Led Zeppelin Reunion Show Too Heavy For Robert Plant

[ninelives]

Of course he isnt going to be as good as Bonzo. But its the drummer!!!!! Not the lead singer or guitarist!!! Replacing Page or Plant is not possible. The acoustic sets if they did them would not miss a beat. They would be just as good. Face it!! So a reunion would still be a special and worth while and tremendous event. Since it isnt going to happen, you are kind of like using Aesops fable the fox and the grapes. You know, the fox could not reach the grapes so , well you know the rest and if you dont, go read it. its short. I am not singling you out either. I just quoted you because I dont know how to use the quote tool and pick pieces out. The Who sure had no problem with their concerts after Moon died did they? And Moon was to me the second best drummer of all time. I watched a clip of Rush the other night on that music channel and it baffles me that anyone could think he is even close to Bonham or Moon. He is not the third best drummer by any means. As for the reunion, some of us die hard Led Zeppelin fans still want it and for those that never got to see them it would be great. Put that in your cereal all of you that keep bashing a reunion, just becaue Robert doesnt want to do it. What about Jimmy? Isnt he part of this band? I think so.

It depends on how you look at it. Zeppelin was what they were because of all FOUR members. Bonzo was just a crucial a part of their sound as the other three. THEY felt when he died, they couldn't continue as they were. Their words. In my opinion, the Who weren't the same without Mooney and certainly less so when Entwistle passed.

No one is bashing a reunion. And not touting wanting one does NOT make us any less a fan. I never saw them and yes it's a bummer but life goes on for me. I am happy they aren't doing what the Stones do and just rehashing greatest hits tours. I like the fact both JPJ and Robert have gone in different directions. It's pretty boring to just do the same thing over and over. Okay so Jimmy wants a reunion - I want a lot of money to travel but I'm not getting that any time soon so I move on.

[Jahfin]

Of course he isnt going to be as good as Bonzo. But its the drummer!!!!! Not the lead singer or guitarist!!! Replacing Page or Plant is not possible.

Nor is replacing Jones or John Bonham possible. Zeppelin was made up of a very special chemistry that was only present when all four of them were there. Take one away and that chemistry is gone. That goes just as much for Bonham as it does for any other member of the band, none are replaceable. Right now you have bands like Molly Hatchet that tour with no original members and the fans are quite alright with that. I would rather Zeppelin not join the ranks of artists that don't know when to call it quits. For all intents and purposes Led Zeppelin ended in 1980 when Bonham died. If they were to tour they would all have to have their hearts in it as I have said. That ain't happening. Better no Zeppelin "reunion" than a half-hearted one. The impossible happened when they played the 02, let it go at that. We got our reunion whether all of us were in attendance or not.

[Wolfman]

The only irony I find with Plant is that a full-scale reunion is too heavy, yet basically doing one with him and Page in '96 and '98 wasn't? I still think they kept JPJ out for financial reasons over any other reason they will say. Still, if Robert doesn't want to do this, so be it. I respect him no matter what decision he makes. It's too late anyway imo. They should have done this in the early 90's if they were going to do a full-scale reunion tour. Still have to say that night in 2007 was one of the greatest in my life and will always be one of the best shows I've been to.

[ninelives]

The only irony I find with Plant is that a full-scale reunion is too heavy, yet basically doing one with him and Page in '96 and '98 wasn't? I still think they kept JPJ out for financial reasons over any other reason they will say. Still, if Robert doesn't want to do this, so be it. I respect him no matter what decision he makes. It's too late anyway imo. They should have done this in the early 90's if they were going to do a full-scale reunion tour. Still have to say that night in 2007 was one of the greatest in my life and will always be one of the best shows I've been to.

My understanding is the "heaviness" referred to in the article was the emotions he felt that night (and not in a negative way). The decision to not work with JPJ, again as I understood it was neither Plant or Page wanted it to be a Zep reunion. They wanted to work together, revisiting Zep in a new way and creating new material of their own.

[Matjaz1]

Just for the record Billy. Having been there when Led Zep III came out, I'll wager dollars for donuts that nobody liked it on first listen. In fact, I'd go as far as to say that the band itself wondered if they'd gone a step too far. Why the rush to get IV out and anybody who was present at the time will well remember .There are plenty of people here ( if they're being honest ) who could verify that fact. It was an album that grew on me as well as most of the Zeppelin I & II fan base. That Jack, is a fact !

