy's 12-string tone in concert had a ringing, chiming quality. Then, on the 1977 tour, it changed to this muddy, grungy tone. The warm, bell-like tones of the double-neck that rang thru songs like "The Song Remains the Same" had disappeared. So what happened? Was it a switch in gear? His gear and amps looked to me to be the same in 1977 as in 1975. Was it his playing style that changed? Or perhaps a fault of the mixing desk or the PA?(while Jimmy's stage amps appeared the same, I think the band used a different PA system for the 1977 tour) It's been puzzling me for years.

I have now had a day to listen and re-listen to the new Radiohead cd "The King of Limbs" and while I can't say that it is as accessible as "In Rainbows"(there's nothing as out-of-the-box striking as "Reckoner" or "Nude" was), I am starting to dig it more and more with each listen. Early favourites on the new record are "Morning Mr. Magpie", "Feral" and "Give Up the Ghost". Besides, it's Radiohead...who, along with Wilco, PJ Harvey, Sigur Ros, Lucinda Williams and a few others, will be remembered 20 years hence as one of the greats of this era. I love Radiohead for the same reasons I got into Led Zeppelin: great musicianship, adventurous sounds, good production, and the stubbornness to follow their muse and do things their own way, conventional-wisdom be damned. Just as Led Zeppelin could take familiar blues-rock tropes and create something scintillating and distinctly their own, Radiohead uses electronica to a similar end. Both bands cast their musical net over a wide and eclectic variety of sources, inspired by an ever-questing musical curiosity, yet the end result is always definable as being uniquely their own. Whether Led Zeppelin was blazing through sun-blasted Arabian deserts or drifting down the muddy Mississippi river or mellowing out in the gorgeous green hills and dales of Wales, the resulting music always bore the unmistakable stamp of Led Zeppelin. Be it a pile-driving blues stomper or a blissed-out English madrigal, Led Zeppelin had the ability to put everything through its magic filter and make it strange, weird, wonderful, and most importantly, ROCK! Even if they were just picking banjos and mandolins...their music rocked. Radiohead is similar. Now before the fanboys get up in arms and say I am crazy for mentioning Radiohead in the same breath as Zeppelin, I am not saying Radiohead is the equal of Led Zeppelin in historical impact or that I would say they are my 1st or 2nd favourite band of all-time. But they are creeping into my top 10. And the feeling I get listening to Radiohead is strikingly similar to the feeling Zeppelin gives me, even though their approach is very different. Radiohead seems to go out of their way to not act or play like a standard rock band, even though all you have to do is take one listen to one of their early albums(say The Bends) and you know they could have made plenty of money and gained plenty of fans just regurgitating the same album over and over. But just like Led Zeppelin refused to repeat Led Zeppelin II ad nauseum, so Radiohead decided after The Bends to follow their own muse, trusting the listener to follow them wherever it lead. Just as "In Through the Out Door" is as different to "Houses of the Holy" as "Houses" is to "Led Zeppelin I", Radiohead's "The King of Limbs" is to "OK Computer" what "OK Computer" is to "Pablo Honey". It's just that the difference is that Zeppelin's inspiration to transcend the blues-rock genre lay in world music(primarily Celtic and North Africa) and Motown and Funk, while Radiohead's way out of the grunge-ghetto led through the fields of electronica and minimalism and the chopped-up beats of hip-hop. But make no mistake, no matter how far afield Radiohead gets, they still make it rock(maybe not as "heavy" as Zeppelin but they rock all the same)...you know a Radiohead song when you hear one. It has the same indefinable "something" that separates them from their supposed followers/competition that Zeppelin songs had. Just as Led Zeppelin were miles above the likes of Black Sabbath, Iron Butterfly, Grand Funk Railroad, Deep Purple, etc., so has Radiohead distanced themselves from the Doves, Elbow, Coldplay, Muse. Characteristics that both bands share: 1. A striking vocalist(Robert Plant/Thom Yorke) with an immediately identifiable voice. 2. A guitarist(Jimmy Page/Jonny Greenwood) with an individual approach to the instrument and an ability to sculpt mesmerizing soundscapes. 3. A great drummer(John Bonham/Phil Selway) capable of handling any beat or time signature the band needs. Trust me, you have to see Radiohead live to appreciate the job Phil Selway does. 4. A bassist(John Paul Jones/Colin Greenwood) with a way with a groove and the ability to play keyboards as well. 5. Consistent quality production...their albums always "sound" good. And while Radiohead doesn't sell near the amount of records that Zeppelin did, they can sell out any show at the drop of a hat. Their live reputation has grown exponentially through the years. If you've never seen them live, you owe it to yourself to at least check them out once. So back to the thread...what are your thoughts about the new Radiohead?

