What Do You Think of Zeppelin's Commercialization?

[bga]

Forget the legacy that may be damaged. "They (LZ) don't have a crystal ball nor have you." Forget about saving the below par music world today. If you were alive in the seventies like me you know that what may have worked then may not work now especially in business. LZ remained underground so to speak way back then partly because mass communication then was not like it is now. There was no internet and certainly no on-line forums where anyone like you and me can speak his or her mind. I saw JP in an interview once that the reason they didn't like to play on tv was the quality of tvsound at that time. And if the world has evolved, why can't LZ? I think they have established that they are an evolving group. Trust them, they're on top of their game. They know what they are doing.

[ally]

Forget the legacy that may be damaged. "They (LZ) don't have a crystal ball nor have you." Forget about saving the below par music world today. If you were alive in the seventies like me you know that what may have worked then may not work now especially in business. LZ remained underground so to speak way back then partly because mass communication then was not like it is now. There was no internet and certainly no on-line forums where anyone like you and me can speak his or her mind. I saw JP in an interview once that the reason they didn't like to play on tv was the quality of tvsound at that time. And if the world has evolved, why can't LZ? I think they have established that they are an evolving group. Trust them, they're on top of their game. They know what they are doing.

Trust Them... Yeah ,that's why I'm confident that this will work. They are fully aware of the stakes and certainly don't need to take any unwarrated risks unless this is something they REALLY want to do. If they do want this..... just bring on the music baby

[SteveAJones]

And if the world has evolved, why can't LZ? I think they have established that they are an evolving group. Trust them, they're on top of their game. They know what they are doing.

They're not on top their game no matter how many revisionists try to insist otherwise.

The 02 was not the best concert they EVER did. Plant does not have the range nor the

desire to perform this music. Jason is not his father. TSRTS soundtrack release is a hatchet job and the dvd release is being pulled.

John Bonham is not evolving, and he was the Kingpin. He made what they wrote work.

Peter Grant is not evolving, and his stewardship of their legacy is sorely missed now.

[ally]

They're not on top their game no matter how many revisionists try to insist otherwise.

The 02 was not the best concert they EVER did. Plant does not have the range nor the

desire to perform this music. Jason is not his father. TSRTS soundtrack release is a hatchet job and the dvd release is being pulled.

John Bonham is not evolving, and he was the Kingpin. He made what they wrote work.

Peter Grant is not evolving, and his stewardship of their legacy is sorely missed now.

Your a prick you just blew my argument away. Would you agree to say.... a nice multi-track DVD of ....let's see Japan 71 ?

[Zephyrus]

an evolving band? the reason why most of the "classic" bands that still tour today suck is because they were willing to "evolve." they were willing to throw away not only chemistry between band members by merely replacing them, but by forgetting their own past by acting like the "new" band IS the original band. it's like a person who cannot admit that a friend has died. perhaps they can keep up the "magic" for a while, a la The Who, but sooner or later the stuff starts to stink. sooner or later another member will die, will it continue then? I'm sure if "Zep" was to tour now, it would continue after the next member bites the dust. will it continue until it becomes another sham like Skynyrd, where nobody on stage is even original anymore? people are saying they want to see the members play live, well shit, you CAN. go see Robert play, go see John Paul play, he gets out there fairly often. if you want to see Page, then pester him to get out there and move on and do something of his own. people are getting too used to getting whatever they want, when they want it.

[The Rover]

I have No Problem with the way Zeppelin have marketed themselves.

I saw some posters at the Mall at Spencer's Gifts. I wish they had more.

I liked the Cadillac Commercials.

Very respectable, all in all.

[dragster]

As we all know, 2007 has seen Led Zeppelin change a great deal. For years they had always been that band that had mystery, and was more something spread by word of mouth then from media exposure. Even with that, they sold the most albums, had the largest concerts, sold countless merchandise, and we as well known as any over-exposed Act. This was accomplished simply off pure power and presence. But now for the first time ever, they have leaned towards much larger commercialization. Examples..

*Commercials

*Digital Catalog

*Ringtones

*The Reunion

*Magazine Covers (Rolling Stone, Guitar World, etc.)

*New Albums..at the front of every music store

*Posters everywhere

So what is to be made of this? Is this good bad or inbetween? Personally...I support it 100% and here is why. The music industry is weak now. But population and global spending power help it thrive. There are enough people to have even weak acts sell alot of records, or get on TV, etc. (although no where near what Zep has done or is doing!). So people might not notice how weak this era is. Think about it. In the 50's they had elvis. In the 60's the beatles, stones, who, hendrix, The 70's Zeppelin, Floyd, Sabbath, Deep Purple, the 80's Michael Jackson, Prince, Queen, Gunz and Roses...etc. Just the past had many big musical acts of higher quality comparitivly speaking. Who was the artist or band of the 90's? Hard to say..how about the 00's?