Well people that were around at that time told you it's not true!

And I don't see any rush in getting Zep IV out!! Thta's just how fast they released the albums those days!! The first four albums follow each other very quickly!! And there was still quite a lot of acoustic stuff on IV!!

And Zep never really calculated and made compromises in their music for succes! They wanted to satisfy themselves first and then give it to the audience, to see how much they will accept it and luckily they did, although there are some who would like Zep II over and over again but those are actually Deep Purple fans!

[silvermedalist]

The only irony I find with Plant is that a full-scale reunion is too heavy, yet basically doing one with him and Page in '96 and '98 wasn't? I still think they kept JPJ out for financial reasons over any other reason they will say. Still, if Robert doesn't want to do this, so be it. I respect him no matter what decision he makes. It's too late anyway imo. They should have done this in the early 90's if they were going to do a full-scale reunion tour. Still have to say that night in 2007 was one of the greatest in my life and will always be one of the best shows I've been to.

Well there Wolfman, you just said it!! 2007 and one of the best shows of your life!!! That kind of negates Jahfins take that Bonzo cant be replaced now doesnt it. And as great as Bonzo was, and he was the best and God rest his soul, they could still be good with his son. The Who were damn good after Moon. It is doable. It wont happen Im sure due to Robert's decision. But it could be done. And it could be a success.

[glicine]

Well there Wolfman, you just said it!! 2007 and one of the best shows of your life!!! That kind of negates Jahfins take that Bonzo cant be replaced now doesnt it. And as great as Bonzo was, and he was the best and God rest his soul, they could still be good with his son. The Who were damn good after Moon. It is doable. It wont happen Im sure due to Robert's decision. But it could be done. And it could be a success.

ok I'm now quoting myself, even if it looks silly enough.

Sigh, I wonder why some people never get it. Jason is not his father, it's not about their ability as drummers, they are simply different people. Robert once said he felt guilty being alive when Bonzo is dead, don't you think that's "heavy" enough for any people? It's not about music, or at least not only about music, there's a lot of emotions involved.

[silvermedalist]

ok I'm now quoting myself, even if it looks silly enough.

I totally understand the emotional part of it. But its been 30 years since Bonzo has been gone. I am only saying if Plant had a change of heart, not likely, it could be done and it could be a success. Someone else here made it sound like it couldnt be done musically, effectively. Bullshit. The who did it without Moon and they did it very well.

[Jahfin]

Well there Wolfman, you just said it!! 2007 and one of the best shows of your life!!! That kind of negates Jahfins take that Bonzo cant be replaced now doesnt it.

It negates nothing. Other than Live Aid, anytime they've played together in the past, they've called on Jason to fill the drum slot. That doesn't make John Bonham "replaceable". When Skynyrd's plane went down in that Mississippi swamp in 1977 that should have effectively ended that band right then and there and did, for ten years. So, when they regrouped in 1987 with a new lineup does that mean Ronnie Van Zant, Steve Gaines and Cassie Gaines were "replaceable"? NO, it doesn't. Listen to the music they've made post-plane crash and it speaks for itself. Take John Bonham out of the equation and you no longer have Led Zeppelin, you have an approximation that doesn't even come close to the original chemistry created by Page, Plant, Jones and John Bonham.

[Electrophile]

Led Zeppelin is not like The Who or the Stones or even Pink Floyd. All three of those bands lost a band member for one reason or another and kept going, either by replacing them officially or just going on with whomever was left.

Led Zeppelin didn't do that. They said, "Led Zeppelin is not Led Zeppelin without all four of us and that's that" and it's been that way for 30 years. They didn't tour after Bonham died, they didn't make anymore albums, they just stopped. They did a few performances here and there for charity or special gigs (Live Aid, Atlantic Records anniversary gig) and then Page/Plant did their deal in the 90s, but that wasn't as Led Zeppelin. Led Zeppelin as we knew them were done and have been done for three decades. The one-off show for Ahmet Ertegun was just that. One-off. Meaning, not more than one.