I fear its hopeless Electrophile...this guy obviously has a mental block when it comes to this topic; perhaps his mother tortured him with endless plays of "YMCA" when driving him to-and-from school when he was a wee lad. No you don't. You never have any valid reasons...just incorrect assumptions and gibberish. Apparently you just throw the words "crappy", "wimpy", "spineless", "rubbish", "disco sucks", "shitty", "ruddy", "YMCA", and "lame" in some random phrase generator and repeat ad nauseum. I don't have the time nor the space to go into detail the false assertions you keep making...the post would run pages and pages long and I don't think Sam Webmaster would appreciate me taking up so much bandwidth on such a trifling matter as this. But let's just take one of your more inane points: that disco was tied to the anti-rock conservative values crowd. In a word: POPPYCOCK! Disco was, for one thing, a public music. It was mostly intended to be heard in dance clubs for people to dance to...it was never meant to be analysed whilst listening to it closely on headphones at home. It wasn't anti-rock, or anti-anything...it was just another form of expression, a type of music to coexist with all the other forms of music around at that time, be it rock 'n' roll, top 40 pop, folk, soft rock, soul, R & B, whatever. Disco didn't replace rock...rock was still plentiful during the disco era...nor was it trying to do so. And as for your assertion that disco was a result of some conservative movement afoot in the country to wipe out rock? That is very funny, considering that the early creators and adherents of disco were mostly from the decidedly non-conservative gay/lesbian and ethnic communities of the big cities. To this day, I still like some disco from the 70's: Donna Summer, KC & the Sunshine Band, Chic, Kool & the Gang...and Gloria Gaynor's "I Will Survive" is a powerful feminist statement of survival. In fact, I would rather listen to any of the above than to the bland offerings of Journey and Foreigner and their late-70's corporate-rock brethren. But don't worry spidersandsnakes...this is the last "invasive post" I will submit to this thread, for trying to follow your logic is like being trapped on a Möbius strip.

I am glad to see that I wasn't the only one who first thought this was about the relative merits of Pittsburgh vs. Philadelphia when reading the PI vs PHI thread title. I'm no math wizard, but I am inclined to go with PI. Yes, PHI is the "Perfect number", or even "Golden number", if you will. But the problem I always say with being perfect is that you can't be anything else. But PI is the "irrational", "transcendental" number, both qualities that are descriptive of Led Zeppelin's music. So even though PHI has many things going for it: its uses in art, music, architecture, nature, et al...how fun it is to say the name Leonardo Fibonacci...the bizarre fact that while the Golden Mean or Golden Section principle has been around since the time of Euclid, it wasn't until the 1909 that the letter PHI was used to designate this concept, thanks to an American mathematician named Mark Barr...no, even with all that in its favour, I am going to go with plucky, little PI. Besides, PI has this in its corner: Pi by Wislawa Szymborska "The admirable number pi: three point one four one. All the following digits are also initial, five nine two because it never ends. It can't be comprehended six five three five at a glance, eight nine by calculation, seven nine or imagination, not even three two three eight by wit, that is, by comparison four six to anything else two six four three in the world. The longest snake on earth calls it quits at about forty feet. Likewise, snakes of myth and legend, though they may hold out a bit longer. The pageant of digits comprising the number pi doesn't stop at the page's edge. It goes on across the table, through the air, over a wall, a leaf, a bird's nest, clouds, straight into the sky, through all the bottomless, bloated heavens. Oh how brief - a mouse tail, a pigtail - is the tail of a comet! How feeble the star's ray, bent by bumping up against space! While here we have two three fifteen three hundred nineteen my phone number your shirt size the year nineteen hundred and seventy-three the sixth floor the number of inhabitants sixty-five cents hip measurement two fingers a charade, a code, in which we find hail to thee, blithe spirit, bird thou never wert alongside ladies and gentlemen, no cause for alarm, as well as heaven and earth shall pass away, but not the number pi, oh no, nothing doing, it keeps right on with its rather remarkable five, its uncommonly fine eight, its far from final seven, nudging, always nudging a sluggish eternity to continue." In summation, anytime is a good time for Pi

