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wordev1977

Best performance of San Francisco Dazed And Confused interlude

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What is the best sung and played version of San Francisco it's often one of my favorite parts of Dazed I'm partial to the 6/3 performance in LA before the tape starts warbleing.

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July 29, 1973 MSG is pretty darn good. And it is a true "San Francisco" interlude...the lyrics as well as the music. A lot of the 1975 interludes feature the lyrics to "Woodstock" over the music.

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2 hours ago, tom kid said:

Seattle 21/3/75 is a pretty unique one. 

Except that "For What It's Worth" doesn't work as well against the music as "San Francisco" or "Woodstock" did IMO. Yet I somehow feel Stephen Stills would have approved...😁

40 minutes ago, Strider said:

July 29, 1973 MSG is pretty darn good. And it is a true "San Francisco" interlude...the lyrics as well as the music. A lot of the 1975 interludes feature the lyrics to "Woodstock" over the music.

I want to say the switch from "San Fran" to "Woodstock" -somebody correct me if I'm wrong- began with the second leg of the '75 US tour, though they did still do "San Fran" on occasion (like alternating them at the Earls Court shows). Mind ya, they barely played "D & C" during the first leg...

And, lest we forget, people, the riffing in the "San Francisco" section begat "Achilles Last Stand".

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What about the one and only time they did 'Old Man' by Love at the 27/3/75 forum show? I always thought that was pretty cool. I think the longest dazed too, clocking in at 46 mins!

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When this interlude first started evolving in late 72, the lyrics matched the music. Cowgirl In the Sand by Neil Young. Robert quickly adapted the San Francisco lyrics, of course, from about Ally Pally through all of 73 and the first leg of 75. Then as the mood struck him San Fran, Woodstock, For What It's Worth. I think the best Woodstock is the 4th night at Earls Court. San Fran is a tough call, there are so many. Shows late in either leg of the 73 North American tour generally have that relaxed, spacey feel that makes this section work.

But the music was clearly adapted from Cowgirl In the Sand. Where Neil was picking individual notes, Jimmy would play many of them as riffs. Then, as stated above, Jimmy worked out the note progression as the intro to this interlude that wound up in Achilles Last Stand. Funny how the first time a mass audience heard San Fran was on TSRTS soundtrack. After Presence was released. It all seemed so natural.

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16 hours ago, tom kid said:

Seattle 21/3/75 is a pretty unique one. 

This is my favourite, both uniqueness- and performance-wise.  Not only does it have the one and only instance of "For What It's Worth" in the main section, it also has some "I Shot The Sheriff," both in keeping with Plant's dedication of Dazed that night to "the difference and the balances between law and order, and where they start crossing each other's lines" and his references to the Seattle Police and the man being held by them for giving Page a stolen guitar.

14 hours ago, Strider said:

July 29, 1973 MSG is pretty darn good. And it is a true "San Francisco" interlude...the lyrics as well as the music. A lot of the 1975 interludes feature the lyrics to "Woodstock" over the music.

That's a great one indeed, and with it being used in the film and remastered versions of The Song Remains The Same, it certainly has an edge in the sound quality department.

13 hours ago, Nutrocker said:

Except that "For What It's Worth" doesn't work as well against the music as "San Francisco" or "Woodstock" did IMO. Yet I somehow feel Stephen Stills would have approved...😁

I want to say the switch from "San Fran" to "Woodstock" -somebody correct me if I'm wrong- began with the second leg of the '75 US tour, though they did still do "San Fran" on occasion (like alternating them at the Earls Court shows). Mind ya, they barely played "D & C" during the first leg...

And, lest we forget, people, the riffing in the "San Francisco" section begat "Achilles Last Stand".

Interesting.  I've always felt that the "For What It's Worth" lyrics worked really well, I wish Plant had used them more often in this section.  Correct, he made the switch to "Woodstock" at the start of the second leg (we don't know if it was Houston or Baton Rouge, of course), with a few "San Fran"'s at Earls Court.