That doesn't mean they should or are going to tour just because they did that show and it didn't suck. Touring as Led Zeppelin requires John Bonham. They don't have him. So they aren't going to do it. More than that, Robert Plant doesn't want to do it. So that's no John Bonham and no Robert Plant. Jimmy, JPJ, Jason (or whoever they get to do drums) and random lead singer X are supposed to be "Led Zeppelin" for the purposes of this tour? I think not.

[silvermedalist]

Led Zeppelin is not like The Who or the Stones or even Pink Floyd. All three of those bands lost a band member for one reason or another and kept going, either by replacing them officially or just going on with whomever was left.

Led Zeppelin didn't do that. They said, "Led Zeppelin is not Led Zeppelin without all four of us and that's that" and it's been that way for 30 years. They didn't tour after Bonham died, they didn't make anymore albums, they just stopped. They did a few performances here and there for charity or special gigs (Live Aid, Atlantic Records anniversary gig) and then Page/Plant did their deal in the 90s, but that wasn't as Led Zeppelin. Led Zeppelin as we knew them were done and have been done for three decades. The one-off show for Ahmet Ertegun was just that. One-off. Meaning, not more than one.

That doesn't mean they should or are going to tour just because they did that show and it didn't suck. Touring as Led Zeppelin requires John Bonham. They don't have him. So they aren't going to do it. More than that, Robert Plant doesn't want to do it. So that's no John Bonham and no Robert Plant. Jimmy, JPJ, Jason (or whoever they get to do drums) and random lead singer X are supposed to be "Led Zeppelin" for the purposes of this tour? I think not.

The Plant not wanting to do it makes perfect sense. But to say they couldnt go out with another good drummer and put on a fine show/tour is just ludicrous. Just crazy. Its been done. The bands you mentioned are all superbands. The Who, Stones, Pink Floyd. They chose to do it and I think they were pretty damn good. And It is different losing a drummer than the lead singer. Say what you will. You have your opinion, and Ill stand by mine.

Oh and you had mentioned Skynrd Jahfin. I thougth 38 special was kind of a take off of them? Kind of . I thought they were very good

[Electrophile]

Drummers are not inherently less important than lead singers. Come off it. I'm sick of that argument being thrown around, as though "fuck Bonham, we can't replace Plant". A good.....no a GREAT drummer is very hard to find. You can find a competent drummer anywhere. Led Zeppelin is not about "competent". They're about great. Jason is not his father. He's not bad. But he's not his father.

[silvermedalist]

Drummers are not inherently less important than lead singers. Come off it. I'm sick of that argument being thrown around, as though "fuck Bonham, we can't replace Plant". A good.....no a GREAT drummer is very hard to find. You can find a competent drummer anywhere. Led Zeppelin is not about "competent". They're about great. Jason is not his father. He's not bad. But he's not his father.

Dont put words in my mouth. Bonham was the best drummer ever. I am only saying a band can go on if they chose to do so. Give me a break. Are you going to tell me that Page, Plant, JPJ and Jason on stage are chopped liver? Get real.

[ninelives]

Drummers are not inherently less important than lead singers. Come off it. I'm sick of that argument being thrown around, as though "fuck Bonham, we can't replace Plant". A good.....no a GREAT drummer is very hard to find. You can find a competent drummer anywhere. Led Zeppelin is not about "competent". They're about great. Jason is not his father. He's not bad. But he's not his father.

Not to mention Bonzo's sound was an integral part to the band's sound and success. As you said and so did I above, the BAND collectively chose not to continue without him.

[Electrophile]

I didn't say Robert, Jimmy, JPJ and Jason were chopped liver. I said that's not Led Zeppelin and they would not tour with that lineup under the banner of Led Zeppelin as the actual band Led Zeppelin chose not to go on as Led Zeppelin after John Bonham died.

And hello......ROBERT PLANT DOESN'T WANT TO DO IT. So now you're out TWO original members. In the words of Sir Paul "Let it be."

[Jahfin]

Oh and you had mentioned Skynrd Jahfin. I thougth 38 special was kind of a take off of them? Kind of . I thought they were very good

.38 Special was led by Ronnie Van Zant's brother Donnie Van Zant and included original Skynyrd bassist Larry Junstrom. Other than that they had nothing at all to do with Lynyrd Skynyrd. In other words, they weren't an off-shoot of Skynyrd, .38 Special was their own entity.