So some friends and I attended last night's double-bill of Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan" and "Star Trek III:The Search for Spock" and, as usual, George Takei was freaking hilarious, insightful and eloquent. If you've never had the chance to see him in person, you should rectify that at your next opportunity...you won't be sorry. He is one of the most entertaining speakers I've ever heard. I am surprised no one has posted this on this thread yet, but here is one of the most hilarious and clever things I've ever seen on Youtube...just the editing work alone deserves massive hosannas...ENJOY! And for those who can't get enough of William Shatner and Leonard Nimoy singing( I have albums by both "thespian-singers"...and no, I don't feel embarrassed by that fact, hehehe), here's a treat for you: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vd5zadgAYg0

TONIGHT at the American Cinematheque@Egyptian Theatre in Hollywood...with GEORGE TAKEI IN PERSON! Star Trek Celebration @ American Cinematheque TO BOLDLY GO…: CELEBRATING STAR TREK In 1979, Robert Wise's STAR TREK: THE MOTION PICTURE kicked off a mania for TV-to-movie adaptations that has thrived ever since and spawned multiple sequels, tributes and spin-offs. To celebrate the STAR TREK film series, we've chosen six of the eight films in the franchise, plumbing deep for gems in the Trek universe that haven't necessarily received the tribute they deserve. All of these films embody the ideals of sci-fi's first franchise that have endured for more than 40 years. May they continue to live long and prosper for many more. Please join us at the Egyptian Theatre for our STAR TREK tribute, including 35mm screenings of THE WRATH OF KHAN and THE SEARCH FOR SPOCK, plus THE VOYAGE HOME, THE FINAL FRONTIER and THE UNDISCOVERED COUNTRY in 70mm. Series compiled by Grant Moninger. Discussion with cast and crew following STAR TREK: THE MOTION PICTURE and with the STAR TREK IV, V and VI screenings. Egyptian Theatre • Thu, March 24 - Sun, March 27 Films in this Series at the Egyptian STAR TREK: THE MOTION PICTURE Thu, March 24 - 7:30pm Egyptian Theatre STAR TREK II: THE WRATH OF KHAN / STAR TREK III: THE SEARCH FOR SPOCK Fri, March 25 - 7:30pm Egyptian Theatre STAR TREK IV: THE VOYAGE HOME / STAR TREK V: THE FINAL FRONTIER Sat, March 26 - 7:30pm Egyptian Theatre STAR TREK VI: THE UNDISCOVERED COUNTRY Sun, March 27 - 7:30pm Egyptian Theatre

Thanks for the tip, Jahfin...this is always one of the highlights of the year for me...only 21 days left! Woohoo!

"open my front door...hear my back door slam...you must have one of them new-fangled back-door man"

Actually you did start the fire...with your incessant yelling(do you always have to post in bold all caps?) about how the 80's were crap. Not only on this thread but on another one in the ramble on section you go on and on about the 80's being crappy, wimpy, all about disco Saturday Night Fever and Studio 54, etc. etc. So not only are you repetitive...but you're incorrect. Saturday Night Fever came out in late 1977 and it definitely was a hit and pushed disco in the mainstream consciousness. 1978-1979 was disco's high point with the Saturday Night Fever soundtrack and albums by Chic and Donna Summer. But by 1980 the writing was on the wall...disco was on the wane. Of course there was the July 12, 1979 Disco Demolition Night at Chicago Whitesox Stadium. But the two things that helped drive a nail in disco's coffin in 1980 was the twin failures of the movies "Xanadu" and "Can't Stop the Music". And by the end of the year everyone had forgotten about Saturday Night Fever as "Urban Cowboy" was Travolta's newest hit and the craze swept the nation as bars from San Francisco to Washington DC installed mechanical bulls. So you see, as the 80's began disco had ceased to be a force, so for you to continuously paint the 80's as a decade of disco is misguided. Actually what is really amusing about these various "music isn't as good as it used to be" is that people say this every decade. The 70's are looked upon as a golden age now but I can assure you that as early as 1973 Rolling Stone and other mags were running articles about how stagnant and boring the rock scene was and that the 70's were dead compared to the exciting 60's. And I guarantee you that in 10 years time people will be moaning about how the 2020's suck and why aren't there any bands as good as the ones in the 2000's, like Radiohead and the White Stripes. Of course the scary thing is that someone will actually be nostalgic for the insipid likes of Train and Maroon 5.

