MonkeyOnMyBack Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Like most of you, I have been knee-deep in Celebration Day for a couple of months now. Overall, I absolutely love it. It isn't a perfect performance (either O2 or Shepperton), but I love it so much better than No Quarter. Among the reasons.. 1) Starting with the obvious, having JPJ there makes such a difference on every level. One, he is miles ahead of the bass/keyboards JImmy/Robert used. Second, he is just one bad mutha who seems to get more capable, cool and polished with age. He owns it so well on stage in CD. I always thought it was in poor taste to not only exclude JPJ from that entire era, but to name the album No Quarter, JPJ's feature song, seemed below the belt. To this day, it really seems like Robert and Jonesy's relationship (including the awkward quip at the Rock-and-Roll Hall of Fame) has never really recovered. 2) Jason Bonham. He is not John Bonham, but as noted above, he is miles beyond the milquetoast drumming we lived through in No Quarter era. So much better. 3) Robert's voice. You would think another 13 years of Wearing and Tearing would have further compromised Robert's fragile voice. To the contrary, it is so much better, stronger and powerful than on the No Quarter / Unledded performance. Listen to the Kashmirs, it isn't even close. 4) Jimmy looks much cooler in the all-white hair than the fake-dyed too black look of the Page/Plant era. Starting with "It Might Get Loud", Jimmy has ascended to a new level of respect, appreciation and command as the leader of Led Zeppelin. 5) I was actually intrigued by, and interested in some of the creative alternate arrangements that came from No Quarter. I loved the drum ensemble on Four Sticks, and the concept of full orchestra and drum ensemble on Kashmir. However, with a few exceptions, a mediocre rhythm section and Robert's vocal struggles really let that show down. Obviously it is an apples and oranges comparison, but in some regards it is a better comparison than Live Aid or Atlantic-40, which didn't feature near the rehearsal time of these two performances. Hands down, I was so thrilled to see O2 (and ultimately the release of Celebration Day) perform at such a high level, after cringing through portions of No Quarter. I'm in the camp who thinks this was probably it for the band, and if so, what an amazing final performance. What other band or artist ever finished like this? Wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe (Liverpool) Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Why didn't you compare it to The Song Remains The Same? Which beats the crap out of Celebration Day musically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pottedplant Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 I so agree with you, MonkeyOnMyBack. There are only three songs from No Quarter that I listen to over and over. Celebration Day, imo, is far and away the better of the two. What ruins No Quarter for me is Robert's vocals. They are really bad on some of the songs. His voice sounds like he has a really bad cold- very raspy and downright out of tune. He sounds strong on Celebration Day, as you said. I do love "No Body's Fault But Mine", "Gallows Pole," though, and my favorite "The Rain Song." Otherwise, not a good outcome for "No Quarter." I am in no way qualified to critique LZ's music from a musician's perspective, but only as a listener (and lover of their music). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarius Rising Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 I enjoy both for different reasons...different times, different focus, just like TSRTS. You really cannot compare these, only preference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyingzepp Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 You forgot to explain the point of this thread Monkey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyOnMyBack Posted January 17, 2013 Author Share Posted January 17, 2013 Why didn't you compare it to The Song Remains The Same? Which beats the crap out of Celebration Day musically. I chose to compare to formations of the principles after the death of John Bonham. Many have compared it (favorably) Live Aid or Atlantic 40, but I felt these two performances best mirrored each other in terms of preparation and rehearsal time. As for comparing it to 1973? That's silly. First off, any comparison of a performance with John Bonham vs. one without is lopsided already. To boot.. let's talk about others from any walk in life who were hitting their peak in 1973... Raquel Welch, Pele, Billie Jean King, Jack Nicklaus, Mark Spitz, Paul Newman, Muhammad Ali, Rudolf Nureyev, Neil Armstrong, etc, and compare them to what level they were performing at in 2007. Probably a pretty notable change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyOnMyBack Posted January 17, 2013 Author Share Posted January 17, 2013 You forgot to explain the point of this thread Monkey Point being how hesitant I was for this reunion and ultimately the release of Celebration Day after the disappointing performances on No Quarter, even though I loved some of the creative arrangements and alternate versions. Of course, the bootlegs were a favorable indication... and then the movie and soundtrack just really hit me with regards to how good they played in comparison to 1994. Another point being.. Robert & JImmy & JPJ > Robert & Jimmy. JPJ is SUCH a key part to why they were better in 2007, as well as how much better Jason Bonham was than the drummer who played with Robert & Jimmy in the 90s... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe (Liverpool) Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 I chose to compare to formations of the principles after the death of John Bonham. Many have compared it (favorably) Live Aid or Atlantic 40, but I felt these two performances best mirrored each other in terms of preparation and rehearsal time. As for comparing it to 1973? That's silly. First off, any comparison of a performance with John Bonham vs. one without is lopsided already. To boot.. let's talk about others from any walk in life who were hitting their peak in 1973... Raquel Welch, Pele, Billie Jean King, Jack Nicklaus, Mark Spitz, Paul Newman, Muhammad Ali, Rudolf Nureyev, Neil Armstrong, etc, and compare them to what level they were performing at in 2007. Probably a pretty notable change. So remind me ....When was No Quarter released?.....How many years before Celebration Day? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe (Liverpool) Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 I so agree with you, MonkeyOnMyBack. There are only three songs from No Quarter that I listen to over and over. Celebration Day, imo, is far and away the better of the two. What ruins No Quarter for me is Robert's vocals. They are really bad on some of the songs. His voice sounds like he has a really bad cold- very raspy and downright out of tune. He sounds strong on Celebration Day, as you said. I do love "No Body's Fault But Mine", "Gallows Pole," though, and my favorite "The Rain Song." Otherwise, not a good outcome for "No Quarter." I am in no way qualified to critique LZ's music from a musician's perspective, but only as a listener (and lover of their music). Are you for real, he misses out so many words on Celebreation Day that my daughter asked me if he had forgotten them, I said no he just can't sing them any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAJones Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 In hindsight, the performance captured for MTV's Unledded was under-rehearsed. Even so, it has it's own unique qualities which have stood the test of time. The courage necessary to even attempt it would be called upon again for the Celebration Day performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Knebs Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 SAJ I agree on the few unique qualities. When it came out I was so pumped and I enjoyed the ensemble. I tried to get with Robert's style and adjustments to the scales and I still can't get there. Doing anything lock-step with the MTV thugs is in my opinion a poor career decision. Wondering what you mean about "under-rehearsed"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirchzep27 Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 My first thoughts are that unledded /no quarter has too much variety and celebration day could have used a bit more variety. On unledded all the acoustic stuff is great to me, nobody's fault, friends, four sticks, levee, gallows, city dont cry, wonderful one, but its chopped up with the electric songs and its maybe too much to appreciate. Kashmir, since, what is, and thank you, are maybe there to promote/reflect the tour to follow this project. ? Imo that was an interesting arrangement of kashmir and listened to that cd alot in the 90s. Basically, the no quarter record is a bit all over the place, with the two titles being an example, i guess it was presented like that, with both page and plant ideas. Imo, think it would have worked better as an album, if it were all acoustic. With celebration day, to read and hear on interviews that they practiced, the rover and houses of the holy, as fans we want to hear those songs. How great was it that they played good times bad times and for your life. To think about adding, rover and houses, is a bit crazy for us fans. Everybody is reflecting this idea of a bit more variety from the catalogue, with set lists for the zeppelin tours. I am not complaining though, am very thankful they made the dvd and cd. Interesting that one was a big project/world tour and one was a tribute. I think that a good page and plant show from 95/98 would compare very easily to the 02 show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Knebs Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 Interesting that one was a big project/world tour and one was a tribute. I think that a good page and plant show from 95/98 would compare very easily to the 02 show. you make some interesting points and do you have a date in mind that would compare favorably? One that comes to mind for me would be Shepherd's Glen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirchzep27 Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 you make some interesting points and do you have a date in mind that would compare favorably? One that comes to mind for me would be Shepherd's Glen... Thanks man. I don't have any particular show in mind, the shows i saw in 95 and 98 were really good shows... The electric songs from 95 tour were better than what was represented on the album, no quarter/unledded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pottedplant Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 Are you for real, he misses out so many words on Celebreation Day that my daughter asked me if he had forgotten them, I said no he just can't sing them any more. Point well taken. I was talking about the sound of his voice, not how many words he missed. He admitted in an interview that he could no longer hit the high notes, but overall, he sounded pretty damn good...to me anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveAJones Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 Wondering what you mean about "under-rehearsed"... Full band rehearsals lasted less than a week, during which the orchestra & Egyptians were only present for about three days. Some songs had to be performed twice during the actual two-days of recording to compensate, perhaps depleting some kinetic energy. As I said though, it was a valiant and courageous endeavor. The duet with Najma remains every bit as magical now as it seemed then. you make some interesting points and do you have a date in mind that would compare favorably? One that comes to mind for me would be Shepherd's Glen... The Shepherds Bush gig of March 25, 1998? Yes, absolutely. Definitely. I was there, about ten feet from Jimmy. Possibly the best gig of the Page/Plant era, though what I saw & heard from my front row vantage point in Frankfurt (December 3, 1998) gives it a real run for it's money (Train Kept' a Rollin' was seemingly performed upon request during the encore, among other highlights). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#1fan Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 I liked the drummer on no quarter, he wasnt bad at all, isnt he dead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 Yes, Michael Lee has passed away....RIP. I enjoyed him for the project, but for Zeppelin Jason is the one and only one who can step in - IMO - for a proper reunion at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovroasperger Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 As many of you said, on Celebration Day, Robert's vocal is WAAAAY better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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