So with a band like Led Zeppelin heaidng towards commercialization..they have went from being the biggest rock band ever...to a popularity and level never before seen. Yes in many ways it sucks to see 16 year olds with zeppelin 77 tour t-shirts, only downloading stairway to their ipod, and acting like they know it all. But i say thats better then the next generation indulging in weaker music. Hopefully this will do more good then bad. I loved zeppelin my whole life...and now, for better or worse...the people in the world who didnt take notice before, are left with no choice now.

If I have learned anything after 49 moons on this dustball of ours, it's this: an artist and/or band can go "commercial" anytime they feel like it.....and Zep is NO exception....BUT to go WIMPY on their fans (e.g. David Bowie with Let's Dance; Floyd with that RUBBISH called The Wall; Scorpions with Wind of Change = "look at the new boss...same as the old boss" = RUBBISH...etc.).........NO WAY......and Zep may have changed over the years, BUT THEY HAVE NEVER......EVER......wimped out on their fans!!!!

VIVA LED ZEP FOREVER!!!

rOBERT

[Nathan]

SteveAJones and Zephyrus, I recommend to you and all other naysaying bullshit purists out there this letter from Nuno Bettencourt to Bob Lefsetz:

http://forums.ledzeppelin.com//index.php?showtopic=2753

It details exactly how I feel.

If Zep does reunite, WHY oh WHY does it have to be for fucking money? What's wrong with them doing it because the magic is there and they just want to rock? What if they feel nostalgic and just feel like getting back on stage and jamming to music that's great? What if they discover a new writing passion and decide "fuck it, this musc is good, let's record it and get one more good album out there."? What if they just WANT to do it? Where's the fucking crime in that? What is so wrong about that?

And WTF is it with you purists? Why are you so dead set against a reunion? Have any of you even bothered to listen to O2? It was fucking mindblowing. And no shit Plant doesn't have the range he used to. In case you haven't noticed, Robert Plant has gotten older. In case you haven't noticed, he's no longer 20 years old. No singer on this planet has the same range at 70 that they had at 20. If you're in your 60's and you still sing like you did at 20 years old... well... um... it won't be long before people realize your lipsinging to one of your old albums.

Voices age just like we do, people. Have any of you figured that out, yet?

Just because the Stones decided to tour for the money doesn't mean Zep will make the same mistake. If Zep tours, it'll be because they WANT to tour.

So here's my final word to you purists. Give up your stupid, holier-than-thou, purist tendencies, or please SHUT UP!

[zepsteve]

I would love a tour and a new album, and so what if the album sucked how the hell is that going to change how i feel about the old stuff! that is the most jackass stupid, dumshit thing i ever heard. What is a purist. sounds like a word some pompous dickhead uses in some feeble atempt to make themselves look or sound important, what a joke !!!!

As far as commercialism goes the music biz is a whole different animal now then it was in the 60's i mean it is 2007!! But most importantly who the f#ck are you or me to tell Led Zeppelin what Led Zeppelin is

thank you,

sincerly,

STEVE AKA ZEPSTEVE

[jadester48]

if they release a new album with the new lineup, i *will* buy it...and if i don't like it, meh, i'll sell it and content myself with listening to classic zep instead of their new stuff.

I only hope, if they do release an album of new stuff, they release it a good time before anouncing a tour. To give me time to soak it up, and decide if i wanna pay to see them perform new stuff (and if so, how much would i pay at most?)

[Blue_Soul]

I would love a tour and a new album, and so what if the album sucked how the hell is that going to change how i feel about the old stuff! that is the most jackass stupid, dumshit thing i ever heard. What is a purist. sounds like a word some pompous dickhead uses in some feeble atempt to make themselves look or sound important, what a joke !!!!

That's exactly how I feel about this too. I would like to add, if you don't like the idea of a new album or tour, that's perfectly fine, then don't buy the cd / tickets in case there will ever be something like that, nobody's forcing you to do so, but don't tell them what they should do or not do. It's their decision and no matter what it'll be it should be respected.

[SteveAJones]

Your a prick you just blew my argument away. Would you agree to say.... a nice multi-track DVD of ....let's see Japan 71 ?

You do get my point then. I'd absolutely welcome an official Japan '71 dvd release. If

they'd start up their own official bootleg label a la The Who and The Grateful Dead it

would be the greatest news.

[LETZ ZEP!]

I can't believe theyre letting loadsa people use their songs now...I heard misty mountain hop on an advert, kashmir on freaking Xfactor?!?! and the immigrant song on shrek 3. Maybe they're skint but then I think its good they're making a comeback but I just don't want them to start going commercial and doing power ballads, but i doubt that'll happen. I stand by Zeppelin they can do no wrong.

