Freemasons

[alwizard03]

My Stepfather was a Mason and We never went to any family meeting and He never told us anything about it.My Dad and My Grandfather were in the KKK in the early 60's and they did not tell us there secrets either. Needless to say I have joined no Secret Clubs and don't intend to.The Company I work for sometimes act like a Secret Club but thats as close as I get.Unless there are Dancing Girls then I might consider it.Heck they don't even have to Dance.

[Hotplant]

Hetware, is that you?

If so, this might get interesting for awhile.

(and I'll have done it with one post... hee hee).

That's Exactly what I was thinking Lakey!

[Dzldoc]

Ever hear of links to give credit to the sight you're googling ?

www.freemasonry.org/

Happy

[Atlas]

When it comes to questions about stuff like Freemasonry, google is a fickle bitch.

Aliester Crowley: 33° Mason Who Knew about Human Sacrifice

[I have got a horsey]

He must be down at bottom end of the scale of things in the Lodges. Between 1 and 27 nothing much happens, but from 27-33 these are the people who are ruling the world, these are the people that have loyalty only unto themselves.

Sounds like the Mormon church

[Atlas]

Sounds like the Mormon church

The guy at the Scottish Rite House of the Temple reminded me that both Smith and Young were Freemasons.

[Atlas]

My Stepfather was a Mason and We never went to any family meeting and He never told us anything about it.My Dad and My Grandfather were in the KKK in the early 60's and they did not tell us there secrets either. Needless to say I have joined no Secret Clubs and don't intend to.The Company I work for sometimes act like a Secret Club but thats as close as I get.Unless there are Dancing Girls then I might consider it.Heck they don't even have to Dance.

On my mother's side, my grandfather and great grandfather were Masons. My mother was in something called the Rainbow Girls. My father would never join the Masons since he does not acknowledge a Supreme Being.

I recently visited the George Washington Masonic National Memorial. I am a great admirer of Washington, and find his involvement in Freemasonry to be one of the most appealing aspects of the fraternity.

Some people claim that Albert Pike - the father of the Scottish Rite Southern Jurisdiction, USA - was a founder of the KKK, but I have never been able to verify that.

[I have got a horsey]

The guy at the Scottish Rite House of the Temple reminded me that both Smith and Young were Freemasons.

You mean Smith as in Joseph Smith? I didn't realise he was a freemason... I've seen his photo, he looks incredibly creepy to me...

[wanna be drummer]

Is this a conspiracy theory Freemason thread or just a legitimate "Who are/were they?" thread?

[BIGDAN]

Is this a conspiracy theory Freemason thread or just a legitimate "Who are/were they?" thread?

You don't wanna know!!!

[Atlas]

Is this a conspiracy theory Freemason thread or just a legitimate "Who are/were they?" thread?

I don't know what that means. I do know that there is a copy of Proofs of a Conspiracy by Robison kept at the Washington Masonic Memorial in Alexandria. Some people claim that Robison misrepresented Weishaupt's activities.

I also know that the Propaganda Due lodge actually existed, and was involved in serious criminal activity of a conspiratorial nature.

My questions are sincere.

[Lake of Shadows]

Is this a conspiracy theory Freemason thread or just a legitimate "Who are/were they?" thread?

I believe the answer to your question is "yes".

I don't know what that means. I do know that there is a copy of Proofs of a Conspiracy by Robison kept at the Washington Masonic Memorial in Alexandria. Some people claim that Robison misrepresented Weishaupt's activities.

I also know that the Propaganda Due lodge actually existed, and was involved in serious criminal activity of a conspiratorial nature.

My questions are sincere.

Classic answer. I don't doubt that you would like to have serious and sincere discussion on the topic. But, I know how you ask questions and sometimes even why you ask them. Yet, you usually have a lot more information on a topic than you let on. Your questions may be sincere, but where you're going with them and your real reason(s) for asking them isn't always clear.