[silvermedalist]

.38 Special was led by Ronnie Van Zant's brother Donnie Van Zant and included original Skynyrd bassist Larry Junstrom. Other than that they had nothing at all to do with Lynyrd Skynyrd. In other words, they weren't an off-shoot of Skynyrd, .38 Special was their own entity.

I was aware it was his brother but I had thought Rossington and Collns were involved. My mistake. you are right they should not have called themselves Lynrd Skynrd. It was very wrong to do that. But in the case of Led zeppelin, three of the original four are there just like with the Who. The rolling stones, that is another story. I mean, replacing Mick Taylor with Ron Wood. That did not go well with me. Just imagine Zeppelin going on stage with a guitarist other than jimmy Page. ha. No way. Not even imaginable. But they called themselves Led zeppelin at the O2 and John Henry Bonham lookiing down from above I am sure approved with his son taking his spot. He would probably like to tell Robert, go ahead and do it!

[bigstickbonzo]

I'm glad to see the thread take a turn for the... after 17+ pages of bashing Robert Plant.

Now we're back on the same ol' topic of why John Bonham shouldn't be the end for the remaining members to play shows. And I thought this conversation was lame before the 02 show!!

I'm reminded of 1969 when John Lennon wanted Billy Preston to join the Beatles as a full time member. Of course, the others scoffed at this and said he was nuts. The closest he got was playing for some of the Get Back sessions. But he never became a Beatle. Why? Because, they all knew The Beatles were the four of them, nothing more or nothing less. You screw with that formula and it ain't them. That's the way Led Zeppelin was, the way the four musicians chose to look at themselves and treat their relationship. We can argue who could replace who til the end of time but it's foolish.

As good as Jason is, being taught by the man himself, he doesn't swing like his father. 90% of drummers can't swing like Bonzo. And I wouldn't take a candidate in the remaining 10% anyhow. He/she would not be John Bonham, therefore it won't be Led Zeppelin and to try and put it out there like so is an injustice to everything they've achieved in their legendary career. That's why I've accepted why Robert doesn't want to do it and really wish Jimmy would move on and play some new guitar and stop palling around with half-ass photographers, aka rock star wannabes.

[Jahfin]

I was aware it was his brother but I had thought Rossington and Collns were involved. My mistake. you are right they should not have called themselves Lynrd Skynrd. It was very wrong to do that. But in the case of Led zeppelin, three of the original four are there just like with the Who. The rolling stones, that is another story. I mean, replacing Mick Taylor with Ron Wood. That did not go well with me. Just imagine Zeppelin going on stage with a guitarist other than jimmy Page. ha. No way. Not even imaginable. But they called themselves Led zeppelin at the O2 and John Henry Bonham lookiing down from above I am sure approved with his son taking his spot. He would probably like to tell Robert, go ahead and do it!

No member of Zeppelin is "replaceable". John Bonham brought something to the table that can't be replicated. The same goes for Plant, Page and Jones. They announced their demise in 1980 for a reason. The same one Plant stands by today. Without John Bonham behind the drumkit there's no Led Zeppelin. They played one last show that no one ever thought would happen and still, folks like yourself want more. Just be glad they did that concert and let it rest.

[silvermedalist]

No member of Zeppelin is "replaceable". John Bonham brought something to the table that can't be replicated. The same goes for Plant, Page and Jones. They announced their demise in 1980 for a reason. The same one Plant stands by today. Without John Bonham behind the drumkit there's no Led Zeppelin. They played one last show that no one ever thought would happen and still, folks like yourself want more. Just be glad they did that concert and let it rest.

Is it so wrong to want more? Its like Im some kind of criminal for wanting to see them again. But what say you abou the Rolling Stones and the Who? Certainly you cant say they were not good without the originals. I mean, Brian Jones, very replacable. Sorry. Moon, second best of all time in my book, but they were great in concert still without Moonie. I was at two of them. Toronto outdoors and Buffalo indoors. And Daltrey and Townsend were just great. The Stones were good in 1975 but during the Some Girls tour, walked off the stage early for a reason I still dont know to this day. Played about an hour and 45 minutes and robbed us fucking blind.

[Electrophile]

*sigh*

The Stones and The Who decided to go on when they lost a band member. Led Zeppelin didn't. That's what makes them different. You can't compare them.

[Jahfin]

Is it so wrong to want more? Its like Im some kind of criminal for wanting to see them again.

