THE END OF FREE LEGAL MUSIC

[BonzoLikeDrumer]

I'll have to start by clarifying that my meaning of digital is download vs. cd/s albums, something you can touch and feel. sorry if I didn't use proper terminology there. Is the correct term streaming?

Computers with no hard drives? I don't know about that one. Anything is possible but I just don't see the world digressing back to the days of a webtv type device.

Hmmm, you don't know the difference between downloading and streaming? You can give your opinion but, if you make statements about the future of the digital and internet world's and don't know how it works right now...well, there will be little worth to your statement to start with so, you can ...

A - ask/listen some one who has some in-site on the subject

B - do some research your self (from some creditable source)

I would advise the latter of the two choices because research is what we all need to do if we want to first, understand and except the screwed up mess there is right now and second, find/support a better way.

Computers are such simple devices and they have only a few basic task's/component's to make it all work!

The complicated thing is the networking and the physical hooking every one in. And of coarse the big cooperation's that are wanting to get the big piece of the pie by only giving you a packaged month to month deal.

Then you have all the little hack's that are trying to stick them self into the system, I wouldn't put it past some of the big corporation's having some of those guy's in there them self (knowing or not knowing).

If we take away the power of the OS from the general public, thing's will be a lot safer! Even if a lot of the hack's and Bug's are less than lethal, it is a problem none the less.

Surf safely

[bigzepfan]

I do know the diff.

Streaming and downloading have the exact same delivery method. Downloading and streaming are the same in that the music comes from an outside source, from another computer to yours. Whether you just play it or download it and then play it, the music came from another computer and not something that you bought in the store.

Downloading and streaming are both different than buying a CD or a DVD which has the music on the disc.

It's all in the delivery! Which IMO they can no longer prohibit the delivery of their music to the masses and never will.

If the whole world only had web-type devices like you were talking about they could control it. But I just don't see that happening. Even our cable boxes and cellphones now have hard-drives because it is beneficial to the consumer, not the artist. Technology advances and is produced on the consumers needs, not the providers needs.

Hopefully this world will put its efforts into greater causes than trying to protect someone who sang a song and wants to get royalties every time the song is played for the rest of their life. To me that is just utterly ridiculous. You earn the income based on the popularity of the band because of the song(via accessory sales, high paid guest appearances, touring), not the song itself.

[BonzoLikeDrumer]

I do know the diff.

Streaming and downloading have the exact same delivery method. Downloading and streaming are the same in that the music comes from an outside source, from another computer to yours. Whether you just play it or download it and then play it, the music came from another computer and not something that you bought in the store.

Downloading and streaming are both different than buying a CD or a DVD which has the music on the disc.

It's all in the delivery! Which IMO they can no longer prohibit the delivery of their music to the masses and never will.

If the whole world only had web-type devices like you were talking about they could control it. But I just don't see that happening. Even our cable boxes and cellphones now have hard-drives because it is beneficial to the consumer, not the artist. Technology advances and is produced on the consumers needs, not the providers needs.

Hopefully this world will put its efforts into greater causes than trying to protect someone who sang a song and wants to get royalties every time the song is played for the rest of their life. To me that is just utterly ridiculous. You earn the income based on the popularity of the band because of the song(via accessory sales, high paid guest appearances, touring), not the song itself.

Like I said, you can have your opinion expressing you own ideals, the technology is closer than you may think. Just doing the development, allowing it to operate, then getting it in place is the largest issue (mainly the last two issues) we'll have to deal with.

So, do you like all this corporation crap of having to upgrade every 6 months or 2 years stuff? I don't, it make's me feel obsolete, every time I think I got something good the new OS come's out or the better hardware is added, making my investment's (that I'm still in debt for in some cases) worthless or less of a value with every new day that passes!

Some thing's you cant get around, for sure, but if we only had an "intelligent web" thing's would be a lot better for the "consumers needs" as you put it. The consumers are just that, consumers, not provider's of cheep free/illegal junk! I don't have any problem if (those being infringed on) one want's to say it's OK for it to go on, that's there deal and another matter all together.

How will any one make a business work if it's all free to the public? If we're talking about ordering physical product or downloading, business is business and if there is no way to make a profit, it can't survive!