12 hours ago, tom kid said:

What about the one and only time they did 'Old Man' by Love at the 27/3/75 forum show? I always thought that was pretty cool. I think the longest dazed too, clocking in at 46 mins!

That's a good one too, for uniqueness at the very least.  And yes, longest version at 45 minutes and change.  3/25/75 L.A. has a cool one as well, with Plant singing "Spanish Harlem."

Overall, this section has always been one of my favourite "songs within a song."  It would probably be harder to find a bad version of it, but some others off the top of my head are:

- 3/16/73 Vienna -- "San Fran."  Not necessarily the best overall, but Bonham does a nice fill just after they enter it.

- 7/9/73 St. Paul -- "San Fran"

- 2/13/75 Uniondale -- "San Fran"

- 3/19 & 20/75 Vancouver -- "Woodstock"

- 5/24/75 London -- "Woodstock"

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3 hours ago, Zep Hed said:

When this interlude first started evolving in late 72, the lyrics matched the music. Cowgirl In the Sand by Neil Young. Robert quickly adapted the San Francisco lyrics, of course, from about Ally Pally through all of 73 and the first leg of 75. Then as the mood struck him San Fran, Woodstock, For What It's Worth. I think the best Woodstock is the 4th night at Earls Court. San Fran is a tough call, there are so many. Shows late in either leg of the 73 North American tour generally have that relaxed, spacey feel that makes this section work.

But the music was clearly adapted from Cowgirl In the Sand. Where Neil was picking individual notes, Jimmy would play many of them as riffs. Then, as stated above, Jimmy worked out the note progression as the intro to this interlude that wound up in Achilles Last Stand. Funny how the first time a mass audience heard San Fran was on TSRTS soundtrack. After Presence was released. It all seemed so natural.

Definitely one of the better ones.

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I prefer the "San Francisco" and "Woodstock" lyrics with the interlude. "Spanish Harlem" would have been okay except that Plant's voice was croaking all over the place so it doesn't sound good. I don't like the "For What It's Worth" or "Old Man" lyrics in this scenario...just doesn't work for me. "For What It's Worth" worked better as part of the "Whole Lotta Love" or "Communication Breakdown" medleys.

Here are the best "San Francisco" interludes from 1973, in my opinion. All use the "San Francisco" lyrics.

 January 15, 1973 Stoke...an often overlooked 1973 gig.

March 21, 1973 Hamburg

March 24, 1973 Offenburg...when in doubt, go with Offenburg...every song from this show ranks among the best performances of said song.

May 14, 1973 New Orleans

May 26, 1973 Salt Lake City

June 2, 1973 San Francisco

July 7, 1973 Chicago

July 12, 1973 Detroit

July 17, 1973 Seattle

July 21, 1973 Providence

July 24, 1973 Pittsburgh

July 29, 1973 New York

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I guess I'll take the easy road & say TSRTS for "San Francisco" and "Woodstock", I'll go with an obvious one again in 3/19/75. Sometimes the larger D & C's are a good one for me to skip unless something sensational grabs me, like Walter's Walk and the Crunge bending my ears in '72....

 

 

 

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On the rare occasions I actually listen to an epic "Dazed And Confused" these days as soon as I hear the bowed guitar I'm fast forwarding😆. Then, after the final verse, with most of the '75 versions, I find myself fast forwarding again through the long jam at the end. That said, I love the epic lead ins Jimmy does prior to the "San Fran"/"Woodstock" sections on some of those later '75 shows. That whole bit, including "San Fran" is probably my favourite part of the entire piece. I like it when they do "Woodstock" more just because I think "Woodstock" is a better song than "San Fran"...

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Now I will deal with 1975. The first one didn't occur until February 3, 1975 at Madison Square Garden. The first few were quite rusty, especially Plant's voice. The February 10 Landover is good musically, and it's a soundboard...but Plant is shot.