[Nathan]

I can't believe theyre letting loadsa people use their songs now...I heard misty mountain hop on an advert, kashmir on freaking Xfactor?!?! and the immigrant song on shrek 3. Maybe they're skint but then I think its good they're making a comeback but I just don't want them to start going commercial and doing power ballads, but i doubt that'll happen. I stand by Zeppelin they can do no wrong.

Actually, it depends on how long the clips you heard were. I know for a fact the clip of IS in Shrek III was less than 30 seconds. What about the rest? If they were 30 second or less clips, then, in America, at least, they fall under the Fair Use Doctrine and these shows/commercials don't actually need permission for that.

[SteveAJones]

blah blah blah

Nathan, I'm disappointed in you. I know your capable of articulating your point of view

in a more convincing manner than your last post.

I never said I was "dead set" against a reunion. For what it's worth, I'm for just about

anything that gets Jimmy off the couch. HOWEVER, aside from the time he spends on

the stage, I dread everything associated with the return of Led Zeppelin. The forums

filled with pointless, often stupid Super Bowl-pre game show style threads. Guys like

Harvey who'll hijack an event to further their own agenda. Corporate contests. The

endless tour speculation.

I had thought what I hated most of all with the return of Led Zeppelin is the revisionist approach so many others now apply to their legacy. People like yourself who go running your mouth when you haven't earned the right to tell me anything whatsoever. If you want your views respected you need to learn to respect the views of others.

Edit:

I've read the link you provided, and I'll highlight this passage from it:

"So next time you see him, Bob, don't shun him or punish him for being in LED ZEPPELIN — just say, 'Hi, Jimmy.' Shake his hand and smile. I swear, the magic and sincerety in his hands will stay with you forever, and you will be glad to know that that new memory didn't erase any of the old ones.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes, I KNOW that feeling.

[Nathan]

Nathan, I'm disappointed in you. I know your capable of articulating your point of view

in a more convincing manner than your last post.

I was tired. Extremely tired. However, I think it made my point.

I never said I was "dead set" against a reunion. For what it's worth, I'm for just about anything that gets Jimmy off the couch. HOWEVER, aside from the time he spends on the stage, I dread everything associated with the return of Led Zeppelin. The forums filled with pointless, often stupid Super Bowl-pre game show style threads. Guys like Harvey who'll hijack an event to further their own agenda. Corporate contests. The endless tour speculation.

It's the return of Led Zeppelin. As they are the biggest, most popular band in the world, that kinda goes with the territory. I guarantee you it'd have been the same by '73 had y'all had the net then as it is now.

I had thought what I hated most of all with the return of Led Zeppelin is the revisionist approach so many others now apply to their legacy. People like yourself who go running your mouth when you haven't earned the right to tell me anything whatsoever. If you want your views respected you need to learn to respect the views of others.

First off... revisionist approach?

I NEVER SAW THEM LIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!! I DON'T HAVE ANY FUCKING MEMORIES TO GET REVISED!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you're so afraid of your precious memories getting screwed with, DON'T GO!

The REASON I want to see a Zeppelin reunion is because I'm 20 fucking years old, hence I'm too fucking young to have the fucking privilege of saying "I saw my all-time favorite band live." So it's a selfish reason. A VERY selfish reason. And I'm damn proud of it.

This Led Zeppelin reunion would allow the other fans teh chance to see their favorite band live. But every time we talk about it, purists like yourself and others have to come shit on it as if it's some kind of evil, Satanic crime for the boys to reunite. Most of you purists saw Led Zeppelin live. My poll here may not prove it, but the majority of the posts here, on PZ, on RO, at FBO, and so on and so forth saying that a Led Zeppelin reunion can not happen are from people who SAW THEM LIVE IN THe 70's. Note I said MOST, not all.

In the end, all of you who saw them and don't want the reunion just have precious memories that you're afraid of getting fucked with, instead of realizing that this is a chance to make new memories to preserve ALONG WITH YOUR OTHER ONES.

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Look, Steve. I do respect you, a lot. You do make some great posts. And I respect your words. I do. But you need to understand that some of us didn't see them live, and this is our chance. So just let it be and hate it in silence, okay? And that's too all of you purists. Let us have our Led Zeppelin. I'm begging you.

[SteveAJones]

Look, Steve. I do respect you, a lot. You do make some great posts. And I respect your words. I do. But you need to understand that some of us didn't see them live, and this is our chance. So just let it be and hate it in silence, okay? And that's too all of you purists. Let us have our Led Zeppelin. I'm begging you.

Nathan, I consider you a friend. An overtired friend, apparently. You must know there are only three men who can decide if you'll get what your seeking. I'm going to PM you.