OK, but your forgetting that if it wasn't for that "great song" then no one will want to give out that big intervw or that grant for a big tour or the "accessory sales".

Can you tell me how the US royalties system work's? Or, is your view about how the music business works just another idea that popped into your head?

All you have to do is say..."I didn't know that's how it all worked". And we'll let it go.

[bigzepfan]

Like I said, you can have your opinion expressing you own ideals, the technology is closer than you may think. Just doing the development, allowing it to operate, then getting it in place is the largest issue (mainly the last two issues) we'll have to deal with.

So, do you like all this corporation crap of having to upgrade every 6 months or 2 years stuff? I don't, it make's me feel obsolete, every time I think I got something good the new OS come's out or the better hardware is added, making my investment's (that I'm still in debt for in some cases) worthless or less of a value with every new day that passes!

Some thing's you cant get around, for sure, but if we only had an "intelligent web" thing's would be a lot better for the "consumers needs" as you put it. The consumers are just that, consumers, not provider's of cheep free/illegal junk! I don't have any problem if (those being infringed on) one want's to say it's OK for it to go on, that's there deal and another matter all together.

How will any one make a business work if it's all free to the public? If we're talking about ordering physical product or downloading, business is business and if there is no way to make a profit, it can't survive!

OK, but your forgetting that if it wasn't for that "great song" then no one will want to give out that big intervw or that grant for a big tour or the "accessory sales".

Can you tell me how the US royalties system work's? Or, is your view about how the music business works just another idea that popped into your head?

All you have to do is say..."I didn't know that's how it all worked". And we'll let it go.

There's alot I don't know. That is why I enjoy having discussions with people who are more knowledgeable.

The music business is changing. and quickly. Regardless of how it worked in the past, it will work differently in the future.

How will any one make a business work if it's all free to the public? If we're talking about ordering physical product or downloading, business is business and if there is no way to make a profit, it can't survive!

It will be harder, I agree. That's why I think the profit will be in the touring, shirts, special appearances, etc. Many types of businesses are changing because of our economy. Music is just one. Music instruction is another. There is so much on youtube for free. You used to have to pay experienced people in your area to learn to play an instrument. Now just turn on youtube and it's free.

I really don't think anyone knows how it's going to go. I just enjoy theorizing.

[Reggie29]

The only way to ensure free music, on hand at all times is......

Learn to play an instrument.

[BonzoLikeDrumer]

There's alot I don't know. That is why I enjoy having discussions with people who are more knowledgeable.

The music business is changing. and quickly. Regardless of how it worked in the past, it will work differently in the future.

How will any one make a business work if it's all free to the public? If we're talking about ordering physical product or downloading, business is business and if there is no way to make a profit, it can't survive!

It will be harder, I agree. That's why I think the profit will be in the touring, shirts, special appearances, etc. Many types of businesses are changing because of our economy. Music is just one. Music instruction is another. There is so much on youtube for free. You used to have to pay experienced people in your area to learn to play an instrument. Now just turn on youtube and it's free.

I really don't think anyone knows how it's going to go. I just enjoy theorizing.

That's cool, yes, there's healthy profit's from tour's and merchandising, always has, and always will!

I'll tell you a little bit about paying someone to show you how to play back in the good old days. I went to a local shop and signed on as a student with the best guy they had! What a joke! I learned more from one of my band mate's (for free) than I ever did with that dude! He was a good player but, not a good teacher!

Good one's, and not so good one's out there, just like with bands, some are good, some ok, and some, just blow your head off with there abilities/sound.

From what I've been reading over in some "over my head" group's, the web will be real intelligence (growing and expanding with-out our help) and PC computer's will be dummy devices, so just get ready for when it come's.

[BenRassmu]

Those that aren't willing to pay for their music must not be true music fans.

What's with this "give it to me free" generation? Any product will cost you money. Is music not important enough in your life to pay for it?

Sad indeed.

[Reggie29]

Those that aren't willing to pay for their music must not be true music fans.

What's with this "give it to me free" generation? Any product will cost you money. Is music not important enough in your life to pay for it?

Sad indeed.

I couldn't agree with you any more than I do.

INGRATES!

There is too much capital tied up in companies to expect them to allow these so called"Free" music downloads etc.

The problem with the ME generation is, they don't consider the hundreds of thousands of people worldwide who are working because of the "Corporations" could lose their jobs as a consequence.