[Nathan]

I also know that the Propaganda Due lodge actually existed, and was involved in serious criminal activity of a conspiratorial nature.

My uncle is a Mason, within the 27-33 degrees (I can't remember of the top of my head exactly which degree he is... I'd have to ask him). I have, in fact, been to one of those upper-level meetings. Shocking, I know, as usually those levels are the most secret, or so conspiracy theorists would like us to believe. What happened at the meeting?

Well, it started with a secular 10-minute service to God. Secular because Mason-members are Jewish, Christian, Muslim (yes, Muslim)... anyone who believes in God. So these types of prayers are secular to include all members' faiths. Then they went around the room doing introductions because they had two new members who had just moved up to those ranks and, of course, I was there. The meeting itself was quite boring. It was about new inductees, finances, upcoming events, charity-work, so on and so forth. Really nothing interesting. The best part of the meeting was the food. Holy shit!

Of course, because the leader of this particular lodge was not only Jewish, but kept Kosher, you had the expected bagels, cream cheese, and lox. But there was also shrimp cocktail, calamari, tea biscuits... I mean... it was just, you know, bite-size of most of it, but... well... imagine a cocktail party at a mansion. This was like that. Of course, there was soda and punch, but there was also alcohol for the adults. No, I didn't have any alcohol because I wasn't 21, yet. I was actually 18, so this was about 3 years ago.

There were no special outfits worn, either. I think the most formal outfit was the lodge leader (forgot what they were actually called), in slacks and a polo... and the polo was a golf-shirt.

Does that de-mystify the Masons for some of you?

The conspiracy theories are false. All of them. The Propaganda Due Lodge (which did exist, even if you were being sarcastic) was a joke lodge set up because the Masons thought it'd be funny to "fan the flames." They figured "hey... if they want conspiracies, let's give them conspiracies."

Masonry is secretive in the same way a college fraternity is secretive. It's just a membership thing. A giant post-college Fraternity.

And BTW, I am joining the Freemasons. I have talked to my Uncle about setting up an initiation for me. I'm waiting for him to tell me when so I can head up to Connecticut which is where he lives and where my (hopeful) initiation will take place. He has kept some things secret from me, but I know what those secrets are about and why, and he said as I move up (I say if, but he wants to see me move up) I will learn those secrets. So say hello to your future resident Mason.

[Atlas]

Does that de-mystify the Masons for some of you?

"fay çe que vouldras"

The conspiracy theories are false. All of them.

Even Robison's?

The Propaganda Due Lodge (which did exist, even if you were being sarcastic) was a joke lodge set up because the Masons thought it'd be funny to "fan the flames." They figured "hey... if they want conspiracies, let's give them conspiracies."

Not according to what I have read and heard. AAMOF, the man showing me around the House of the Temple acknowledged their wayward conduct.

Masonry is secretive in the same way a college fraternity is secretive. It's just a membership thing. A giant post-college Fraternity.

How about Skull and Bones? Somehow I can envision Poppy Bush in the middle of some weird Ivy League death cult circle jerk. Even easier is Dubya.

But that's not Masonic, so far as I know.

[I have got a horsey]

A secret society does sound terribly exciting, but what's there to be secret about anymore?

[Nathan]

"fay çe que vouldras"

Translate please?

Even Robison's?

You'll have to remind me which one is Robinson's, again, but yes, it most likely isn't true.

Not according to what I have read and heard. AAMOF, the man showing me around the House of the Temple acknowledged their wayward conduct.

Not according to what you have read and heard.

Exactly. That's the whole point. Most Mason's will tell you about The Propaganda Due Lodge's "wayward conduct" in order to fan the flames. If you are already a Freemason Conspiracy Theorist, they give you something to run away with, and that is usually the Propaganda Due Lodge.

You've heard about it's "wayward conduct" because you're supposed to have heard about it's "wayward conduct." That's the whole point of the lodge.