Miracle of miracles the surviving members of Led Zeppelin played together again at the 02 in 2007. There's your reunion. Is it wrong to want more? Any good artist knows it's best to go out on top, leaving the audience wanting more. Zeppelin accomplished that. Does it make you a "criminal" that you want to see them continue? No, it doesn't but by the same token, why are you so unwilling to accept the fact that they do not want to carry on without John Bonham? He was a very unique individual that cannot be replaced by anyone. Not his son, not by any of the world's top drummers. Let the man rest and allow the rest of band to follow their own individual paths as artists. Hopefully their decision not to carry on as a band will benefit Page in his upcoming solo project and subsequent tour. Personally, I'm much more interested in that than seeing a band try to rehash their past.

[ally]

Well people that were around at that time told you it's not true!

And I don't see any rush in getting Zep IV out!! Thta's just how fast they released the albums those days!! The first four albums follow each other very quickly!! And there was still quite a lot of acoustic stuff on IV!!

And Zep never really calculated and made compromises in their music for succes! They wanted to satisfy themselves first and then give it to the audience, to see how much they will accept it and luckily they did, although there are some who would like Zep II over and over again but those are actually Deep Purple fans!

Given that Zep I & II were all that anyone had heard previously, III was a real change in direction for the band and not one that was expected by the fans. In North America at least, it was not initially well received. You are right about one thing though,when we cracked the album seal and thru it on the turntable, many, many people who where around at the time told me they didn't like it.

[silvermedalist]

Given that Zep I & II were all that anyone had heard previously, III was a real change in direction for the band and not one that was expected by the fans. In North America at least, it was not initially well received. You are right about one thing though,when we cracked the album seal and thru it on the turntable, many, many people who where around at the time told me they didn't like it.

Was not the case with my circle of friends. The Immigrant Song just whacked you and then Celebration Day the same. Since Ive Been Lovin You, was a big success. Maybe some of the acoustic material surprised them like Thats the Way? But I will say the worst song they ever did was on that album. Hats off to harper. Man. But hey, name a band that doesnt have a bad song. Cant do it. 99.9999 percent of their songs were great. To me, Harper and the Crunge were the only bad ones. Now here come the Crunge lovers after me next

[Deborah J]

Hello All !!

I hope this comes accross as intended, with good intentions. We are all here because of our love of Led Zeppelin and music. Do I from time to time dream of a reunion with Jason on drums, yes! That is because I love this band so much musically and there is nothing wrong with dreaming. I did see these four magnificent creatures twice, so I was very fortunate and I know that! I did not secure tickets to the 02, but I am so happy for those that did. What IMHO is not acceptable is finding fault with Robert.

I am taking the day to listen to as much of their music as I can fit in! I was listening to "I Can't Quit You Babe", the first song I heard from them at the age of 9. I am thinking about my first concert in 73 and how amazing that night was. It was very hard in those days to get big camaras in to tape them, and honestly for me, I was just overwhelmed with joy to be going to their event. I have now invested in huge flatscreens and great sound systems and can listen to them and take great pleasure in playing the DVD's, CD's right in my own home....having everything official and a few bootlegs that have been shared with me. My point is that the music that came from the four of them and their individual projects is so much more out there with new technology. More than for me, I know a lot of the young fans that have come on board wished they could have seen them live, but you have all of these new ways of seeing them. Find and take pleasure in that. Don't ever let anyone give you any shit about Zeppelin either!!

All of us (I hope) can appreciate what they have shared with us. I know I sure treasure it. I was so busy making a living in the late 80's and 90's that I missed the Page/Plant and Jimmy,Robert and JPJs solo concerts. Again, happy for anyone that was able to attend those events.

For the most part, I really enjoy everyone on this forum. I can share thoughts with all of you here that have that same passion. The music is supposed to bring us together.

I truly hope that we can all share the musical magic that these most talented musicians have given us. I hope our passion for music can be shared, I hope we teach the younger fans a few things along the way about the history of this band as those of us that are lets say more mature in age can exchange our fond memories. Now I am off to listen/watch a few DVDs of JPJ, Robert, The Firm and on to Knebworth for the 3 and half hours and soak it all in again as I still have that same passion now almost 41 years later!! If all of you could see the smile on my face and the joy it brings to my life...and I hope that for all of you!