[Nathan]

I want to apologize to everyone, especially Steve, for my last two posts concerning purists. I have been in a really bad mood the past couple of days, which has only changed, basically, just now (something else I've wanted just came through for me, so that has put me in a good mood).

I blew what Steve initially said way out of proportion, and due to my already horrible mood, exploded in a way I shouldn't have.

Everyone, at this point, knows how I feel about the purists and their feelings against a reunion. However, my posts were out of left field and completely inappropriate, so anyone and everyone who took offense to what I said, please, please forgive me.

[SteveAJones]

I want to apologize to everyone

No worries. I know it's frustrating right now. Just remember good tickets aren't cheap.

[madison]

it didn't hurt the Police on their 2007 reunion tour as far as commercialization. and they were reluctant to do a tour (i know at least one....was it copeland) who dreaded it and was pleasantly surprised at the reception. i don't hear much negative info on this tour. it wasn't much different than a tour in the early 80's for them.

i think LZ could make it work and not be a circus about it.

[Krish]

I'm an older fan at 43 yrs old but also never got to see them live. They are my favorite band of all time and have written and recorded my favorite song of all time (ALS) - if they toured I would definitely see them and love every moment. HOWEVER, what I don't like about the commercialization of Zeppelin in the 21st Century (and this is just my feeling based on perception) is that the commercialization is being carried out by people who have no appreciation for the music and are just doing this in an effort to get rich from the tour. I have no evidence to back this up but when I hear about suits from various concert promotion companies flying to the O2 to make Zeppelin a huge offer I feel like these people could care less about the music and just want to make millions of dollars. Now since I don't have millions of dollars and wish I did, that just makes me upset. Once again with no data to back things up it seems to me that back in the 70s promoters truly appreciated the music and were there both for the money and the tunes. K

[LETZ ZEP!]

Actually, it depends on how long the clips you heard were. I know for a fact the clip of IS in Shrek III was less than 30 seconds. What about the rest? If they were 30 second or less clips, then, in America, at least, they fall under the Fair Use Doctrine and these shows/commercials don't actually need permission for that.

Oh...well I actually haven't seen shrek 3. I was just listening to IS one day and someone said "hey thats the song from shrek 3" and in a Zeppelin-exploiting fuelled rage I was like GAAARRR!!! Lol but Xfactor is just...too far.

[Zephyrus]

30 seconds? that sounds fishy to me. if that were true, we'd be hearing a hell of a lot more good music in commercials. 30 seconds is a long time, most music doesn't last that long in movies unless it was written specifically for it, and you hear all the time about what a hard time the movie makers had in getting permission to use a dinky 25 second clip. School Of Rock had to beg and plead Led Zeppelin for permission to use Immigrant Song, and while it's been a while since I've seen the movie, I'm pretty sure it was at or under 30 seconds. if this 30 second rule is true, then why bother begging Led Zeppelin for permission? I'm not saying you're wrong, it just sounds fishy. what's your source?

[shiela]

As we all know, 2007 has seen Led Zeppelin change a great deal. For years they had always been that band that had mystery, and was more something spread by word of mouth then from media exposure. Even with that, they sold the most albums, had the largest concerts, sold countless merchandise, and we as well known as any over-exposed Act. This was accomplished simply off pure power and presence. But now for the first time ever, they have leaned towards much larger commercialization. Examples..

*Commercials

*Digital Catalog

*Ringtones

*The Reunion

*Magazine Covers (Rolling Stone, Guitar World, etc.)

*New Albums..at the front of every music store

*Posters everywhere

i don´t like digital catalog and the ringtones..

in my opinion it´s kinda wrong.

it´s not the same as a CD or a vinyl.

But i like the magazine covers and posters

[Nathan]

30 seconds? that sounds fishy to me. if that were true, we'd be hearing a hell of a lot more good music in commercials. 30 seconds is a long time, most music doesn't last that long in movies unless it was written specifically for it, and you hear all the time about what a hard time the movie makers had in getting permission to use a dinky 25 second clip. School Of Rock had to beg and plead Led Zeppelin for permission to use Immigrant Song, and while it's been a while since I've seen the movie, I'm pretty sure it was at or under 30 seconds. if this 30 second rule is true, then why bother begging Led Zeppelin for permission? I'm not saying you're wrong, it just sounds fishy. what's your source?

On further research I was wrong.

http://www.ivanhoffman.com/fairusemusic.html

Also, as for School of Rock, he had to get permission because it is the featured song on the Soundtrack (I have the soundtrack). It's one thing to use 30 seconds or less in the movie, but they wanted to use the whole song on the School of Rock soundtrack. Hence the need for permission.

However, I do believe that 30 seconds in most cases (not cited in the link above, of course) is looked over.