Here are my suggestions for 1975.

The "San Francisco" interludes:

February 12, 1975 MSG New York

February 13, 1975 Nassau New York

February 14, 1975 Nassau New York

February 16, 1975 St. Louis

May 23, 1975 Earls Court

May 25, 1975 Earls Court (for the last "Dazed" the band went back to "San Francisco")

The first "Woodstock" interlude occured February 28 at Baton Rouge and it remained "Woodstock"  save for March 21 Seattle and March 25 and 27 LA Forum, and a couple of Earls Court dates.

Here are my "Woodstock" suggestions:

February 28, 1975 Baton Rouge

March 3, 1975 Ft. Worth

March 5, 1975 Dallas

March 10, 1975 San Diego

March 11, 1975 Long Beach

March 12, 1975 Long Beach

March 19, 1975 Vancouver

March 20, 1975 Vancouver

March 24, 1975 L.A. Forum

May 18, 1975 Earls Court

May 24, 1975 Earls Court

Lastly, because it is unique and the longest interlude, there is the March 21, 1975 Seattle which has bits of "For What It's Worth", "Rude Boy", "I Shot the Sheriff", and "Woodstock".

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2 hours ago, Nutrocker said:

On the rare occasions I actually listen to an epic "Dazed And Confused" these days as soon as I hear the bowed guitar I'm fast forwarding😆. Then, after the final verse, with most of the '75 versions, I find myself fast forwarding again through the long jam at the end. That said, I love the epic lead ins Jimmy does prior to the "San Fran"/"Woodstock" sections on some of those later '75 shows. That whole bit, including "San Fran" is probably my favourite part of the entire piece. I like it when they do "Woodstock" more just because I think "Woodstock" is a better song than "San Fran"...

For the 1975 D & Cs I skip to the first jam leading into the San Francisco/Woodstock interludes and listen to the end of the bow segment, then I fast forward again until the end of the final verse and listen to the final jam.

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1 hour ago, Strider said:

For the 1975 D & Cs I skip to the first jam leading into the San Francisco/Woodstock interludes and listen to the end of the bow segment, then I fast forward again until the end of the final verse and listen to the final jam.

Heh, we're opposites in that regard!😅

I wonder whatever happened to the guy who claimed he had the whole "Fourty seven minute" version of D & C from the last L.A. '75 show...😅

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10 hours ago, Nutrocker said:

Heh, we're opposites in that regard!😅

 

I'm surprised by this. Because, the San Francisco interlude and the final wah wah jam are, to my ears, the only parts of the song that still sounded alive and vibrant.

I have said this before and I'll say it to my dying daze, by 1975 "No Quarter" was the superior jam. "Dazed and Confused" was a dead horse.

From 1969 to 1973 "Dazed and Confused" had grown in concert as new jams and segments were developed and added to the song. 1975 is the first year where the song didn't add anything new (save for Plant changing from "San Francisco" to "Woodstock" lyrics in the interlude), and in fact they removed certain parts such as the Crunge or Funk jam in the middle of the fast solo section. I think only once or twice in 1975 was the funk section played. 

Another problem was Plant. First, he didn't sing the song...he squealed the song like Ned Beatty getting raped in "Deliverence". Second, he long had stopped caring about singing the song's lyrics. All he did was repeat over and over "I wanna make love to you little girl...25...25...25 blah blah blah." it was infantile, puerile, sterile nonsense.

The song had lost all meaning. It had ceased being a song. And when the jam no longer serves the song because the song no longer serves the jam, then the jam becomes merely an exercise in wankery.

The problem was that most of the wankery was just by rote. They were regurgitating all the parts from 1973...only not as well. "Dazed and Confused" used to explode in concert. In 1975 it plundered and plodded along. Even the "fast" ones in 1975 sound slow and leadened compared to 1973 and before.