In the 70's there was one music magazine I read religiously from cover-to-cover and that was CREEM. I would also read Crawdaddy, Trouser Press, Rolling Stone, Downbeat, NME, Melody Maker, and Circus on a semi-regular basis. Later in the 70's the punk zines started to appear and those were always fun reads and some are now quite valuable. But Creem was my rock n roll bible from 1969 to about 1986 when it started running out of steam. Today MOJO is the one magazine I always make sure to get every month and read every page. Good writers(including some old Creem vets), a large and varied review section, a good mix between historical and new music, and a free cd with every issue makes Mojo the one essential read for any music fan. The other music mags I still peruse with varying degrees of devotion are Uncut, Paste, Downbeat, Gramophone, BBC Music, HotPress, American Songwriter, Record Collector, Relix, Q, NME, The Wire, Spin, Filter, Oxford American Music Issue, and yes, even Rolling Stone...although more for its current affairs reportage than its musical content.

Man, things have been so hectic that my mind has been elsewhere...for the first time in YEARS I didn't fill out a bracket. Just don't follow the college basketball season like I used to do. All I know is that the PAC 10 was down this year. I was hoping Belmont and Gonzaga would go farther (further?) than they did. And while I usually don't root for Duke, after what Jalen Rose said in that self-aggrandizing Fab Five film, I will cheer for Duke to squash Michigan today.

Of all the times it had to rain here in Los Angeles, Mother Nature chose last night to send clouds and rain our way, negating any chance for us Angelenos to see the closest moon in 18 years.

Double amen. I'm gonna go out and hug a tree in your honour.

Amen, sister.

For the newbies... First time hearing Led Zeppelin

Here's an all-girl band, The Daughters of Eve, singing "Help Me Boy", which is a female version of "Help Me Girl", a song recorded by the Animals and the Outsiders: Another hot one from the Lost Agency: But, of all the great songs and bands that are on this collection, HERE IS THE #1 REASON YOU SHOULD BUY/DOWNLOAD THIS COMPILATION-The Foggy Notions "Need A Little Lovin'" Well, that's just great...it's no longer on youtube. It was on the other day, but now it's been pulled due to copyright issues for some reason. Too bad, as it was my favourite discovery of the whole set. With a propulsive bassline and jangling, shimmering(almost shoegazey-like) guitar riffs and sweet vocal harmonies, this was a song the Stone Roses would have KILLED to have. And get this, the average age of the band was 16! Imagine being in high school and already having this song under your belt...man, talk about a trail of panties. Apparently, they only cut this one single...and since I can't post "Need A Little Lovin'", here's the flipside, "Take Me Back and Hold Me"...but it's nowhere near as good as "Need A Little Lovin'":

Yeah, I LOVE Sundazed...along with Proper, Ace, Charly and Bear Records, they put out some of the most amazing and rare stuff. There were a few other songs I wanted to put in my earlier post, but I had exceeded my file limit. So, now that Kiwi Zep Fan has had a chance to catch up, here are some more nuggets from the Sundazed 2131 South Michigan Avenue set: First up, a couple tracks with some PUMPING BASSLINES. Well, I wanted to post Oscar and the Majestics "Soul Finger" but there isn't one on youtube, so here's some cool fuzzed-out ravers instead... More fuzz goodness to come...