How about Skull and Bones? Somehow I can envision Poppy Bush in the middle of some weird Ivy League death cult circle jerk. Even easier is Dubya.

But that's not Masonic, so far as I know.

There are people who'd like it to be Masonic, but no, it's not. In fact, the only correlation between the two is that many members of Skull and Bones become Freemasons once out of Yale.

My Aunt, who works at Yale, is actually trying to get permission to take me into that house. She's been in, though she is NOT a member. She says it's actually quite comfortable in there and the members are really nice. I really can't debunk this one yet, though. I haven't had my tour. But my Aunt doesn't believe the Conspiracy Theories, and that's good enough for me. I just want to see for myself out of curiosity.

[Atlas]

Translate please?

"Do what thou wilt."

You'll have to remind me which one is Robinson's, again, but yes, it most likely isn't true.

http://www.sacred-texts.com/sro/pc/index.htm

PROOFS

OF A

CONSPIRACY

AGAINST ALL THE

RELIGIONS AND GOVERNMENTS

OF

EUROPE,

CARRIED ON

IN THE SECRET MEETINGS

OF

FREE MASONS, ILLUMINATI,

AND

READING SOCIETIES,

COLLECTED FROM GOOD AUTHORITIES,

BY JOHN ROBISON, A. M.

PROFESSOR OF NATURAL PHILOSOPHY, AND SECRETARY TO THE ROYAL SOCIETY OF EDINBURGH.

Nam tua res agitur paries cum proximo ardet.

THE FOURTH EDITION.

TO WHICH IS ADDED, A POSTSCRIPT.

NEW-YORK:

Printed and Sold by George Forman, No. 64, Water-Street,

between Coenties and the Old-Slip.

[1798]

Not according to what you have read and heard.

Exactly. That's the whole point. Most Mason's will tell you about The Propaganda Due Lodge's "wayward conduct" in order to fan the flames. If you are already a Freemason Conspiracy Theorist, they give you something to run away with, and that is usually the Propaganda Due Lodge.

You've heard about it's "wayward conduct" because you're supposed to have heard about it's "wayward conduct." That's the whole point of the lodge.

Nonsense. There were real crimes, real murders, real investigation, real convictions, etc.

There are people who'd like it to be Masonic, but no, it's not. In fact, the only correlation between the two is that many members of Skull and Bones become Freemasons once out of Yale.

My Aunt, who works at Yale, is actually trying to get permission to take me into that house. She's been in, though she is NOT a member. She says it's actually quite comfortable in there and the members are really nice. I really can't debunk this one yet, though. I haven't had my tour. But my Aunt doesn't believe the Conspiracy Theories, and that's good enough for me. I just want to see for myself out of curiosity.

I judge them by their deeds in life. Taft seems to have been the best of the cult thus far.

[Nathan]

"Do what thou wilt."

Ahh, Crowley. A crazy man, and possibly the first hippie. But a Satanist? He started the religion of Thelema. Jimmy Page is a Thelemic Wizard. Now you don't believe Jimmy Page is a Satanist... right?

http://www.sacred-texts.com/sro/pc/index.htm

PROOFS

OF A

CONSPIRACY

AGAINST ALL THE

RELIGIONS AND GOVERNMENTS

OF

EUROPE,

CARRIED ON

IN THE SECRET MEETINGS

OF

FREE MASONS, ILLUMINATI,

AND

READING SOCIETIES,

COLLECTED FROM GOOD AUTHORITIES,

BY JOHN ROBISON, A. M.

PROFESSOR OF NATURAL PHILOSOPHY, AND SECRETARY TO THE ROYAL SOCIETY OF EDINBURGH.

Nam tua res agitur paries cum proximo ardet.

THE FOURTH EDITION.

TO WHICH IS ADDED, A POSTSCRIPT.

NEW-YORK:

Printed and Sold by George Forman, No. 64, Water-Street,

between Coenties and the Old-Slip.