30 and 40 minutes wasted on "Dazed and Confused" when they had just released a double-album of slamming songs. Why weren't they playing "The Rover", "Wanton Song", "In the Light", "Ten Years Gone", "Houses of the Holy"?

If they wanted to play something old from the first album, play "Good Times Bad Times", "Communication Breakdown". Play "How Many More Times" where Jimmy can still do the bow solo with the laser light show.

I am so jealous of the people in Chicago and Indiana who got to see the first leg of the 1975 tour and got "Wanton Song", "When the Levee Breaks" and "How Many More Times" instead of the tired wankery of "Dazed and Confused". Even the worst 1977 show I saw was better than most 1975 shows. The 1977 shows were more energetic and lively to my mind...and a big reason was the setlist.

To me, the 1975 shows were dark and plodding and too many 'Ludes by both band and audience alike. I think 1975 suffers in my mind for also being bracketed by the 1973 and 1977 shows, which had more positive energy.

That is why I have resisted doing one of my concert threads on the 1975 shows I saw. I don't want to write something too negative.  Granted, I still enjoyed most of the shows...the first show I saw March 12 at Long Beach was definitely my favourite of the bunch. The stretch from "Over the Hills" to "Trampled Under Foot" was the best part of the show for me. Then an hour was wasted as Bonham and Page showed off.

But at least with the "Woodstock" interlude, bow solo and the final wah wah jam, there were still moments in "Dazed" that could take my breath away and thrill me.

Now when I listen to 1975 tapes, the quality of the show determines if I listen to all of "Dazed and Confused". If it is a goood show with good flow...like March 3 Ft. Worth or March 12 Long Beach or March 21 Seattle...then I let it play all the way through. It also helps if it is an audience tape...the band usually sounds better. The Earls Court shows, for instance, I prefer on audience than the thin dry soundboard or videotrack.

The soundboards accentuate the flaws in Plant's voice and Page's playing. It sounds like Page is strangling a cat on some of those soundboards.

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5 hours ago, Strider said:

From 1969 to 1973 "Dazed and Confused" had grown in concert as new jams and segments were developed and added to the song. 1975 is the first year where the song didn't add anything new (save for Plant changing from "San Francisco" to "Woodstock" lyrics in the interlude), and in fact they removed certain parts such as the Crunge or Funk jam in the middle of the fast solo section. I think only once or twice in 1975 was the funk section played

Another problem was Plant. First, he didn't sing the song...he squealed the song like Ned Beatty getting raped in "Deliverence". Second, he long had stopped caring about singing the song's lyrics. All he did was repeat over and over "I wanna make love to you little girl...25...25...25 blah blah blah." it was infantile, puerile, sterile nonsense.

Four times I believe: 2/14 Uniondale, 3/21 Seattle, 3/25 L.A. and 3/27 L.A.

RE: Lyrics -- one of the many reasons to love the 3/21 Seattle version, at least as far as '75 versions go 😅 He does sing the "will your tongue wag so much when I send you the bill" line, and sounds damn good for '75 on "bill," albeit it's in the wrong spot as he sings it in one of the initial verses if memory serves.

Can't argue with any of your other observations.  '75 was actually the first live year I got into about 10 years ago now I guess, so I still have a soft spot for a few versions, but the deeper I dig into previous years, the more I realize the inferiority of '75 Dazed's as a whole.

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16 hours ago, Strider said:

I'm surprised by this. Because, the San Francisco interlude and the final wah wah jam are, to my ears, the only parts of the song that still sounded alive and vibrant.

I have said this before and I'll say it to my dying daze, by 1975 "No Quarter" was the superior jam. "Dazed and Confused" was a dead horse.

From 1969 to 1973 "Dazed and Confused" had grown in concert as new jams and segments were developed and added to the song. 1975 is the first year where the song didn't add anything new (save for Plant changing from "San Francisco" to "Woodstock" lyrics in the interlude), and in fact they removed certain parts such as the Crunge or Funk jam in the middle of the fast solo section. I think only once or twice in 1975 was the funk section played. 