No need to worry that you're steppin' on toes. But maybe you could tell me which bands on my list do you feel AREN'T an 80's band?

Well, if I bought the record and saw the band at Raji's or Club Scream in the 80's, then they're an 80's band to me.

Another one from Texas...welcome to the board, Cindy! Saw you visited my profile, and as I didn't recognize your name, thought I'd do a little checking myself and that is when I saw you were a new member. Well, if you like Led Zeppelin, I'm sure we'll cross paths on the board soon. Hope you enjoy your time here.

Thanks for posting this...never was a big Cliff Richard fan, but the link between Jet Harris and Jimmy and JPJ is undeniable and not to be forgotten. And 71 is a reasonably long life...R.I.P. Jet.

Oh don't be so dramatic...and stop your weeping; this ain't the Miami Heat locker-room. I see...so then I must have HALLUCINATED Sonic Youth, The Swans, Big Black, Black Flag, X, Alley Cats, Cramps, Blasters, Gun Club, Southern Death Cult, Social Distortion, Descendents, Dead Kennedys, Flesh Eaters, Divine Horsemen, Circle Jerks, Fear, Flipper, Minutemen, Meat Puppets, Melvins, Dinosaur Jr., Green River/Mudhoney, Soundgarden, Nirvana, Gang of Four, Mission of Burma, Mekons, Feelies, XTC, R.E.M., Robyn Hitchcock/The Soft Boys, The Cure, Jesus & the Mary Chain, Cocteau Twins, This Mortal Coil, The Mighty Lemon Drops, My Bloody Valentine, Spacemen 3, Yo La Tengo, Pixies, Jane's Addiction, Thelonious Monster, 45 Grave, Fishbone, Busboys, Top Jimmy & the Rhythm Pigs, Tex & the Horseheads, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Dream Syndicate, Rain Parade, Opal, Kendra Smith, Bangles, Bad Brains, Steel Pulse, Public Enemy, Afrika Bambaataa, Beastie Boys, N.W.A., Run-DMC, Eric B. & Rakim, Steve Earle, Pogues, Nick Cave & the Bad Seeds, Bauhaus, Crowded House, Kate Bush, Joan Jett, Go-Go's, Madonna, Prince, Husker Du, Replacements, House of Freaks, Violent Femmes, Orchestral Manoeuvres in the Dark, Thomas Dolby, Gary Numan, Echo & the Bunnymen, U2, The Teardrop Explodes, Psychedelic Furs, Talk Talk, Human League, Yazoo, Depeche Mode, New Order, Nurse with Wound, The Smiths, Stevie Ray Vaughn, Iron Maiden, Guns 'n' Roses, Accept, Ministry, Metallica, Megadeth, Slayer, Siouxsie and the Banshees, Sade, Peter Gabriel, Pere Ubu, the Fall, Cabaret Voltaire, Au Pairs, Altered Images, Pet Shop Boys, Kid Creole & the Coconuts, Cameo, Klaus Nomi, Wall of Voodoo, the db's, Concrete Blond, Mary's Danish, Southern Culture on the Skids, Chesterfield Kings, Oingo Boingo, Diamanda Galas, Lydia Lunch, Annie Lennox/Eurhythmics...and probably many more that I'm forgetting. Not to mention Robert Plant and Jimmy Page, who both released records in the 80's.

Whew...(breaths sigh of relief)...that is good news.

Doesn't something have to actually go away before you can miss 'em? I swear it sometimes seems like the 80's and 90's have never left. It used to be there was a lag time before nostalgia kicked in...like how it wasn't until the early 70's(helped by American Graffiti) that there was a 50's revival. Or the 1979-81 boom in all things Doors and 60's counterculture, which in turn led to the Paisley Underground. But, now with the internet and the 24/7 news cycle and the shortening of attention spans, there seems to be a current of nostalgia running all the time. I also love how people reduce whole decades to simplified cliche. Like one poster above who equated the 80's with light frothy John Hughes movies and the 90's with dark violent QT films. Well, the 80's had their share of dark twisted films...does the name David Lynch ring a bell? Blue Velvet? Wild at Heart? Elephant Man? And I'm pretty sure the 90's had their fair share of light frothy teenage movies.