[1798]

Oh that crap? First off... the Illuminati no longer exist. They have probably been the only secret society in which the conspiracy theories are mostly true. The Freemasons are rather ashamed of the Illuminati. But the Illuminati is gone... has been for a very long time.

Nonsense. There were real crimes, real murders, real investigation, real convictions, etc.

You're proving me right, Atlas. You are supposed to believe all that. The Masons have enough money that they invented all this shit. They created the papers and the folders and the files on these investigations and crimes that never happened. One day, if you get the chance, take a look at the people who were "murdered." Some don't exist. Others were so old they actually died of natural causes, but made younger in the reports. A very small few died by accident (car crashes, overdoses, etc). You are supposed to believe what you believe. That's the point.

I judge them by their deeds in life. Taft seems to have been the best of the cult thus far.

Except it isn't a cult. It's a fraternity.

[Atlas]

Ahh, Crowley.

Ben Franklin, et al.

Crowly? He probably fancied himself as something of a Satanist. For the most part, I take him to have been a nutter.

Oh that crap? First off... the Illuminati no longer exist. They have probably been the only secret society in which the conspiracy theories are mostly true.

The guy at The House of the Temple sure was talking about "Illuminati".

The Freemasons are rather ashamed of the Illuminati. But the Illuminati is gone... has been for a very long time.

You're proving me right, Atlas. You are supposed to believe all that. The Masons have enough money that they invented all this shit. They created the papers and the folders and the files on these investigations and crimes that never happened. One day, if you get the chance, take a look at the people who were "murdered." Some don't exist. Others were so old they actually died of natural causes, but made younger in the reports. A very small few died by accident (car crashes, overdoses, etc). You are supposed to believe what you believe. That's the point.

So they have a conspiracy to invent a conspiracy where there is none?

Except it isn't a cult. It's a fraternity.

YMMV.

[Nathan]

Ben Franklin, et al.

Crowly? He probably fancied himself as something of a Satanist. For the most part, I take him to have been a nutter.

We can agree on that.

The guy at The House of the Temple sure was talking about "Illuminati".

I'll need more info, but I doubt it.

So they have a conspiracy to invent a conspiracy where there is none?

Exactly! Now you're getting it.

YMMV.

?

[Atlas]

The image behind the pillars is called "Illuminus".

[Nathan]

The image behind the pillars is called "Illuminus".

And what is that symbol of, Atlas? It's a symbol of the "eternal light," something that has its base in Judaism (and also known as "the Sun"). "Illuminus" is its name because it represents the illuminating light of God. That has nothing to do with the Illuminati. Their name, and the name of that symbol, is coincidental. Nothing more. You are reading way too much into it.

[Atlas]

And what is that symbol of, Atlas? It's a symbol of the "eternal light," something that has its base in Judaism (and also known as "the Sun"). "Illuminus" is its name because it represents the illuminating light of God. That has nothing to do with the Illuminati. Their name, and the name of that symbol, is coincidental. Nothing more. You are reading way too much into it.

They also had Robert Anton Willson's The Illuminati Papers prominently displayed in their library.

[wanna be drummer]

I don't know what that means. I do know that there is a copy of Proofs of a Conspiracy by Robison kept at the Washington Masonic Memorial in Alexandria. Some people claim that Robison misrepresented Weishaupt's activities.

I also know that the Propaganda Due lodge actually existed, and was involved in serious criminal activity of a conspiratorial nature.

My questions are sincere.

Well, the Freemason have always had a conspiracy aura about them. Whenever I hear Freemason, I usually hear about worldwide conspiracies. I was wondering if you wanted to know what conspiracy theorists think or what the real story behind them is.

[Atlas]

Well, the Freemason have always had a conspiracy aura about them. Whenever I hear Freemason, I usually hear about worldwide conspiracies. I was wondering if you wanted to know what conspiracy theorists think or what the real story behind them is.

Whatsa "conspiracy theorist"?