Another problem was Plant. First, he didn't sing the song...he squealed the song like Ned Beatty getting raped in "Deliverence". Second, he long had stopped caring about singing the song's lyrics. All he did was repeat over and over "I wanna make love to you little girl...25...25...25 blah blah blah." it was infantile, puerile, sterile nonsense.

The song had lost all meaning. It had ceased being a song. And when the jam no longer serves the song because the song no longer serves the jam, then the jam becomes merely an exercise in wankery.

The problem was that most of the wankery was just by rote. They were regurgitating all the parts from 1973...only not as well. "Dazed and Confused" used to explode in concert. In 1975 it plundered and plodded along. Even the "fast" ones in 1975 sound slow and leadened compared to 1973 and before.

30 and 40 minutes wasted on "Dazed and Confused" when they had just released a double-album of slamming songs. Why weren't they playing "The Rover", "Wanton Song", "In the Light", "Ten Years Gone", "Houses of the Holy"?

If they wanted to play something old from the first album, play "Good Times Bad Times", "Communication Breakdown". Play "How Many More Times" where Jimmy can still do the bow solo with the laser light show.

I am so jealous of the people in Chicago and Indiana who got to see the first leg of the 1975 tour and got "Wanton Song", "When the Levee Breaks" and "How Many More Times" instead of the tired wankery of "Dazed and Confused". Even the worst 1977 show I saw was better than most 1975 shows. The 1977 shows were more energetic and lively to my mind...and a big reason was the setlist.

To me, the 1975 shows were dark and plodding and too many 'Ludes by both band and audience alike. I think 1975 suffers in my mind for also being bracketed by the 1973 and 1977 shows, which had more positive energy.

That is why I have resisted doing one of my concert threads on the 1975 shows I saw. I don't want to write something too negative.  Granted, I still enjoyed most of the shows...the first show I saw March 12 at Long Beach was definitely my favourite of the bunch. The stretch from "Over the Hills" to "Trampled Under Foot" was the best part of the show for me. Then an hour was wasted as Bonham and Page showed off.

But at least with the "Woodstock" interlude, bow solo and the final wah wah jam, there were still moments in "Dazed" that could take my breath away and thrill me.

Now when I listen to 1975 tapes, the quality of the show determines if I listen to all of "Dazed and Confused". If it is a goood show with good flow...like March 3 Ft. Worth or March 12 Long Beach or March 21 Seattle...then I let it play all the way through. It also helps if it is an audience tape...the band usually sounds better. The Earls Court shows, for instance, I prefer on audience than the thin dry soundboard or videotrack.

The soundboards accentuate the flaws in Plant's voice and Page's playing. It sounds like Page is strangling a cat on some of those soundboards.

I agree with every word of this, though, and it only reinforces my belief that they should have stuck with "How Many More Times" in the set in '75 in place of the mothworn "Dazed And Confused". 

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6 hours ago, Nutrocker said:

I agree with every word of this, though, and it only reinforces my belief that they should have stuck with "How Many More Times" in the set in '75 in place of the mothworn "Dazed And Confused". 

I think cutting the "circular funk" section as ledzeppelin-refrence.com refers to it didn't help -- that section was not only one of the cooler parts of the song, it was also slower than the other parts of the midsection, which could have given Page a chance to at least have a section where he could play with more fluidity, akin to the slower part in the Stairway solo.  Similar to our discussion about the Pontiac NQ in one of the other threads, this section being missing always makes the '75 versions feel lopsided to me.  The end of the bow solo was fairly consistently more than halfway through the song, even on the extra long ones (except 3/27, where the bow solo ends around the 21:00 mark, but that version has that section).  3/21 the bow ends around 21:00 as well, but that one is "only" 40:07 long, so more than halfway.

Edited by Bonzo_fan

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