Their attitude is, that's it's a sacrifice they are willing (for others) to make, as long as it's not ME!

Welcome to the forum!

[BenRassmu]

I couldn't agree with you any more than I do.

INGRATES!

There is too much capital tied up in companies to expect them to allow these so called"Free" music downloads etc.

The problem with the ME generation is, they don't consider the hundreds of thousands of people worldwide who are working because of the "Corporations" could lose their jobs as a consequence.

Their attitude is, that's it's a sacrifice they are willing (for others) to make, as long as it's not ME!

Welcome to the forum!

Thanks.

I spend more money on music than anything else besides a home, food and (other survival) necessities. Music is part of the survival as well so that would rank number 4 in my priorities.

Can you believe that a $12 cd with 60 or more minutes of music on it is considered expensive to today's potential music buyer?

Unbelievable!

[Aquamarine]

Those that aren't willing to pay for their music must not be true music fans.

What's with this "give it to me free" generation? Any product will cost you money. Is music not important enough in your life to pay for it?

Sad indeed.

And the people who make that product deserve to be compensated a fair amount, which will benefit music-lovers because the best musicians will be able to focus full-time on their music, as professionals. (Or the most popular, at least, I realize they're not necessarily the same.) Thus we not only get higher quality music, but more of it, because the musicians aren't trying to hold down a day job and produce quality music at the same time.

[Yupter]

It just might end up where music can no longer be transfered over the internet unless buying it from an official vendor.

After which we'll end up stuck with making burn disks.

[bigzepfan]

And the people who make that product deserve to be compensated a fair amount, which will benefit music-lovers because the best musicians will be able to focus full-time on their music, as professionals. (Or the most popular, at least, I realize they're not necessarily the same.) Thus we not only get higher quality music, but more of it, because the musicians aren't trying to hold down a day job and produce quality music at the same time.

The flipside is that if they don't make as much off of one album/song they will work more at making music and touring instead of one album per year or one album every few years.

I like Eric Claptons idea this year of touring with several different artists(first beck, then daltry, then winwood). One tour produces megamoney in ticket sales, three different DVD's and increased fame(not that EC needs that, but the up and comings do).

Bonzolikedrumer - do you have a link to what you're referring to? Would love to read up more.

What's with this "give it to me free" generation? Any product will cost you money. Is music not important enough in your life to pay for it?

I prefer to pay for music when I see it live, not recorded. Music is huge in my life, but so is food, clothing, shelter, education, transportation, etc.

Another really interesting item is that Them Crooked Vultures put out their whole album on you-tube so that people could hear it and download it for free -- prior to their album coming out. It was only a few days before but it was still given to the fans for free. I don't recall another band ever doing that and when I pondered why they did it I can come up with only one reason. They know that it's going to be there for free by someone else so why not distribute freely the best quality version. Any other theories why they did what they did???

[BenRassmu]

Another really interesting item is that Them Crooked Vultures put out their whole album on you-tube so that people could hear it and download it for free -- prior to their album coming out. It was only a few days before but it was still given to the fans for free. I don't recall another band ever doing that and when I pondered why they did it I can come up with only one reason. They know that it's going to be there for free by someone else so why not distribute freely the best quality version. Any other theories why they did what they did???

I've never known You Tube to deliver the best quality version of music ever! The bit rate is generally very poor.

[bigzepfan]

I've never known You Tube to deliver the best quality version of music ever! The bit rate is generally very poor.

Agreed, I guess I'm stretching for a reason why!

[Aquamarine]

I prefer to pay for music when I see it live, not recorded. Music is huge in my life, but so is food, clothing, shelter, education, transportation, etc.

But musicians work just as hard to write, rehearse, then record music. And they need food and clothing too!

[bigzepfan]

But musicians work just as hard to write, rehearse, then record music. And they need food and clothing too!

So true. So true...and they definitely deserve their reward. Unfortunately, due to technology, I'm guessing they're going to make less than they have in the past. For all of the musicians out there I hope that I am wrong.

I can't imagine how much work goes into recording, editing and producing one album.

It's got to be hour after hour after hour of listening to the same song over again and again until it comes out just right. I sometimes have the desire to give it a try, but my patience is thin.